So.....next up season 5 or xpac?

[ZeftheWicked.3076]

As in title.

[DeanBB.4268]

LW season 5 is next.

[Ayakaru.6583]

As in previous announced news

[KryTiKaL.3125]

They don't need another expansion yet. They need to address current game issues with PvP balance, PvE content (such as dead content like dungeons), WvW with Alliance System or otherwise, and QoL issues (such as inconsistencies in PvE design, interface functionality and use, and mechanic issues with gameplay).

A new expansion would just add more onto that plate and likely make several of the current issues worse with the addition of some new content thing, new elite specs, new race (unlikely), etc.

[Blude.6812]

OP can search and quickly find what Ayakaru said.

[Brimstone.3807]

Is it even confirmed the xpac model will continue? I haven't read anything to indicate that.I believe they did say they want to focus on expanding existing maps instead of introducing new ones for LW seasons. Which honestly sounds kind of bleak in combination with the lack of an xpac.

[Danikat.8537]

@Brimstone.3807 said:Is it even confirmed the xpac model will continue? I haven't read anything to indicate that.I believe they did say they want to focus on expanding existing maps instead of introducing new ones for LW seasons. Which honestly sounds kind of bleak in combination with the lack of an xpac.

Anet almost never announce their long-term plans (because people then expect it all to happen very soon and complain when it doesn't) so it's not unusual that all they've said is that season 5 is up next. We know nothing beyond that but because it's not unusual there's no reason to think they won't announce more details about season 5 when it's starting and announce the next thing (expansion, more living story, something else...) once that season is done.

[Tzarakiel.7490]

Honestly I couldn't care less about people that says Anet should not add more stuff until they improve the game balance. I want new elite specs to play with and someone else's subjective opinion is not gonna change mine. Besides I hate the idea that because X isn't the way I want, they should not do Y. It's not like the same teams that balance the game makes the elite specs in the first place. One isn't going to affect the other until elite specs are close to completion.

[Zaklex.6308]

@"ZeftheWicked.3076" said:As in title.

In case you missed the before: https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/whats-next-for-guild-wars-2/

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

@Brimstone.3807 said:Is it even confirmed the xpac model will continue? I haven't read anything to indicate that.I believe they did say they want to focus on expanding existing maps instead of introducing new ones for LW seasons. Which honestly sounds kind of bleak in combination with the lack of an xpac.

Here's what was announced:

Content teams will have more flexibility to decide what makes sense for a given release—for example, we could focus on expanding the boundaries and content of an existing map if that would provide a better experience than creating a new one.

Could focus, a possibility; nothing set in stone.

[Samnang.1879]

yall complain about expac costing $50, but now they gonna give lw5 for free and yall want an expac... make up ur minds

[Gop.8713]

@Samnang.1879 said:yall complain about expac costing $50, but now they gonna give lw5 for free and yall want an expac... make up ur minds

I have never understood the community's interest in expacs. I've always thought of them as a necessary evil at best . . .

[Derdzvero.7051]

Free content is crap (lws). Paid content should be good (expansion).GW2 cannot live on LWSx and gold2gem conversion, it's just a matter of time to either shut down or release paid stuff.

[Faaris.8013]

@Derdzvero.7051 said:GW2 cannot live on LWSx and gold2gem conversion, it's just a matter of time to either shut down or release paid stuff.

How do you know what earns them more money? And don't forget that every gem that is sold for gold had to be aquired with real money (with the exception of the little amount that enters the game via achievement chests). I would guess that Anet generates more income with the gold <> gem conversions than with expansions.

[Derdzvero.7051]

Having stable income doesn't mean enough for development of new quality content. There is no objection to the fact that game can survive on gems to cover its maintenance cycle, but business logic dictates income can be significantly increased-no business mgmt will overlook that so easily.

The problem in GW2 currently is the new content development. LWS are given for free to existing player base. That works only if we'd have high number of newcomers, willing to pay upfront for that content. And that with real money, not ingame currency.Which is not the case - not many new players join, way less of those buy expansions, way less of those buy LWS episodes and a small percentage of those do all that with real money. And so on.

That means LWS development gets funded by costs, which are irregular and unpredictable..or coming from cosmetics, which creates conflict of interests: anet has to release ugly items and bad content to encourage financial income... Or in very best case dedicate resources to cosmetics, instead of better development/maintenance.

Just imagine the financial income if they would release a new expansion tomorrow - probably 70% of active player base would pay 35-50€ on the spot.. that's a huge fiancial injection and it won't take money out of maintenance pot .

[maddoctor.2738]

@Faaris.8013 said:How do you know what earns them more money?

According to the official revenue reports during the expansion months there is ALWAYS a large spike in revenue. Meaning, during expansion release they get way more money than they do when there is no expansion.

In fact comparing Q4 2017 (when POF was released) with Q1 2019 (the latest quarter we have info on), Guild Wars 2 made 34903 in Q4 2017 and 16337 in Q1 2019, so double the amount of money during the expansion release. -all values in million korean won.

So it's rather clear what earns them more money, and that's expansions.

[Gop.8713]

@maddoctor.2738 said:

@Faaris.8013 said:How do you know what earns them more money?

According to the official revenue reports during the expansion months there is ALWAYS a large spike in revenue. Meaning, during expansion release they get way more money than they do when there is no expansion.

In fact comparing Q4 2017 (when POF was released) with Q1 2019 (the latest quarter we have info on), Guild Wars 2 made 34903 in Q4 2017 and 16337 in Q1 2019, so double the amount of money during the expansion release. -all values in million korean won.

So it's rather clear what earns them more money, and that's expansions.

You may be right -- or you may not -- but those numbers don't tell you anything . . .

[maddoctor.2738]

@Gop.8713 said:

@maddoctor.2738 said:

@Faaris.8013 said:How do you know what earns them more money?

According to the official revenue reports during the expansion months there is ALWAYS a large spike in revenue. Meaning, during expansion release they get way more money than they do when there is no expansion.

In fact comparing Q4 2017 (when POF was released) with Q1 2019 (the latest quarter we have info on), Guild Wars 2 made 34903 in Q4 2017 and 16337 in Q1 2019, so double the amount of money during the expansion release. -all values in million korean won.

So it's rather clear what earns them more money, and that's expansions.

You may be right -- or you may not -- but those numbers don't tell you anything . . .

Arenanet making double the money during the expansion sale than they do now doesn't tell us anything?

[Faaris.8013]

@maddoctor.2738 said:

@Faaris.8013 said:How do you know what earns them more money?

According to the official revenue reports during the expansion months there is ALWAYS a large spike in revenue. Meaning, during expansion release they get way more money than they do when there is no expansion.

In fact comparing Q4 2017 (when POF was released) with Q1 2019 (the latest quarter we have info on), Guild Wars 2 made 34903 in Q4 2017 and 16337 in Q1 2019, so double the amount of money during the expansion release. -all values in million korean won.

So it's rather clear what earns them more money, and that's expansions.

Well, that sounds like expansions cause players to spend more money in general when expansions are released. That means expansions are good for revenue (I never argued about that, of course they do) but not because people spend money on the expansion itself. Revenue would probably rise with the release of an expansion even if they handed them out for free. People buy the new stuff, need gold for mounts so they trade gold for gems etc.

[Gop.8713]

@maddoctor.2738 said:

@Gop.8713 said:

@maddoctor.2738 said:

@Faaris.8013 said:How do you know what earns them more money?

According to the official revenue reports during the expansion months there is ALWAYS a large spike in revenue. Meaning, during expansion release they get way more money than they do when there is no expansion.

In fact comparing Q4 2017 (when POF was released) with Q1 2019 (the latest quarter we have info on), Guild Wars 2 made 34903 in Q4 2017 and 16337 in Q1 2019, so double the amount of money during the expansion release. -all values in million korean won.

So it's rather clear what earns them more money, and that's expansions.

You may be right -- or you may not -- but those numbers don't tell you anything . . .

Arenanet making double the money during the expansion sale than they do now doesn't tell us anything?

No. Not without knowledge of how much is invested in developing the expac, how long they can continue to see that bump if expac releases continue at regular intervals, how much it takes to maintain gw2 in its 'baseline' maintenance state vs the revenues received during those periods, how long those revenues will hold out without a new retail release, etc. . . .

We really have absolutely nowhere near the kind of information we would need before we could make a decision about whether an expac would make financial sense for anet . . .

[Eloc Freidon.5692]

Since the PoF leak and in regards to that, the furthest an Anet employee has discussed is that they know what they have planned on doing after the expansion and into the next. We won't know and shouldn't know what until about the 5th year after PoF's launch. That is until things go smoothly, which is hasn't considering this year. Which is fine since they bounced back as strong as ever.

[maddoctor.2738]

@Faaris.8013 said:Well, that sounds like expansions cause players to spend more money in general when expansions are released. That means expansions are good for revenue (I never argued about that, of course they do) but not because people spend money on the expansion itself. Revenue would probably rise with the release of an expansion even if they handed them out for free. People buy the new stuff, need gold for mounts so they trade gold for gems etc.

Expansions come bundled with 2k gems for those that get the deluxe editions (cheaper than buying the gems in-game btw)

[maddoctor.2738]

@Gop.8713 said:No. Not without knowledge of how much is invested in developing the expac, how long they can continue to see that bump if expac releases continue at regular intervals, how much it takes to maintain gw2 in its 'baseline' maintenance state vs the revenues received during those periods, how long those revenues will hold out without a new retail release, etc. . . .We really have absolutely nowhere near the kind of information we would need before we could make a decision about whether an expac would make financial sense for anet . . .

All we know is that during the living world releases period the revenue is on a steep decline, and when expansions are released they get a very big boost in revenue. It was the same when HOT was released and when POF was released.

[Etria.3642]

@maddoctor.2738 said:

@Faaris.8013 said:How do you know what earns them more money?

According to the official revenue reports during the expansion months there is ALWAYS a large spike in revenue. Meaning, during expansion release they get way more money than they do when there is no expansion.

In fact comparing Q4 2017 (when POF was released) with Q1 2019 (the latest quarter we have info on), Guild Wars 2 made 34903 in Q4 2017 and 16337 in Q1 2019, so double the amount of money during the expansion release. -all values in million korean won.

So it's rather clear what earns them more money, and that's expansions.

Actually, we don't know that. Example:Company spends 12 million on product. Company earns 24 million in gross revenue. Profit: 12 millionCompany runs business as usual. Company earns 14 million in gross revenue. Profit: 14 millionCompany spends 12 million on product. 70% of current customers purchase product and then can continue to spend on new product-related revenue: Profit: 12 million.Company runs business as usual following new product. Company earns 10 million in gross revenue. Profit: 10 million

Mind you these numbers are sheer complete made-up numbers if what /might/ have happened after Path of Fire. IE, if a player does not HAVE mounts, they obviously are not purchasing the $30 mount skin. That is /literally/ the price of an expansion with a TINY percent of the effort.

Further example: This is using gw2efficiency, which is, granted, not all the accounts. But even so, only 79% of registered users on it have Path of Fire. 93% have Heart of Thorns. The logic would then follow that /not/ everyone who bought Path of Fire would purchase a new expansion.

Again, if you don't have access to the new shinies, you aren't spending money on the Fashion Wars part of the new shinies. I have thrown around other theories too, such as the huge buy-in a new player must make, /currently/ even without a new expansion. In fact we FINALLY recruited a long-standing friend, who, it turns out, had purchased the base game, leveled to a whopping 31, decided he didn't like it, and left. Well, yesterday he bought both expansions, and was happily going through his birthday stuff(to my jealously since I have not even hit the 3 year mark) and we had gotten him his raptor, taken him through a couple events, and he's currently fussing over having to also buy all the lw chapters. I honestly don't think he would have returned at all if he had to buy /another/ expansion too. At least the chapters he can do in smaller chunks.

[maddoctor.2738]

@Etria.3642 said:Company spends 12 million on product. Company earns 24 million in gross revenue. Profit: 12 millionCompany runs business as usual. Company earns 14 million in gross revenue. Profit: 14 millionCompany spends 12 million on product. 70% of current customers purchase product and then can continue to spend on new product-related revenue: Profit: 12 million.Company runs business as usual following new product. Company earns 10 million in gross revenue. Profit: 10 million

Given how Arenanet has the same number of employees it's highly unlikely that they spend more during expansions. The cost for the company is the same, regardless if their employees are working on an expansion or the living world. The big difference is those cancelled projects.

Further example: This is using gw2efficiency, which is, granted, not all the accounts. But even so, only 79% of registered users on it have Path of Fire. 93% have Heart of Thorns. The logic would then follow that /not/ everyone who bought Path of Fire would purchase a new expansion.

Using gw2efficiency again, you can see that although 80% have bought Path of Fire, only 32% reached Dragonfall. This means that many players bought the expansion, but less than half still play and visit the gem store to bring revenue to Arenanet. Yes many players won't buy the next expansion, but the drop between expansions is much smaller than the drop in the Living World.