Make more money Anet

[Crab Fear.1624]

@derd.6413 said:

@Crab Fear.1624 said:

@derd.6413 said:

@Crab Fear.1624 said:

@derd.6413 said:let's go over them one by one

• no
• no
• no
• no
• you're argument is terrible but they probably should still consider a way to sell older xpacs cheaper
• would be nice but probably not

i'd give it a 1/6, it overall would just be pointless since anet is making enough money to support development and more money doesn't mean more good content (if it even would make them more money given that it would antagonize parts of their playerbase)

players like you, who want everything free, are in large, part of the reason those layoff happened not to long ago. not all content will meet your standards of good, but more content is better than less content.

with no expansion on the horizon any time soon, how do you expect they will keep the lights on? how will they keep the wheel turning? magic?

the freeloader player base can be antagonized all day, they are not what keeps the game going.

um no, anet lay-offs had nothing to do with anet not making enough money so you can cut the guilt tripping and i don't want everything for free, i want anet to not turn into EA or activision when it comes to monetization (or anything really)

anet makes enough money they're not going bankrupt. stop with that nonsense.

um yes

"Citing an internal email, Kotaku reported that NCSoft West’s CEO Songyee Yoon told employees: “Our live game business revenue is declining as our franchises age, delays in development on PC and mobile have created further drains against our revenue projects, while our operating costs in the west have increased … Where we are is not sustainable, and is not going to set us up for future success.”"

https://www.geekwire.com/2019/guild-wars-2-developer-arenanet-confirms-layoffs-canceled-projects/

it clearly says they were not making enough money.

they didn't make enough money to fund additional projects, and that probably contributed to it as well.

edit: thought I should point at those reasons are in that TOP 10 list I gave you.

they weren't talking about gw2 they were talking about all their mmo's which has 2 completely different ramification

GW2 is in that group, so yeah they were talking about them.

[derd.6413]

@Crab Fear.1624 said:

@derd.6413 said:

@Crab Fear.1624 said:

@derd.6413 said:

@Crab Fear.1624 said:

@derd.6413 said:let's go over them one by one

• no
• no
• no
• no
• you're argument is terrible but they probably should still consider a way to sell older xpacs cheaper
• would be nice but probably not

i'd give it a 1/6, it overall would just be pointless since anet is making enough money to support development and more money doesn't mean more good content (if it even would make them more money given that it would antagonize parts of their playerbase)

players like you, who want everything free, are in large, part of the reason those layoff happened not to long ago. not all content will meet your standards of good, but more content is better than less content.

with no expansion on the horizon any time soon, how do you expect they will keep the lights on? how will they keep the wheel turning? magic?

the freeloader player base can be antagonized all day, they are not what keeps the game going.

um no, anet lay-offs had nothing to do with anet not making enough money so you can cut the guilt tripping and i don't want everything for free, i want anet to not turn into EA or activision when it comes to monetization (or anything really)

anet makes enough money they're not going bankrupt. stop with that nonsense.

um yes

"Citing an internal email, Kotaku reported that NCSoft West’s CEO Songyee Yoon told employees: “Our live game business revenue is declining as our franchises age, delays in development on PC and mobile have created further drains against our revenue projects, while our operating costs in the west have increased … Where we are is not sustainable, and is not going to set us up for future success.”"

https://www.geekwire.com/2019/guild-wars-2-developer-arenanet-confirms-layoffs-canceled-projects/

it clearly says they were not making enough money.

they didn't make enough money to fund additional projects, and that probably contributed to it as well.

edit: thought I should point at those reasons are in that TOP 10 list I gave you.

they weren't talking about gw2 they were talking about all their mmo's which has 2 completely different ramification

GW2 is in that group, so yeah they were talking about them.

but read the last 6 words of my previous comment

[TheGrimm.5624]

@kharmin.7683 said:

@TheGrimm.5624 said:

Now I will play the other side, why doesn't GW2 offer discounts on more gems, see above, a discount would reduce the incoming cash since you would get more for less.How would that impact the in-game economy?

Wasn't coming at in from the ingame economy side but the side that if ANet offered an increased amount of gems for a lower dollar they would make less over the same amount of lower dollar transactions, but it would create incentive to a player buying gems to buy more if there was a price break.

[PlagueParade.7942]

They want to make money? PUT the black lion key on sale blast it!!!!

[IndigoSundown.5419]

@"Crab Fear.1624" said:

um yes

"Citing an internal email, Kotaku reported that NCSoft West’s CEO Songyee Yoon told employees: “Our live game business revenue is declining as our franchises age, delays in development on PC and mobile have created further drains against our revenue projects, while our operating costs in the west have increased … Where we are is not sustainable, and is not going to set us up for future success.”"

https://www.geekwire.com/2019/guild-wars-2-developer-arenanet-confirms-layoffs-canceled-projects/

it clearly says they were not making enough money.

they didn't make enough money to fund additional projects, and that probably contributed to it as well.

A decline in revenue as a gaming franchise ages is an expected part of the gaming business. Once you understand that, it's easy to conclude that the real problem was exactly what NCSoft stated. They were funding development that produced no revenue and costs have gone up.

So, we can conclude that -- across all NCSOft properties -- they were not making enough to continue to fund operations and development, and show enough profit to satisfy shareholders, with the revenue they are producing. We can conclude that GW2 revenue on its own was insufficient to counterbalance the increased costs in western ops/development. We cannot conclude that GW2 does not bring in enough revenue to support itself, or even to counterbalance the revised western ops/development costs post restructuring and show a reasonable profit.

Sure, any business would of course want more revenue. However, the best way to generate more revenue is to provide something consumers want. Simply charging for things that are now free is going to result in lost revenue from current sources. That's a guarantee. People do not react well to having to pay (or pay more) for things that they think they are entitled to. That's Consumer Psychology 101. Pity the old forums are archived. If you looked at the time when HoT was coming out, the outrage over HoT's cost, ANet's perceived money-grab, and their disregard for veteran players was quite instructive.

Also -- as it stands, cutting the value of gems is going to result in loss of gem sales. Fewer people will trade gold-to-gems, which will make gems-to-gold look less attractive. If you think that enough players who currently buy gems with gold are going to suddenly start buying a new premium, cash-only currency to counterbalance the lost revenue from gems-to-gold, well, that is not going to happen. That's also Consumer Psychology 101.

[Blude.6812]

Time to give it up peeps. Just let the thread die. The idea has no merit and needs to be let go of.

[Riverborn.1542]

Making people charge for something that was free before is kinda too EA and would cause an uprising of very angry players.

[Healix.5819]

@Riverborn.1542 said:Making people charge for something that was free before is kinda too EA and would cause an uprising of very angry players.

Most people wouldn't even notice. ArenaNet would never charge for the living world for example, since the whole point is to keep people coming back. They would instead slow it down and divert those resources to releasing paid DLC side stories or quicker expansions.

[Kurrilino.2706]

@Crab Fear.1624 said:

@Kurrilino.2706 said:

@Crab Fear.1624 said:players like you, who want everything free, are in large, part of the reason those layoff happened not to long ago. not all content will meet your standards of good, but more content is better than less content.

with no expansion on the horizon any time soon, how do you expect they will keep the lights on? how will they keep the wheel turning? magic?

the freeloader player base can be antagonized all day, they are not what keeps the game going.

EDIT: seriously, dude. what are your awesome suggestions that they can do right now and make more money. old content won't keep your game alive, especially when it's free to play. you slapped them all down like you have some kind of high ground, but what idea did you put forth? NONE.

No idea why you attack this person.Just for the case you didn't notice. The lights will go off anyways.If you decide to throw money at a dying game it's your thing to do. But don't attack people who are not oblivious to the world around them.

Firing a huge chunk of the staff including key position people and openly announcing there will be no future content is not ringing a bell i assume.

When did they say no future content? I saw that no expansion were currently in the works, but I also saw they are moving forward with LS content as planned. Since that is not today, that is future content.

Whatever the direction was, it was obviously wrong.

Also for attacking "this person", read their initial response to my OP. Imagine they responded in that way to a list of your suggestions to get some perspective.

The game needs revenue to survive. More free content, and no expansion in sight doesn't feel good.

If the game dies, I can move on and forget it. It's not a family member or a pet, but it has been a good way to past time and drink beer.

They announced it right after they they apologized for firing all the good people. You can also look into their job postings.Every single job posting has been removed. No connect the dots. Tons of people were let go and none will be hired.That screams tons of awesome future content.

My personal guess is they deliver the next living season and let the game slowly die off after and hope people still throw money at them

[Crab Fear.1624]

@Kurrilino.2706 said:

@Crab Fear.1624 said:

@Kurrilino.2706 said:

@Crab Fear.1624 said:players like you, who want everything free, are in large, part of the reason those layoff happened not to long ago. not all content will meet your standards of good, but more content is better than less content.

with no expansion on the horizon any time soon, how do you expect they will keep the lights on? how will they keep the wheel turning? magic?

the freeloader player base can be antagonized all day, they are not what keeps the game going.

EDIT: seriously, dude. what are your awesome suggestions that they can do right now and make more money. old content won't keep your game alive, especially when it's free to play. you slapped them all down like you have some kind of high ground, but what idea did you put forth? NONE.

No idea why you attack this person.Just for the case you didn't notice. The lights will go off anyways.If you decide to throw money at a dying game it's your thing to do. But don't attack people who are not oblivious to the world around them.

Firing a huge chunk of the staff including key position people and openly announcing there will be no future content is not ringing a bell i assume.

When did they say no future content? I saw that no expansion were currently in the works, but I also saw they are moving forward with LS content as planned. Since that is not today, that is future content.

Whatever the direction was, it was obviously wrong.

Also for attacking "this person", read their initial response to my OP. Imagine they responded in that way to a list of your suggestions to get some perspective.

The game needs revenue to survive. More free content, and no expansion in sight doesn't feel good.

If the game dies, I can move on and forget it. It's not a family member or a pet, but it has been a good way to past time and drink beer.

They announced it right after they they apologized for firing all the good people. You can also look into their job postings.Every single job posting has been removed. No connect the dots. Tons of people were let go and none will be hired.That screams tons of awesome future content.

My personal guess is they deliver the next living season and let the game slowly die off after and hope people still throw money at them

That's sad.

[Healix.5819]

@Kurrilino.2706 said:Every single job posting has been removed. No connect the dots. Tons of people were let go and none will be hired.

Those jobs were not related to GW2. They've been hiring for future projects for a few years now, which is why a new game has been expected for a while now. Also, they have already hired people after the layoffs.

My personal guess is they deliver the next living season and let the game slowly die off after and hope people still throw money at them

That was likely the plan prior to the layoffs, as they were focused on their next game. With it cancelled and the people who were moved off of GW2 back on GW2, GW2's development team has basically doubled, which returns it to its original size.

[hellsqueen.3045]

@"hellsqueen.3045" said:Your suggested changes are ridiculous and would stand to damage the health of the game.

Many people chose Guild Wars because it was pay to play.There was no subscription.There was free content updates.There was skins that you could buy.There was quality of life and extra things you could buy instead of subscriptions.Yet, it wasn't pay to win.

People hate pay to win.

But if you really think ANets design is the wrong one, then I dare you to write out a comparison of the way ANet are doing this now and then go look at Warframe.

Warframe is Free To Play and still runs its game off of a similar system to Guild Wars. You can earn everything, including the premium currency by playing but you can also pay money to experience it easier without hindering other players. Warframe runs their game solely off the optional purchases and are doing beyond fine.

If Warframe can, so can Guild Wars 2 and ANet. And they are.It is not a dying monetization scheme, it is the one that is best for the community.

Will have to talk to a guildmate that plays Warframe tonight. Not sure I get your point here. After a quick glance it looks like Warframe uses a model that is more you pay the more bonus currency you get. GW2 uses a flat method with no discount the more you buy. In reality for those that spend cash to support versus convert to gold this would be an increase and kind of along the same lines that the OP is talking about. Actually was surprised GW2 didn't use this method first time I bought gems, why wasn't there a per gem discount the more was purchased. Could be a tipping scale do I spend 20 or 40 or 100.

I more meant in terms of being able to trade into obtaining the paid currency and such.Warframe is free to play and you could play the game your entire life without paying a cent, you have to work a bit harder but you can manage it. It comes from trading items between players for the currency but it still lets players obtain premium currency for in game items.They still offer skin purchases and some are even fan made skin exclusives.They offer special packages to be the first to get the new frames without crafting them and they come with exlusive skins and extra stuff.

Overall their schemes still let people play the game on equal terms, it isn't pay to win. It is a free-to-play that runs off the idea that if people can pay for things they want, there will always be those that will. They even spend time asking the community about how they feel about packages and it's pricings and what kinds of packages there could be.

Back in the early stages of their games and the when the warframes were starting to come out in packages or an old frame was being unvaulted, the unvaulted warframe came back into circulation with some unique skins but you had to buy the whole package when you really didn't need the warframe again. The community told Warframe "hey it's really expensive to buy this whole package again especially when I already have the frame from when before it was vaulted". They stopped and listened and offered some extra packages and bothered to ask what the community thought was a reasonable price for them to pay while still being enough for the company.

If Warframe can survive as a free-to-play game running off a system where you could manage to play free-to-play forever and you don't feel the weight of pay-to-win anywhere around you, ANets model really isn't that bad for earning them cash.

Guild Wars at the end of the day, is buy to play with the option for paid currency on top of that. Overall, you would likely end up spending more in Guild Wars than in Warframe just because of their designs. As I mentioned, gold to gem conversion is so poor that it promotes gem purchases anyway, especially if the item is incredibly expensive ((infinite gathering tools D: those are real expensive))

[Rasimir.6239]

@"TheGrimm.5624" said:We still come back to the same question:

• GW2 is a B2P, and is committed to that
• Players can buy gems today with cash, there is no limit, they can do this themselves daily, weekly, monthly, whenever
• Gem sales via cash is a source of income and is optional, and there is no price break on buying more or less
• Gold to gems is NOT a source of income, it will keep some players in game and there is a chance of future sales via items and expansions

So why would an account addon that allowed for a reacquiring gem purchase with a discount or some account convenience since it was automated and allowed ANet directional feedback on how the game was being managed impact other players? We are not talking about subscription that limits game access. People that don't buy gems today still wouldn't. All it might do is give the people that do buy gems for cash already more incentive to do so if want to show support and are happy with direction. This doesn't take time from game development. The account receivable and business analysts are not coding environments or doing skill balancing.

So to players that say no other options, why? Besides it not being a service they offer today? If you had friend that is playing because GW2 has B2P and still did tomorrow why would they quit because someone else was buying gems and paying for future development?Psychology. We've had a few threads about discounted gem offers in the past, and the majority replies come down to being more likely to buy gems because in this game you will always get the best (as it's the only) value for your real world money, no matter if you buy 800 gems every couple of weeks or 4k every six months. It's one of the pillars that make ANet's gemstore look "fair" to a lot of players compared to competitors. Gem discounts (either as time-limited sales, recurring subscriptions, or for buying larger chunks at once), while working to nudge a lot of people into buying gems they might not need for the perceived bonus, will also put a sizeable number of people up in arms, shouting about predatory tactics and such, and they do have a point.

ANet has decided that stable gem prices (when bought with real money) is the way they want to go, and they've kept to that for more than six years. It looks like it works for them, and the backlash to changing the system now might well be more damaging to their reputation and playerbase than the added income from people lured into spending on sales or optional subscriptions.