Elementalist is absolutely BROKEN rn, we need this patched asap pls...

[Xenesis.6389]

See Gunflame hits for 45k damage.

But it's just a meme build!

No one else will run this build!

Na-Uh!

🤭

🤣

🍿

Edited May 3, 2023 by Xenesis.6389

[crewthief.8649]

3 hours ago, TrollingDemigod.3041 said:

Screens provided by him says otherwise, but ok, since you have never experienced it that automatically makes his arguments invalid, classic. If I meet some random Gun Flame enjoyer, I usually get hit for 17k+ from 1.5k range while also having prot on myself most of the time.
On top of that if by stoneskin you mean Stone Heart then 6k is far too high for non-crit on the squishest class in the game.
Just because it didn't happen to you, doesn't mean it doesn't happen at all. Lol.

Okay, we’ll use outliers to make balance decisions (that 29k hit is an extreme outlier). 😕

I’ve hit the numbers I mentioned in full Berserker gear, Sigils of night (at night) and force, Strength, Tactics, Berserker trait-lines using all offensive traits, 25 stacks of might, and full offensive consumables. You cannot (mathematically) pull much higher numbers than I am getting (on average). While my personal experience may be anecdotal, the math is objective. The average I am getting is probably around 12k.

And we’ll agree to disagree about the damage it SHOULD do to an Ele with Stone Heart in Earth. The build is all-or-nothing and I have definitely had good players react to my popping signets and LOS, dodge, or otherwise avoid the damage.

The build is 100% centered on that ONE shot. It is a meme. Kinda like signet Thief.  It’s tradeoff is that it dies if looked at the wrong way. There are specs/builds in this game that have it all in one package (such as the previously referenced Catalyst). And by the way, a glass Fresh Air Ele can hit similar numbers with far better survivability…

Edited May 3, 2023 by crewthief.8649

[solemn.9670]

  

6 hours ago, crewthief.8649 said:

Says the guy making presumptions about the skill of players in this thread that think Catalyst is over-performing. It isn’t just us that think that, by the way. 

The reason those 90%(totally arbitrary percentage, but okay) of players are bad is because they assume they’ll be carried by that spec, which in a lot of cases they are. 

As far as Harbinger goes, I get that you’re using whatabout-ism to try and deflect, but Harbinger isn’t relevant to the thread that YOU started.

Classic case of "two things can't be true at once" but actually, two things *can* be true at once. Lol.

1) Catalyst is overperforming and should be toned down alongside everything else, and put on the same level more or less

2) It's still a skill issue/most catalysts are bad/easy bags if you're running any kind of meta cele build which most people are right now (let's also note that catalyst is OP because cele is OP, but you know, what's the difference anymore)

as for "they assume they'll be carried by the spec so they're bad so you're wrong" this isn't even an argument so I don't know what to tell you in response considering that you didn't actually say anything.

What-about-ism is entirely relevant in the context of the overall balance of the game, what-do-you-mean-ism? Lmao. It's not a deflection, it's relevant, if anyone is deflecting here it's you. "B-b-b-but e-e-e-ele is overpowered, t-that's what all my friends tell me, e-everything else is fine!!" is this what you meant to type? Maybe not, but it's starting to come off like that. Copium.

6 hours ago, crewthief.8649 said:

Almost as if he doesn’t know what he’s talking about… 😂

So let's break this down, since you're going for the easy lib "gotcha" thing that people do on the internet.

1) Being one-shot is not fun or engaging

2) Soulbeast and one-shot warr both fall in this category

3) ????

4) this might be a bad thing

You're acting like I've started a crusade against warrior and likened it to soulbeast in such a way that I must actually believe they are nearly the exact same thing.

Edited May 3, 2023 by solemn.9670

[RazieL.5684]

 

someone was saying something about 11k average hits... skill issue there too? not knowing to refresh the gunflame to shoot it instantly a second time ? THEN PROCEED TO USE VOLLEY FOR 5k PER SHOT... yeah once i blow ALL my defensives to avoid that then i die to a random spit from a bird... btw the only counter to that kitten that was stone heart was deleted last night with the latest unbalance patch...

 

p.s i love it when people say "X is absolutely broken and overperforming like a modafoka... i don't die to it though... but it's totally overperforming!!" not sure if trying not to lose face or what? last time was a virtuoso complaining that he didn't have enough invulnerabilities in his kit... what a joke...

p.p.s cata is actually not even that good with cele... yeah it can murder a clueless player like any other spec, but then when you have someone that has more than 2 brain cells cata gets destroyed by classes that can pop 6-8 condies on you with 1 button... or willbender... even some power builds *cough* thief/ranger/willbender*cough* can outright DELETE a cele cata with prot up in a couple of seconds while usually being completely or almost completely immune to damage during that time... so at that point i have absolutely NO idea what the hell you're talking about and get some kitten condi cleanses!...

Edited May 3, 2023 by RazieL.5684

[solemn.9670]

5 hours ago, crewthief.8649 said:

You are not hitting 30k with that Gunflame build. Not even 29k (which you claimed earlier in the thread).  The absolute highest damage I’ve done was 24k on a glass, low-level, light armor player. The average WvWer takes about 10-12k. And an Ele with Stoneskin, and in earth atonement, is getting hit for MAYBE 6k.

Ok it's kind of hard to believe that you might actually be making a case that ele in general is overpowered due to stone heart.

Do you talk to, or hang around, any ele mains who are competent? If yes, how many use stone heart in any of their builds? I probably know a lot more ele mains and none of them use stone heart. It's a bad build. Bad players use it because they need to be extra tanky to compensate. If a stone heart ele is enough to defeat your morale, ... well I'm afraid of how you'll react when you discover immob druid... or harbinger in general ... or literally any class that runs all defensive traits/utilities/runes/sigils.

[MysteryDude.1572]

Solemn real talk now unrelated to post tho 

Wtf is wrong with zerg  staff catalyst?? Compared to weaver it feels underpowered af . Like lava fonts not criting , storm glyf significantly less dmg , like 4 k power it feels like im gently brushing enemies . 

Comparing the 2 has weaver more dps throught traits and dual attacks coefs? My first time playing it in large scale felt different from the weaver I played couple of times. Usually I play hammer rev tho, I dunno if I'm missing anything or is this spec a noodle... 

Like .. did staff ele got THAT much nerfed over the years ? ....

Edited May 3, 2023 by MysteryDude.1572

[BumboJumbo.1308]

30k gunflame? Your build must be as squishy as the builds you're fighting against.

Also, I don't know how you play but use terrain like walls or pillars to obstruct projectiles.

[Tao.5096]

Those never-ending threads about Ele..

Well, it is true that Ele's sustain and mitigation of damage and conditions was always abnormal and Anet never did anything with it.

Anet's fix was always to nerf something completely outside of logic.

Remember when they nerfed off-hand Dagger for Cele ele?
It got replaced with Focus which increased the sustain and mitigation of damage and decreased a bit the damage output.

This topic goes over for a decade already...

[Junkpile.7439]

Best idea is nerf  core traits and not touch catalyst traits. This way all specs get nerf because even full glass fresh air scepter/dagger core ele overperforming. Last time when I played it I did stay alive like 7 sec couple times.

[Hotride.2187]

Gotta wonder at all the gunflame posts. There was a gunflame topic just a while back, cant you write there? Get it to like 150 pages, maybe devs will do something about it. Personally I've not seen the build other than on video, but even on video it looks pretty dumb and like something that should not be a thing.

For ele, delete cele catalyst and then look at what needs buffing.

 

[Dr Meta.3158]

I was wondering why one of the top diehard ele mains decided to suddenly want to stream playing warrior.

[Aerthan.1907]

21 hours ago, crewthief.8649 said:

You are not hitting 30k with that Gunflame build. Not even 29k (which you claimed earlier in the thread).  The absolute highest damage I’ve done was 24k on a glass, low-level, light armor player. The average WvWer takes about 10-12k. And an Ele with Stoneskin, and in earth atonement, is getting hit for MAYBE 6k.

 

This is simply not true, my ranger got hit for 24k from a single shot from up to 1500 away, it's insane.

[Jski.6180]

Well every time they nerf scepter in an game type anet is saying ele is doing too much ranged dmg in that game type as scepter is eles only true ranged dps weapon. Why an class that favor ranged casting only has 1 ranged dps weapon and about 3 MH melee weapons is beyond me. Its even more confusing to let an melee tankly class like war have more ranged dps weapons then the mages class (at the same time doing more burst dmg at ranged).

 

 

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

Don't think I've seen a 45k gunflame since Feb2020.

[Xenesis.6389]

Anet's counter fix to the celestial argument... put more one shot damage back into the game...

Feb 2020! Who?

🤭🍿

[KrHome.1920]

21 hours ago, RazieL.5684 said:

 

Typical misleading montage. In at least half of the scenes he died seconds after these oneshots. That's obvious.

These zerkers are quite common. I tend to hardfocus them in pug smallscale encounters to prevent my servermates from being oneshotted since lots of players have no clue what it means when this build shows up. Usually I force them to switch back to GS and run away before they can fire their first shot, because they are squishy as hell (which can also be seen in the video above).

[Xenesis.6389]

/coughlaughs

Yeah squishy as hell.... then watches the first part of the video... oh he's 1v3 for 15sec, oh he's has multiple people down in the rest of the video. How are those dead people killing him seconds after the one shots? 🥴

Don't nerf meeeeeeeeme 🤭🍿

[KrHome.1920]

10 hours ago, Xenesis.6389 said:

/coughlaughs

Yeah squishy as hell.... then watches the first part of the video... oh he's 1v3 for 15sec, oh he's has multiple people down in the rest of the video. How are those dead people killing him seconds after the one shots? 🥴

Don't nerf meeeeeeeeme 🤭🍿

And in the rest of the video the recording stops right in the moment he takes damage. In a few scenes he would be (and I bet also was) downed with one additional hit.

Anyone can produce 1v3 videos with any class. There are tons of reasons why this might happen. Targets that have used all their defenses recently, targets that are not aware of the situation, bad player targets, afk targets ...

Edited May 5, 2023 by KrHome.1920

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

6 hours ago, KrHome.1920 said:

And in the rest of the video the recording stops right in the moment he takes damage. In a few scenes he would be (and I bet also was) downed with one additional hit.

Anyone can produce 1v3 videos with any class. There are tons of reasons why this might happen. Targets that have used all their defenses recently, targets that are not aware of the situation, bad player targets, afk targets ...

^ There was a LOT of free casting allowed in that video. Most of the time with Gunflame you don't see those kinds of numbers. 12k-15k hits are more the norm considering the amount of toughness+protection people are running around with these days. 

But then you find that one gem who is 'leveling' their character in WvW and has white gear on to put into a montage video to mislead people on the forums with.

[dead.7638]

Okay, IF you got hit by gun flame.   Here’s what you do.   Back peddle three steps.   Whew.

[Xenesis.6389]

Right right right, the problem is he took damage and didn't hit the heal and dies off clip.... after they down/kills 3 people..... yup totally meme build that doesn't work... totally should be allowed to one shot for 2-3x the hit points of players.

🤭🍿

[Forum Moderator.3419]

Hi Everyone,

Just a reminder to keep it civil. I've removed some posts.

Regards.

[Jski.6180]

Ideally you would let say Pile Driver (all charge up root single shot skills) hit for at least kill shot dmg maybe not gun flame. But agen staff is mostly an utility weapon with some dmg skills (most dule skills are dmg for all wepons weaver gets) so out side of these class skill or even pAoE skills scepter is the "ture" ranged dps weapon for the ele class. Maybe we need an real gun flame skill on scepter.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

4 minutes ago, Jski.6180 said:

Ideally you would let say Pile Driver (all charge up root single shot skills) hit for at least kill shot dmg maybe not gun flame. But agen staff is mostly an utility weapon with some dmg skills (most dule skills are dmg for all wepons weaver gets) so out side of these class skill or even pAoE skills scepter is the "ture" ranged dps weapon for the ele class. Maybe we need an real gun flame skill on scepter.

They did that more or less with Dragon's Tooth and you saw what happened there.

[Jski.6180]

Just now, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

They did that more or less with Dragon's Tooth and you saw what happened there.

So dragon's tooth issues was no add on to the "tell" during its fall. If the ring would simply grow showing the player it was about to fall these nerfs would not be needed. But it looks like anet was not willing to update the tell. I kind of want to see more skills like dragon tooth get the same effect of it showing above ppl with an timer for an big hit. We cant reliey on the skill cast being an real tell for big skills to be an viable way to balance them as in wvw and even spvp there just too much going on at once to even tell if some one is doing an emote or they are casting an skill.

The situation with dragon tooth is on anet end of work and animations NOT its effect. Most skills that are targeted work like dragon tooth but with out the delay on the fall. You could say flame burst or even Lightning Surge work the same way as dragon tooth but after the cast of these skills there is no tell that they are going to hit as they hit right after the cast. These skills do not hit as hard as dragon tooth but they come with added effects. If you want to avoed them you must see an ele cast it and reacte to the cast not to the skill it self. So dragon tooth is not reacting to the cast but to the skill effect it self.

Even say gun flame has an animation (on top of an cast) that you can reacted to. It is in its own way an dragon tooth but with less tell on the skill it self but more on its cast time for the skill. If gun flame had the tell of the skill after it was fired much like dragon tooth it would be an weaker skill. If it had the tell that dragon tooth should have the growing ring it would be even weaker still.

In an game type like wvw rings and growing rings are far more balancing then any root or player cast animations. That is what happen to dragon tooth and anet inability to balance it right.