Skirmish Tickets and WvW Legendary armor

[dontlook.1823]

We'll be making some quality-of-life changes to World vs World in the November 9 release. Your feedback is clear: skirmish reward tracks take entirely too long to complete, especially for new players or players who are playing on the third-place team in a match up. To address this, we'll be increasing the number of skirmish pips earned for match placement from 3/4/5 to 4/5/6. We'll also be adding a new +1 bonus skirmish pip for players with a WvW rank between 1-149. Existing rank-based pip bonuses will also increase by +1 (so a total of +2 for Bronze, +3 for silver, and so on).
 

 

Don't know if anyone else noticed the increase in skirmish tickets. But can we talk about that? WvW legendary armor takes 7.5 months without skipping a beat of weekly tickets. In addition to increasing the amount earned, can we also decrease the amount needed for the armor? I am not saying like a drastic dip in the requirement. I feel like PvE and even PvP legendary armor takes nowhere near as long... Correct me if I'm wrong cause I don't know if that's true. But for PvP, it is about three seasons, like three months or so, give or take. Then PvE is like a few months of raiding and daily tasks, and you are good to go.
So pretty much, in a nutshell, why is WvW legendary armor so unnecessarily long to get? Also, the crappy thing is WvW has literally 1 option. There is no getting around the requirement or speeding things up like PvE and PvP...

 

PvE: 

It takes  https://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/5/5e/Legendary_Insight.png 150 Legendary Insights to obtain the first set of Legendary raid armor. With the weekly cap of  https://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/5/5e/Legendary_Insight.png 25 Legendary Insights (assuming you trade  https://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/7/7a/Legendary_Divination.png Legendary Divinations for  https://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/5/5e/Legendary_Insight.png Legendary Insights), this will take 6 weeks of reaching the required amount. Any subsequent sets of legendary armor cost  https://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/5/5e/Legendary_Insight.png 300 Legendary Insights, taking 12 weeks each, because crafting additional Refined Envoy armor precursor sets costs  https://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/5/5e/Legendary_Insight.png 150 Legendary Insights.

• Without converting  https://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/7/7a/Legendary_Divination.png Legendary Divinations into  https://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/5/5e/Legendary_Insight.png Legendary Insights the first armor set will take 10 weeks and subsequent armor sets 20 weeks each.

PvP:

6330 PvP pips earned over 3 seasons: To finish as fast as possible, the player must complete 3 seasons of the non-repeatable PvP League reward chests. At any time during these 3 seasons, they must also complete the final repeatable Byzantium reward chest 24 times to accumulate the rest of the https://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/thumb/3/3d/Ascended_Shard_of_Glory.png/20px-Ascended_Shard_of_Glory.png required.

 

WvW:

 

22 weeks @ 365 tickets per week

29 weeks @ 365 tickets per week

Edited October 21, 2021 by dontlook.1823

[Xenesis.6389]

6 minutes ago, dontlook.1823 said:

So pretty much, in a nutshell, why is WvWlegendary armor so unnecessarily long?

 

Because apparently it's the easiest one to get, hence the longer time gate.

[dontlook.1823]

2 minutes ago, Xenesis.6389 said:

 

Because apparently it's the easiest one to get, hence the longer time gate.

Ah, didn't know that.. Still think they could shave like a couple of months off of it... Like a half a year and 1.5 month is a bit outrageous. 

Edited October 21, 2021 by dontlook.1823

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

26 minutes ago, dontlook.1823 said:

Ah, didn't know that.. Still think they could shave like a couple of months off of it... Like a half a year and 1.5 month is a bit outrageous. 

It's easier, but if they start removing the lazier ways to maintain participation, then adding in more sources of tickets would be nice.

Edited October 21, 2021 by Lan Deathrider.5910
Typo

[MedievalThings.5417]

From what I read they are only increasing the pip rate, NOT the amount of tickets earned.  It's still gonna be capped at 365.

[Infusion.7149]

Unless you don't raid at all you should instead be asking for a unique skin for WVW/PVP legendary armor. The alternative would be to provide a way to unlock PVE envoy armor skin without the materials that are used in WVW legendary armor as discussed previously. (So if you want envoy skin it would still be LI + map currencies just no materials that were already used in the WVW set. An easy way would be to add a perfected envoy skin tab to the magnetite vendor with the requirement you have refined armor unlocked + Gift of Craftsmanship instead of Gift of Gift of Prosperity + Gift of Prowess + Gift of Dedication + refined Envoy piece.)

As it is now there's no point anymore after legendary armory if you have raid armor as ascended WVW armor has the same skin (see

.

Edited October 21, 2021 by Infusion.7149

[dontlook.1823]

13 minutes ago, Ubi.4136 said:

From what I read they are only increasing the pip rate, NOT the amount of tickets earned.  It's still gonna be capped at 365.

Yes, the focus was just the pip increase. The cap is at the same. That's the core issue of the topic. 

7 minutes ago, Infusion.7149 said:

Unless you don't raid at all you should instead be asking for a unique skin for WVW/PVP legendary armor. The alternative would be to provide a way to unlock PVE envoy armor skin without the materials that are used in WVW legendary armor as discussed previously. (So if you want envoy skin it would still be LI + map currencies just no materials that were already used in the WVW set).

As it is now there's no point anymore after legendary armory if you have raid armor (see

.

Oof, I don't quite understand this.. could you clarify please. XD

 

[Infusion.7149]

9 minutes ago, dontlook.1823 said:

Yes, the focus was just the pip increase. The cap is at the same. That's the core issue of the topic. 

Oof, I don't quite understand this.. could you clarify please. XD

 

Situation A:
I raid casually and WVW. I complete heavy raid armor before having enough skirmish tickets for WVW legendary armor. I can either get legendary WVW armor in a different weight (typically medium armor from people I talk to) or just buy the WVW ascended skins. There is no legendary WVW skin so you lose nothing.

Situation B:
I WVW mainly and raid casually even less than situation A. I complete WVW heavy armor before having 150 LI. If I decide to go get legendary heavy PVE armor skin I need to pay for every material for zero functionality unless it is a different weight (then you get a different weight of armor).

Situation C :
I PVP mainly and raid / WVW on the side for dailies or whatnot. If I have PVP legendary heavy armor and then get PVE heavy legendary armor I need to pay for every material. If I get WVW legendary armor there is no point since WVW armor has no skin.

Situation D :
I finish 150 LI for 1 set of PVE heavy armor and do PVP/WVW. If I get a set of medium PVE legendary armor as well then PVP/WVW legendary medium armor is worthless.

---

The person that multi-modes and finishes PVE armor first is always ahead.

You will note PVP, PVE , and WVW backpieces all have their own skin.

Edited October 21, 2021 by Infusion.7149

[MedievalThings.5417]

The tickets are earned in segments/reward tiers.  From wood through diamond.  Each tier has a number of pips that need to be earned to get the tickets from that tier.  

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Skirmish_reward_track good reference.

 

So, the first tier is wood, and requires 100 total pips to complete.  You currently get 17 skirmish tickets completing the wood tier.

You earn pips based on warscore, your rank, and an additional +1 pip if you completed the wood tier the week before.  Also, you get +5 pips by being outnumbered.

The pips are earned once every 5 minutes.  So, if you are in last place during the current 5 minutes, completed wood the previous week, and are bronze rank, you would earn 5 pips every 5 minutes.

 

Anet is going to increase the pips based on warscore by +1 and increase the pips earned by ranks (including no rank) by +1.  But, even with the new changes, you will still only earn 17 skirmish tickets, because the tickets are not being increased, just how fast you can earn them, up to the 365 weekly cap, which means finishing every tier through diamond. 

 

Edited October 21, 2021 by Ubi.4136

[dontlook.1823]

1 hour ago, Ubi.4136 said:

The tickets are earned in segments/reward tiers.  From wood through diamond.  Each tier has a number of pips that need to be earned to get the tickets from that tier.  

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Skirmish_reward_track good reference.

 

So, the first tier is wood, and requires 100 total pips to complete.  You currently get 17 skirmish tickets completing the wood tier.

You earn pips based on warscore, your rank, and an additional +1 pip if you completed the wood tier the week before.  Also, you get +5 pips by being outnumbered.

The pips are earned once every 5 minutes.  So, if you are in last place during the current 5 minutes, completed wood the previous week, and are bronze rank, you would earn 5 pips every 5 minutes.

 

Anet is going to increase the pips based on warscore by +1 and increase the pips earned by ranks (including no rank) by +1.  But, even with the new changes, you will still only earn 17 skirmish tickets, because the tickets are not being increased, just how fast you can earn them, up to the 365 weekly cap, which means finishing every tier through diamond. 

 

Yes, exactly. No ticket increase. It will be easier to finish the reward track, but the ticket cap will still be there. I feel that requiring fewer tickets for the Legendary armor or more per week is also a good idea. I'm not saying they should change it drastically, but it would be a lot more realistic to shave at least two months, at the least, off the time it takes to get the Legendary pieces. 7.5 months.. a half of year, and then some is ridiculous.

[Firebird Gomer.9563]

I agree. Having done Medium Raid armor. PVP Light armor. And now doing WvW  Heavy armor. The creation time is very long on WvW. Reducing the Skirmishing Ticket cost or adding a few to each end chest or even making the Diamond chest have tickets in the repeatable chest would make sense. PvP has repeatable Ascended shards why doesnt WvW.

Also I don't think that they should totally remove Outnumbered pips. Drop the amount yes remove them all together... No. Drop them from 5 to 2 would still encourage people to go to outnumber maps. Having no bonus points takes the motivation to move maps away from people roamers especially.

[Xenesis.6389]

Think Anet is happy with the amount they have the ticket capped at, they haven't mentioned anything about them in the messages the past 6 months, only about the speed at which we complete the track. We also have the hoarders that complain they have nothing to buy because they bought their legendaries and are done.

 

They still want long term reward goals for wvw, and the legendary armor is on top of that list, because eventually you'll get enough ranks for your masteries, you'll figure out how useless ppting is, and you'll be down to earning the gear or fighting in blobs till you eventually quit.

[Head Kracker.4790]

Actually the new pip change is a good thing. I say this as a extremely casual wvw player. One of the biggest and most daunting tasks was the acquisition of pips and tickets. Now while yes I still can only get the same amount of tickets as before I now can do other things during the week and not burn myself out trying to hit 40 hours of play, with the changes I only have to hit something like 24 hours of play. I honestly cannot play the exact same game mode for 40 hours a week nor does anyone on the lower tiered servers like to be farmed for 40 hours of that gameplay. People will lose interest. WVW should not be my second job once I get off work.

 

Even during my pve sessions I'm not doing the same thing every day raids, strikes, story content, fractals, and infusion trains stagger my gameplay. I believe with the pip change I could manage 4 hours or less a day and without the long grind for pips and tickets and that would definitely help a game mode that while I might not hit diamond I'm definitely getting rewarded more for participating in a relevant currency and progression to legendary armor. 

[Blood Red Arachnid.2493]

As much as I'd like to see a ticket increase, I'm glad there's going to be a pip increase.  My static is in limbo right now and I haven't had time to find a new raid static, largely because I'm too busy with WvW.  I spend most of my free time in WvW, and occasionally I even have to play nights just to hit the skirmish cap.  

[Dawdler.8521]

2 hours ago, Firebird Gomer.9563 said:

I agree. Having done Medium Raid armor. PVP Light armor. And now doing WvW  Heavy armor. The creation time is very long on WvW. Reducing the Skirmishing Ticket cost or adding a few to each end chest or even making the Diamond chest have tickets in the repeatable chest would make sense. PvP has repeatable Ascended shards why doesnt WvW.

Getting them in WvW is literally no effort. You get the tickets you need to make legendary armor whether you want to or not - no running around the entire world, no doing specific things over and over and over again, just... being in WvW, playing WvW and enjoying whatever you like in WvW. Thats it. Those of us that has played WvW for a while probably has enough tickets for like 6 more sets in addition to the 3 sets we already built and we dont even know what to do with the pile of tickets that just grows and grows. And on top of that get so many free mystic clovers we dont know what to do with them either.

Its as if you could get legendary armor just AFKing in LA.

[dontlook.1823]

6 hours ago, Infusion.7149 said:

Situation A:
I raid casually and WVW. I complete heavy raid armor before having enough skirmish tickets for WVW legendary armor. I can either get legendary WVW armor in a different weight (typically medium armor from people I talk to) or just buy the WVW ascended skins. There is no legendary WVW skin so you lose nothing.

Situation B:
I WVW mainly and raid casually even less than situation A. I complete WVW heavy armor before having 150 LI. If I decide to go get legendary heavy PVE armor skin I need to pay for every material for zero functionality unless it is a different weight (then you get a different weight of armor).

Situation C :
I PVP mainly and raid / WVW on the side for dailies or whatnot. If I have PVP legendary heavy armor and then get PVE heavy legendary armor I need to pay for every material. If I get WVW legendary armor there is no point since WVW armor has no skin.

Situation D :
I finish 150 LI for 1 set of PVE heavy armor and do PVP/WVW. If I get a set of medium PVE legendary armor as well then PVP/WVW legendary medium armor is worthless.

---

The person that multi-modes and finishes PVE armor first is always ahead.

You will note PVP, PVE , and WVW backpieces all have their own skin.

Ah, excellent point. It seems like PvE is the favored route. That kind of stinks cause I know many people who don't even want to touch PvE, so PvP or WvW is their only option. Stat change on the fly is nice in WvW. I already got Light Legendary armor from PvE a couple of years ago. I am currently going for Medium in WvW and Heavy in PvP. I'm already halfway there for PvP, and I am at 2 075 tickets for WvW. I've been raiding almost every night for a couple of hours and scrambling to finish the weekly skirmish tickets by Friday. I don't have the time to be in WvW for 8 hours a day to ensure I get the tickets. The pip increase is a nice QoL change there, but I think they need to tweak it just a bit when it comes to the armor.

[suialthor.7164]

6 hours ago, Xenesis.6389 said:

Because apparently it's the easiest one to get, hence the longer time gate.

The PvP one doesn't require skill, just time investment.  I did the back, amulet, and an armor set in less than a year.  

The Raiding one requires a little learning for a few of the bosses.  If all else fails you can pay a group (with in game currency) to get you through them assuming you can learn basic mechanics.  After that you can do the easy 5 or 6 each week for 20% of the weekly cap.  An average group with a new player or two can do this in about 2 hours.  I honestly think this is the easiest method and the least time consuming for the first set.  For additional sets, it is still the easiest and least time consuming but it will take much longer. 

WvW, like PvP, only requires time.  Except it requires drastically more over a longer time period.  Plus you don't get little breaks like in PvP between matches.  You are expected to keep active and long travel times can make this annoying.  I wish 2 hours could get average players to 20% of the weekly cap.   Even after the pip change 2 hours might get around 10% of the weekly cap for lower ranks.

[Xenesis.6389]

7 minutes ago, suialthor.7164 said:

The PvP one doesn't require skill, just time investment.  I did the back, amulet, and an armor set in less than a year.  

The Raiding one requires a little learning for a few of the bosses.  If all else fails you can pay a group (with in game currency) to get you through them assuming you can learn basic mechanics.  After that you can do the easy 5 or 6 each week for 20% of the weekly cap.  An average group with a new player or two can do this in about 2 hours.  I honestly think this is the easiest method and the least time consuming for the first set.  For additional sets, it is still the easiest and least time consuming but it will take much longer. 

WvW, like PvP, only requires time.  Except it requires drastically more over a longer time period.  Plus you don't get little breaks like in PvP between matches.  You are expected to keep active and long travel times can make this annoying.  I wish 2 hours could get average players to 20% of the weekly cap.   Even after the pip change 2 hours might get around 10% of the weekly cap for lower ranks.

 

You can sit in smc afk on a treb and get full participation, or sit by a wall, repair, and then go afk for 10 mins. Stuff like this is why a greater time investment is given for wvw. If anet decides to get rid of participation like that, and make it more active that you work to maintain, then they will probably listen about increasing tickets per week.

 

Edit: hmmm two confused emotes on two straightforward posts of mine in this thread, hope that person gets help soon.

Edited October 22, 2021 by Xenesis.6389

[Strider Pj.2193]

7 hours ago, Xenesis.6389 said:

 

Edit: hmmm two confused emotes on two straightforward posts of mine in this thread, hope that person gets help soon.

I’ve collect 14 so far on a single thread about adding a new reaction emoji.  (🙄). It’s quite entertaining.  🙂

[mistsim.2748]

8 hours ago, Dawdler.8521 said:

Getting them in WvW is literally no effort. You get the tickets you need to make legendary armor whether you want to or not - no running around the entire world, no doing specific things over and over and over again, just... being in WvW, playing WvW and enjoying whatever you like in WvW. Thats it

That's it? 20 hours per week for 6 months to complete the track. And that's it! Wow, so casual, so easy. If one doesn't have a life. At least in PvE and spvp, you can accelerate your progress if you choose to (i.e. if you're on vacation you can just play more). Anyway, the upcoming pip changes will make this a lot better. Long time coming.

[Dawdler.8521]

1 minute ago, mistsim.2748 said:

That's it? 20 hours per week for 6 months to complete the track. And that's it! Wow, so casual, so easy. If one doesn't have a life. At least in PvE and spvp, you can accelerate your progress if you choose to (i.e. if you're on vacation you can just play more). Anyway, the upcoming pip changes will make this a lot better. Long time coming.

Who says you have to play 20 hours a week? And for just 6 months? We've played this for 9 years. Before skirmish chests even existed. Before legendary armor existed.

If you go into WvW just for the armor and then you're going to kitten right off because you've served your time well then everything will be too slow for you.

[mistsim.2748]

1 hour ago, Dawdler.8521 said:

Who says you have to play 20 hours a week? And for just 6 months? We've played this for 9 years. Before skirmish chests even existed. Before legendary armor existed.

If you go into WvW just for the armor and then you're going to kitten right off because you've served your time well then everything will be too slow for you.

At 5 pips per tick, that's pretty much how much I have to play to get my last Diamond chest. 

How long we've played is irrelevant, you're missing my point entirely. Leggies from PvE and spvp can be grinded in less time, should one choose to do so, yet for some dumb reason wvw is much more time gated and by far the worst mode to get leggies in.

[Gorani.7205]

Getting a +2 via the way described helps out the lower ranked, lesser placed players more than those already benefiting from high ranks and match leaders. That's a good change. "+5" instead of "+3" will reduce the time to have earned the Wooden Chest from 170 minutes to 100 minutes. That is a lot of times saved on getting such a minimal base reward and kind of a "20 min investment a day" in WvW each week, which a lot more people might be willing to do, resulting in more WvW population.

I think reducing the Outnumbered buff to +2/+3 would still not unbalance the pip gain for those roaming oriented players on "enemy lands".

Now we only need the "weekly trader" to gradually cash in on "9 years WvW - Veteran" with the Emblems, Badges etc. we have accumulated over that period of time. Ideas to turn those into additional Skirmish Tickets, fine materials, Clovers and Mystic Coins are on the table here on the forum.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

25 minutes ago, mistsim.2748 said:

At 5 pips per tick, that's pretty much how much I have to play to get my last Diamond chest. 

How long we've played is irrelevant, you're missing my point entirely. Leggies from PvE and spvp can be grinded in less time, should one choose to do so, yet for some dumb reason wvw is much more time gated and by far the worst mode to get leggies in.

Well, as you spend those 6 months working on it you'll end up with more pips ,and less time required to cap it.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

2 minutes ago, Gorani.7205 said:

Getting a +2 via the way described helps out the lower ranked, lesser placed players more than those already benefiting from high ranks and match leaders. That's a good change. "+5" instead of "+3" will reduce the time to have earned the Wooden Chest from 170 minutes to 100 minutes. That is a lot of times saved on getting such a minimal base reward and kind of a "20 min investment a day" in WvW each week, which a lot more people might be willing to do, resulting in more WvW population.

I think reducing the Outnumbered buff to +2/+3 would still not unbalance the pip gain for those roaming oriented players on "enemy lands".

Now we only need the "weekly trader" to gradually cash in on "9 years WvW - Veteran" with the Emblems, Badges etc. we have accumulated over that period of time. Ideas to turn those into additional Skirmish Tickets, fine materials, Clovers and Mystic Coins are on the table here on the forum.

Daily and weekly traders mind you.