Are you 100% forced to play meta to enjoy raids?

I mean...is there any way that casuals can enjoy the end game part of GW2 without adhering to a strict meta archetype? I am looking for a guild or just a group of people who just want to enjoy the game without all the fuss , anger and frustration.

To be more specific , I do not expect or even want the same level of "efficiency" of meta runs but at the same I will commit to a certain level of common sense like I wouldn't expect to get anything done with a healing thief for example.

Basically is there anywhere out there where you can play with whatever stats and still enjoy the mode as long as the job get done?

@"Arheundel.6451" said:I mean...is there any way that casuals can enjoy the end game part of GW2 without adhering to a strict meta archetype? I am looking for a guild or just a group of people who just want to enjoy the game without all the fuss , anger and frustration.

To be more specific , I do not expect or even want the same level of "efficiency" of meta runs but at the same I will commit to a certain level of common sense like I wouldn't expect to get anything done with a healing thief for example.

Basically is there anywhere out there where you can play with whatever stats and still enjoy the mode as long as the job get done?

But healing thief is meta ¯_(ツ)_/¯

I get the joke but...simply I won't play full zerk ele, the 11k Hp build is just ridicolous and I'm sure a marauder ele would get things done in the end so why the problems?

Only if you join meta groups.

Create your own group with your own rules and problem solved.

@Arheundel.6451 said:I get the joke but...simply I won't play full zerk ele, the 11k Hp build is just ridicolous and I'm sure a marauder ele would get things done in the end so why the problems?

Why is it ridiculous?

I'm certain casual groups wouldn't mind the build you use as long as the role is somewhat fulfilled.

Create your own group. manege 9 other people you dont know what skil level they are, what they are bringing to the group and let us know how it went. how long it took for the first vale guardian kill.Meta is not a imposition, its a conclusion after many trials and errors and people not wating to spend more time for thing they already did many times over. /hugs

@TexZero.7910 said:Only if you join meta groups.

Create your own group with your own rules and problem solved.

I believe in raids, that won't work. I might even test this, but I think you will get people who take over your squad and make it meta. The toxicity is already so ingrained in the community that even if you open an LFG without asking for any requirements, as training run, you will have players joining and spamming their kill proofs and LIs. And these people will expect new squad members to do the same. Sure, you could start with 3 friends and kick toxic players, but I think you'll have a really hard time getting ready.

My advice would be: don't use PUGS. find a guild that does casual raids - there are many out there i've seen advertised (and am also a part of), at worst you can use the lf guild section of this very forum.

When you just use the lfg in game, you're going to get elitists who only accept meta, only want you with kill proof, only want you if you can achieve the dream benchmarks etc.

In the end, with a guild you like, you can chill on the builds so long as dps/support is still efficient enough to kill things in time and you'll have a lot more fun doing it with guild mates than random pugs who you have no connection to whatsoever.

Group of your friends or casual guilds is your best bet I guess.

@Faaris.8013 said:

@"TexZero.7910" said:Only if you join meta groups.

Create your own group with your own rules and problem solved.

If you create your own groups it absolutely works. You are the commander and have sole responsibility at that point.I'm not saying you're guaranteed a clear, but you are guaranteed to create a group with people who like you don't want "META" if you label it "Not Meta Raid" or even create your own guild/static with people who dont run meta. Judging solely by the forums this shouldn't be too hard as the meta according to the forums seems to be a minority given the number of "anti-meta" posters.

If you can't stay alive with full zerk ele generally, you're going to have a bad time in raids. Because a full marauder's set worth of extra HP won't save you from failing mechanics - most of them are a one-shot. And you need to be keeping up minimum 10k DPS in actual play to not be deadweight to your team.

@Arheundel.6451 said:I mean...is there any way that casuals can enjoy the end game part of GW2 without adhering to a strict meta archetype? I am looking for a guild or just a group of people who just want to enjoy the game without all the fuss , anger and frustration.

If you are on a EU server you are welcome to join my guild. We are a salt free guild, friendly and helpful. If you are interested send me a mail on the forum or a whisper in game my IGN: Orguyo

(Through Thick and Thin [TTT])

Second everyone with create your own group with your own rules and problem solved. Do what you need to get the job done. Best to have friends or guild mates to start out. LFG can take a while finding specific class professions, leaving less time to raid after to work things out etc (explaining & assuming there will be wipes). Will be similar to a "training run" ran by you tbh. Get in contact with the participants and try to make it a regular. :smile:Long story short; to joing others, follow their requirements. Your squad, your rules.

@Lexi.1398 said:My advice would be: don't use PUGS. find a guild that does casual raids - there are many out there i've seen advertised (and am also a part of), at worst you can use the lf guild section of this very forum.

When you just use the lfg in game, you're going to get elitists who only accept meta, only want you with kill proof, only want you if you can achieve the dream benchmarks etc.

And? Noone forces you to join them :P, unless you dont have the ability to actual read the description of the lfg. There are enough pug groups who dont want anything of li or kp, though its true that it will be way faster to rather search for a fitting guild/static, since it can take a while for those squads to fill. And if there arent any, just start your own. Like everyone did themself when raids where released.

No, you are not, not at all. But you must know all mechanics!

not including meta builds, I have done successful raids, in pugs and statics, on...

marauder+zerker dps weaver and tempestgrieving staff dps weavercarrion+sinister dps tempest (2016)apothecary+shaman healer scourge (this should be meta for pugs)apothecary+shaman tank/healer tempestminstrel tank/healer tempestzealot's healer weaver

Anyway, yes. As a dps, so long as you are doing well, no one is going to question what you're running. But if your dps is bad, you may get yelled at for not running meta, regardless of the reason for your bad dps.And yes, marauder can help a little with staying alive on ele sometimes. It gives your healer some extra time to react to get your health up if the damage you're taking isn't one-shots. It's not going to be a magic bullet, but it can help in some cases.

Note that, especially if you're weaver, you're probably going to be overcapping crit chance with marauder, so you may want to do a combination of marauder and valkyrie to minimize dps loss.

@"Arheundel.6451" said:I mean...is there any way that casuals can enjoy the end game part of GW2 without adhering to a strict meta archetype? I am looking for a guild or just a group of people who just want to enjoy the game without all the fuss , anger and frustration.

To be more specific , I do not expect or even want the same level of "efficiency" of meta runs but at the same I will commit to a certain level of common sense like I wouldn't expect to get anything done with a healing thief for example.

Basically is there anywhere out there where you can play with whatever stats and still enjoy the mode as long as the job get done?

If you use common sense you would play zerk weaver or opt for a more sustainable profession like holo.

Anyways last monday a power soulbeast joined. We still had 5min left at sabetha, instabreak gorse and xera mid without issues. And I often times see non meta groups raid. To be fair almost no Pug runs truely meta.

So yeah jou can play off meta in almost any group. But it really depends on how you play.

Technically, @"Arheundel.6451" is absolutely correct: full zerk isn't necessary; Marauder can get the job done fine. But on a practical basis, the faster stuff dies, the less time there is for someone to make a mistake or screw up a rotation or let the boss catch them out-of-bounds. Team sociology tends to favor people who can adjust to the circumstances, including who else is playing, how well people are doing.

When a player says, "I'm running this, but not that", it suggests that they expect everyone else to adjust to their playstyle, but they don't believe that they need to adjust to meet everyone else's.

And that's fine if you're running the raid. People should reasonably expect to adjust more to suit the commander. If instead you're joining someone else's group, I strongly encourage you to be flexible. It's easier for everyone, including yourself.

I see "off meta" raids from time to time, so it's a thing. As a full viper's condi mirage my health pool is flimsy to say the least, but I generally don't have any issues with healing (though finding healing druid can be an adventure sometimes). You're just meant to rely on your healers to stay alive. Or on boonshare chrono to throw aegis your way. On your friendly DH to press F3 in bad situation. Then you can shine with extra super mega damage (if RNG gods smile at you).

When you switch to Marauder's, how much of an extra hit can you take without going down? Is there something that prevents group healer from giving you that extra health to survive? A positioning problem or rotation problem or something else?

...................

@Arheundel.6451 said:I get the joke but...simply I won't play full zerk ele, the 11k Hp build is just ridicolous and I'm sure a marauder ele would get things done in the end so why the problems?

Sure why not, i personally user zerker...BUT to each his own. Here's how you check:Get ArcDPS, and use your build. If on normal, you alone circumstances you top 10k, you should be good.If you do ~15k and above consitently in T4 Fractals (with a chrono and a druid, or at least a steady source of might, quickness, alacrity and fury), you shouldn't have a problem.

Otherwise, if you don't want to install ArcDPS for any number of reasons, go to the DPS Golem, if you can top 20k with realistic boons, you should be alright.If you can't, consider adding more berzerker/assassin's items to your gear.

I strongly recomend ArcDPS if you really want to improve your personal build, since it will tell you more than just your DPS, but also stuff like your overal crit rate (if it's low you might want more precision, if it's high but your damage is still low - likely with marauder's, you might need more power or ferocity), etc.

PS: These are in no way great values, but are more or less enough for you to not be a waste of space in a Raid (The median for Tempest in GW2 Raidar is 15k, so doing that consistently should be enough).

pug runs 2 healer , slow gors break . usually no weaver or bad weaver unless its kc.if u meant pug "meta" , generally as long as your dps is fine , some off meta gear option or utility /trait changes are fine by most pug groups .things like power herald , power reaper may have trouble with pugs tho .

also keep in mind , some off meta build even meta build will suffer from lacking of aoe or ranged option or burst or cc on certain bosses , its still better for you to be flexible .otherwise if the group struggles ,even your dps is fine , you might still be the one who holds the group back . despite whatever pug believes , more often utilities help more than higher dps .especially on bosses like sloth or xera

and like someone already said , if you feel full zerker weaver is not good for you , it might be better to just play holo or dh . if you already have ascended light armor , you can try power chrono .its easier than weaver with better utility + cc .and if you have trouble to stay alive on weaver , try to replace primary stance with defensive skill before you change gear . its much more practical this way .

@"Arheundel.6451" said:I mean...is there any way that casuals can enjoy the end game part of GW2 without adhering to a strict meta archetype? I am looking for a guild or just a group of people who just want to enjoy the game without all the fuss , anger and frustration.

To be more specific , I do not expect or even want the same level of "efficiency" of meta runs but at the same I will commit to a certain level of common sense like I wouldn't expect to get anything done with a healing thief for example.

Basically is there anywhere out there where you can play with whatever stats and still enjoy the mode as long as the job get done?

Yeah. Usually guild groups do this. And if you're running guild groups, meta is not a requirement at all, so long as your build makes "sense." No healthief, sorry. Usually people will still play meta or something close since it's pretty easy and comfortable, but not required in most guild groups I've run. I mean, I run full ascended Soldier's gear, Hammer, Axe(mace)/Shield on a base warrior (I have both expansions) and regularly clear wings 1-4. Not actually tried the newest raid though.

@TexZero.7910 said:Only if you join meta groups.

Create your own group with your own rules and problem solved.

Ignore any other posts ... ^^^ THIS one is /thread

You simply need to be aware that there are players that want optimal play ... and there are those that don't. Respect the teams that want optimal play if you decide to join them.

In 99% of the LFG groups you are expected to play meta because the builds are min maxed, increasing the chances to win the fight. Obviously those groups do not want any people in the groups who intentionally do not use meta builds. Who would want someone in the group that intentionally lowers success chances (or at best makes the fight harder and longer because you have less DPS). With enough DPS many mechanics in raids become skipped or obsolete.

All the stat and trait options in this game just create an illusion of choice, most are completly terrible for anything but niche uses. Plenty of classes have just a single viable build for each game mode.