why less stuff?

[Ashen.2907]

29 minutes ago, ZeftheWicked.3076 said:

https://www.guildwars2.com/en-gb/news/combat-in-guild-wars-2-secrets-of-the-obscure/
 

It's at the end of first paragraph in section about relics.

I am not sure that a nerf to an existing 6th tier bonus, such as shown for thief, really counts as new content or features.

[ZeftheWicked.3076]

42 minutes ago, Ashen.2907 said:

I am not sure that a nerf to an existing 6th tier bonus, such as shown for thief, really counts as new content or features.

We'll have wait and see.
Also it's not a straight up nerf. damage bonus is cut in half, but not reliant on flanking.
Nerf to bossing for sure, but might be a  boon to mobbing, since you can't be arsed to walk behind every mob you encounter.

[Ashen.2907]

18 minutes ago, ZeftheWicked.3076 said:

We'll have wait and see.
Also it's not a straight up nerf. damage bonus is cut in half, but not reliant on flanking.
Nerf to bossing for sure, but might be a  boon to mobbing, since you can't be arsed to walk behind every mob you encounter.

The damage bonus is largely irrelevant for any foe that you cannot flank or who is not defiant. So, at least in PvE, it will be a nerf. Dont get me wrong, I think some nerfs are in order, but it is one such.

[Mungrul.9358]

At a guess, I would say that this also marks a change in how they plan to deliver content that would have previously been "Living World".

The problem with Living World was that you had to log in when it was released in order to get it for free, otherwise you would have to pay for it.
I'm guessing that the new pricing structure means you get everything that's released between this expansion and the next for free, removing the complexity and confusion of Living World releases.

But that's just a guess.

[IAmNotMatthew.1058]

On 7/2/2023 at 11:51 PM, Ashen.2907 said:

Charging money for work you do? What a crazy concept. I am sure that you tell your employer that they do not need to pay you...right?

Noone's complaining about having to pay for it, the complaints are about it being almost as much as a proper expansion, but with notably less content. Know the difference. Imagine paying the same 30€ for EoD, but only getting half of what EoD had.

On 7/1/2023 at 4:48 PM, Panda.1967 said:

It didn’t quite dawn on me until just now… this is the first of the new “mini expansions” they talked about earlier this year… so um… ANet… why is it full priced? Ya’ll said they would be lower cost.

Mini expansion, not mini price. You pay a bit less, you get quite some less.

[Atomepapier.5420]

Honestly, first expansion were amazing and i keep praising this game for years and years to all my friends !

But.. EoD, i'm sorry but was a bit of a disappoitment.... A lot of chapter in the story, but short chapters.. in the end it was the same time as any other to do it...

A year of waiting... to a 10th of a new map... what a shame..

 

And now this new "expansion" it honestly should be just a major update of what we already have and frankly.. we didn't had a major update since the lauch of Eod (beside the rest of the story earlier that year)...

 

In the end, 25$ or 25€ for almost nothing.. yeah we can use the weapons, new strikes... but certainly not that much money for so little !

For sure, i'm not gonna buy it at the moment, maybe on a 50% discount that will be there surely soon enough

[ShatteredStars.6548]

On 6/28/2023 at 6:46 AM, Ashen.2907 said:

Over the course of a couple of years ANet will be asking for $25 each for two expansions. $50 total for half a dozen maps, strikes, fractals, combat options, cosmetics, new systems, and so on. To me that seems reasonable (assuming that the specifics of those elements are appealing).

Some players are greedy and don't care if the devs spend time developing features, maps e.c.t, they just want to complain.

[ShatteredStars.6548]

On 7/2/2023 at 11:06 AM, pocky.7468 said:

It's literally a paid Living World season, guys. The name change to "expansion" is just a PR/marketing trick.

First of all, you don't have no idea how much content it will be.

[Gazrul.3086]

I'll reserve judgement until they've showcased the upcoming zones and content to us. It's hard for me to make conclusions based on incomplete info. 

I don't think we're getting a bad deal here, 25€ is perfectly reasonable for what we're getting. It's still one of the cheapest pricing for the expansion compared to other big MMOs like ESO, WoW and FF14. 

Of course, it could end up being disappointing, but I'm hopeful that after Gyala Delve they've learned what doesn't work and what needs to be improved in order to make the content more fun. 

 

[SoftFootpaws.9134]

you're all perhaps forgetting about their policy of always offering the complete game at a single price point. this means it doesn't matter how much content the new expansions get, with each release the older expansions are cheaper and more approachable for new players. it may not seem like alot to us, but its very important for the future of the game to go down this road compared to the disaster that living world is for newer players.

 

i imagine they'll probably even merge path of fire into end of dragons after a few years.

 

arenanet is desparately trying to think of the future of the game, not the present. there's been some major issues going on with the game's adaptability ever since around the end of living world season 4. slowly but surely they've been changing this, but it takes time.

 

icebrood saga happened (for better or worse) precisely because we didn't have a "mini-expansion" model in place at the time.

Edited July 8, 2023 by SoftFootpaws.9134

[rotten.9753]

On 7/4/2023 at 7:22 AM, Ashen.2907 said:

The damage bonus is largely irrelevant for any foe that you cannot flank or who is not defiant. So, at least in PvE, it will be a nerf. Dont get me wrong, I think some nerfs are in order, but it is one such.

If they left Relic of the Thief intact, then it would be pretty much almost always picked due to how flanking works now - there are only a few bosses that are not defiant and some of them are really easy to flank, HT CM for example. The only reason Runes of the Thief are not widely used right now is that you lose a lot of stats for condition damage gain, and they give a lot of precision that some builds do not need. Once you decouple raw stats from that 6th bonus plus a recent change to flanking, the 6th bonus from Runes of the Thief becomes the best in slot for any power build, because other bonuses like Scholar (although it might change as well) require some precondition and only give 5% in the end.

Edited July 8, 2023 by rotten.9753

[HonesltlyX.7164]

On 6/27/2023 at 11:47 PM, Balsa.3951 said:

Anything to explain why we get less than Ice Brood saga content for the price of a regular x pac?

lets try overcome the hype of new shine and look at the substance.

and before ppl say i own 25dollar and i know im not forced to buy.

what we get really new is 2-3 maps thats awesome

and what now?

legendary armor~ thats just a cosmetic (they only show concept art prepare urself for wait a.half year)

Relic~ thats runes with complication (legendary owners mutiny inc)

new way get skyscale~ good for some i guess

use all weapons ~ sounds like a lot but those already exist. No design effort needed just some balanceing.

New weapons ~ poor mans version of a elite 

I will wait and see but  wow thats a slim x pac

Anet u made fishing look like actual effort now in feature comparession.

edit i got told 1 fractal and two strikes + strike cms.

Icebrood saga was 6 strikes and 2 fractals? i forgot

Anet already communicated that they will release content in smaller bits months ago so that they can have time to address issues and do game patches. We are not going to get the magnitude of content that we got in the past. We have been told this already.

The only other legendary armor in the game requires doing raids - which is hard to get into cuz of LFG shenanigans.

Relics - never owned legendary runes never saw any reason to grind out all of that for a QoL thing when I can just buy runes for a negligible fraction of that.

I think we got enough elite specs in the game. Adding more is just more for anet to manage with class balances, more for players to learn (who isn't really willing to learn), more for new players to be overwhelmed with.

Skyscale - I got mine a long time ago. I like the new masteries adding more for my skyscale and griffon. It's cool they are giving it to new players.

Unlocking weapons across all subclasses opens up a ton of new build options for theorycrafters to explore.

Don't get me wrong. I'm not trying to hype up this expac. But I'm happy to pay $25 for this content alone.

[Linken.6345]

39 minutes ago, HonesltlyX.7164 said:

Anet already communicated that they will release content in smaller bits months ago so that they can have time to address issues and do game patches. We are not going to get the magnitude of content that we got in the past. We have been told this already.

The only other legendary armor in the game requires doing raids - which is hard to get into cuz of LFG shenanigans.

Relics - never owned legendary runes never saw any reason to grind out all of that for a QoL thing when I can just buy runes for a negligible fraction of that.

I think we got enough elite specs in the game. Adding more is just more for anet to manage with class balances, more for players to learn (who isn't really willing to learn), more for new players to be overwhelmed with.

Skyscale - I got mine a long time ago. I like the new masteries adding more for my skyscale and griffon. It's cool they are giving it to new players.

Unlocking weapons across all subclasses opens up a ton of new build options for theorycrafters to explore.

Don't get me wrong. I'm not trying to hype up this expac. But I'm happy to pay $25 for this content alone.

So elite specs bad because it overwhelms new players and people who dont want to learn.

But more weapons good because it opens up more build options wouldent that also overwhelm new players and the ones who dont want to learn too? + more build options is also more for Anet to manage so same - as you gave to elite specs should applie here aswell.

Just so you know we had 3 different legendary armor sets for quite awhile not just the raid ones.

[Strider.7849]

On 6/28/2023 at 5:25 AM, Ashen.2907 said:

To be fair it costs half of what HoT did at launch. I like the combat mechanics I see for the new expac (depending on implementation) more than I did/do most of the HoT elite specs.

I think that strike missions add more than you give credit for. 

Still, I am up in the air (pun intended) about the expac due to what it contains rather than how much.

HoT was worth every dollar spent to me. I absolutely loved it and still play those maps today. SotO is the first expansion I haven't pre-purchased immediately. Due to the current/recent state of the game and the direction they are heading, I'm not sure if I will purchase it at all.

[DeathPanel.8362]

On 6/27/2023 at 10:47 PM, Balsa.3951 said:

Anything to explain why we get less than Ice Brood saga content for the price of a regular x pac?

How do you know there's less content when the expansion isn't even released yet?

[rotten.9753]

38 minutes ago, DeathPanel.8362 said:

How do you know there's less content when the expansion isn't even released yet?

Because people tend to focus on the amount of maps we get, completely ignoring stuff like replayability, e.g. LS3 had more maps than any expac, but their replayability is abysmal.

[Gehenna.3625]

On 7/3/2023 at 2:27 PM, ZeftheWicked.3076 said:

The price is far less of an issue than the labeling.
If it calls itself an expansion, it better bring expansion level content.

SWTOR does call them expansions and has a lot less stuff in it. So the labeling is much worse over there as well. However, if you wanted what you see as a full expansion you would probably have to pay 50 bucks for that.

On 7/3/2023 at 2:27 PM, ZeftheWicked.3076 said:

And I don't see something that rivals full new set of e-specs in terms of expanding combat.
Nor do I see a new game changing feature like the Glider, Mounts or Jade Bot.
I believe in A-net delivering when it comes to new zones, but that's one mark checked outta three.

Well, what they're doing with the Skyscale might be game changing and I don't need them to rival a new set of e-specs because I see that as a bad thing. I'm actually happy they're not going to bring out new e-specs. Oh and incidentally SWTOR has had the same classes for something like 12 years now and has added a new skill here and there but that's it.

On 7/3/2023 at 2:27 PM, ZeftheWicked.3076 said:

Call it DLC, or Living World season 6 - we're good.
Or raise the price to 50$ if needed but with full xpac's worth of content no questions asked.
But if it names itself an expansion it'll be held to such standard.

I think you put too much emphasis on what the label is. You see what content it has and then you decide on whether that's worth your money. Why would a label change that?

[Frostfear.2158]

well it's less content because we will get a new expansion like this probably next year, they're trying what ESO tried but i guess eso is not going in that direction right now

[Balsa.3951]

7 hours ago, DeathPanel.8362 said:

How do you know there's less content when the expansion isn't even released yet?

bcs anet even said it

[DeathPanel.8362]

1 hour ago, Balsa.3951 said:

bcs anet even said it

Where?

[enigmatic.3576]

On 7/7/2023 at 7:49 PM, TheRunningSquire.3621 said:

First of all, you don't have no idea how much content it will be.

We can just look at previous releases to get a good idea.  It's two maps so the most you can expect is a story the size of what we got across Seitung and Kaineng.  It'll probably be less with a lot of it focused on open world objectives as their trend with recent releases.  I'm not expecting any noteworthy map meta events but I'm hoping they're at least not as copy/pasted/repetitive as Gyala Delve.

The DLC in August is going to make or break this new model of theirs.  If it succeeds, or is at least passable, expect to see it going forward.  If it gets the same reception as Gyala Delve, there's a good chance they'll have to rethink it.  Or they can just continue to load the DLCs with a lot of player requested features (such as what they did with weaponmaster training and open world legendary armor) so that enough players concede.  Don't be so surprised to see land spears highlighted as a major feature in a future DLC.

[Bankrotas.8215]

To be fair, if we take inflation into account 40$ in 2015 for HoT would be about 50$ in 2023 , so 25$ for half the content would be appropriate price.

And I'm not paying more because the extra options have mandatory char slot expansion, which I consider no sale option.

Edited July 16, 2023 by Bankrotas.8215

[Polar.8634]

53 minutes ago, Bankrotas.8215 said:

To be fair, if we take inflation into account 40$ in 2015 for HoT would be about 50$ in 2023 , so 25$ for half the content would be appropriate price.

your example with inflation is correct, but amount of new content in hot is more then twice of soto. Professions, lege, raids and more all were introduced in hot first time.

Edited July 16, 2023 by Polar.8634

[Ashen.2907]

3 hours ago, Polar.8634 said:

your example with inflation is correct, but amount of new content in hot is more then twice of soto. Professions, lege, raids and more all were introduced in hot first time.

To be fair, some of those elements came after HoT, and we dont know exactly what will come after SotO.

[ScottBroChill.3254]

It's literally $25 bucks, that's not a lot of money and the devs need to be able to buy groceries. They literally sell skins in the gem store that cost 20 bucks and somehow this is too little content for 5 more bucks? get real.