A REAL legendary armor

[Vilin.8056]

31 minutes ago, displayname.8794 said:

I should be able to get legendary armour through roleplaying. ANet give it to me now or I'll stop swiping my card!!1!11!!1

(actually just mail it to my account and I'll forgive you xoxo)

Join the club here - roleplaying as the Majority Casuals.

Edited April 23, 2022 by Vilin.8056

[Xerxez.7361]

37 minutes ago, displayname.8794 said:

I should be able to get legendary armour through roleplaying. ANet give it to me now or I'll stop swiping my card!!1!11!!1

(actually just mail it to my account and I'll forgive you xoxo)

 

If you get it you'll stop swiping your card on Transmutation Charges. Let's settle for new skins and no Legendaries with sales on Transmutation Charges.

Edited April 23, 2022 by Xerxez.7361

[Mercutio.6312]

4 hours ago, IAmNotMatthew.1058 said:

Except OP is asking for fast and cheap OW Legendaries by throwing out the special stuff, you know, the ones that GATE the Legendary armor, if you remove the PvP aspect of PvP armor in favor of achievement and stuff you remove the gating with it.

You have an item that is made up of 4 easy things and an item that takes long to get or expensive to get. You remove the latter you make the item faster to get.
In case of each game mode's armor there is an item that gates it. Legendary Insight, Ascended Shards, Skirmish Tickets. You remove these you make the item faster to get. Claiming that others should get armor that way, because they matter too is you telling those who got the item already that they don't matter for you.

Saying that OW players should get a Legendary armor piece for ~320 gold without anything difficult or a time gate is actually asking for a fast and cheap Legendary.

 

I haven't written anywhere that they have to make legendary armor easier or cheaper. I brought the example of PVP armor as a model to say that it should not be complicated to create a pve version. Then the objects obtained through pve instead of pvp ones can be expensive and take time to obtain. The skins of the Envoy set do not interest me can remain exclusive for those who raid.

[Erise.5614]

9 hours ago, Sarius.9285 said:

doesn't make sense at all. I did all 3 sets and never got more than 1 per chest.

You get 8 keys, can buy 10+ more to open around or over 20 crystalline chests per meta. You can get two guaranteed ones.

Netting you somewhere between 3 - 6 eggs per meta if you need eggs. 5 isn't exceptionally lucky.

9 hours ago, Sarius.9285 said:

lol...of course you need to do multiple Tarir runs for the auricular ingots. you get around 50-100 dust, which isn't nearly enough....so please stop spreading bull kitten and admit you're wrong

75-100 are a decent average just for the final loot run. Pre events also award Lost Arms of an Auric Hero, Recovered Priory Expedition Chest and the additional chests that show up around them. Which you can farm on all 4 sides as well. 

Making it very possible to get over 150 for a single meta. Also, entire Ingots can drop from grand chests as well. 

It's fine if you don't wanna min max. Or rather go the shorter way by running a few metas repeatedly. Rather than the other way around. But that's your own personal preference then.

It is possible to get the entire legendary armor by playing OW the time or even less than I claimed. 

Edited April 24, 2022 by Erise.5614

[Sarius.9285]

7 minutes ago, Erise.5614 said:

You get 8 keys, can buy 10+ more to open around or over 20 crystalline chests per meta. You get two guaranteed ones.

Netting you somewhere between 3 - 6 eggs per meta if you need eggs. 5 isn't exceptionally lucky.

that's just not true at all....like I wrote I crafted all 3 sets, so 90 eggs and opened exactly 500 chests(bought the keys and tracked it) and got 0 additional eggs.....I had to do the Meta 45 times (1 egg per Meta+1 for the daily)

 

You really shouldn't make those claims about things you haven't done yourself 

[Erise.5614]

15 minutes ago, Sarius.9285 said:

that's just not true at all....like I wrote I crafted all 3 sets, so 90 eggs and opened exactly 500 chests(bought the keys and tracked it) and got 0 additional eggs.....I had to do the Meta 45 times (1 egg per Meta+1 for the daily)

 

You really shouldn't make those claims about things you haven't done yourself 

Either that is wrong or you were excessively unlucky (which, admittedly, is possible).

I have over 500, never picked egg from hero chest. Never did it more than once a day. And I have most certainly not done it hundreds of times. The vast majority of those came throughout the half year before EoD where I ran one infusion train per day where I had time. 

As far as I can tell. Drop rates are somewhere around 5%-10% per crystalline with a chance at 5 or 10 from the boss chest. Raising it to somewhere around 5 per run on average, if you actually grind for it. 

Since drop rates are percentages it is possible you never dropped any. But that's not normal. Or you didn't open crystalized chests / didn't max those which would also explain a much lower drop rate.

Edited April 24, 2022 by Erise.5614

[Epsilon Indi.2031]

14 minutes ago, Erise.5614 said:

Either that is wrong or you were excessively unlucky (which, admittedly, is possible).

I have over 500, never picked egg from hero chest. Never did it more than once a day. And I have most certainly not done it hundreds of times. The vast majority of those came throughout the half year before EoD where I ran one infusion train per day where I had time. 

As far as I can tell. Drop rates are somewhere around 5%-10% per crystalline with a chance at 5 or 10 from the boss chest. Raising it to somewhere around 5 per run on average, if you actually grind for it. 

Since drop rates are percentages it is possible you never dropped any. But that's not normal. Or you didn't open crystalized chests / didn't max those which would also explain a much lower drop rate.

Chiming in here.  Out of my entire time crafting full legendary armor for all 3 sets, I only got an average of 2.5 eggs per meta.

[Shaogin.2679]

19 minutes ago, Erise.5614 said:

Either that is wrong or you were excessively unlucky (which, admittedly, is possible).

I have over 500, never picked egg from hero chest. Never did it more than once a day. And I have most certainly not done it hundreds of times. The vast majority of those came throughout the half year before EoD where I ran one infusion train per day where I had time. 

As far as I can tell. Drop rates are somewhere around 5%-10% per crystalline with a chance at 5 or 10 from the boss chest. Raising it to somewhere around 5 per run on average, if you actually grind for it. 

Since drop rates are percentages it is possible you never dropped any. But that's not normal. Or you didn't open crystalized chests / didn't max those which would also explain a much lower drop rate.

Also chiming in, crafted light armor and had to religiously do that meta every day to get all the eggs I needed.

[Erise.5614]

1 minute ago, Sir Alymer.3406 said:

Chiming in here.  Out of my entire time crafting full legendary armor for all 3 sets, I only got an average of 2.5 eggs per meta.

1 minute ago, Shaogin.2679 said:

Also chiming in, crafted light armor and had to religiously do that meta every day to get all the eggs I needed.

Mind if I ask your routine? Did you stay for the crystalized chests / use up all keys? Bought more with map currency? 

Did you do the Zinn riddles that you can do while waiting at rata?

[Asum.4960]

15 hours ago, Erise.5614 said:

It's 25 - 50 LI.

5 chak eggs (1 meta), 5 auric ingots (1 meta), 5 metal plates (1 meta) and 3 map currencies (where you get enough by playing the 3 previously mentioned metas that one time). So about an hour of OW gameplay.

Provisioners tokens take a while but don't require any other PvE gameplay.

So really. It's about an hour of OW and anywhere between 4 - 20+ hours of raids. Per piece. 
(4 hours if you get the free precursor from the collection and take an average of 10 minutes per boss. Which means first try always with an experienced team and no time spent setting up).

It's a raid armor that requires a minimum of OW gameplay.
If an alternative with the roles reversed would exist, that'd already be pretty neat. Requiring a single raid wing per piece and hours upon hours of OW gameplay. 

In all my grinding for my 3 Legendary Sets, I don't think I've ever gotten more than the 2 Chak Eggs from the meta. In all my chest opening (which must have been hundreds of Caches) I think I may have gotten 2 extra total, over the course of getting the 90 needed. 

Then always having to be there ages in advance to get into proper maps, and hell, I was even there for some fails while being in a proper looking map 30m+ in advance. 

So just the Eggs alone, non of the Provisioner Tokens, HoT map currencies, Auric Ingots etc. etc., was about 5 times the OW investment than you attribute to it total.

 

It's clear you are trying to push an agenda rather than have a discussion, but come on.

Edited April 24, 2022 by Asum.4960

[Cyninja.2954]

28 minutes ago, Erise.5614 said:

Mind if I ask your routine? Did you stay for the crystalized chests / use up all keys? Bought more with map currency? 

Did you do the Zinn riddles that you can do while waiting at rata?

 

I finished 6 full pve legendary armors pre armory (and have quite a few eggs left over). 2 eggs are guaranteed if one selects the egg from the daily chest.

 

I got 2 lucky 10 egg drops and 2-3 5 egg rolls. I can count the amount of eggs I recevied from opening crystalized chests on 1 hand, and I would open around 20-30 on most meta events. So those are definitely not a factor.

 

The chack event absolutely does not reward above 2-3 eggs average with daily chest included and as such has to be farmed for an extensive time and 3-6 eggs on average is not even a lucky roll, that's pure fantasy.

Edited April 24, 2022 by Cyninja.2954

[Erise.5614]

11 minutes ago, Cyninja.2954 said:

 

I finished 6 full pve legendary armors pre armory (and have quite a few eggs left over). 2 eggs are guaranteed if one selects the egg from the daily chest.

 

I got 2 lucky 10 egg drops and 2-3 5 egg rolls. I can count the amount of eggs I recevied from opening crystalized chests on 1 hand, and I would open around 20-30 on most meta events. So those are definitely not a factor.

 

The chack event absolutely does not reward above 2-3 eggs average with daily chest included and as such has to be farmed for an extensive time and 3-6 eggs on average is not even a lucky roll, that's pure fantasy.

I literally just ran it getting 3 (not counting daily chest).

[Labjax.2465]

15 hours ago, Einsof.1457 said:

No. Let's be honest, you just want it given to you. 

Gen 1 legendary weapons can be obtained without ever entering a raid, but are still a huge time sink to get. You are wrong and should stop with these dishonest putdowns of other players.

[Erise.5614]

39 minutes ago, Asum.4960 said:

In all my grinding for my 3 Legendary Sets, I don't think I've ever gotten more than the 2 Chak Eggs from the meta. In all my chest opening (which must have been hundreds of Caches) I think I may have gotten 2 extra total, over the course of getting the 90 needed. 

Then always having to be there ages in advance to get into proper maps, and hell, I was even there for some fails while being in a proper looking map 30m+ in advance. 

So just the Eggs alone, non of the Provisioner Tokens, HoT map currencies, Auric Ingots etc. etc., was about 5 times the OW investment than you attribute to it total.

 

It's clear you are trying to push an agenda rather than have a discussion, but come on.

No. I am saying it is theoretically possible. You can get Provisioner Tokens with only Karma. By converting karma into obsidian into provisioner tokens at a rate of 1 per day. If you are fine putting in some gold you can up that to 15 provisioners tokens per day. No OW gameplay necessary. You can get HoT map currencies via 20 exotic luck on new years festival via the tyrian exchange voucher or various other tradable currencies during other festivals. Auric Ingots can be gained at a rate of ~100-180 depending on how many chests you open and whether you do pre events. 

Avoiding OW it is extra work, is slower and next to no one is going to do it. But it is mostly possible. And the remaining necessary time can be minimized extremely if so desired.

Succeeding at all 4 raid wings and doing it for months on end is not avoidable. And I sincerely believe it should be (mostly) avoidable. Similar to how most OW farming can (mostly) be avoided if one absolutely doesn't want to play OW. 

That's the point. Too many people say "just suck it up", "want the reward, play the content". While having options to avoid almost all content they don't like. Giving them actual options and decisions to make. They can choose to suck it up. But it's not a necessity. 

Edited April 24, 2022 by Erise.5614

[Sobx.1758]

11 hours ago, Killthehealersffs.8940 said:

You are the one saying that they don't need Legendary in OW

"Want more? Play more of the game's content. Don't want to? Great, stick to the ascended tier, it's not a problem and never was. "

Yeah and it has nothing to do with the quote you made up in your previous post. 🙄

[warherox.7943]

16 hours ago, Einsof.1457 said:

No there shouldn't. Most Legendary trinkets are just time sinks so get those. The  Legendary raid armor is at least trying to require skill  and should stay as is. Just use ascended or do wvw for your legendary armor(which is a time sink) if you don't like it. 

Yes there should, as long as the massive quality of life stuff is still gated behind legendaries. 

[Sobx.1758]

24 minutes ago, Labjax.2465 said:

Gen 1 legendary weapons can be obtained without ever entering a raid, but are still a huge time sink to get.

So you can get weapons by simply playing OW, but to acquire full legendary gear, you need to participate in broader content the game offers. Makes sense to me.

Edited April 24, 2022 by Sobx.1758

[HnRkLnXqZ.1870]

Legendary Armor was added to the game as an exclusive reward for raids. You want to get that armor, you play raids. Does the bait fit to the content it was added to? Sometimes.

Legendary Armor has fancy skins that changed appearance while in combat - that is the eye-candy many people are interested in. The stat-swap feature is the ultimate convenience. But it is questionable what content truly benefits from such a feature. Raids do in a way, as certain encounters require different builds and gear.

Before the Legendary Armory was added, most people had multiple armor sets. The armory was imo added way too late. Should have been released the same day as the Legendary Armor. For the ~ 6 years only the armor existed, it was just an ascended set with a nice skin and 0 costs for stat-swapping (which took long). Convenience? Only if you changed your build drastically.

Does Legendary Armor have a place in Fractals & Strike Missions? Looking at what the raiders have made out of this content, sadly YES. We have finally reached a time where easy content requires dedicated buffers and dedicated healers. Content we used to run with normal builds, no dps check and significantly lower power-creep. But raiders want to roleplay raiding in all of tyria, even if it means to stomp a single mouse with horde of ettins. You want the flexibility of changing your gear on the go as every single encounter has different requirements. Some guides tell you exactly what to bring to every single encounter. It is either Legendary Armor or multiple sets. Which can be rather difficult in Fractals with that AR infusion system. Alternatively, you can use multiple characters with fixed builds. 

Open World PvE? Not really. While the convenience would be nice to experiment with different stats, Legendary Armor is mostly an overkill. The skins are interesting. But open world is designed in a way where almost every build works. Stuff that does not work can easily be adjusted, with very little effort.

DRM/Dungeons? Some raiders enjoy roleplaying raid-mode in DRMs. It is an overkill. But as long as they enjoy it and do not bother others, fine by me. You can run it with raid builds, but you can also run it with Open World builds. I would say no, Legendary Armor has no place in that content. 

-

The stat-swap system of ascended gear is rather clunky. I would rather like to have that system overhauled and maybe even taken a look at exotic gear acquistion. It is a giant mess at the moment and confusing a lot of new players long before they have even picked a class.

People do not play certain content without bait. What they did in EoD - a revive-module that cannot be used in Strike Missions can only be acquired in Strike Missions? Bad decision imo. But locking Legendary Armor behind raids fits. It is the target-audience that mostly benefits from it. 

[Labjax.2465]

6 minutes ago, Sobx.1758 said:

So you can get weapons by simply playing OW, but to acquire full legendary gear, you need to participate in broader content the game offers. Makes sense to me.

You can't though?? WvW is still a requirement because of Gift of Battle. But it's also something you can do casually, without concern for being one of the 1%ers of the game, in contrast to the bizarre raid requirement. Since then, they made PvP and WvW versions of legendary armor. Idk about the PvP one, never looked into that much, but the WvW one you can get by following around zergs and getting lucky with what team you end up on so it's easier to keep participation and pips high.

I mean, your response is just confusing me. The other person was acting like people want this stuff handed to them, so I pointed out legendary weapons are anything but a handout while still not requiring raids. Idk why you're bringing up "participating in broader content."

[Killthehealersffs.8940]

10 hours ago, Sobx.1758 said:

Yeah and it has nothing to do with the quote you made up in your previous post. 🙄

Good morning .

You are the one is saying that people don't need OW legendary . Who made you  dev ?

[Erise.5614]

18 minutes ago, HnRkLnXqZ.1870 said:

Legendary Armor was added to the game as an exclusive reward for raids. You want to get that armor, you play raids. Does the bait fit to the content it was added to? Sometimes.

Legendary Armor has fancy skins that changed appearance while in combat - that is the eye-candy many people are interested in. The stat-swap feature is the ultimate convenience. But it is questionable what content truly benefits from such a feature. Raids do in a way, as certain encounters require different builds and gear.

Before the Legendary Armory was added, most people had multiple armor sets. The armory was imo added way too late. Should have been released the same day as the Legendary Armor. For the ~ 6 years only the armor existed, it was just an ascended set with a nice skin and 0 costs for stat-swapping (which took long). Convenience? Only if you changed your build drastically.

Does Legendary Armor have a place in Fractals & Strike Missions? Looking at what the raiders have made out of this content, sadly YES. We have finally reached a time where easy content requires dedicated buffers and dedicated healers. Content we used to run with normal builds, no dps check and significantly lower power-creep. But raiders want to roleplay raiding in all of tyria, even if it means to stomp a single mouse with horde of ettins. You want the flexibility of changing your gear on the go as every single encounter has different requirements. Some guides tell you exactly what to bring to every single encounter. It is either Legendary Armor or multiple sets. Which can be rather difficult in Fractals with that AR infusion system. Alternatively, you can use multiple characters with fixed builds. 

Open World PvE? Not really. While the convenience would be nice to experiment with different stats, Legendary Armor is mostly an overkill. The skins are interesting. But open world is designed in a way where almost every build works. Stuff that does not work can easily be adjusted, with very little effort.

DRM/Dungeons? Some raiders enjoy roleplaying raid-mode in DRMs. It is an overkill. But as long as they enjoy it and do not bother others, fine by me. You can run it with raid builds, but you can also run it with Open World builds. I would say no, Legendary Armor has no place in that content. 

-

The stat-swap system of ascended gear is rather clunky. I would rather like to have that system overhauled and maybe even taken a look at exotic gear acquistion. It is a giant mess at the moment and confusing a lot of new players long before they have even picked a class.

People do not play certain content without bait. What they did in EoD - a revive-module that cannot be used in Strike Missions can only be acquired in Strike Missions? Bad decision imo. But locking Legendary Armor behind raids fits. It is the target-audience that mostly benefits from it. 

I can agree with several of the points. But would like to point out a few points.

The design changed. A lot. The original raid armor was fine. It was a flashy and gimmicky reward for high dedication. Nice to have. However, with the addition of it to WvW, PvP and the addition of the armory this changes. It's not tied to where it's useful (PvP), it's not a reward for mastery of the combat system (WvW & PvP) while being a highly desirable long term goal.

Something that is missing from OW. Weapons loose appeal quickly, have much lower utility and much larger steps between completion. A legendary weapon costing 2k is only rewarding in a single burst at the very end. Whereas 6 pieces of armor, each costing 400 gold make for a much more gradual progression. This is why I believe it fits as long term reward for OW gameplay. Filling a niche that is underserved and getting more people into that aspect of the end game grind. Though a different set of long term rewards other than the armor would be valid too. So long as the desirability, kind of grind towards it and cost per progression step is comparable. 

The QoL isn't necessary. And you don't maximize benefit in OW. But it's still extremely desirable. Making it a good fit.

Now that Raids are abandoned in favor of Strike CMs an overhaul of PvE armor acquisition would be appropriate anyway. Even if just replacing the Envoy collection and keeping the LI gates. I still disagree with those but that would already be a step in the right direction. Options are always good. Doesn't have to be efficient options either. 

And, as a side note. I don't believe I've ever seen the skin in game. I know a whole bunch of people who have the armor but they always transmute it into other skins. 

Edited April 24, 2022 by Erise.5614

[Sarius.9285]

35 minutes ago, Erise.5614 said:

Succeeding at all 4 raid wings and doing it for months on end is not avoidable.

lol what are you even talking about. You're clearly just making things up. Claiming you can average 6 eggs per chak....and having to farm for MONTHS in raids, which is so incredibly untrue....you need 150 LI for one armor which you can get in 6-10 weeks...

[yoni.7015]

3 minutes ago, Erise.5614 said:

 

And, as a side note. I don't believe I've ever seen the skin in game. I know a whole bunch of people who have the armor but they always transmute it into other skins. 

You don’t seem to spend much time in game. I see the skin all the time. 

[Sobx.1758]

5 minutes ago, Erise.5614 said:

I can agree with several of the points. But would like to point out a few points.

The design changed. A lot. The original raid armor was fine. It was a flashy and gimmicky reward for high dedication. Nice to have. However, with the addition of it to WvW, PvP and the addition of the armory this changes. It's not tied to where it's useful (PvP), it's not a reward for mastery of the combat system (WvW & PvP) while being a highly desirable long term goal.

Something that is missing from OW. Weapons loose appeal quickly, have much lower utility and much larger steps between completion. A legendary weapon costing 2k is only rewarding in a single burst at the very end. Whereas 6 pieces of armor, each costing 400 gold make for a much more gradual progression. This is why I believe it fits as long term reward for OW gameplay. Filling a niche that is underserved. Though a different set of long term rewards besides the armor would be valid too. 

The QoL isn't necessary. And you don't maximize benefit in OW. But it's still extremely desirable. Making it a good fit.

Now that Raids are abandoned in favor of Strike CMs an overhaul of PvE armor acquisition would be appropriate anyway. Even if just replacing the Envoy collection and keeping the LI gates. I still disagree with those but that would already be a step in the right direction. Options are always good. Doesn't have to be efficient options either. 

And, as a side note. I don't believe I've ever seen the skin in game. I know a whole bunch of people who have the armor but they always transmute it into other skins. 

Seeing how people wanting leggy armor acquired strictly through playing OW want it to remove the need of getting additional ex/asc sets, your claim about OW "missing long term goal" is wrong. (or straight up dishonest, because it was already talked about in the preivous thread too)

It's good that it's "desirable", that's the point. It's still an optional reward for participating in broader content of the game though.

Edited April 24, 2022 by Sobx.1758

[Killthehealersffs.8940]

10 hours ago, Sobx.1758 said:

Seeing how people wanting leggy armor acquired strictly through playing OW want it to remove the need of getting additional ex/asc sets, your claim about OW "missing long term goal" is wrong. (or straight up dishonest, because it was already talked about in the preivous thread too)

So not all people are gunning for the Aurora and simply get an asc .

So magically  the Legendary OW , will makes all the gear absolute ?

Edited April 24, 2022 by Killthehealersffs.8940