Guardians are highly infuriating and broken

[HunterLogic.1203]

No matter what I do I can't beat Guardians, they block so much damage while also deal like 90% of your health in less than a second, how is this fair. It could be a DH, FB or Core. They just absolutely melt you through any form of defensive ability and it makes no difference between me using berserkers amulet or demolishers they throw 1 skill and poof 90% of my health is gone. How the hell do you counter this class as an engineer. I don't button mash and I make sure to use my abilities only at certain times. I have even went as far as using Elixir C, Spectrum Shield and Elixir S and still they can melt through all of it. I either get turned into a burn victim or spin to win in most cases.

Are they just busted or am I missing something?

 

If it helps I only have around 200 hours in the game and I come from WoW as a 2.2k arena player as well as having a significant amount of time in BDO as well as a pvp player.

[Guirssane.7082]

Just dodge... 

What do you die from? JI + GS combo? Getting bounced in traps? To counter DH you LoS it, if you're tethered you go behind a wall so he can't pull u in trap. If you know he is running core greatsword just expect the JI + greatsword combo and dodge... For a game as complex mechanically as gw2, 200 hours isn't much, keep going

Edited September 6, 2021 by Guirssane.7082

[Genesis.5169]

Bruh when you said FB killed you in seconds you lost any and all credibility that your single post history could give you.

[HunterLogic.1203]

6 minutes ago, Genesis.5169 said:

Bruh when you said FB killed you in seconds you lost any and all credibility that your single post history could give you.

Based on this your input or opinion would automatically be invalidated and worthless. If your not going to provide anything constructive or give any tips why bother posting?

[Genesis.5169]

23 minutes ago, HunterLogic.1203 said:

Based on this your input or opinion would automatically be invalidated and worthless. If your not going to provide anything constructive or give any tips why bother posting?

 

FB does so little damage that just dodge would too be generous only way for an FB to kill you is if you stood in every aoe for a good 10 seconds didnt roll didn't cleanse and didn't heal. Not much advice to give that traitline is in such a bad state only way to lose against it is stand still for 10seconds do absolutely nothing cleanse nothing and do no damage.

 

You literally can walk out of everything unless you get scepter 3'd in which cause you still wouldn't die, unless purging flames is under you which is a consecration and its gonna take atleast 2-3 pulses to kill you if you sitting on 2 symbols, Now how you got purging flames and 2 symbols under you and then a scepter 3 on you to keep you there is beyond me.

 

So much has to go right for Firebrand to actually kill you its not funny thats why you got my response.

 

FB is in a really shattered state so bad that you run it in marauders as a power build even then its not enough, running avatars or sage doesn't help you at all FB heals don't do enough to apply stats for sPvP everything FB does Core guardian does it better and easier and faster access to it. Can't run it condition either because they neutered all of that too.

Edited September 6, 2021 by Genesis.5169

[Diswan.8156]

2 minutes ago, Genesis.5169 said:

 

FB does so little damage that just dodge would too be generous only way for an FB to kill you is if you stood in every aoe for a good 10 seconds didnt roll didn't cleanse and didn't heal. Not much advice to give that traitline is in such a bad state only way to lose against it is stand still for 10seconds do absolutely nothing cleanse nothing and do no damage.

 

You literally can walk out of everything unless you get scepter 3'd in which cause you still wouldn't die, unless purging flames is under you which is a consecration and its gonna take atleast 2-3 pulses to kill you if you sitting on 2 symbols, Now how you got purging flames and 2 symbols under you and then a scepter 3 on you to keep you there is beyond me.

 

So much has to go right for Firebrand to actually kill you its not funny thats why you got my response.

 

FB is in a really shattered state so bad that you run it in marauders as a power build even then its not enough, running avatars or sage doesn't help you at all FB heals don't do enough to apply stats for sPvP everything FB does Core guardian does it better and easier and faster access to it. Can't run it condition either because they neutered all of that too.

I'm sorry bro, but you are wrong there. 

I get what you are saying and why your saying it. Firebrand in PVP is very underpowered. 

This being said, most of it's issues come from sustain and not really from it's lack of damage. 

 

Quickness in PVP is a huge diference in the amount of dmg u can deal. 

I have been trying a hybrid and another power based build and it rlly melts people super fast. 

 

This builds are a Lot of fun but the lack of sustain and escapes make it a meme build for playing at "plat" lvl. 

 

[Sigmoid.7082]

31 minutes ago, HunterLogic.1203 said:

Based on this your input or opinion would automatically be invalidated and worthless. If your not going to provide anything constructive or give any tips why bother posting?

To be entirely fair it doesn't sound like you are asking for help at all and comes across as the typical type of post of "I am dying / can't win so it must be overpowered. Trust me I am a good player so I know, I'm good at other games. "

 

If you really want help on understanding what's going on, why, and how to improve, especially with how new you are to the game, I don't think you are going about asking for it the right way. 

[Leonidrex.5649]

1 hour ago, Diswan.8156 said:

I'm sorry bro, but you are wrong there. 

I get what you are saying and why your saying it. Firebrand in PVP is very underpowered. 

This being said, most of it's issues come from sustain and not really from it's lack of damage. 

 

Quickness in PVP is a huge diference in the amount of dmg u can deal. 

I have been trying a hybrid and another power based build and it rlly melts people super fast. 

 

This builds are a Lot of fun but the lack of sustain and escapes make it a meme build for playing at "plat" lvl. 

 

FB is objectively not good, it has nothing to do with ranking, its bad in every rank.
EVERYTHING kills bad players, if something doesnt work in plat, it just doesnt work in general, you dont get to plat by being good, you get to plat by not actively sabotaging your own games.

[Ragnar.4257]

You are certainly missing something.

 

Holosmith is generally considered to be an S-tier or A-tier sidenoder. Guardian is generally considered to be C-tier sidenoder.

 

In a 1v1 you should never, under any circumstances, be eating the full damage of the "spin to win" - i.e. GS#2. Given that it's the main damage dealing skill, you should be saving a dodge for it, and even if you don't have a dodge, if you simply run out of it you'll only take 50% of the damage, since GS#2 reduces the guardians movement speed so that he can't keep pace with you.

 

As a holosmith you have greater mobility with Holo Leap, superspeed, as well as potentially stealth, which means you can dictate when and where you want to engage, or you can disengage when you want. You also have very good healing between your healing skill, elixir gun, heat therapy. These 2 facts combined mean that, provided you don't get 1-shot, you can always disengage, heal up, and then come back in. This means that in a protracted war of attrition, you should always eventually beat a guardian 1v1. The only way the guardian can win this fight is if he gets a cheesy 1-shot right at the start. Provided you are properly using your dodges, defensive cooldowns, and not standing like a dumpling in AoE like symbols, it's entirely in your power to not get 1-shot.

 

The simplest way to learn how to deal with this, would be to make a guardian yourself and go try and duel some holosmiths. You'll quickly come to see that any guardian build you make which can put out high levels of damage will always end up losing a war of attrition to a holosmith.

Edited September 6, 2021 by Ragnar.4257

[Pimsley.3681]

Hi OP, there's a counter to every guardian build but it appears from your post that you've encountered a burn guard and got insta bursted w/ a GS ( or may have been the spirit sword DH)

 

Since you have elixirs for cleansing lined up, if things get too heated vs a guard, you can always easily disengage with your S. 

 

Also, what engie build do you play? If prot holo, conditions applied to you can be a good thing for you and your team as you have the ability to convert them  to boons. 

 

If going vs a DPS, I suggest that your disengage. Maybe save a slot and understand how each specialization work and discover their weak points. The advice they gave you on here are pretty solid. 

[HunterLogic.1203]

Thanks for the tips. I do have a guardian at level 80 though I have not really played it beyond leveling.

 

I will give it a try and also find some guardians to duel.

 

I am playing the standard dps holosmith build.

[Disney.7826]

On 9/6/2021 at 3:05 AM, HunterLogic.1203 said:

No matter what I do I can't beat Guardians, they block so much damage while also deal like 90% of your health in less than a second, how is this fair. It could be a DH, FB or Core. They just absolutely melt you through any form of defensive ability and it makes no difference between me using berserkers amulet or demolishers they throw 1 skill and poof 90% of my health is gone. How the hell do you counter this class as an engineer. I don't button mash and I make sure to use my abilities only at certain times. I have even went as far as using Elixir C, Spectrum Shield and Elixir S and still they can melt through all of it. I either get turned into a burn victim or spin to win in most cases.

Are they just busted or am I missing something?

 

If it helps I only have around 200 hours in the game and I come from WoW as a 2.2k arena player as well as having a significant amount of time in BDO as well as a pvp player.

“Because i am bad and i cant kill guard, means they are OP, broken and should be removed from the game.”

 

U said how to counter as engi… i guess u are playing nade holo? DH - dodge tether and longbow 2, dont get pushed through test of faith, throw nades where u see he is playing traps - mostly try landing nade 2 (literally 1 shot dh). Core - just kite him and throw nades, guard is way slower than u, ur nades also pretty much ignore his aegis / focus 5.

 

Vs burn, read this trait

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Prismatic_Converter

 

U can also always ask some guard friend or someone in FFA to duel u

 

Also try setting up keybinds so u react to stuff faster.

Edited September 7, 2021 by Filip.7463

[Disney.7826]

21 hours ago, Pimsley.3681 said:

Hi OP, there's a counter to every guardian build but it appears from your post that you've encountered a burn guard and got insta bursted w/ a GS ( or may have been the spirit sword DH)

 

Since you have elixirs for cleansing lined up, if things get too heated vs a guard, you can always easily disengage with your S. 

Burn guard doesnt use greatsword and elixirs dont clean conditions… too heated vs guard use elixir S????? What the kitten are u talking

[BlackTruth.6813]

While the OP's skill level is questionable, Guardian has NEVER had a point in time where it took skill. It has always been an instant cast class that evaded while attacking, and even though Ranger/Necro/Mesmer/old d/d Ele was more effective in that aspect, you still provided boons to your team, and Guard was still a one dimensional spam evades/blinds while doing damage class. This class has NEVER been hard on paper and mechanically was one of the easiest classes in the game of ALL TIME, on top of ranger.

 

Some guardian players understand this and some of them don't, most guardians who tried an actual hard spec came crying back to guardian. I pray that willbender gets buffed to balanced and other guard specs nerfed to willbender level because TELEGRAPHED SKILLS/ASPECTS ARE HEALTHY FOR THE GAME. Not annoying random aegis's where you can't play a slow build or you just can't land a hit, that is meta enforcing and annoying.

 

ANET has a chance to balance this obnoxious brain damage class for once.

[Crozame.4098]

On 9/6/2021 at 10:17 AM, Ragnar.4257 said:

You are certainly missing something.

 

Holosmith is generally considered to be an S-tier or A-tier sidenoder. Guardian is generally considered to be C-tier sidenoder.

 

In a 1v1 you should never, under any circumstances, be eating the full damage of the "spin to win" - i.e. GS#2. Given that it's the main damage dealing skill, you should be saving a dodge for it, and even if you don't have a dodge, if you simply run out of it you'll only take 50% of the damage, since GS#2 reduces the guardians movement speed so that he can't keep pace with you.

 

As a holosmith you have greater mobility with Holo Leap, superspeed, as well as potentially stealth, which means you can dictate when and where you want to engage, or you can disengage when you want. You also have very good healing between your healing skill, elixir gun, heat therapy. These 2 facts combined mean that, provided you don't get 1-shot, you can always disengage, heal up, and then come back in. This means that in a protracted war of attrition, you should always eventually beat a guardian 1v1. The only way the guardian can win this fight is if he gets a cheesy 1-shot right at the start. Provided you are properly using your dodges, defensive cooldowns, and not standing like a dumpling in AoE like symbols, it's entirely in your power to not get 1-shot.

 

The simplest way to learn how to deal with this, would be to make a guardian yourself and go try and duel some holosmiths. You'll quickly come to see that any guardian build you make which can put out high levels of damage will always end up losing a war of attrition to a holosmith.

Just FYI, nade does not use elixir gun. And heat therapy got nerfed because of prot holo, so nade get collateral dmg.

 

I do not think nade nolo is a A-tier side noder. It needs to kite around to make space to spam nades, therefore, need to give up the node fast. Also, many side noders can win the matchup. 

 

But I guess symolic core guard is still quite fine as side node bunker. Well, at least it can decap since need to avoid the symbol dmg.

Edited September 7, 2021 by Crozame.4098

[Ragnar.4257]

16 minutes ago, Crozame.4098 said:

Just FYI, name does not use elixir gun. And heat therapy got nerfed because of prot holo, so nade get collateral dmg. But I guess symolic core guard is still quite fine as side node bunker. Well, at least it can decap since need to avoid the symbol dmg.

If as OP claim's he's getting killed in "under a second" by "spin to win" then we are not talking about bunker symbol builds. We're talking about zerker-greatsword builds.

 

You can't conflate a 1-shot zerker guardian with 11k HP and zero defensive traits with a sage/avater bunker guardian with 3 defensive trait-lines. They are not the same thing.

 

And being de-capped by symbol builds hasn't been a thing for more than a year now. Symbols do not cover the entire node. You can survive forever against a symbol build without even drawing your weapon, just use WSAD correctly.

 

It is also not at all clear from the original post I replied to whether we're talking about nade-smith or prot-holo.

Edited September 7, 2021 by Ragnar.4257

[Pimsley.3681]

1 hour ago, Filip.7463 said:

Burn guard doesnt use greatsword and elixirs dont clean conditions… too heated vs guard use elixir S????? What the kitten are u talking

 

Did you read and comprehend the OP's post? My response was a direct correlation to his immediate concerns.

 

If I'm rude, as response to your snide comment about my alleged lack of understanding of the class,  I would have asked you to learn how to read and comprehend instead of glancing at text and making thoughtless assumptions.

 

I would have asked you if you're the type of person who gets their news from clickbait titles yet never gets through the first paragraph. 

 

I would have exposed your ignorant, embarrassing,  blunder and lack of understanding of how the other class works. 

 

However, I'm not rude and I try to understand the situation before making thoughtless comments so there,  I won't ask you those things nor assume you're that kind of person 

Edited September 7, 2021 by Pimsley.3681

[Disney.7826]

34 minutes ago, Pimsley.3681 said:

 

Did you read and comprehend the OP's post? My response was a direct correlation to his immediate concerns.

 

If I'm rude, as response to your snide comment about my alleged lack of understanding of the class,  I would have asked you to learn how to read and comprehend instead of glancing at text and making thoughtless assumptions.

 

I would have asked you if you're the type of person who gets their news from clickbait titles yet never gets through the first paragraph. 

 

I would have exposed your ignorant, embarrassing,  blunder and lack of understanding of how the other class works. 

 

However, I'm not rude and I try to understand the situation before making thoughtless comments so there,  I won't ask you those things nor assume you're that kind of person 

OP didnt say elixirs are cleansing or that gs inflicts burning.

[Shao.7236]

Thing to take with Guardians, you have to poke at them before going all guns blazing, the class is pretty much meant to not be getting mauled down quickly while having the lowest health pool in the game. Wearing them down is key to winning.

 

In my book, if you see guardian, they always have one hit they'll be denying you. Your next CC will probably trigger the passive trait that generates also Aegis once every minute or so. After that you'll have them pushing their utilities then you can finally start working your combo's.

[Exile.8160]

15 hours ago, BlackTruth.6813 said:

While the OP's skill level is questionable, Guardian has NEVER had a point in time where it took skill. It has always been an instant cast class that evaded while attacking, and even though Ranger/Necro/Mesmer/old d/d Ele was more effective in that aspect, you still provided boons to your team, and Guard was still a one dimensional spam evades/blinds while doing damage class. This class has NEVER been hard on paper and mechanically was one of the easiest classes in the game of ALL TIME, on top of ranger.

 

Some guardian players understand this and some of them don't, most guardians who tried an actual hard spec came crying back to guardian. I pray that willbender gets buffed to balanced and other guard specs nerfed to willbender level because TELEGRAPHED SKILLS/ASPECTS ARE HEALTHY FOR THE GAME. Not annoying random aegis's where you can't play a slow build or you just can't land a hit, that is meta enforcing and annoying.

 

ANET has a chance to balance this obnoxious brain damage class for once.

Easies class of all time? Laughs in necro gameplay!!! (Smashing face to keyboard and still win)