Anti blobing : its time

[LordTemujin.5498]

take off the kitten 5 target lock and put anti kittenous blobing measures , thanks.

[Dopamine.6324]

so do i get this right, after this comm would call stacking for buffs and heals after that spread cloud repeat? sounds intresting

[Dawdler.8521]

So all the skills that heal, grant boons, bubbles, auras now do it to the entire zerg? 

Good idea there, surely this will stop super tanky boonballs 👍

[subversiontwo.7501]

One thing that is beginning to pique my interest a bit is that we're seeing an increase in all these complaints while playing as clouds grow as a norm. If one want to stop "them bad guilds and blobbers", I can inform you that it is already happening - without further help from ArenaNet. The developers are doing a fine enough job of that already by indefinately delaying the Alliance project and by having older issues they've caused ramp up with time, brewing with trouble. The inaction is an action of itself. So, I would suggest that an increase in threads like this stems from an increase of players who play what they feel is opposed to it.

The reality is that clouds are gaining ground while squads are losing ground in the realm of every day content. Most people starting recent balance conversions just have their heads too far up to see it. Beyond the 2-3 nomadic communities in EU, few other servers have very little in the way of stonger organised public content or competent larger guilds left. It is becomming sharply difficult to find that kind of content (read: opponent) in matchups already.

There are plenty of clouds and 50-large PPT groups though. Perhaps that is the evil boon balls you want to get rid of? Now, don't get me wrong. I'm not here to chastise how someone else plays. If people cloud and PPT, it is as much up to the organised premade groups to adapt and not make up false claims about balance. However, it is fair to stand by actual claims of balance and point to what actually seems to be trending around the servers in terms of content. Like I said, beyond that, I don't really know what people complain about half the time anymore so I try to steer clear of those topics. It feels like boonballs is anything from a 4-man party to a 50-man squad or single celestial roamer to people spamming these threads. While the reality is that these things impact quite differently depending on scale and type of content.

Edited October 7, 2023 by subversiontwo.7501

[LordTemujin.5498]

1 hour ago, Dawdler.8521 said:

So all the skills that heal, grant boons, bubbles, auras now do it to the entire zerg? 

Good idea there, surely this will stop super tanky boonballs 👍

hmm.... good point tho. i only tho about the offensive skills  and not the defensive ones  , but yea thats not good

[LordTemujin.5498]

1 hour ago, subversiontwo.7501 said:

One thing that is beginning to pique my interest a bit is that we're seeing an increase in all these complaints while playing as clouds grow as a norm. If one want to stop "them bad guilds and blobbers", I can inform you that it is already happening - without further help from ArenaNet. The developers are doing a fine enough job of that already by indefinately delaying the Alliance project and by having older issues they've caused ramp up with time, brewing with trouble. The inaction is an action of itself. So, I would suggest that an increase in threads like this stems from an increase of players who play what they feel is opposed to it.

The reality is that clouds are gaining ground while squads are losing ground in the realm of every day content. Most people starting recent balance conversions just have their heads too far up to see it. Beyond the 2-3 nomadic communities in EU, few other servers have very little in the way of stonger organised public content or competent larger guilds left. It is becomming sharply difficult to find that kind of content (read: opponent) in matchups already.

There are plenty of clouds and 50-large PPT groups though. Perhaps that is the evil boon balls you want to get rid of? Now, don't get me wrong. I'm not here to chastise how someone else plays. If people cloud and PPT, it is as much up to the organised premade groups to adapt and not make up false claims about balance. However, it is fair to stand by actual claims of balance and point to what actually seems to be trending around the servers in terms of content. Like I said, beyond that, I don't really know what people complain about half the time anymore so I try to steer clear of those topics. It feels like boonballs is anything from a 4-man party to a 50-man squad or single celestial roamer to people spamming these threads. While the reality is that these things impact quite differently depending on scale and type of content.

the only good cloud is magumaa . im talking zerg busting or mabye crack down on the super blobs like CO, flux etc... the concept of penalizing map queue blobs are hard to apply tho

the peak of WvW  for me is to watch 15-25 zergs crash on each others ! flankings!, surprise attacks ! fake pushes ! NOT  W KEYING IN BLOB !!

Edited October 7, 2023 by LordTemujin.5498

[Johje Holan.4607]

Create the Blob Bomb. It can be a trick or trap or like the siege disablers. It does insane damage and boon strip to players stacked on top of each other but barely tickles a single player not in some minimum range of another player. 

[subversiontwo.7501]

2 hours ago, LordTemujin.5498 said:

the only good cloud is magumaa . im talking zerg busting or mabye crack down on the super blobs like CO, flux etc... the concept of penalizing map queue blobs are hard to apply tho

the peak of WvW  for me is to watch 15-25 zergs crash on each others ! flankings!, surprise attacks ! fake pushes ! NOT  W KEYING IN BLOB !!

I don't disagree with you, I'd take it a step further and say that the peak of WvW for me is when we have a little bit of everything, solo content, party content, smaller squad content, midsized squad content and large squad content. The problem we face is simply that there are not enough good groups and players around that can bridge this content anymore because ArenaNet treats us like garbage. That's all there is to it.

If we take your example there: It's not like balance has changed so wildly that good 15-25 groups can't bust up to 25-50 public or relatively casual groups. The problem lies in that we've been choking the 15-25 groups out over years of full servers, paid transfers and encouraging various wagoneers to follow them around. We've lost most community building with community guilds and people helping new players - as ArenaNet has been more bent on flooding WvW with existing solo-minded PvE players that doesn't want help - than building WvW around the group-minded players the game has or could pull into the game to play WvW. It is an absolute catastrophic issue that we can't reasonably pull friends into this game from other games to play WvW together. It's not even a question of you having to pay  for the game all over again just to move off a server to play with a new friend you bring in. Instead you may need to pay for entire groups of friends to transfer off to play with some new friends or old friends returning. It is catastrophic and ArenaNet have had no urgency with it what so ever. They just don't care about us, enough.

Edited October 7, 2023 by subversiontwo.7501

[Knighthonor.4061]

The only anti zerg mechanics should come in the form of mobile siege weapons designed for Player vs zerg fighting.  This changes how zergs play. Tags would need to dedicate self defense along side their offensive strategies 

[Riba.3271]

If you want balanced fights, they need to fix the balance across the map first.

Stacked groups you can't do anything against alone will always aim to be strong enough to take T3 towers or keeps from average pugmanders as it is only way they can guarantee kills regardless of timezones. The fact that they seem so overwhelmingly strong, just shows how  overwhelming advantageous defending is these days. We have entered balance where stacked servers can easily defend anything when they will so, but are still reluctant to go on offensive unless they have a full discord group backing them up.

Now I am not saying flattening combat differences between offense and defense will instantly make superstacked groups disperse, but it will most definitely improve WvW longterm as they do not need to be as strong and they might even lose objectives during weaker moments.

Anyways, blobs here to stay as most popular way to play the game. The maps just aren't large enough to warrant splitting up. There just isn't enough reasonable objectives to fight around.

Edited October 7, 2023 by Riba.3271

[Aeolus.3615]

17 hours ago, LordTemujin.5498 said:

the only good cloud is magumaa . im talking zerg busting or mabye crack down on the super blobs like CO, flux etc... the concept of penalizing map queue blobs are hard to apply tho

the peak of WvW  for me is to watch 15-25 zergs crash on each others ! flankings!, surprise attacks ! fake pushes ! NOT  W KEYING IN BLOB !!

Several groups of 15-25 at max in several spots that is  a WvW dream, most omnizergs even run away if they find resistance to their group..

Sadly Anet gameplay is ment towards iin favor of Ktrain farming empty structures, they always said they would love to port what was hapening in EOTM to wvw.

 

They will always favour Ktrains like they do favor the perma boons groups, it is how pve works and how belive anet belives game is balanced in their lamers brains.

Edited October 8, 2023 by Aeolus.3615

[blp.3489]

18 hours ago, subversiontwo.7501 said:

It is an absolute catastrophic issue that we can't reasonably pull friends into this game from other games to play WvW together. It's not even a question of you having to pay  for the game all over again just to move off a server to play with a new friend you bring in. Instead you may need to pay for entire groups of friends to transfer off to play with some new friends or old friends returning. It is catastrophic and ArenaNet have had no urgency with it what so ever. They just don't care about us, enough.

This is an honest question: won't WR help in this regard?  Just have your new friend join your WvW guild?

I'm not sure if a new user could join a guild before entering WvW and get placed on the guild's team, or if they will be considered an individual until the next round of team-making.

[MedievalThings.5417]

All the blobs are running scorched earth cause it has a 25 target cap.  The problem isn't the target cap, the problem is downstate and boons.  Downstate shouldn't exist and boon sharing is stupidly broken.  The couple times Anet has admitted boon sharing was a problem, it was followed the next day with nerfing/removing boon strips.

[Edu.6984]

Reflects and projectile block need to be toned down. 1 single wall of reflection or ventari bubble can conter an infinite amount of projectiles. IMO those skills should have a cap, block X amount of projectiles and disappear. That would make non ground target ranged skills more reliable. That would remove one of the benefits of stacking.

[subversiontwo.7501]

6 hours ago, blp.3489 said:

This is an honest question: won't WR help in this regard?  Just have your new friend join your WvW guild?

I'm not sure if a new user could join a guild before entering WvW and get placed on the guild's team, or if they will be considered an individual until the next round of team-making.

Oh, yes it will. It will help, that is for sure. If it will be enough to turn the ship around at this point remains to be seen, but from a tech standpoint, that is the issue WR will solve.

I've just been around this game so long that I have learnt to speak Anet. The whole "we're refocusing on WR" might as well mean we get a post in 2025 that says "whoop-di-do, we dropped the ball again, we're sorry, please understand us, this update you WvW people really really need is very very complex and difficult for us, nudge nudge, wink wink".

Edited October 8, 2023 by subversiontwo.7501

[allshallperish.4620]

focus leader 

[Aeolus.3615]

14 hours ago, Edu.6984 said:

Reflects and projectile block need to be toned down. 1 single wall of reflection or ventari bubble can conter an infinite amount of projectiles. IMO those skills should have a cap, block X amount of projectiles and disappear. That would make non ground target ranged skills more reliable. That would remove one of the benefits of stacking.

IF Anet does that, that means the DPS of the range builds will go down to avoid being range broken easilly dps....

Players already have quite some  tools to bypass all that if they dont know wich specs to pair to nulify those not Anet problem in regards that.

Edited October 9, 2023 by Aeolus.3615

[Sirvaleen.1379]

Give us a bomb Relic already. Something like TESO's Vicious Death set last bonus. It would be fun at least to try that imho 💣

Edited October 9, 2023 by Sirvaleen.1379

[Zyreva.1078]

1 hour ago, Sirvaleen.1379 said:

Give us a bomb Relic already. Something like TESO's Vicious Death set last bonus. It would be fun at least to try that imho 💣

Unfortunately it wouldn't be quite as effective in GW2 as it is in ESO, but still a more fun effect for a relic than what we've got right now.

Edited October 9, 2023 by Zyreva.1078

[Edu.6984]

3 hours ago, Aeolus.3615 said:

IF Anet does that, that means the DPS of the range builds will go down to avoid being range broken easilly dps....

 

I believe you are wrong on this one.

Most projectiles are single target skills. Even if there was zero projectile reflect it is hard to imagine someone hitting 1 guy will do more dmg overall than people blasting aoes hitting 5 people. Also, I suggested projectile hate to be toned down, not completely deleted. A group could still run full projectile immunity, like current state, but that would require more investment. Right now there is almost zero trade off.

3 hours ago, Aeolus.3615 said:

Players already have quite some  tools to bypass all that if they dont know wich specs to pair to nulify those not Anet problem in regards that.

Only way for a projectile based skill to bypass a perma 100% projectile block/reflect is to have unblockable, witch very few skills have baseline and very few classes have access to that as a buff, and the ones that have only last a few seconds.

If you are advocating that bringing non projectile skills is the solution, that is the equivalent to balance the game so melee becomes useless and saying that the bypass is don't play melee.

Edited October 9, 2023 by Edu.6984

[Luthan.5236]

They could introduce the fractal mechanics that makes people stay away a bit from each other. Making it so it can't be bypassed with stability.
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Mistlock_Instability:_Social_Awkwardness

[Dawdler.8521]

1 hour ago, Luthan.5236 said:

They could introduce the fractal mechanics that makes people stay away a bit from each other. Making it so it can't be bypassed with stability.
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Mistlock_Instability:_Social_Awkwardness

Or make condition damage spread exponentially to everyone within 600 range, no target cap.

I mean you wouldn’t want to be near a sick person, right…

[Netrizhul.3429]

I always find target caps idea stupid way to balance abilities. There was a time it was in WoW then they removed then bring back after outcry they removed again. It's just stupid that "hey I'm 6th person here in this lava pool, since skill has 5 cap I'm completely safe from damage even though I'm in pool"

[kash.9213]

Don't come at them blob to blob when you're not a blob. Your side doesn't have to plow through them. If you put everything into keeping each other up and start down a kill list, even one or two knocked out of their composition will start a cascading scramble if you don't get impatient or frustrated and start running right into them again. If your side isn't even catching a body or two after hounding them for like ten minutes, they've got you with no target cap also. 

[MalekithDG.6124]

You cant stop blobbing without killing the mode in the process. To many people like blobbing. What you need to do is keeping the blobbing in the game but encouraging the skirmishing via more rewards. So that your skirmisher Joe and Denice doesnt opt in to existing blobs because skirmishing is so bad.

A complete objective-reward-siege overhaul of WvW could go a long way as well. Individuals and smaller groups are given less power. You cant even build a catapult efficiently, takes multiple back and forths to supply camp, let alone siege a keep without spending a year on the wall. When you capture the keep... Nothing. You gained nothing. Winning is not important, keep lord gives nothing, capturing the keep gives nothing. breaking the wall gives nothing. Nothing.