"GW2 has no healers" .... I wish they did :(

[FASTCAR.7831]

Ele and War are best, rest are meh

[MedievalThings.5417]

@"DeceiverX.8361" said:

Trinity games just force styles of play on people. Any other optimization in role-less games is the result of player mentality of speeding through content and nothing more.

Log in to wvw. The "no trinity" system we have now is forcing people to play 60-70% scourge, 10-20% firebrand and a few others for certain abillities if they want ANY chance at winning. There is no reason to play if you have 0% chance to win regardless of skill, and that is what we have. If you don't field the "forced meta" you stand no chance at winning.

[Buy Some Apples.6390]

@DeceiverX.8361 said:

@Buy Some Apples.6390 said:There are several builds which can be used as healer builds.

Problem is:1) Loot is based on damaging target above a certain amount in order for you to tag it for loot. Healer builds have very very low tag rate, hence very very low loot

This isn't true. Loot and WXP is also shared to people healing after a certain threshold amount of heals. So long as someone you heal gets a tag, you'll get the loot, too.

In a number of cases, the healers I've played with have gotten the most loot because they get loot coming in from two different sides of a fight or from people they've healed who have moved away from them and gotten kills.

After 4 years of playing a water support ele, I can tell you this is definitely NOT the case!

[FASTCAR.7831]

I get the most loot on my FULL healer Ele and WarBy far

[ZNICK.8537]

@FASTCAR.7831 said:

@ZNICK.8537 said:I'm not too sure about the loot... I've been playing full healz on my Tempest and if it's a world or meta event I still get the chest, and in WvW (where I spend more time) I still get pips, etc..

In what instance do healers get less loot?

Z

I get plenty of loot and a high amount of red items.Some days 3-4

I do too, so was confused what he's talking about.

Z

[DeceiverX.8361]

@Buy Some Apples.6390 said:

@DeceiverX.8361 said:

@Buy Some Apples.6390 said:There are several builds which can be used as healer builds.

Problem is:1) Loot is based on damaging target above a certain amount in order for you to tag it for loot. Healer builds have very very low tag rate, hence very very low loot

This isn't true. Loot and WXP is also shared to people healing after a certain threshold amount of heals. So long as someone you heal gets a tag, you'll get the loot, too.

In a number of cases, the healers I've played with have gotten the most loot because they get loot coming in from two different sides of a fight or from people they've healed who have moved away from them and gotten kills.

After 4 years of playing a water support ele, I can tell you this is definitely NOT the case!

Then you're doing a bad job healing because this is how it works and is the same testimony many above are also saying.

[DeceiverX.8361]

@Ubi.4136 said:

@"DeceiverX.8361" said:

Trinity games just force styles of play on people. Any other optimization in role-less games is the result of player mentality of speeding through content and nothing more.

Log in to wvw. The "no trinity" system we have now is

forcing

people to play 60-70% scourge, 10-20% firebrand and a few others for certain abillities if they want ANY chance at winning. There is no reason to play if you have 0% chance to win regardless of skill, and that is what we have. If you don't field the "forced meta" you stand no chance at winning.

That's because scourge's design is literally busted and will forever be OP in WvW. It has no realistic counterplay.

There's a huge difference between something being busted with no counter and a metagame not being possible.

[Kovu.7560]

If Anet keeps calling on Negan to bludgeon Druids over and over again, pretty soon Warriors will be better healers.Stay tuned, folks.

~ Kovu

[Vivilett.8509]

Yeah ive been doing 300k heals for my group lately , they been wiping scourges easy

[FASTCAR.7831]

A guy PM me that his Engy by the numbers out heals any Ele oO

[Israel.7056]

@DeceiverX.8361 said:That's because scourge's design is literally busted and will forever be OP in WvW. It has no realistic counterplay.

Scourge totally has counterplay. Scourge combined with firebrand support can be tough particularly in close quarters which is where I think a lot of players have the most trouble with them. It just so happens that almost all the capture nodes in the major objectives are relatively small and favor comps designed around close quarters combat.

[Tongku.5326]

Are tablet revs still capable or did they get completely put away due to their condi vulnreability ?

[FASTCAR.7831]

Rev was always bad

[Aeolus.3615]

@Tongku.5326 said:Are tablet revs still capable or did they get completely put away due to their condi vulnreability ?

it simply has no place in the current gameplay, due scourge + aoe spam range and rush when stackign in zerg, simply cause tablet takes damage easilly and it is needed to be on the action where spam happens, and it has a stupidly short heal range. (ANet borked their own gameplay all over again..as usual...)

I would not say condi vulnerability, due Purifying_Essence, but thi sskills needs its resource cost lowered to 20-15

Sometimes i really wonder if Anet dev's really know what they are doing and why they cant see the issues has many players do...

[Seffen.2875]

Firebrand

Tempest

Druid

Core guard

Revenant

Off Meta:

Core Warrior

Engineer

Core Elementalist

Scrapper

Weaver

"NO REAL HEALER" 10 out of 27 spec / core are able to do decent healing (though only 4 being meta) but there is definitely no real healer here.

Holy Trinity, 10 out of 27 ~ 30 %, I really don't see your Problem here.

[intox.6347]

@"Seffen.2875" said:Firebrand

Tempest

Druid

Core guard

Revenant

Off Meta:

Core Warrior

Engineer

Core Elementalist

Scrapper

Weaver

"NO REAL HEALER" 10 out of 27 spec / core are able to do decent healing (though only 4 being meta) but there is definitely no real healer here.

Holy Trinity, 10 out of 27 ~ 30 %, I really don't see your Problem here.

Holy trinity doesnt mean that you have 1/3 of all classes healers. That means you use classic style of party (classes) as a tank + healer(support) + dps, thats holy trinity.

[Israel.7056]

@Aeolus.3615 said:Sometimes i really wonder if Anet dev's really know what they are doing and why they cant see the issues has many players do...

Most of them don't play the game and the ones that do are atrociously bad. Complete novices. They balance with spreadsheets and golem testing and they have no idea what's going on at any level of the game except for maybe PvE where the golem testing and spreadsheets are somewhat applicable. Most of these people probably spend 40-50 hrs a week working on whatever the next thing is for this game does anyone really expect them to go home and play GW2? Forum feedback is unreliable because it's often either completely unrealistic and impractical or overly contentious and contradictory. It seems like they just throw changes at the game periodically and only notice the most vociferous feedback threads on reddit.

[Seffen.2875]

@intox.6347 said:

@"Seffen.2875" said:Firebrand

Tempest

Druid

Core guard

Revenant

Off Meta:

Core Warrior

Engineer

Core Elementalist

Scrapper

Weaver

"NO REAL HEALER" 10 out of 27 spec / core are able to do decent healing (though only 4 being meta) but there is definitely no real healer here.

Holy Trinity, 10 out of 27 ~ 30 %, I really don't see your Problem here.

Holy trinity doesnt mean that you have 1/3 of all classes healers. That means you use classic style of party (classes) as a tank + healer(support) + dps, thats holy trinity.

True that. But still, my Point is valid. There is the possibility to Play the classic healer. And there are classes fullfilling that role better than others. And as far as i can say there is a healer needed in the endgame of any mode.

[Aeolus.3615]

@Israel.7056 said:

@"Aeolus.3615" said:Sometimes i really wonder if Anet dev's really know what they are doing and why they cant see the issues has many players do...

Most of them don't play the game and the ones that do are atrociously bad. Complete novices. They balance with spreadsheets and golem testing and they have no idea what's going on at any level of the game except for maybe PvE where the golem testing and spreadsheets are somewhat applicable. Most of these people probably spend 40-50 hrs a week working on whatever the next thing is for this game does anyone really expect them to go home and play GW2? Forum feedback is unreliable because it's often either completely unrealistic and impractical or overly contentious and contradictory. It seems like they just throw changes at the game periodically and only notice the most vociferous feedback threads on reddit.

True....reason having a "balance tem" that knows how things are done in game and what is happenign and why is important across gamemodes, rather than look to a pve side where build can be easilly manipulated(metabatltle) in favour of some persons taste.But at the end im starting to believe we(as in players that actually want skillfull play rather than the pretend to be a skillfull game) are the one requesting to way to much, than what this game is about.... we should be at least playign "normal persons games" not a game for "bait content" trained chimps wich gw2 actually looks like.

I dont think forum isnt that unreliable, i ment it is easy to filter what is to much and what is acceptable, and dev's made the game they can easilly spot that, at least they should be, I has a software developer need to know what clients are talkign even if they are talkign wrongly or talking due lack of knowledge of some of my products but also need to notice when somehting went actually wrong even when the information isnt reliable , problem is when dev's cant produce some data and fail to aquire the correct data wich IMO is why this game have awfull gameplay atm.

For example...Anet saturated the game on HoT release and added more aoe spam in PoF, wich created an oversaturated and disgustfull gameplay, and yet for sure they will increase the aoe spam capabilities once more to create damage ouput in class evolution, rather than choose a clever design, where they could actually increase the AOE cap by reducing th cleave and spam overall, wich would create a more skillfull gameplay than see 40+ bad players rellying on spam and the other 10-20 decent players...

There are alot of wrongly implemented ideologies on this game, if dev's cant see what they are damaging more the product than making it good, well.. nothing more can be expected from this guys.

[Israel.7056]

@Aeolus.3615 said:

@Israel.7056 said:

@Aeolus.3615 said:Sometimes i really wonder if Anet dev's really know what they are doing and why they cant see the issues has many players do...

Most of them don't play the game and the ones that do are atrociously bad. Complete novices. They balance with spreadsheets and golem testing and they have no idea what's going on at any level of the game except for maybe PvE where the golem testing and spreadsheets are somewhat applicable. Most of these people probably spend 40-50 hrs a week working on whatever the next thing is for this game does anyone really expect them to go home and play GW2? Forum feedback is unreliable because it's often either completely unrealistic and impractical or overly contentious and contradictory. It seems like they just throw changes at the game periodically and only notice the most vociferous feedback threads on reddit.

True....reason having a "balance tem" that knows how things are done in game and what is happenign and why is important across gamemodes, rather than look to a pve side where build can be easilly manipulated(metabatltle) in favour of some persons taste.But at the end im starting to believe we(as in players that actually want skillfull play rather than the pretend to be a skillfull game) are the one requesting to way to much, than what this game is about.... we should be at least playign "normal persons games" not a game for "bait content" trained chimps wich gw2 actually looks like.

I dont think forum isnt that unreliable, i ment it is easy to filter what is to much and what is acceptable, and dev's made the game they can easilly spot that, at least they should be, I has a software developer need to know what clients are talkign even if they are talkign wrongly or talking due lack of knowledge of some of my products but also need to notice when somehting went actually wrong even when the information isnt reliable , problem is when dev's cant produce some data and fail to aquire the correct data wich IMO is why this game have awfull gameplay atm.

For example...Anet saturated the game on HoT release and added more aoe spam in PoF, wich created an oversaturated and disgustfull gameplay, and yet for sure they will increase the aoe spam capabilities once more to create damage ouput in class evolution, rather than choose a clever design, where they could actually increase the AOE cap by reducing th cleave and spam overall, wich would create a more skillfull gameplay than see 40+ bad players rellying on spam and the other 10-20 decent players...

There are alot of wrongly implemented ideologies on this game, if dev's cant see what they are damaging more the product than making it good, well.. nothing more can be expected from this guys.

Why do you take it for granted that the balance team "knows how things are done in game and what is happening and why?"

Forums are incredibly unreliable imagine having to try to sift through these forums for useful feedback. Actually try to imagine doing it.

[ArmageddonAsh.6430]

@Aeolus.3615 said:

@Tongku.5326 said:Are tablet revs still capable or did they get completely put away due to their condi vulnreability ?

it simply has no place in the current gameplay, due scourge + aoe spam range and rush when stackign in zerg, simply cause tablet takes damage easilly and it is needed to be on the action where spam happens, and it has a stupidly short heal range. (ANet borked their own gameplay all over again..as usual...)

I would not say condi vulnerability, due Purifying_Essence, but thi sskills needs its resource cost lowered to 20-15

Sometimes i really wonder if Anet dev's really know what they are doing and why they cant see the issues has many players do...

Since when does Ventari take damage? Are you sure you're not getting confused with the Renegade summons? Ventari Tablet doesnt take damage. It is however rather poorly designed for fast paced, constantly moving combat. When combined with Mal and some of the traits, it could be SEMI-decent. Remove/transfer like 4-5 conditions on legend swap, decent Resistance (suckas against scourge though :/) condition removal on Staff, on Ventari skills and elite

[Aeolus.3615]

@ArmageddonAsh.6430 said:

@Aeolus.3615 said:

@Tongku.5326 said:Are tablet revs still capable or did they get completely put away due to their condi vulnreability ?

it simply has no place in the current gameplay, due scourge + aoe spam range and rush when stackign in zerg, simply cause tablet takes damage easilly and it is needed to be on the action where spam happens, and it has a stupidly short heal range. (ANet borked their own gameplay all over again..as usual...)

I would not say condi vulnerability, due Purifying_Essence, but thi sskills needs its resource cost lowered to 20-15

Sometimes i really wonder if Anet dev's really know what they are doing and why they cant see the issues has many players do...

Since when does Ventari take damage? Are you sure you're not getting confused with the Renegade summons? Ventari Tablet doesnt take damage. It is however rather poorly designed for fast paced, constantly moving combat. When combined with Mal and some of the traits, it could be SEMI-decent. Remove/transfer like 4-5 conditions on legend swap, decent Resistance (suckas against scourge though :/) condition removal on Staff, on Ventari skills and elite

Tks for the correction, had to play it again and see why i tough they were destroyed, for some reason i tough they were destroyable like sumons, i played with ventari 2 months ago, should remember it wasnt destroyable..but for some reason....

yeah testing against group with lots of scourges wasnt the ideal test ground, it is a pain, had to swap back to Jalis, that thign with mediocre to decent groups on both sides is unplayable due combat movement required.

[ArmageddonAsh.6430]

@Aeolus.3615 said:Tks for the correction, had to play it again and see why i tough they were destroyed, for some reason i tough they were destroyable like sumons, i played with ventari 2 months ago, should remember it wasnt destroyable..but for some reason....

yeah testing against group with lots of scourges wasnt the ideal test ground, it is a pain, had to swap back to Jalis, that thign with mediocre to decent groups on both sides is unplayable due combat movement required.

Thankfully it isnt, its bad enough designed as it is, imagine if it was killable as well lolI think the bigger problem with Ventari is the tablet design. Its poorly designed in a game that is about movjng, fast paced combat and everything to have to keep moving the tablet every few seconds. In my opinion, they should remove the tablet and make the effects happen round the Revenant. The Heal would need to be changed. Maybe have the Heal summon a passive tablet that follows you and heals and keep the elite so that it is used to destroy the tablet but the utilities proc around yourself rather than the tablet. It has some good skills but its too fiddly and too micro management heavy for this kind of game. Would actually work in a game like WoW where boss fights and such arent all about moving every 2seconds and such but here, it just doesnt work as well.

[FASTCAR.7831]

None of the above are in the class of EleEngy doesnt heal 5% as much

[Bigpapasmurf.5623]

I just wanna say that I have mad respect for those that play support.

Im too impatient in fights and need to do damage to be able to play a good support. They keep the condis off us and provide much needed heals in fights to keep the DPS peeps going.

RespectTheSupports