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Botting Players

Master Childman.2135Master Childman.2135 Member ✭✭
edited November 22, 2020 in Living World

It really annoys me to see groups of players abandoning their characters somewhere in the game to do farming activities using blatantly botting systems. If these players don't feel like playing, please ditch GW2 immediately and go elsewhere. The real victim of this illegal system is the profession itself. At this moment almost all botting players are using the necromancer (minions master version) for their unlawful farming activities. Sooner or later ArenaNet will intervene to block this lousy activity by altering the skills of the necromancer profession. We've all seen what happened to the Engineer turrets (the first profession used for farming in botting mode).
This anger arises after seeing a group of losers (because this is the only kind term I can think of to define them) engaged in farming at Southsun Cove.

Comments

  • Ashantara.8731Ashantara.8731 Member ✭✭✭✭

    You mean botting, not booting. "Booting players" means "kicking players from you group".

  • Oh! Lol. Could not fathom why it was called 'booting'.

  • wolfyrik.2017wolfyrik.2017 Member ✭✭✭

    I always report them. No idea if anything comes of it.

  • Teratus.2859Teratus.2859 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Kittens me off as well.
    I've loved the Necromancer profession in this franchise for almost 15 years.. my first character in Gw1 was a Necromancer and in Gw2 I use them very often as a second main and have a good few of them.
    Minions are also one of my favourite class mechanics in this game and I am heavily invested in them on a few builds.

    This fear that Minions will end up being gutted and completely destroyed because of these AFK farmers is something I have expressed many many times on the forums and in game as an argument for why this should not be allowed.

    Problem is though they are at least for the most part NOT! botting..
    AFK farming is done through in game abilities, setting Greatsword 4 to autocast and leaving yourself idle with minions active.. this isn't technically botting and it's the main reason it's so difficult to punish these players.
    They just need to sit at their computer and occasionally type in chat if contacted and nothing will be done about them, It doesn't matter if they're not actively playing the game which is where I strongly disagree with people who defend them.

    If you're not actively playing the game then you shouldn't be able to be rewarded as if you were.. this to me is no different than using bots so I really don't see a difference between these Minion Master farmers and those using Bot, even though technically they are different.

  • I don't know whether these lazy kittens are still doing this in starter areas, but I remember that I once had issues with completing a heart in a region because there was a dozen of these in various locations just around that one heart. I forgot where it was, but it really was annoying. It would be so easy for anet to check these out, watch them for a few minutes and then do something.

  • First to set some things straight. You call it illegal activities. This is not the case. Based on the User agreement, they made a policy that is pretty straight forward.

    • You have to be present at the keyboard. You are not allowed to use any macro's to automate. One key-click/mouseclick should result in one actin as designed by Arenanet.

    This means that auto farming using a automated attack key (which is a function present in the game) and minions/turrets/clones/pets/etc is perfectly allowed. Even if you do not actively play your character. You are not allowed to automate things beyond what Arenanet has made available. For example. A guildleader of mine who isn't currently playing, used to farm this way while folding laundry, cooking, etc. But she always had the laptop next to her.

    To verify wether or not you are actively present, you need to be able to respond to a PM by a GM. If not you will get booted and recieve a warning.

    The guildleader I was speaking about would get about 2-3 pm's from GM's each week. Afterwards she also saw a lot of fellow-farmers dissappear (meaning these farmers where not present and able to respond to the GM.

    So how to handle this as a player. PM the person. As you are not a GM, they are not obliged to respond, but if they do not respond, just report them and a GM will investigate. Be cafrefull to jump to conclusions. I always ask something like: "Hey, I noticed you are AFK-farming. Are you here?".

  • I visited Southsun Cove today and found it free of these botting players. Then I decided to visit Iron Marches, in the Bloodfin Lake area (known area where you can find these "afk players") and it was fun to find Engineers who were constantly placing all the different turrets. So I proceeded to send a PM to the players to ask if and what they were to farm and I did not receive any response (10 minutes wait) (too busy placing the turrets to write?) Then I sent the report.

  • Is legal farming this way (afk and use pets&torrets)

  • Linken.6345Linken.6345 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @ragnarock.4592 said:
    Is legal farming this way (afk and use pets&torrets)

    No not Afk, but doing it this way, watching netflix, cooking or folding laundery while answering the GM personal messages is perfectly fine.

  • Smoosh.2718Smoosh.2718 Member ✭✭✭

    I'll still stand by my belief that players who AFK farm set a bad image for the game. And some of them are 100% not legit players, Only takes 3 minutes to work out if someone is botting or not by the clockwork skills they are using, always in the same order.

    One way I found how to detect a macro user is this: https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Bouquet_of_Roses
    Throw that in to their hands before combat starts, and watch them still try to do their skills, they wont remove it from their hands. Slap them all with a temp ban then a longer ban if repeated then perma ban them out of the game if they do it for a 3rd time.

    Its a bad image, it sets the idea that its ok to cheat in gw2, it makes players also believe that Anet doesnt ban people and they do in some areas prevent honest players from completing a task quickly (ascalon STILL has that problem).

    I will guarantee that this thread will have an army of afk farmer defenders coming in. With the fact that there is a BIG rise in Bots / Cheaters, something needs to be done to deter people away from doing it.

  • kharmin.7683kharmin.7683 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Players may want to read and understand the official policy on this topic which can be found here: https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/65548/policy-unattended-gameplay

    I am a very casual player.
    Very.
    Casual.

  • Southsun Cove is plagued by afk farming necro to a point there are more of them than people actualy doing karka queen...

  • Seeing bots in any game is an infuriating experience. However, every MMORPG has them (most likely) and as long as people will profit from it, there will be more of them and more advanced. Not sure if there is a good way to fight them other than admins camping them and permabanning their accounts.

  • @Linken.6345 said:

    @ragnarock.4592 said:
    Is legal farming this way (afk and use pets&torrets)

    No not Afk, but doing it this way, watching netflix, cooking or folding laundery while answering the GM personal messages is perfectly fine.

    Another important thing is not to use macros to farm and simulate that you are not completely afk.

  • @ragnarock.4592 said:
    Is legal farming this way (afk and use pets&torrets)

    could you kindly explain to me how an Engineer can place all the types of turrets that he can put in his skills while in AFK? in game you have the possibility to put the autoattack on only one skill. I am not aware that there is the option of being able to autoattack multiple skills at the same time? or did I miss this update?

  • Linken.6345Linken.6345 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Master Childman.2135 said:

    @ragnarock.4592 said:
    Is legal farming this way (afk and use pets&torrets)

    could you kindly explain to me how an Engineer can place all the types of turrets that he can put in his skills while in AFK? in game you have the possibility to put the autoattack on only one skill. I am not aware that there is the option of being able to autoattack multiple skills at the same time? or did I miss this update?

    it is not how are you sure they are afk?

    They could speak another language or ignore msg from normal players only answering gms.

  • @kharmin.7683 said:
    Players may want to read and understand the official policy on this topic which can be found here: https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/65548/policy-unattended-gameplay

    I think your answer can very clearly and simply make it clear to what extent a player who uses autoattack can be considered afk or not. [...] As a general policy, any form of unattended gameplay is prohibited in Guild Wars 2. This includes: the use of auto-casting abilities to farm while not at your computer or not actively playing the game. [...]

    [...] Note that this does not mean that you cannot be away from your computer (AFK) while you are online. Idling in a city or even in the open world is not prohibited, though your character should not perform actions, participate in content, or otherwise engage with the world while you are away from your computer. [...]

    So if you want to do laundry or cook or watch Netflix, please avoid farming, even using in-game the autoattack.

  • Let their minions have natural health degen, like the minions in Guild Wars (ofc summoning minions out of thin air in this version still makes no sense to me BUT...) make giving the minions the same properties as they were in Guild Wars, once summoned they start losing their health, and if not healed by the master, they die, in combat or not.

  • @Linken.6345 said:

    @Master Childman.2135 said:

    @ragnarock.4592 said:
    Is legal farming this way (afk and use pets&torrets)

    could you kindly explain to me how an Engineer can place all the types of turrets that he can put in his skills while in AFK? in game you have the possibility to put the autoattack on only one skill. I am not aware that there is the option of being able to autoattack multiple skills at the same time? or did I miss this update?

    it is not how are you sure they are afk?

    They could speak another language or ignore msg from normal players only answering gms.

    Let a GM decide if they are afk or not ... in the meantime I will report them; not hastily, but I give him enough time to try and respond.

  • kharmin.7683kharmin.7683 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Master Childman.2135 said:

    @kharmin.7683 said:
    Players may want to read and understand the official policy on this topic which can be found here: https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/65548/policy-unattended-gameplay

    I think your answer can very clearly and simply make it clear to what extent a player who uses autoattack can be considered afk or not. [...] As a general policy, any form of unattended gameplay is prohibited in Guild Wars 2. This includes: the use of auto-casting abilities to farm while not at your computer or not actively playing the game. [...]

    [...] Note that this does not mean that you cannot be away from your computer (AFK) while you are online. Idling in a city or even in the open world is not prohibited, though your character should not perform actions, participate in content, or otherwise engage with the world while you are away from your computer. [...]

    So if you want to do laundry or cook or watch Netflix, please avoid farming, even using in-game the autoattack.

    I agree. This is why players should simply report suspected AFK and let Anet sort it out.

    I am a very casual player.
    Very.
    Casual.

  • Healix.5819Healix.5819 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 27, 2020

    @Master Childman.2135 said:
    could you kindly explain to me how an Engineer can place all the types of turrets that he can put in his skills while in AFK? in game you have the possibility to put the autoattack on only one skill. I am not aware that there is the option of being able to autoattack multiple skills at the same time? or did I miss this update?

    ArenaNet only does something if the person fails to respond, so with that in mind, they do it by using a macro to use their skills and a program to "call for help" when something happens. For the more casual ones, they simply have the game running in the background and use the skills when they happen to think about it / notice it.

    Back in the day, ArenaNet far more strict and would simply ban them on the spot, including anyone that happened to be next to them.

  • Smoosh.2718Smoosh.2718 Member ✭✭✭

    @Healix.5819 said:

    @Master Childman.2135 said:
    could you kindly explain to me how an Engineer can place all the types of turrets that he can put in his skills while in AFK? in game you have the possibility to put the autoattack on only one skill. I am not aware that there is the option of being able to autoattack multiple skills at the same time? or did I miss this update?

    ArenaNet only does something if the person fails to respond, so with that in mind, they do it by using a macro to use their skills and a program to "call for help" when something happens. For the more casual ones, they simply have the game running in the background and use the skills when they happen to think about it / notice it.

    Back in the day, ArenaNet far more strict and would simply ban them on the spot, including anyone that happened to be next to them.

    This system is too easy to fool. Use a macro, watch a movie, do other things and just keep tabs on your chat window for a GM message to pop in, while not touching the keys once.

    This is why a blanket ban system must be adopted, stamp out what could get worse... which is getting worse. Look at the rise in actual bots, look at the rise in cheaters.

  • There's a big sweep to do in southsun cove every day dozens of afk farming necros are there...

  • @Smoosh.2718 said:

    @Healix.5819 said:

    @Master Childman.2135 said:
    could you kindly explain to me how an Engineer can place all the types of turrets that he can put in his skills while in AFK? in game you have the possibility to put the autoattack on only one skill. I am not aware that there is the option of being able to autoattack multiple skills at the same time? or did I miss this update?

    ArenaNet only does something if the person fails to respond, so with that in mind, they do it by using a macro to use their skills and a program to "call for help" when something happens. For the more casual ones, they simply have the game running in the background and use the skills when they happen to think about it / notice it.

    Back in the day, ArenaNet far more strict and would simply ban them on the spot, including anyone that happened to be next to them.

    This system is too easy to fool. Use a macro, watch a movie, do other things and just keep tabs on your chat window for a GM message to pop in, while not touching the keys once.

    This is why a blanket ban system must be adopted, stamp out what could get worse... which is getting worse. Look at the rise in actual bots, look at the rise in cheaters.

    If the people use multi box and don´t use macros is legal.

    Policy

    A player may own and operate several accounts, but they may do so only when they play and control each account independently of any other account. This means that:

    Each account must be attended at all times.
    Each account must be operated independently of each other.
    Accounts must not be operated simultaneously using macros or bots.
    One keystroke should translate to one action on one account.
    

    https://help.guildwars2.com/hc/en-us/articles/360013658134-Policy-Dual-or-Multi-Boxing

  • Blude.6812Blude.6812 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Some have said to report botting and let Anet handle it, or let a GM handle it and move on. I highly suspect that Anet is doing neither. (i.e The in game bot reports are ignored or put in the round filing cabinet and GMs don't bother with monitoring botters anymore).

  • Solvar.7953Solvar.7953 Member ✭✭✭

    I suspect at best what Anet does with botting reports is see if there are a bunch related to the same map, and if so, maybe send a GM there to ping the players. They probably want to be overly cautious and not ban legitimate players, so a botting report by itself is not something they can act on.
    I suspect that for the most part, it probably isn't worth Anet's time to deal with it - they ban some accounts, those people create new ones, and repeat. The botters probably don't pay any actual money (convert to non-free account) until they have gathered enough stuff to make it worthwhile.

  • @Solvar.7953 said:
    I suspect at best what Anet does with botting reports is see if there are a bunch related to the same map, and if so, maybe send a GM there to ping the players. They probably want to be overly cautious and not ban legitimate players, so a botting report by itself is not something they can act on.
    I suspect that for the most part, it probably isn't worth Anet's time to deal with it - they ban some accounts, those people create new ones, and repeat. The botters probably don't pay any actual money (convert to non-free account) until they have gathered enough stuff to make it worthwhile.

    I think Anet is very generous in what they allow on free accounts. As it stands, ftp accounts are limited to starter maps up to level 10, and Lion's Arch unlocks at level 35. Personally, I would take it further and make Lion's Arch at level 35 the absolute max, and make maps that provide access to materials above level 3 unavailable on ftp accounts. I know it would upset folks, but it would be one way to discourage players just creating new free accounts and continue to afk farm and/or botting.

  • evlover.6270evlover.6270 Member ✭✭
    edited December 1, 2020

    They don't care about botting. There's a guy that goes to the meta's with 5-6 accs, one mesmer portalling all the other ones that are necros. All running around in the same outfit, same guild name, basically mocking everyone else and slapping them in the face with it. Reporting him every time, even opened a ticket with all the account ID's. The reply was to answer in a forum topic with a link to where it was being discussed.. Guess what, 20 out of the 40 replies where from that botter's main account about how that kind of of playstyle should be allowed which I also replied in the ticket but I got the same response, reply on forum. Not reporting anything anymore since then cause the people who care about the game are treated as dumb monkeys anyway apparently, you just get thrown into a circle that has no end -.-' (and fyi, that guy is still around doing the same thing after 2+ years, says enough imo)

    edit: and yes, multiboxing should be considered botting even though it's considered to be a grey zone while it really isn't:
    1. Each account must be attended at all times.
    -> you're not "attending" all of them at all times, you're rotating between them
    2. Each account must be operated independently of each other.
    -> using a mesmer to portal the other ones around constantly isn't operating them independently of each other.
    The only ones defending multiboxing are people who actually multibox themselves, ofc those people don't want that to stop, what would you expect.. -.-'

  • Solvar.7953Solvar.7953 Member ✭✭✭

    Anet probably leaves multi boxing as a grey area, because they are happy to have that person to have paid for 6 accounts. I'm not going to defend multiboxing (I only have a single account), but based on rules as Anet has presented them, it seems the usage described above falls within them.
    Anet could certainly clarify the rules or add more restrictions (when multiboxing, the accounts can not be on the same map would be a simple one to prevent this). But unless Anet actually wants to enforced the rules, it really makes no difference, and I've not seen much indication that Anet does want to spend much effort enforcing the rules.

  • @Master Childman.2135 said:

    @kharmin.7683 said:
    Players may want to read and understand the official policy on this topic which can be found here: https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/65548/policy-unattended-gameplay

    I think your answer can very clearly and simply make it clear to what extent a player who uses autoattack can be considered afk or not. [...] As a general policy, any form of unattended gameplay is prohibited in Guild Wars 2. This includes: the use of auto-casting abilities to farm while not at your computer or not actively playing the game. [...]

    [...] Note that this does not mean that you cannot be away from your computer (AFK) while you are online. Idling in a city or even in the open world is not prohibited, though your character should not perform actions, participate in content, or otherwise engage with the world while you are away from your computer. [...]

    So if you want to do laundry or cook or watch Netflix, please avoid farming, even using in-game the autoattack.

    Not really, It is prohibited when you use it while being away from keyboard. This has been stated in your own linked quote as well as many other times by support. Please stop misspreading information.

    To explain why this matters to me.
    There is a lot of confusion in this matter and some people are very fierce against farmers. Everyone is entitled to their opinion in the matter (see mine down below), but it is often based on wrong information. This is leading to frustration to both sides and rather flamatory behaviour by those against this kind of farming in general towards those who do it. Flamatory behaviour towards other players is bad as well and should be avoided.

    And now my personal opinion. -Meh. I have no interest in AFK-farming at all (I dislike any kind of numbless farming to be honest), but I do not mind people doing it within the set rules by GW2 as they do not bother me in enjoying my life in GW2. What I am against is the monetisation of RTM and goldsellers who are behind real farmbots. They are harmfull as they use stolen accounts, stolen credit cards and as they are often used by North Korean regime to bypass blockade

  • lare.5129lare.5129 Member ✭✭✭✭

    this is some bonus for necro and engineers. Don't be toxic !

    want solid balance ? - play chess.

  • Teratus.2859Teratus.2859 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Smoosh.2718 said:
    One way I found how to detect a macro user is this: https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Bouquet_of_Roses
    Throw that in to their hands before combat starts, and watch them still try to do their skills, they wont remove it from their hands. Slap them all with a temp ban then a longer ban if repeated then perma ban them out of the game if they do it for a 3rd time.

    You sir are an absolute genius XD
    I never thought of doing that lmao!!

  • @mercury ranique.2170 said:

    @Master Childman.2135 said:

    @kharmin.7683 said:
    Players may want to read and understand the official policy on this topic which can be found here: https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/65548/policy-unattended-gameplay

    I think your answer can very clearly and simply make it clear to what extent a player who uses autoattack can be considered afk or not. [...] As a general policy, any form of unattended gameplay is prohibited in Guild Wars 2. This includes: the use of auto-casting abilities to farm while not at your computer or not actively playing the game. [...]

    [...] Note that this does not mean that you cannot be away from your computer (AFK) while you are online. Idling in a city or even in the open world is not prohibited, though your character should not perform actions, participate in content, or otherwise engage with the world while you are away from your computer. [...]

    So if you want to do laundry or cook or watch Netflix, please avoid farming, even using in-game the autoattack.

    Not really, It is prohibited when you use it while being away from keyboard. This has been stated in your own linked quote as well as many other times by support. Please stop misspreading information.

    To explain why this matters to me.
    There is a lot of confusion in this matter and some people are very fierce against farmers. Everyone is entitled to their opinion in the matter (see mine down below), but it is often based on wrong information. This is leading to frustration to both sides and rather flamatory behaviour by those against this kind of farming in general towards those who do it. Flamatory behaviour towards other players is bad as well and should be avoided.

    And now my personal opinion. -Meh. I have no interest in AFK-farming at all (I dislike any kind of numbless farming to be honest), but I do not mind people doing it within the set rules by GW2 as they do not bother me in enjoying my life in GW2. What I am against is the monetisation of RTM and goldsellers who are behind real farmbots. They are harmfull as they use stolen accounts, stolen credit cards and as they are often used by North Korean regime to bypass blockade

    I have no problem with players "abandoning" their inert and inactive characters in the game to remain AFK and engage in other real-world activities; the presence of these characters has no impact on the game and its economy; after a certain period of inactivity of the character, the system itself warns him and closes the connection (a character who does not perform any action in the game does not get any kind of reward from events). On the contrary, what I contest is that players "abandon" their characters by activating precise mechanisms to farm and gather resources in the game while they are AFK. This type of activity damages the game and its economy.

    Aside from the fact that the use of in-game macros for farming is clearly prohibited, the use of auto-casting abilities to farm while not at your computer or not actively playing the game, is also prohibited. This is what I read in the link proposed by the user. I've read wrong? is the link wrong or old?

    If you decide to leave your character stationary anywhere on the map and remain AFK, I will not contest it. If you decide to leave your character anywhere on the map and activate farming mechanics (for example, your character performs actions) and remain AFK, I will contest it.

    It is difficult for me to think that all of this could be considered a spread of incorrect information. But I'm always ready to step back and acknowledge my mistakes, if I've made them.