why less stuff?

[Balsa.3951]

Anything to explain why we get less than Ice Brood saga content for the price of a regular x pac?

lets try overcome the hype of new shine and look at the substance.

and before ppl say i own 25dollar and i know im not forced to buy.

what we get really new is 2-3 maps thats awesome

and what now?

legendary armor~ thats just a cosmetic (they only show concept art prepare urself for wait a.half year)

Relic~ thats runes with complication (legendary owners mutiny inc)

new way get skyscale~ good for some i guess

use all weapons ~ sounds like a lot but those already exist. No design effort needed just some balanceing.

New weapons ~ poor mans version of a elite 

I will wait and see but  wow thats a slim x pac

Anet u made fishing look like actual effort now in feature comparession.

edit i got told 1 fractal and two strikes + strike cms.

Icebrood saga was 6 strikes and 2 fractals? i forgot

Edited June 28, 2023 by Balsa.3951

[Deihnyx.6318]

I'm a bit puzzled by that too. This xpac comes with great features, but the actual playable content is scaled down to a minimum and that's a problem when you call that an expansion.

I really wish they would consider dungeons again, maybe some procedurally generated instances with some fun combinations, to keep it fresh each time.

Edited June 28, 2023 by Deihnyx.6318

[Misterbrady.2167]

If they do what wow does and give content patches over time between expansions then it's somewhat okay, but that's not the message we're getting.

[Linken.6345]

OP you forgot the 1 fractal and two strikes + strike cms.

[Balsa.3951]

3 minutes ago, Linken.6345 said:

OP you forgot the 1 fractal and two strikes + strike cms.

ok added this info. thats something  good

[Luthan.5236]

They need to make money I guess. And there is no real way to increase gem prices (would make people most annoyed) - so they only can cut down on sales (getting people to need to buy more gems) ... and releasing expansions more frequently.

I just wonder if this won't end up in "mass producing" boring stuff. Or cluttering the game with too much mechanics. Since making some changes here and then might be quick ... not needing too much resources. Creating a lot of new maps might need more manpower than stuff like this with the wepons. That of course ... will need balancing as well.

But there is a limit. New fractals can only happen until you have 25 unique ones. (And I hope the other new ones will be of normal length - not like Silent Surf a over-long one with unique achievement category.) The weapon stuff obviously is limited as well. Unless they really want to give everyone access to every weapon. Then of course they can always bring something new though ... I guess warrior would still be the first one to be "full" (not being able to get more if he access to all weapons).

New daily stuff = just more pressur ... already now you have to chose what you want to to on your daily routine. Can't do everything.

I just hope the festival stuff will be toned down. Or other side content. Keep it at the festivals (no irregular other content like "rushes") + finalize them (making the new sets they added for SAB and dragon bash - where they surely will continue in the other festivals ... the last stuff) - so people can catch up there ... + new content in the expansions.

I mean the way they phrased it it seems like they want to give a few updates every 3 months and relasing the next full expansion in late 2024 already lol. (Instead of waiting at least until 2025.) For this one it seems to make sense - with the content. Next one I can't imagine what they might bring. (Unless they really start to focu shard on PvP and WvW.)

[Loboling.5293]

I agree the contents seem limited. I'm glad for how this expansion will spice up my favorite activity, rolling new characters. New weapons and options seems great. But I do hope they add good maps. The amount isn't so important as how fun they are to play. Some of the EoD maps and PoF maps, are just boring. And I'll admit Tangled Depths is loved by some, that's not for me. It needs a better UI to navigate through there. Anyway, I hope the new maps are enjoyable.

[Fueki.4753]

Getting half an expansion for half the price of an expansion would have been fine. But we get half an expansion for roughly 83% of the price of an expansion, which is a bad sign.

For this first "mini" expansion, one could argue the price also includes all the system changes.

But what about after that? Will they keep asking for 25€, despite not having to offer more than half an expansion and the systems already being changed?

[Misterbrady.2167]

After reading the info myself, I am interested in the expansion.  It does look like they will be releasing content after expac launch.  I was stuck at work with only hearsay which caused me to get it wrong.

[The Boz.2038]

1 hour ago, Fueki.4753 said:

But we get half an expansion

How do you reckon half?
Is e-spec trait lines the bulk of an expansion's content for you?

[Fueki.4753]

20 minutes ago, The Boz.2038 said:

How do you reckon half?
Is e-spec trait lines the bulk of an expansion's content for you?

HoT was four maps at launch. PoF was five maps at launch. EoD was four maps at launch. SotO will be two maps at launch.

If we also consider the following Living World Seasons, SotO even will be less than a third than what HoT and PoF are. and slightly above half of EoD.

The Strike Missions are reused story bosses, so they don't factor much into the comparison.

The fractal will most likely be available to everyone, because it is a fractal. So it doesn't factor into the price. Locking the fractal to people we paid for SotO and thus splintering the fractal playerbase doesn't sound like a good idea.

If specialization weapons usable on the whole profession ends up requiring a SotO specific mastery, that's just paid powercreep that's far FAR less than elite specializations.

I don't understand how someone can NOT see that SotO is half (or less) than a full expansion.

Edited June 28, 2023 by Fueki.4753

[Danikat.8537]

It's cheaper than the £33.99 my other MMO is charging for a comparable expansion (That one includes 2 new maps, 1 new class, small additions to existing mechanics (mainly collections), and the promise that the second half of the story will come later in the year).

So just the fact that SotO is only £21.99 is an improvement. Also it's adding stuff my existing characters can use. I know it's not the same as a full e-spec but I'm looking forward to being able to mix and match weapons and specs.

I haven't decided if I'm going to get it yet. I'm in no rush to decide, I'm going to wait until after the beta weekend at least. But to me it seems like the price and what you get for it isn't out of line with other games.

5 hours ago, Misterbrady.2167 said:

If they do what wow does and give content patches over time between expansions then it's somewhat okay, but that's not the message we're getting.

That's exactly what they've said they're doing (and what they've always done).

[Ashen.2907]

Over the course of a couple of years ANet will be asking for $25 each for two expansions. $50 total for half a dozen maps, strikes, fractals, combat options, cosmetics, new systems, and so on. To me that seems reasonable (assuming that the specifics of those elements are appealing).

[Ashen.2907]

2 hours ago, Fueki.4753 said:

I don't understand how someone can NOT see that SotO is half (or less) than a full expansion.

To be fair it costs half of what HoT did at launch. I like the combat mechanics I see for the new expac (depending on implementation) more than I did/do most of the HoT elite specs.

I think that strike missions add more than you give credit for. 

Still, I am up in the air (pun intended) about the expac due to what it contains rather than how much.

[TSCavalier.8053]

GW2 is an older game. I don't know how many NEW players are joining the game these days (paid ones, anyway), and even those new players wouldn't be joining due to the existence of this new expansion, since there's a gigantic amount of content to play already in the game.

This expansion... in fact, the new expansion model itself... seems to be targeting the audience of long-time players who are willing to spend more to get a little more since they're already invested.

The game has SO much content now already, so these new zones are just moving the "bubble" for long-time players. Consider the fleet of skyscales that frequent Gyala Delve... and that you kinda need one to keep up with the pack. Now consider what's needed to actually have a skyscale (which requires every expansion and living story, no?). Those are veteran players that are riding the wave of the latest zones.

So this new expansion... and its price... are for people who are cool with pumping more money into a game they have already invested in... and are a bit more willing to drop $25 on a couple new maps... just like they might drop $5 on a mount skin or two (which is MUCH less content in comparison).

[Jin.8501]

Maybe because it used to be ridiculously cheap to play. There's a reason GW1 failed. It's not easily sustainable. You people whine that 25-30€ is too much every 1-5 years and then in the same breath whine that there isn't enough of content coming up compared to other big MMORPGs. There's no winning here. 

[Randulf.7614]

We will still get many hours out of it. I don’t see the price as an obstacle. DLCs for triple AAA games with even less content are about the same price or not significantly less. They need to make money at this late stage of the game and we have been spoiled. 

I do think it could use more preorder exclusives. That’s where I feel it is lacking

Edited June 29, 2023 by Randulf.7614

[Redfeather.6401]

Let's just see how the next year goes. I like the idea behind the new update cadence. It is better than elder scrolls online's. Just have to see how it actually plays out.

[WeightTrainer.3219]

On 6/27/2023 at 10:47 PM, Balsa.3951 said:

Anything to explain why we get less than Ice Brood saga content for the price of a regular x pac?

lets try overcome the hype of new shine and look at the substance.

and before ppl say i own 25dollar and i know im not forced to buy.

what we get really new is 2-3 maps thats awesome

and what now?

legendary armor~ thats just a cosmetic (they only show concept art prepare urself for wait a.half year)

Relic~ thats runes with complication (legendary owners mutiny inc)

new way get skyscale~ good for some i guess

use all weapons ~ sounds like a lot but those already exist. No design effort needed just some balanceing.

New weapons ~ poor mans version of a elite 

I will wait and see but  wow thats a slim x pac

Anet u made fishing look like actual effort now in feature comparession.

edit i got told 1 fractal and two strikes + strike cms.

Icebrood saga was 6 strikes and 2 fractals? i forgot

I am more curious about the quality than the quantity. Of course 4 new maps that are of high quality would be awesome, but if reducing 4 mediocre maps to 2 maps of high quality I am all for it. The Relic/Runes is a massive issue for what seems to be the playerbase that has anywhere from 1 to 6/7 legendary runes and I think anet needs to be very careful how they move forward with this. I am always up for new legendary stuff as long as it is, once again, high quality. I don't thin anet has the ability to balance more elite specs if they add them each expansion especially since now expansions will be smaller but release more often otherwise it will start to be like Guild Wars 1 (for those that played it) the amount of skills in that game was beyond comprehension and a massive nightmare that could never really be balanced, so in other words "less is more" i guess but anet needs to learn from past mistakes when it comes to trying to balance too much stuff and focus on less elite specs that are balanced rather than trying to make new ones. I don't do strikes so no comment on those.

[Balsa.3951]

5 hours ago, WeightTrainer.3219 said:

I am more curious about the quality than the quantity. Of course 4 new maps that are of high quality would be awesome, but if reducing 4 mediocre maps to 2 maps of high quality I am all for it. The Relic/Runes is a massive issue for what seems to be the playerbase that has anywhere from 1 to 6/7 legendary runes and I think anet needs to be very careful how they move forward with this. I am always up for new legendary stuff as long as it is, once again, high quality. I don't thin anet has the ability to balance more elite specs if they add them each expansion especially since now expansions will be smaller but release more often otherwise it will start to be like Guild Wars 1 (for those that played it) the amount of skills in that game was beyond comprehension and a massive nightmare that could never really be balanced, so in other words "less is more" i guess but anet needs to learn from past mistakes when it comes to trying to balance too much stuff and focus on less elite specs that are balanced rather than trying to make new ones. I don't do strikes so no comment on those.

i agree quality over quantity but was the last maps we got quality or quantity? 

[Batalix.2873]

My concerns are similar to OP's.

It's not really the *amount* of content that bothers me. They said they were going to be pulling back the amount in each expac to focus on bringing other aspects of the game up. I'm fine with less story and fewer maps if that means working on things like revitalizing underwater combat, new PvP maps/modes, new WvW maps/updated features, new raids.

But so far we haven't gotten any of that. Instead, we have, as OP says, recycled things like reusing espec weapons, awkwardly shoving in more core weapons, easier PvE leggy armor, and easier skyscale. And virtually all of these "fake-new" things (a) reuse assets or systems that were already developed and (b) severely undermine old structures and content in ways that I think will be seriously unhealthy for the game. We are going to see an overall narrowing of "meta" buildcrafting, as well as less participation/interest in raids and HoT (leggy armor), PoF and LWS4 (skyscale), and dungeons (relics) because now players can just skip those parts of the game for leggy armor/skyscale.

They are literally tearing apart the game to try to make some revenue to tide them over until GW3 (or some other game) saves them, and that does not sit well with me at all.

Edited July 1, 2023 by Batalix.2873

[Dante.1508]

My only issue is the lack of content but the price is still extremely high.. $120 AUD for ultimate seems like price gouging.

[Serephen.3420]

On 6/28/2023 at 12:47 PM, Balsa.3951 said:

Anything to explain why we get less than Ice Brood saga content for the price of a regular x pac?

lets try overcome the hype of new shine and look at the substance.

and before ppl say i own 25dollar and i know im not forced to buy.

what we get really new is 2-3 maps thats awesome

and what now?

legendary armor~ thats just a cosmetic (they only show concept art prepare urself for wait a.half year)

Relic~ thats runes with complication (legendary owners mutiny inc)

new way get skyscale~ good for some i guess

use all weapons ~ sounds like a lot but those already exist. No design effort needed just some balanceing.

New weapons ~ poor mans version of a elite 

I will wait and see but  wow thats a slim x pac

Anet u made fishing look like actual effort now in feature comparession.

edit i got told 1 fractal and two strikes + strike cms.

Icebrood saga was 6 strikes and 2 fractals? i forgot

New skins, armours, weapons and other rewards from the tower. It's definitely gonna be meatier than IBS from what I've seen. And the price is rather reasonable, considering how much we pay just for some skins in the first place. 

Ibs gave no new skills or weapons or elite specs. We got some good maps and then some awful DRMs. 

Legendary armour is not just a skin. It's a big deal to more people than you'd think. As it's the first open world accessible legendary set. It is more of a prestige skin for people who already have a set like myself yes, but nothing wrong with that. 

We get new skyscale skills as well as what some have been calling mounted combat? Correct me if I'm wrong about that. 

Edit:

Also I should mention I am curious about what they do with runes now as I have legendary runes. Still I've preordered when I originally intended not to as the story premise and the combat features were enough for me to be interested. I was pro having more e-specs, especially because of the weapons. If they added no new weapons, I might have been more on the fence then.

@Dante.1508 when looking at AUD it can be a bit rough but that's nothing new at this point. Aussie dollar isn't doing so great at the moment and looks to be on the downward trend still.😔

Edited June 30, 2023 by Serephen.3420

[Dante.1508]

3 minutes ago, Serephen.3420 said:

New skins, armours, weapons and other rewards from the tower. It's definitely gonna be meatier than IBS from what I've seen. And the price is rather reasonable, considering how much we pay just for some skins in the first place. 

Ibs gave no new skills or weapons or elite specs. We got some good maps and then some awful DRMs. 

Legendary armour is not just a skin. It's a big deal to more people than you'd think. As it's the first open world accessible legendary set. It is more of a prestige skin for people who already have a set like myself yes, but nothing wrong with that. 

We get new skyscale skills as well as what some have been calling mounted combat? Correct me if I'm wrong about that. 

 

@Dante.1508 when looking at AUD it can be a bit rough but that's nothing new at this point. Aussie dollar isn't doing so great at the moment and looks to be on the downward trend still.😔

Its not just the Aussie dollar though, these companies do not always do exact conversion rates imo.. What is the American Prices for SotO?

Edited June 30, 2023 by Dante.1508

[Serephen.3420]

1 minute ago, Dante.1508 said:

Its not just the Aussie dollar though, these companies do not do exact conversion rates imo.. What is the American Prices for SotO?

I wouldn't know because I'm not American 😅 

Though I think it shows on the website anyways. 

 

That said yeah, thiugh at least it's not as rough gouging as I get from Adobe. It's straight up daylight robbery🥲

Edited June 30, 2023 by Serephen.3420