People are AFK-Botting at Drizzlewood to get unfair map participation / event rewards - [Merged]

[Umut.5471]

These guys are afk-farming the supply caravan event by staying at this spot everyday. As I observed some of them are using bots/macros to automate the autoattack, some of them just use necro minions.Thus, when the event mobs spawn on them, they hit some of them and get participation from every Vloxen mine supply caravan by doing nothing.I have hidden their names by hiding the UI because it may be against forum rules.

My suggestion: These events are very open to this kind of abuse, a powerful legendary mob can spawn around and attack&kill people who stay in the same spot for prolonged periods then disappear.

[SoftFootpaws.9134]

I don't imagine they're getting much, diminishing returns (DR) kicks in after only an hour or so, sometimes less, and lasts across logins of the same map with the same character so can last for days even if the player exits and logs back in later.

They have to continuously rotate characters or maps to keep getting rewards.

This is why, for example, you can't always leave characters at certain farming points (like Ley-Line Anomoly), because eventually you'll stop getting the event completion and the rewards even if you just do it once a day and log off there.

The only exception (that I know of) is resource nodes, like the Cypress Sapling nodes in Malchor's Leap, which stop giving bonus rewards like Foxfire Clusters but always give the resource itself because they're never affected by DR.

[Friday.7864]

@Hannelore.8153 said:I don't imagine they're getting much, diminishing returns (DR) kicks in after only an hour or so, sometimes less, and lasts across logins of the same map with the same character so can last for days even if the player exits and logs back in later.

They have to continuously rotate characters or maps to keep getting rewards.

This is why, for example, you can't always leave characters at certain farming points (like Ley-Line Anomoly), because eventually you'll stop getting the event completion and the rewards even if you just do it once a day and log off there.

The only exception (that I know of) is resource nodes, like the Cypress Sapling nodes in Malchor's Leap, which stop giving bonus rewards like Foxfire Clusters but always give the resource itself because they're never affected by DR.

From my experience the map works in the following way: ANY event gives you the same amount of map participation (% depends only on event medal). Depending on accumulated participation percentage and number of camps held you get map reward chests. Participation starts dropping only if you do nothing in the map for 30 minutes.Diminishing returns might apply to mob drops, but no matter which event you do and how often, the map participation gain doesn't seem to change.Since those people keep doing the same event over and over their participation will only increase without ever dropping, and they'll keep getting chests every 10 minutes.

Personally I don't like those leechers either, I felt like a fool knowing I will give them even better rewards by doing the meta properly.

[AgentMoore.9453]

I've seen huge clusters of these people every time I visit, and it's really disheartening since the map is still so recent. Might be a good place for the devs to add to their list of sweep areas when they message people in-game to check for AFK shenanigans. If nothing else, at least these people are easy to find.

I don't know that they're able to affect the economy if diminishing returns are functioning correctly, but this is clearly not the play intended.

[Rex.3602]

Some people have also been openly admitting they are afk farming and to just ignore them through the chat which makes me wonder why I am bothering to do the events. I think it may also be artificially affecting the map instance grouping, which is meant to move you to a more populated version of the map when there are not many players on the current version, because the game will think there are active players participating in events. This makes the map meta event even harder to complete, since there are time limits for capturing the bases so you need enough damage output to complete the capture events.

Also, the time limits for captures could use some serious adjustment/increase especially for Leadfoot Village. It takes around a minute just to wait for the point to capture after killing the boss, and it's so annoying when you miss a capture by a couple of seconds because you have to stand in one area for a minute. It's even worse in Leadfoot Village where Vishen shadowsteps all over the place and so much time is wasted just finding and chasing him. It's rare to see people trying to bother capturing Leadfoot Village unless there is a large zerg because of this reason. In off-peak times it's even rarer to find capturing any bases being attempted since there's few people and it's unlikely the capture will be completed before the time limit expires due to lack of damage output.

[SoftFootpaws.9134]

@Friday.7864 said:

@"Hannelore.8153" said:I don't imagine they're getting much, diminishing returns (DR) kicks in after only an hour or so, sometimes less, and lasts across logins of the same map with the same character so can last for days even if the player exits and logs back in later.

They have to continuously rotate characters or maps to keep getting rewards.

This is why, for example, you can't always leave characters at certain farming points (like Ley-Line Anomoly), because eventually you'll stop getting the event completion and the rewards even if you just do it once a day and log off there.

The only exception (that I know of) is resource nodes, like the Cypress Sapling nodes in Malchor's Leap, which stop giving bonus rewards like Foxfire Clusters but always give the resource itself because they're never affected by DR.

From my experience the map works in the following way: ANY event gives you the same amount of map participation (% depends only on event medal). Depending on accumulated participation percentage and number of camps held you get map reward chests. Participation starts dropping only if you do nothing in the map for 30 minutes.Diminishing returns might apply to mob drops, but no matter which event you do and how often, the map participation gain doesn't seem to change.Since those people keep doing the same event over and over their participation will only increase without ever dropping, and they'll keep getting chests every 10 minutes.

Personally I don't like those leechers either, I felt like a fool knowing I will give them even better rewards by doing the meta properly.

I think this is partly due to a flaw in the game engine. When HoT came out, it also had "participation" on every single event, not just map-wide, but it was eventually removed because of being glitchy (i.e, dropping people out of events when they were still doing them). Because of this, the engine no longer supports participation on events themselves, and just counts the number of event completed.

This worked fine in older maps because players were always progressing the meta, and you could never farm a single location.

If the original participation system were still intact, players would lose participation in the supply caravan escorts because they didn't escort the caravan all the way to the fortifications. It'd timeout after a short time of no XP gained.

[Donutdude.9582]

Hello,

If you feel that they are breaking the Terms of Use then it would be better to use the in-game report feature. The developers investigate these using the many tools at their disposal.

A forum post is not the right way to report something like this.

[Umut.5471]

@Donutdude.9582 said:Hello,

If you feel that they are breaking the Terms of Use then it would be better to use the in-game report feature. The developers investigate these using the many tools at their disposal.

A forum post is not the right way to report something like this.

I did this as well but it's not limited to these people. More and more people started doing this.A simple mechanic addition can prevent this without hurting anyone. Like I suggested in the first post, a mob or triggered event can clear or teleportAFKers staying at event spawn areas for a prolonged time.

[Yggranya.5201]

@"Donutdude.9582" said:Hello,

If you feel that they are breaking the Terms of Use then it would be better to use the in-game report feature. The developers investigate these using the many tools at their disposal.

A forum post is not the right way to report something like this.

No, they don't. If they did, many of the most painfully obvious ones would have been removed already. There is a limit to when you can say "you can't know if they are botting" and what i have seen. A single person just can't do that.

@AgentMoore.9453 said:I've seen huge clusters of these people every time I visit, and it's really disheartening since the map is still so recent. Might be a good place for the devs to add to their list of sweep areas when they message people in-game to check for AFK shenanigans. If nothing else, at least these people are easy to find.

I don't know that they're able to affect the economy if diminishing returns are functioning correctly, but this is clearly not the play intended.

There are no sweep areas, nothing will get done. They all just stand there while waching netflix/playing something else on their second screen or other computer/console, so even if they get moved they just walk back. If they are sleeping, they might be logged out but nothing will be done regardless. They are not playing the game but they get around it with this because anet doesn't actually care. They will continue to do this when the next expansion is released and infect it too.

To put it simply, get used to it. It's never going to change. It's the same in every MMO, the companies just don't care.

[HnRkLnXqZ.1870]

@"Donutdude.9582" said:A forum post is not the right way to report something like this.

There are no names included or any data that gives information about the owners of the characters. It is a common problem that has not yet been solved, so it is worth to remind them until it gets fixed.

I usually tag them, friend them, nick them, block them. When I log into the game, I always check my blocklist. Most of the tagged ones are active players who just want to make some extra-money with this cheap mechanic. Some are active WvW players, sPvP players, run Fractals/Raids/Strikemissions/Dungeons or participate in large scale meta events/bounty-runs. Only a small fraction of them camp those locations for extended periods of time. Have I noticed any bans? Not really. I sometimes meet old "friends" I tagged years ago who gave it a new try on a new map. Sometimes I am tempted to unblock them and greet them. But then I realize, they are just AFK.

The real problem comes with the class mechanics. But they refuse to fix it and claim it works as intended.

[Donutdude.9582]

@"Yggranya.5201" said:No, they don't. If they did, many of the most painfully obvious ones would have been removed already. There is a limit to when you can say "you can't know if they are botting" and what i have seen. A single person just can't do that.

They do look at them, however the conclusion to the investigation is not always an account ban.

What you have to understand is that ArenaNet need to prove beyond any reasonable doubt that the player's actions violate any reference to automation in the Terms of Use agreement. If they are unable to do so, the player will not be punished. These investigations take time and resource to carry out.

[kharmin.7683]

@HnRkLnXqZ.1870 said:

@Donutdude.9582 said:A forum post is not the right way to report something like this.

There are no names included or any data that gives information about the owners of the characters. It is a common problem that has not yet been solved, so it is worth to remind them until it gets fixed.Certainly. Because all of the past posts about AFK farming have worked.

[AgentMoore.9453]

@Yggranya.5201 said:There are no sweep areas, nothing will get done.

I know you're a fatalist, but devs whispering suspected perpetrators of tomfoolery is a real thing that really happens. I know this because I've got a handful of friends who have had devs whisper them to check in over the years. You don't have to accept that the check-ins are effective or that enough action is taken against people who break the TOS, but to act like the situation is hopeless or that the company doesn't at all care about its community helps no one.

OP is clearly showing some optimism and trying to suggest possible solutions, so for people to respond so negatively only reinforces the idea that something is terribly wrong. Should they report cruddy activity in-game instead? Probably (and maybe they already have). Does it hurt anyone to state the issue on the forums and look for potential solutions? No.

Show a little sunshine, would you?

[HnRkLnXqZ.1870]

@kharmin.7683 said:Certainly. Because all of the past posts about AFK farming have worked.

What works?

[Rex.3602]

@HnRkLnXqZ.1870 said:

@kharmin.7683 said:Certainly. Because all of the past posts about AFK farming have worked.

What works?

We have to report every single player that ever afk farms in game, because that is somehow much more efficient than removing the incentives for afk farming.

[Yggranya.5201]

@HnRkLnXqZ.1870 said:

@"Donutdude.9582" said:A forum post is not the right way to report something like this.

There are no names included or any data that gives information about the owners of the characters. It is a common problem that has not yet been solved, so it is worth to remind them until it gets fixed.

I usually tag them, friend them, nick them, block them. When I log into the game, I always check my blocklist. Most of the tagged ones are active players who just want to make some extra-money with this cheap mechanic.

I have 7 characters on my block list that are every single day, all day standing in a different main city next to a Black lion market NPC. They used to be in the same guild but i think they changes that, they are all asura and they have been there for close to half a year as far as i know, could be longer before i noticed them.

Anet does nothing, they might get logged out when map is forced to reset (or maybe the "player" forgot to move them or their automatic system had a problem while they slept) but then they always log back in and continue to do the same. If you say that you actually believe that a person might never need to sleep, then i wonder in what world you live in.

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

I always wonder how someone knows, beyond a shadow of a doubt, someone else is somewhere 24/7 without actually also being in that spot watching them 24/7 (and looking to others like they are AFK).

[miraude.2107]

@Inculpatus cedo.9234 said:I always wonder how someone knows, beyond a shadow of a doubt, someone else is somewhere 24/7 without actually also being in that spot watching them 24/7 (and looking to others like they are AFK).

Don't necessarily have to be spot watching. If I hit an event, fly around the map collecting mats and head back into the area and they are still standing there without having moved? That can raise some flags. I remember getting GM whispers in WoW because I was fishing in one spot and was partially afk while I was cooking dinner. Still responded to the GM though explaining what was going on. The person who reported then whispered me and apologized saying they were doing arch and getting the map I was on and seeing that I was still in the same spot an hour later so they reported. So yeah, don't have to spot watch necessarily.In ESO, the dark anchor/dolmen events had afkers/botters as well when I played. I think their solution was a stacking charge if someone stood still too long near the event the charge would start stacking, hit a certain number and then explode, killing the person. Easy way to negate it was simply to move around and actively participate during the event. It also made botters extremely obvious after and easier to report because they were now jumping in one spot but still not participating fully besides autoattacking.

GW2 could implement something similar to that to the events.

[Cyndercat.7615]

@AgentMoore.9453 said:

@Yggranya.5201 said:There are no sweep areas, nothing will get done.

I know you're a fatalist, but devs whispering suspected perpetrators of tomfoolery is a real thing that really happens. I know this because I've got a handful of friends who have had devs whisper them to check in over the years. You don't have to accept that the check-ins are effective or that enough action is taken against people who break the TOS, but to act like the situation is hopeless or that the company doesn't at all care about its community helps no one.

OP is clearly showing some optimism and trying to suggest possible solutions, so for people to respond so negatively only reinforces the idea that something is terribly wrong. Should they report cruddy activity in-game instead? Probably (and maybe they already have). Does it hurt anyone to state the issue on the forums and look for potential solutions? No.

Show a little sunshine, would you?

I dont know about PVE but in PVP at least nothing is ever done about the botting. Its close to 50% bots in games now in off hours and is only getting worse. Cant really feel like the company cares when its in that state.

[Lamont.5973]

maybe the easiest solution would be to simply remove the supply runs to the mine and the overlook. The other supply runs only happen if the outposts are held so in between meta events anyone AFKing on them would be killed by mobs.

[Vancho.8750]

@miraude.2107 said:

@Inculpatus cedo.9234 said:I always wonder how someone knows, beyond a shadow of a doubt, someone else is somewhere 24/7 without actually also being in that spot watching them 24/7 (and looking to others like they are AFK).

Don't necessarily have to be spot watching. If I hit an event, fly around the map collecting mats and head back into the area and they are still standing there without having moved? That can raise some flags. I remember getting GM whispers in WoW because I was fishing in one spot and was partially afk while I was cooking dinner. Still responded to the GM though explaining what was going on. The person who reported then whispered me and apologized saying they were doing arch and getting the map I was on and seeing that I was still in the same spot an hour later so they reported. So yeah, don't have to spot watch necessarily.In ESO, the dark anchor/dolmen events had afkers/botters as well when I played. I think their solution was a stacking charge if someone stood still too long near the event the charge would start stacking, hit a certain number and then explode, killing the person. Easy way to negate it was simply to move around and actively participate during the event. It also made botters extremely obvious after and easier to report because they were now jumping in one spot but still not participating fully besides autoattacking.

GW2 could implement something similar to that to the events.If you stay too long on one spot some veteran mobs spawn with the Mordrem abilities, made thematic for the zone.

[IndigoSundown.5419]

@"Donutdude.9582" said:Hello,

If you feel that they are breaking the Terms of Use then it would be better to use the in-game report feature. The developers investigate these using the many tools at their disposal.

A forum post is not the right way to report something like this.

The OP is not reporting people. He provides no information about individual accounts, which would be necessary to make his post an attempted report. Instead, he complained about a situation and offered a solution. Whether you believe the situation is a problem or not, or believe his solution is a good or bad one, the forum is an appropriate place to discuss the game.

---

Me, I'd not be in favor of a Legendary mob showing up to wipe them, though I would support Hannelore's idea to require greater participation in the escort than "fighting" one of the several (3, iirc) groups of attackers.

[DaFishBob.6518]

Have some dominion snipers spawn on the cliff faces near where these guys wait.

[miraude.2107]

@Vancho.8750 said:

@miraude.2107 said:

@Inculpatus cedo.9234 said:I always wonder how someone knows, beyond a shadow of a doubt, someone else is somewhere 24/7 without actually also being in that spot watching them 24/7 (and looking to others like they are AFK).

Don't necessarily have to be spot watching. If I hit an event, fly around the map collecting mats and head back into the area and they are still standing there without having moved? That can raise some flags. I remember getting GM whispers in WoW because I was fishing in one spot and was partially afk while I was cooking dinner. Still responded to the GM though explaining what was going on. The person who reported then whispered me and apologized saying they were doing arch and getting the map I was on and seeing that I was still in the same spot an hour later so they reported. So yeah, don't have to spot watch necessarily.In ESO, the dark anchor/dolmen events had afkers/botters as well when I played. I think their solution was a stacking charge if someone stood still too long near the event the charge would start stacking, hit a certain number and then explode, killing the person. Easy way to negate it was simply to move around and actively participate during the event. It also made botters extremely obvious after and easier to report because they were now jumping in one spot but still not participating fully besides autoattacking.

GW2 could implement something similar to that to the events.If you stay too long on one spot some veteran mobs spawn with the Mordrem abilities, made thematic for the zone.

That would work. Since we know so many Ash Legion have switched sides have a debuff that is similar to the target shape with a 'You feel like you are being watched, I should move somewhere safe.' and a countdown on it. If the person still hasn't moved in say 5 minutes, it goes critical with a 'I heard something, I know I heard something. I need to go somewhere safe now!' and at 10 minutes is when the assassin pops in and kills them. Can even have the NPC say a voice line or something of 'Should have been paying attention.' or 'Ha! Free kill!'The only way to get the debuff off is to move to a held fortress or to a different area of the map. Like if they are at the Mine they need to move to the mine's fortress or to the Grotto area to wipe it etc.

[realviizz.4982]

@DaFishBob.6518 said:Have some dominion snipers spawn on the cliff faces near where these guys wait.

I wish that would work, sadly most of the time it's minion necros grouped up with revenants that run protection/regeneration. Even the snipers would probably have issues killing that.Personally I see it everytime I visit the map and it's always the same people/same guild.Luckily they might not hit a lot of mobs, since all the Necro seems to do is spam GS4 on cooldown, unless he's core, obviously.