Vagrant.7206

I don't agree. There are builds that stand above others and are considered OP for a reason. One class (particular build) should not be able to:deal crazy damagehave crazy sustainhave crazy utilityhave a whole set of boons on demandhave access to strong CChave invulnerability all at once and on its own. It's never going to be a good design. Sure, Engi at its core is a hybrid class and should be jack-of-all-trades, master of none. Every build must have a weakness. But every engi build does. That's what boggles me about this thread. The rifle variant is very susceptible to condi damage, corruption, and CC. A good scourge can ruin this holo's day.The prot variant is very susceptible to CC and spike damage. It also has poor escape and chase potential. A spike rev can ruin this holo's day.The problem is when you try to yolo the yolosmith, you get yolo'ed first. Try playing holo, or watching two holos fight. They engage each other in a way to exploit each other's weaknesses, presuming they both know what they're doing.

I think if you use Elixir X underwater, you can still see it. The difference between Rampage and Tornado is particularly hard felt on builds where I've used Elixir X. I pray every single time to get rampage. If it's tornado, I just hit 3 -> 4 -> 5 and exit the transform after.

Protip: Don't try. If you know nobody's listening, don't talk. Think you've trolled the thread enough? Nawp. Welcome to the GW2 forums! We've got broken records everywhere! Fair point. That's the sad thing about fourms. The very argument we would have had over a beer... That would have taken like 3min... Makes it look like we want to kill each other... When in reality we could have read expressions and tone, and completely skipped the 'argument' part and kept it in discussion-land. Yep! Light trolling seems to be about the only thing I can do to get people to that point.

Protip: Don't try. If you know nobody's listening, don't talk. Think you've trolled the thread enough? Nawp. Welcome to the GW2 forums! We've got broken records everywhere!

Leadership would be a logical choice, given boon duration + conversion.

Protip: Don't try. If you know nobody's listening, don't talk.

We're not saying you can't be excited but we're saying you can't double your barrier gain on a support build like you calculate, or go from dumpster to extremely overpowered feats like tanking three people like you're expecting to do. (Edit: that wasn't you actually, mb) Haha... In this case nihilism is the nametag on the strawman you just shredded Who is we? Royal we. Chaith is engineer royalty.

Doing so makes you way more vulnerable though. You lose a stunbreak and stealth.

That's what's most aggravating. Even a higher skill player can outplay a holo till they're 25%, and then you see how OP they are. Invuln, stealth, heal to full, superspeed escape. What's worst is holos Cooldowns are so low, once they cowardly run away, they'll return as if the fight never happened and try again till you die

Your first mistake was looking at it by each profession as a whole. Second mistake was purposefully leaving out that Engi(Scrapper) had Rapid Regeneration, Adaptive Armor, Perfectly Weighted, Recovery Matrix, F5 skill all functionally deleted in favor of things that have much less sustain and utility. You went through every spec that recently got gutted, but I'm guessing Scrapper didn't make your thorough list of nerfs every profession has gotten cause' it didn't fit your narrative that ArenaNet purposefully let's Engineers fall under the radar. It's in the same boat that Druid is. Keep the discussion to Holo specifically and you won't look as biased Some number nerfing on Heat therapy won't magically cause a drop of Holo from OP to UP state and we both know that....Wat It's literally a free bonus heal less every 20 seconds or less. It's a reward for going full ham as fast as possible. If your goal is to nerf sustain, it's one of the most obvious targets. It's also never been nerfed, and a ripe target for it.

This is very true but certain people are not willing to try to get creative with their builds thus they rather stick to the Meta over getting a it creative with what can be made. Holosmith is fine for players who want a alternative to spamming Grenades in a Power build but it has potential in a condition build aswell to build Burn condition with Grenade conditions and pistol conditions. The mind is the greatest weapon because it is where creativity to how can someone be killed is made. As for the Elite Spec itself for me, well I am still waiting on something else a bit more creative with the Elite Spec that is not "spam kits' and Ignore Main Weapon. a Elite Spec that is deisnged to sacrifice Kits to modify the Main Weapon is still a interesting one I hope they may one day add since as a Engineer, the character should have a Elite Spec that gives them the ability to focus on Main Weapon by Modifying it using the Kits to perform the type of role they want such as if Rifle gets modified with Grenade and Bomb kit, it would gain 5 new Rifle skills that focus on Power Explosive Damage but if you modify the Rifle with Grenade Kit and Flamethrower kit, the Rifle gets 5 New skills that focus on Condition Explosive Burn Damage. Along with if you Modify the Rile with ELite Mortor kit with Tool Kit, it gives the Rifle 5 new skills that makes it into a Power Damage Railgun. Holo is not good with a condi setup .... it is better core engi condi than holo condi ihmo. For a condi setup with pistols you need firearms , so you have to take holo and firearms .... if you take also explosive you are of paper but nades without granedier are not viable ihmo . I disagree. Condi holo is superior, if only because it's way easier on the fingers for roughly equivalent DPS. how do you build it ? https://snowcrows.com/raids/builds/engineer/holosmith/condition/ No stunbreak, no condi clean .... It's meant for PvE.

Uhh, more PTSD, less Stockholm syndrome. Remember what they did to turrets? u mean removing the ability to throw ur turrets to places unreachable to other players? fmlWay more than that. Turrets (except HT) were rendered largely inoperable for a few years.

Uhh, more PTSD, less Stockholm syndrome. Remember what they did to turrets?

According to the OP, if you have a build, it's BS.

This is very true but certain people are not willing to try to get creative with their builds thus they rather stick to the Meta over getting a it creative with what can be made. Holosmith is fine for players who want a alternative to spamming Grenades in a Power build but it has potential in a condition build aswell to build Burn condition with Grenade conditions and pistol conditions. The mind is the greatest weapon because it is where creativity to how can someone be killed is made. As for the Elite Spec itself for me, well I am still waiting on something else a bit more creative with the Elite Spec that is not "spam kits' and Ignore Main Weapon. a Elite Spec that is deisnged to sacrifice Kits to modify the Main Weapon is still a interesting one I hope they may one day add since as a Engineer, the character should have a Elite Spec that gives them the ability to focus on Main Weapon by Modifying it using the Kits to perform the type of role they want such as if Rifle gets modified with Grenade and Bomb kit, it would gain 5 new Rifle skills that focus on Power Explosive Damage but if you modify the Rifle with Grenade Kit and Flamethrower kit, the Rifle gets 5 New skills that focus on Condition Explosive Burn Damage. Along with if you Modify the Rile with ELite Mortor kit with Tool Kit, it gives the Rifle 5 new skills that makes it into a Power Damage Railgun. Holo is not good with a condi setup .... it is better core engi condi than holo condi ihmo. For a condi setup with pistols you need firearms , so you have to take holo and firearms .... if you take also explosive you are of paper but nades without granedier are not viable ihmo . I disagree. Condi holo is superior, if only because it's way easier on the fingers for roughly equivalent DPS. how do you build it ? https://snowcrows.com/raids/builds/engineer/holosmith/condition/

Don't forget time constraints. Those of us with jobs may not be able to play at the same times as those whom we want to play with. Some people, like myself, don't like being tied to a set schedule either.

This is very true but certain people are not willing to try to get creative with their builds thus they rather stick to the Meta over getting a it creative with what can be made. Holosmith is fine for players who want a alternative to spamming Grenades in a Power build but it has potential in a condition build aswell to build Burn condition with Grenade conditions and pistol conditions. The mind is the greatest weapon because it is where creativity to how can someone be killed is made. As for the Elite Spec itself for me, well I am still waiting on something else a bit more creative with the Elite Spec that is not "spam kits' and Ignore Main Weapon. a Elite Spec that is deisnged to sacrifice Kits to modify the Main Weapon is still a interesting one I hope they may one day add since as a Engineer, the character should have a Elite Spec that gives them the ability to focus on Main Weapon by Modifying it using the Kits to perform the type of role they want such as if Rifle gets modified with Grenade and Bomb kit, it would gain 5 new Rifle skills that focus on Power Explosive Damage but if you modify the Rifle with Grenade Kit and Flamethrower kit, the Rifle gets 5 New skills that focus on Condition Explosive Burn Damage. Along with if you Modify the Rile with ELite Mortor kit with Tool Kit, it gives the Rifle 5 new skills that makes it into a Power Damage Railgun. Holo is not good with a condi setup .... it is better core engi condi than holo condi ihmo. For a condi setup with pistols you need firearms , so you have to take holo and firearms .... if you take also explosive you are of paper but nades without granedier are not viable ihmo . I disagree. Condi holo is superior, if only because it's way easier on the fingers for roughly equivalent DPS.

That would be a buff, mate. Elixir U is also a stunbreak. Doing the opposite would actually be a nerf. Hyperbole, AWAYYYYY. Seriously though, every time the subject of holo comes up, you chime in. Then I chime in. Then we circle around the same tired old arguments. You claim that holo hasn't seen any major nerfs. I point out several substantial nerfs to damage and sustain. You claim healing turret is the best heal in the game. I point out that Heat Therapy is the problem. You claim that "There's too much stability" and almost everyone points out that you can just avoid corona burst to prevent the majority of stability holo has access to (don't even need to dodge, just range or kite). Can we just stop circling around the same tired arguments?You only pretend*.Its kinda ridiculous "we shouldnt nerf holo because year ago it had some nerfs", I had a good laugh.HT isnt the main issue, its part of it. HT alone wont stop them from spamming forge with low cds carelessly, the amount of passives to help them as well.I get that you want such nerf that wont affect real issues so it be OP still, pretty obvious, talking with such people is pointless, so I wont.This is what we call "moving the goalposts." I pointed out several places where your anger was misguided, but then you shift it to another, generally vaguer problem.

Pistol 1 has one of the lowest power coefficients of any autoattacks in the game (0.4). Only one that's lower is necro scepter, which has way more utility in its autoattack. No need to nerf it further just to meet its stated cast time. As far as kits go: Med kit is fine after rework. No complaints.Tool kit's #2 skill needs to be change to have more utility. I would suggest increasing the radius, duration, and duration of bleeds/cripples of the attack. Rest of the skills are fine.Bomb kit needs to have short fuse as a baseline. The delay is too long to be useful in competitive formats.Grenade kit should have the flight speed increase as baseline. I would also suggest adding some kind of resistance to projectile hate/retaliation, because these REALLY hurt grenade kit.E-Gun is mostly fine. I would like to see its #1 and #2 improved though.Flamethrower #1 should have burning interspersed throughout the attack, not at the end. This would make it way more dangerous (and useful) in competitive formats. I also think the #4 skill should destroy projectiles, and the #5 skill should have ammo (2 count seems right).Mortar kit should have have lower flight times. I think it's otherwise in a decent spot.

Hyperbole, AWAYYYYY. Seriously though, every time the subject of holo comes up, you chime in. Then I chime in. Then we circle around the same tired old arguments. You claim that holo hasn't seen any major nerfs. I point out several substantial nerfs to damage and sustain. You claim healing turret is the best heal in the game. I point out that Heat Therapy is the problem. You claim that "There's too much stability" and almost everyone points out that you can just avoid corona burst to prevent the majority of stability holo has access to (don't even need to dodge, just range or kite). Can we just stop circling around the same tired arguments?

and the only way to catch holo is with another holo to reveal them, feelsweirdman @"praqtos.9035" said:I wonder if any amount of "nerf braindead holo" threads will have any effect.After layoffs it was left without attention.Pretty braindead spam spec with a high reward and low effort, its been settled its about PvE now. Either you play one or shut up->buy gems->play pve. The hyperbole is real in this thread.

Truth is, both of the pistols need improvement. MH more than OH. Casting time on Pistol 1 is a big problem. It's >60% longer than the stated casting time. Its AoE effect could also stand to be improved.Pistol 2 (Poison dart volley) should pierce targets. This skill is abysmal for group combat.Pistol 3 is probably the best of MH pistol. I might increase the confusion stacks, but otherwise it seems fair.Pistol 4 is fine IMO.Pistol 5 should also pulse slow on targets in the glue shot, and I'd increase the velocity of the projectile. It's still pretty slow and unwieldy.Pistol could also stand to have some better, more interesting traits. I honestly miss Coated Bullets. There's really 4 turrets that need examination: Rocket Turret's normal attack is pretty flimsy, and its overcharge has such an insane arc, you might as well fuhgeddaboutit. The toolbelt is even worse.Net turret is simply underwhelming. Same goes for the toolbelt.Flame turret should add a longer burn, or more burn stacks. The toolbelt is alright.Rifle turret does laughable damage (overcharged or not). It's almost exclusively taken for its toolbelt or an extra blast finisher.I'm not even going to get into kits because that would take me way too much time.

Thank you for listening on most of these changes. Rune of antitoxin was the biggest problem as far as cleansing goes. Rest of the changes look fairly good, few inputs I have: Thank you for noticing how impact savant was overbearing to scrappers in general. This change should be sufficient to see more scrappers in offensive builds in all competitive game formats.While the change to chemical field is more competitive in PVP game modes, it's got a negative impact on PvE. It's also thematically inappropriate. I would suggest leaving chemical field as it is, but the field left behind pulses reveal. Alternatively, as many players have suggested, tie detection pulse to function gyro. Considering f-gyro is nearly useless right now, it would be helpful.Should the change to rune of antitoxin go through, please don't double-whammy purge gyro. On builds that don't have rune of antitoxin, this nerf would substantially reduce self-cleansing potential for offensively-oriented scrappers.

The change to rune of antitoxin was sufficient enough to reduce the impact of cleansing scrappers. I don't think they need to double-whammy purge gyro.Sneak gyro change is fine.Change to corona burst is fine.HS change strikes me as a little odd for a WvW-focused balance change, seems more relevant to sPvP. But, I don't play WvW enough to really have a stake in this one.Impact Savant change is immensely appreciated. This change would be sufficient to see offensive scrapper become relevant again.Chemical field change feels thematically inappropriate, even if it's kind of a buff for WvW support scrapper. I think it might be smarter to leave chemical field, but add an AoE reveal onto the poison field.Overall... alright. I'm glad to see they listened on several of the changes. It'll be nice to see more utility in offensive scrapper builds.

Oh, look. It's the usual suspects on this thread. Sigh.