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LIs to Divinations exchange removed


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Guess no legendary ring for me then...

Just didn't care about raiding any more after beating Qadim since accessibility to W5 and W6 is downright awful and having to work and study really doesn't go along that well with PUG-raiding. Would have been nice if the permanent (!) exchange was still a thing to try to get a sufficient amount of LI to exchange through W1 - W4 and maybe W7 (hope this one won't go the "have a bazillion KP or else kitten off"-route), but a temporary return is just annoying - you need 150 LD for the ring after all (that's basically your first full set of legendary armor).

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@Magnus Godrik.5841 said:If you had the chance to exchange it earlier why would you wait to do so. I expected it would disappear as it was an option given to those who did the raids when they only dropped LI.

People are still working on Legendary Armors, there was nothing to spend LD on, and the conversion was assured to be permanent.Why wouldn't you wait?

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What is with the players who were doing the legendary armor first and now dont have enough LI? I mean, this "LI -> LD -Option" is for the players who cleared W5 after release, because they got LI and not LD as reward. I am one of these players, who dont convert their LI instantly because i was doing the legy armor first and i thought i can get my LD from W5 (it must be around 100) anytime as anet said in their old post. Now i have just 3 LI in my bank because i finished my armors a few days ago. Anet said they bring the option back but just for a limited time. So, if i do the clear from wing 1 to 4 next week and anet brings the option back next tuesday for just one week, i can never get my 100 LD i earned after the release of W5, just 15. So, i would agree with previous posts. Why not both options? This would be good for those one who using their li from w5 to craft the armor and dont have enough time to collect enough to get the LD they earned ...

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@Stephane Lo Presti.7258 said:After talking to the team, we want to make clear that we intended to communicate this change before the update so that the community is aware. Unfortunately this didn’t happen and we apologize for this miscommunication.

The team is now looking into temporarily bringing back this conversion option via the vendor. This functionality will be brought back in a future planned build and we will tell you ahead of time when it will be removed.

Thank you! I am perfectly fine with this solution.

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@Asum.4960 said:

@Magnus Godrik.5841 said:If you had the chance to exchange it earlier why would you wait to do so. I expected it would disappear as it was an option given to those who did the raids when they only dropped LI.

People are still working on Legendary Armors, there was nothing to spend LD on, and the conversion was assured to be permanent.Why wouldn't you wait?Precisely. Waiting was the most sensible solution. And it was also the reason why people asked to make sure first whether the option would be time-limited or not. And they were assured it wouldn't be.

@Peter Panda.5629 said:Thank you! I am perfectly fine with this solution.There are some good arguments mentioned before (for example in a post above yours) for it
not
being good enough. Seriously, they did make a promise that this exchange won't disappear, and a number of players made their spending policy based on that assumption. And breaking such a promise is not a good thing - who's going to believe you next time? It's something to be done only when there's a really good and compelling reason to do so. Preferably one you can share with the community to get them on board.

This time however, Anet can't even give us a reason why this exchange was removed in the first place - and i don't mean a good reason. I mean, any explanation whatsoever. Sure, we do know why they are doing that - the PoF raids aren't as popular as the first 4 wings. They aren't even close to that. And Anet would like to push people to move from old raids into new ones, without realizing that there might be other, very good reasons, for people less liking new raids (like their difficulty, for example - w5 had done a lot to reduce player interest in raids). The question is - is that reason good enough to risk a PR kittenstorm, and a loss of trust? Personally, i don't think so. There are other ways to encourage players to play new content. There aren't many ways to regain lost trust however.

Honestly, by that point they should merge LI and LD into one, and be glad people are still running any raid. If there are players that want to farm Coalescence in old raids? That's fine, they still are playing the content. And they would still need to clear w5-7 at least once anyway.What, you're afraid that some people have enough LI to insta-buy Coalescence now? Hint: those players likely have enough LDs as well. It's not like those are a new thing.

So, just merge Insights and Divinations, and introduce some new repeatable rewards to buy for it - make the ring recraftable, maybe a backpack or something, maybe even some loot boxes for LI/LD with mats for legendary crafting (t6, clovers, Mystic Coins, etc). maybe even let raiders buy Gifts of Map Completion outright (with a steep price of course).And then let people choose which wings they prefer.

It's a game without raid tier progression - embrace that instead of acting as if you hated the very idea.

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@"Talindra.4958" said:I think they should just give all players the ring free. Everyone has a life outside game

Did I said that ? No.

I said : "Plus, I remind you that you have to kill all the bosses from W5, W6 and W7 to finish the collections of Coalescence, so in way or another you have to finish those raids. So who cares how you obtain the LD you need to finish the recipe for the ring ???"

Plus I remind you that legendary weapons are free too, and everybody is happy with that !

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@"Ayrilana.1396" said:It may not be permanent because since only three wings count towards divinations, and the new legendary requires them, they'd prefer that players get them from those wings only (or at least going forward). Otherwise players could ignore them altogether outside of what's needed for the collections which would be like a single full clear of each wing.

Now if they kept the 168 cap, it wouldn't be as bad since players would still need to farm another 182 divinations.

They dont need to farm any more ld since you only need 150 thats covered by the 168 conversion.https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Coalescence

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@Linken.6345 said:

@"Ayrilana.1396" said:It may not be permanent because since only three wings count towards divinations, and the new legendary requires them, they'd prefer that players get them from those wings only (or at least going forward). Otherwise players could ignore them altogether outside of what's needed for the collections which would be like a single full clear of each wing.

Now if they kept the 168 cap, it wouldn't be as bad since players would still need to farm another 182 divinations.

They dont need to farm any more ld since you only need 150 thats covered by the 168 conversion.

I double-counted something and accidentally used the raid currency as divisions. So yeah, it’s just 150. I’ll correct the post.

It seems that they’re trying to keep wings 5-7 relevant by giving players an incentive to do them to get legendary armor but not remove a need to do them beyond the initial full clears in order to get the ring.

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@Ayrilana.1396 said:

@Ayrilana.1396 said:It may not be permanent because since only three wings count towards divinations, and the new legendary requires them, they'd prefer that players get them from those wings only (or at least going forward). Otherwise players could ignore them altogether outside of what's needed for the collections which would be like a single full clear of each wing.

Now if they kept the 168 cap, it wouldn't be as bad since players would still need to farm another 182 divinations.

They dont need to farm any more ld since you only need 150 thats covered by the 168 conversion.

I double-counted something and accidentally used the raid currency as divisions. So yeah, it’s just 150. I’ll correct the post.

It seems that they’re trying to keep wings 5-7 relevant by giving players an incentive to do them to get legendary armor but not remove a need to do them beyond the initial full clears in order to get the ring.If they have to do such shenanigans because they fear the old content is more relevant than the new one, it means there's a problem with the content itself. Maybe they should look into it, instead of trying to use ducttape and painting grass.
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@Astralporing.1957 said:

@Ayrilana.1396 said:It may not be permanent because since only three wings count towards divinations, and the new legendary requires them, they'd prefer that players get them from those wings only (or at least going forward). Otherwise players could ignore them altogether outside of what's needed for the collections which would be like a single full clear of each wing.

Now if they kept the 168 cap, it wouldn't be as bad since players would still need to farm another 182 divinations.

They dont need to farm any more ld since you only need 150 thats covered by the 168 conversion.

I double-counted something and accidentally used the raid currency as divisions. So yeah, it’s just 150. I’ll correct the post.

It seems that they’re trying to keep wings 5-7 relevant by giving players an incentive to do them to get legendary armor but not remove a need to do them beyond the initial full clears in order to get the ring.If they have to do such shenanigans because they fear the old content is more relevant than the new one, it means there's a problem with the content itself. Maybe they should look into it, instead of trying to use ducttape and painting grass.

Perhaps or perhaps a percentage of players are doing it to chase rewards and the change is aimed at the latter. .

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@Ayrilana.1396 said:Perhaps or perhaps a percentage of players are doing it to chase rewards and the change is aimed at the latter. .That's still a problem with the content. For one, by introducing LD->LI exchange so the people doing new wings won't feel like losing out, they admitted that the old rewards were better. And that LDs are for the most part useless.For another, if there's a significant number of players that would rather do old wings over new ones for the ring, and Anet feels it's important enough that they should rather do the new ones, then perhaps Anet should have taken them into consideration when designing wings 5-7.

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@Astralporing.1957 said:That's still a problem with the content. For one, by introducing LD->LI exchange so the people doing new wings won't feel like losing out, they admitted that the old rewards were better. And that LDs are for the most part useless.

Talking from personal experience here:When a new member joins my static group the more experienced raiders ask them which parts they are missing from their legendary armor, often they miss everything if they are completely new to Raids. Then we go and finish Wings 1 through 4 as many times as required so those newer players can get their legendary armor completed. The more experienced members of the group don't really care about the ring (me included), so we run POF Raids mostly when we want to try something new.

I'm sure a lot of the static raid groups also work like this as Legendary Armor is far more important than a Legendary Ring.

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Indeed. Not only a Legendary Armor set is more important than a single ring, but you also can craft multiples, while the ring is not repeatable. It really looks like they either originally intended to introduce more rewards for PoF wings (and abandoned the idea halfway), or that it was LDs that were a departure from the original plan (perhaps enforced from above). If i remember the original talks about raids well, i think they intended LIs to be an uniform currency for all raids, not just for few wings.

All in all, it is a design failure. One they are trying to ducttape right now. Without admitting outright that it was a failure.

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The other aspect is the vast cost/benefit difference for the items.

Legendary armor is, I have said so in the past, to cheap. It's at most 6-8 times as expensive as ascended armor while weapons are a lot more expensive and less useful.

For Coalescence this becomes a factor of, oh I don't even want to do the math. Ascended trinkets are way to cheap for the performance they bring (Living World Season 3, now Living World Season 4, 15-19 pristine fractal relics per day, etc.). Yet Coalescence and other legendary trinkets are similar priced as expensive T1 legendary weapons.

The incentive to get these rewards is very low. Even less given some of the hardest bosses are in wing 5-7.

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The problem is not why some of us didn't change our LI => LD, but why they remove it after they confirmed there was no time limit and without tell us about the removing. That's not good, especially for a compagny like GW2. And I think they should bring back this conversion for good with no limit time.

Now we know that they will bring back the thing, the question is when ? Because if they bring back LI => LD in a mouth, I don't get the point. They said they have an update on Monday, we'll see !

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@Linken.6345 said:We dident know how much and if we would be able to convert ld back to li so converting to many would have been a waste.

People sit on 1k+ LI after crafting 3 sets of legendary armor and converting to LD - THAT'S a waste. Pugs will most likely ask for latest LI. So there's going to be LI 3.0 (If we ever get more raids OMEGALUL). Now all that LD we have left is going to waste since there is no other option to utilize leftovers.

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@Krzysztof.5973 said:

@Linken.6345 said:We dident know how much and if we would be able to convert ld back to li so converting to many would have been a waste.

People sit on 1k+ LI after crafting 3 sets of legendary armor and converting to LD - THAT'S a waste.Anet themselves just admitted that, barring 150 LD for Coalescence, they are completely useless. That is the very reason why they introduced LD->LI exchange. LIs at least still have some use.

Pugs will most likely ask for latest LI. So there's going to be LI 3.0 (If we ever get more raids OMEGALUL)Even if we get new raids (which as you noticed is not all that certain) i doubt we'd get LI 3.0. For the very reason outlined above - they'd need to introduce some good, long term (and
repeatable
) rewards. They couldn't do that for LDs, so there's even less chance they would do that for LI 3.0.

Now all that LD we have left is going to waste since there is no other option to utilize leftovers.That is exactly the reason why people waited before exchanging LI for LDs - they predicted this might happen.

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@Krzysztof.5973 said:

@Linken.6345 said:We dident know how much and if we would be able to convert ld back to li so converting to many would have been a waste.

People sit on 1k+ LI after crafting 3 sets of legendary armor and converting to LD - THAT'S a waste. Pugs will most likely ask for latest LI. So there's going to be LI 3.0 (If we ever get more raids OMEGALUL). Now all that LD we have left is going to waste since there is no other option to utilize leftovers.

I have 4 sets of legendary armor and am about to make my 5th (and I'll likely keep making armors until my main squad of each class is decked out). It's not about the title for everyone you know.

LI were more useful than LD the entire time (and still are by the way, hence the ability to convert back). Not converting LI to LD when specifically told that the option would remain available was the actual smart move, since that way players were able to keep their resources useful until LD were actual made useful.

Again, I am not personally affected since even without converting I am sitting on 200+ LD currently and will likely convert back if no other legendary trinkets are made available via LD. It's still a not well communicated move.

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@Jude Lhogora.6917 said:

@"Talindra.4958" said:I think ppl missunderstood the idea of this free conversion. Players need to physically do new wings to earn it. I didnt think they should have given players the free conversion so generously. Its just like li, leg armour, ppl need to do it or buy it. But nevertheless i do agree they should have informed

Really ? It's a game not life, just chill a bit. I remember you that we all bought the same game so it must gives you the same things to
ALL
. Raids are only for the elite of players, that a fact but it's open to
everyone
. There are actually ppl like me you don't like raiding all weeks and they fight like they can to achieve what they have to do to have the legendary armor or the legendary ring.

It's so difficult to find some ppl to play with, raiders asking too hard things to play with them. Or maybe ppl don't have the time to do raid every weeks, or maybe they don't like W5 or W6 but they love the rest, so how do they complete the ring if they want it ??? So if Anet create a way to help these ppl to finish the ring, I said go on !

Plus, I remind you that you have to kill all the bosses from W5, W6 and W7 to finish the collections of Coalescence, so in way or another you have to finish those raids. So who cares how you obtain the LD you need to finish the recipe for the ring ???

I completely disagree with your statement that since everyone bought the game it must give everyone ALL the same things. What is the point of a game if you just get handed everything outright? Isn't the point of a game to be engaging and challenging? Legendary armor and trinkets are long term rewards for dedicated players, they give two things: convenience and cosmetics, none of which are required to access any content in the game.

I get the frustration of finding other players to play with, but I also think that if you bring something to the table, people are happy to raid with you. When you say "raiders asking too hard things to play with them" do you mean that they are not willing to carry you through the raids? I don't have time to raid every week myself, but I am still able to get legendary armour, and it is nice to have some extra insentive to do the raids. I really don't get why you think you should be entitled to the ring if you are not willing to do the content it is tied to (W5 and W6).

Being rewarded for dedication is one of the core pillars of MMOs and this kind of entitlement and desire for instant gratification will just water down the experience in the end. I can still remember my Dhuum CM kill, because we trained and spent hours on the boss (probably around 400 tries), and it was very satisfying when we finally got the kill. And I don't think it would be fair for someone to just jump in game and do some menial tasks to get the same rewards as people who dedicate a lot of time and concentration in the game.

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@"Farling.8075" said:Being rewarded for dedication is one of the core pillars of MMOs and this kind of entitlement and desire for instant gratification will just water down the experience in the end. I can still remember my Dhuum CM kill, because we trained and spent hours on the boss (probably around 400 tries), and it was very satisfying when we finally got the kill. And I don't think it would be fair for someone to just jump in game and do some menial tasks to get the same rewards as people who dedicate a lot of time and concentration in the game.Riiight. Beause people that killed a w5 boss before the exchange was introduced just "jumped in the game and did some menial tasks to get the same rewards as people that dedicated a lot of time and concentration in the game".Let's be honest, we're talking about at least semi-hardcore players either way. People with hundreds of raid kills behind them. Nice job, disparaging their efforts that way.

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@Astralporing.1957 said:

@"Farling.8075" said:Being rewarded for dedication is one of the core pillars of MMOs and this kind of entitlement and desire for instant gratification will just water down the experience in the end. I can still remember my Dhuum CM kill, because we trained and spent hours on the boss (probably around 400 tries), and it was very satisfying when we finally got the kill. And I don't think it would be fair for someone to just jump in game and do some menial tasks to get the same rewards as people who dedicate a lot of time and concentration in the game.Riiight. Beause people that killed a w5 boss before the exchange was introduced just "jumped in the game and did some menial tasks to get the same rewards as people that dedicated a lot of time and concentration in the game".Let's be honest, we're talking about at least semi-hardcore players either way. People with hundreds of raid kills behind them. Nice job, disparaging their efforts that way.

I mean..doing river is basically a menial task. You can jump into it on any build or class and be successful, its not hard.

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