Im pretty sick of failing Dragons End meta

[Gorem.8104]

12 hours ago, Gibson.4036 said:

I haven’t been to Dragon’s End for quite a while. Decided it was better to work on leggie trinkets, and buying A.S.S from the weekly vendor will get me to the Aurene leggie eventuslly.

I just recently went back to grab the hero points for a character. As I ran around I could read a group of players in map chat trying to do the meta.

It failed. There was no toxicity in chat during or after. Just a sort of resignation.

”Too bad”

”Ah well”

Made me a little sad for GW2.

 

Oh yeah, its def calmed down since launch, especially as the zones so dead already. People already have seen their fair share of fails, its basically just the norm for most people. Must suck to still need your first win for achievements/mastery points now. Cause you are forced to join an organised group, like the person posting before who said they organise 20 people to do it putting them way outside the norm for the average player who has no idea what stats do or what traits do and is just playing the game for, fun. 

 

But hey, at least toxic chat was replaced with defeatist/resignation chat right? That's what they wanted with EoD, the "TEN YEAR IN THE MAKING" Event. 

[Astralporing.1957]

7 hours ago, Ashantara.8731 said:

Soooo... if "the majority" doesn't play Raids, Strikes or Fractals, or stays away from WvW and/or PvP, the game is "at fault"... for what exactly? Providing different content for different players? Yes, wow, how dare they! And how dare others have fun with said content!?

For trying to push that majority of players into a content they don't (and will not) like. The problem is not about "Providing different content for different players". The issue is when they provide wrong content to wrong players.

Quote

The DE meta comes as close to raid-level content as open world/story PvE content will ever get. It's not meant for just anyone, you have to have some skill. No one ever took raiders by their hand to guide them through Raids.

Yes. And which is why it should have been separated from the content that is being played by those "just anyone" this event is not meant for. Or rather not designed for, because according to what Anet kept saying, they did mean this event for everyone. They considered it a grand finale of story content. They wanted it to be epic, not inaccessible. They've just (again) completely misjudged their playerbase. And i have no idea why, because they should have had near 10 years of experience telling them that idea of theirs is not going to work out the way they hoped.

Edited June 2, 2022 by Astralporing.1957

[yoni.7015]

42 minutes ago, Gorem.8104 said:

Oh yeah, its def calmed down since launch, especially as the zones so dead already. People already have seen their fair share of fails, its basically just the norm for most people. Must suck to still need your first win for achievements/mastery points now. Cause you are forced to join an organised group, like the person posting before who said they organise 20 people to do it putting them way outside the norm for the average player who has no idea what stats do or what traits do and is just playing the game for, fun. 

 

But hey, at least toxic chat was replaced with defeatist/resignation chat right? That's what they wanted with EoD, the "TEN YEAR IN THE MAKING" Event. 

What’s wrong with joining an organized group? Isn’t it a good thing that players organize themselves in an MMO? Because of the meta new guilds and groups are established. People are actually playing together again, they communicate and cooperate. The guild I am doing the meta with now has over 70 members and it is a lot of fun to do the meta with them.
But of course it is your agenda that everything about EoD is awful, we get it. 

Edited June 2, 2022 by yoni.7015

[Gehenna.3625]

15 minutes ago, yoni.7015 said:

What’s wrong with joining an organized group? Isn’t it a good thing that players organize themselves in an MMO? Because of the meta new guilds and groups are established.

It's good for some people and not good for others. Just because you call it a good thing, doesn't mean it's good for everybody. One of GW2's unique selling points is how you can participate with group events and meta's in OW without having to join an organized group. You just jump in and participate and when it's done you can go your merry way.

There are many players that prefer the anonymity of that and not having to group up, because they know that when they group up usually it means that people will ask them about their build and they're very likely to get kicked for not having a proper meta build.

15 minutes ago, yoni.7015 said:

The guild I am doing the meta with now has over 70 members and it is a lot of fun to do the meta with them.

That's great...for you.

I get the feeling that it's so logical in your mind that this is fun, that you cannot fathom that people get their fun from different things. That's...very unfortunate.

[yoni.7015]

6 minutes ago, Gehenna.3625 said:

It's good for some people and not good for others. Just because you call it a good thing, doesn't mean it's good for everybody. One of GW2's unique selling points is how you can participate with group events and meta's in OW without having to join an organized group. You just jump in and participate and when it's done you can go your merry way.

There are many players that prefer the anonymity of that and not having to group up, because they know that when they group up usually it means that people will ask them about their build and they're very likely to get kicked for not having a proper meta build.

That's great...for you.

I get the feeling that it's so logical in your mind that this is fun, that you cannot fathom that people get their fun from different things. That's...very unfortunate.

If they don’t think it is fun then there are a lot of other things they can do. No one is forcing them to do it.  There are so many other events and aspects in the game. For the huge majority of events you don’t have to organize or join groups. 
You don’t like the DE meta? Cool just don’t do it and stick to stuff you like. Where is this coming from that you and others want to ruin the event for the players that enjoy it? That’s unfortunate 

Edited June 2, 2022 by yoni.7015

[Gehenna.3625]

5 minutes ago, yoni.7015 said:

If they don’t think it is fun then there are a lot of other things they can do. There are so many other events and aspects in the game. You don’t like the DE meta? Cool just don’t do it and stick to stuff you like. Where is this coming from that you and others want to ruin the event for the players that enjoy it? That’s unfortunate 

That is what I'm doing. I just question the wisdom in putting content like this in OW because it generally it gets abandoned after a short while. Seems like a lot of resources for something that gets abandoned so quickly. I'm sure DE will follow suit soon enough. SO, I'm fine with DE being what it is, I just don't get why they would do something like this in OW at all.

Edit: please, don't think that because I question some things of you that I'm automatically in the other camp. I don't want to ruin your fun. I'm fine with DE as it is. I just don't go there anymore, that's all.

Edited June 2, 2022 by Gehenna.3625

[yoni.7015]

4 minutes ago, Gehenna.3625 said:

That is what I'm doing. I just question the wisdom in putting content like this in OW because it generally it gets abandoned after a short while. Seems like a lot of resources for something that gets abandoned so quickly. I'm sure DE will follow suit soon enough. SO, I'm fine with DE being what it is, I just don't get why they would do something like this in OW at all.

If they would put it in an instance, the same people that are complaining now would complain because it is not an Open World event and they feel left out. 
It’s now three months after release and there are still several squads doing the event every evening and I am sure there are also some groups that don’t advertise in LFG. What will happen in six months? We don’t know. 

Edited June 2, 2022 by yoni.7015

[Gehenna.3625]

1 minute ago, yoni.7015 said:

It’s now three months after release and there are still several squads doing the event every evening. What will happen in six months? We don’t know. 

Sure and how much are those several squads on the total population? That's what I wonder about. Several doesn't sound like a lot to me. But as I said, I'm fine with it, I just wonder why Anet is doing these meta's like this. They might very well have a good reason, but I don't know.

[yoni.7015]

7 minutes ago, Gehenna.3625 said:

Sure and how much are those several squads on the total population? That's what I wonder about. Several doesn't sound like a lot to me. But as I said, I'm fine with it, I just wonder why Anet is doing these meta's like this. They might very well have a good reason, but I don't know.

The same people that are complaining now would complain if the meta was an instance. They always complain about everything and they always feel left out. Their real problem is that there is something in the game they don’t like but others do, they can’t stand that  

Why don’t have it in Open World, there is nothing wrong with that. 
The only thing they should change are better rewards, the summoning stone is great but the meta should reward more. That’s the only thing in my opinion Anet should change. 

Edited June 2, 2022 by yoni.7015

[Gehenna.3625]

6 minutes ago, yoni.7015 said:

The same people that are complaining now would complain if the meta was an instance. They always complain about everything and they always feel left out. Their real problem is that there is something in the game they don’t like but others do, they can’t stand that  

What does that have to do with me?

6 minutes ago, yoni.7015 said:

Why don’t have it in Open World, there is nothing wrong with that. 
The only thing they should change are better rewards, the summoning stone is great but the meta should reward more. That’s the only thing in my opinion Anet should change. 

And then this would be popular and other things get abandoned. I don't need Anet to change anything, but I just ask the question why they have done this when so few people will actually do this? 

[Fueki.4753]

21 minutes ago, yoni.7015 said:

If they would put it in an instance, the same people that are complaining now would complain because it is not an Open World event and they feel left out. 
It’s now three months after release and there are still several squads doing the event every evening and I am sure there are also some groups that don’t advertise in LFG. What will happen in six months? We don’t know. 

They could simply put the current version of Soo-Won into an instanced fight, similar to Dragonstorm, so that the people who enjoy organizing for it can keep their fun.

The actual open world version could then be adjusted to fit with the vast majority of players, rather than a smaller subset (like it currently is).

That way, Open World players can enjoy it more and organized people don't have to complain about non-participants taking up character space on the map.

This would put Dragon's End in a better position for almost everyone who cares for it.

[Cuks.8241]

5 minutes ago, Fueki.4753 said:

They could simply put the current version of Soo-Won into an instanced fight, similar to Dragonstorm, so that the people who enjoy organizing for it can keep their fun.

The actual open world version could then be adjusted to fit with the vast majority of players, rather than a smaller subset (like it currently is).

That way, Open World players can enjoy it more and organized people don't have to complain about non-participants taking up character space on the map.

This would put Dragon's End in a better position for almost everyone who cares for it.

I think its better that it is in OW. More people get to experience it.

Many players complain instances are inaccessible to them for various reasons including anxiety, need to talk to other players. I think many players just dont do strikes and fractals even if they are more than capable of doing them. Just because they dont want to engage in group forming and interactions that come with it. 

In this case you have the middle ground. Yeah the event is a bit harder than most metas. People on this forums grossly exaggerate though. I mean its forums, everything is the end of the world, sky falling, dead game, conspiracy aimed against them. But realistically anyone can join the same way as other metas. Find a group and join map. 

[Gehenna.3625]

3 minutes ago, Cuks.8241 said:

I think its better that it is in OW. More people get to experience it.

That's debatable because most people seem to avoid it.

3 minutes ago, Cuks.8241 said:

Many players complain instances are inaccessible to them for various reasons including anxiety, need to talk to other players. I think many players just dont do strikes and fractals even if they are more than capable of doing them. Just because they dont want to engage in group forming and interactions that come with it. 

And group forming is pretty much a requirement for this meta.

3 minutes ago, Cuks.8241 said:

In this case you have the middle ground. Yeah the event is a bit harder than most metas. People on this forums grossly exaggerate though. I mean its forums, everything is the end of the world, sky falling, dead game, conspiracy aimed against them. But realistically anyone can join the same way as other metas. Find a group and join map. 

A bit? This one is a lot more difficult objectively with all the mechanics going on that you cannot ignore. You say "find a group and join map". That is completely in contradiction with your previous point about people not wanting to engage in group forming.

[yoni.7015]

18 minutes ago, Gehenna.3625 said:

A bit? This one is a lot more difficult objectively with all the mechanics going on that you cannot ignore.

It is not, the mechanics are not difficult. Some of them are annoying but not difficult. Groups don’t fail because of the mechanics, they fail because their DPS is bad. 
After HoT launched a lot of groups had problems with the Towers in DS, also not a difficult mechanic. 

Edited June 2, 2022 by yoni.7015

[Cuks.8241]

29 minutes ago, Gehenna.3625 said:

That's debatable because most people seem to avoid it.

And group forming is pretty much a requirement for this meta.

A bit? This one is a lot more difficult objectively with all the mechanics going on that you cannot ignore. You say "find a group and join map". That is completely in contradiction with your previous point about people not wanting to engage in group forming.

Off course you can just find a group and join the map. I mean there are some commanders that form group in Arborstone but the majority of groups are formed exactly like all others meta groups. I think I've only done the Arborstone grouping twice and that was more prominent when you still needed to get all 10 stacks before hand.

Join squad, join map instance. You can leave the group and do the event outside of the squad if you don't want to be part of it.

[yoni.7015]

47 minutes ago, Cuks.8241 said:

I think its better that it is in OW. More people get to experience it.

This is very true. Many players would be excluded because they don’t like to join instances. Having multiple versions would divide the player base. 

Edited June 2, 2022 by yoni.7015

[Fueki.4753]

2 hours ago, Cuks.8241 said:

I think its better that it is in OW. More people get to experience it.

My idea literally was an instanced version for and an Open World, so your point is moot. It's not a middle ground, it's the best for both ends of the discussion.

And the Open World version needs to have its bar lowered (if Arenanet wants it to be a grand finale instead of a smudge of mud at the story's end), because it's currently doing nothing but driving people away from it.
 

Quote

People on this forums grossly exaggerate though.

Some people exaggerate, but Dragon's End's meta truly is in a pitiful state that's makes it next to impossible to clear from randomly assembled groups of average players, whom Open World should be targetted at, since they are the vast majority of the game's population.

Making Open World content for the top end minority the enjoys the top end instanced content more than open world is just wrong. Arenanet made this meta for this minority, even know they should know better. They ought to rectify this, if they want to see more success.

 

Edited June 2, 2022 by Fueki.4753

[Bakeneko.5826]

Recap of last DS meta I was part of: good portion of players doing sub 9k DPS. ~5 doing between 10k-15k, and 3-4 doing 15-30k. Low effort builds do more dmg than pugs do, but noone cares to run them, or even put some effort into it.

[yoni.7015]

1 hour ago, Fueki.4753 said:

Some people exaggerate, but Dragon's End's meta truly is in a pitiful state that's makes it next to impossible to clear from randomly assembled groups of average players, whom Open World should be targetted at, since they are the vast majority of the game's population.

Making Open World content for the top end minority the enjoys the top end instanced content more than open world is just wrong. Arenanet made this meta for this minority, even know they should know better. They ought to rectify this, if they want to see more success.

 

There are three more meta events in EoD. For them you don’t need any organization, they are a loot piñata without any challenge and difficulty, perfect for the average Open World player.

There are so many meta events in the game for players that don’t want any challenging content, that only want to do auto attack while watching a series. Why is it so important to you that the DE meta becomes yet another one? Why can’t it be a little bit more challenging for players that like a challenge and like to organize? 

Edited June 2, 2022 by yoni.7015

[Forum Moderator.3419]

Hello Everyone,

Just a reminder to keep it civil. I've removed some posts.

Regards.

[Sigmoid.7082]

12 minutes ago, Fueki.4753 said:

If they want to organize anyway, why can't they take an instanced version of the fight, that's more tailored to their needs and let Open World people have a version of that fight that's tailored towards Open World people?

The problem here would be that, one way or another, the instanced version would have greater or unique rewards. 

 

Then the complaints would shift into the common territory of it's not that you are getting more for doing a haeder,instanced, version, it's that you are getting less for not doing that and doing the normal version.

[SlayerXX.7138]

1 hour ago, Bakeneko.5826 said:

Recap of last DS meta I was part of: good portion of players doing sub 9k DPS. ~5 doing between 10k-15k, and 3-4 doing 15-30k. Low effort builds do more dmg than pugs do, but noone cares to run them, or even put some effort into it.

Don't they just do so little dps because they are at downstate. You cant compare Golem dps to action dps. Golem doesnt hit you into downstate. I did it once while doing story. No idea what i was doing. Group clearly disorganized. We still completed it." Reasons for that: In the phase with the whirlpools the commander valiantly spawned chat so people use the EMPS . A couple of people were rezzing people who got downed because they failed mechanics. That was all it took to make it.

DE isn't hard. It is just busy visually and a little convoluted. Whirlpools aren't self explanatory, but otherwise what would you even nerf at this point? Break bars and disable way stations? Some people are just a little overwhelmed, if you wanna try hard just write the current mechanic in squad chat and see the dps rise as people get an idea what they have to do.

Reason I will never do it again: 1,5 hours having to be at least semi focused on a task I just a lot man(for a game). Same reason I did drizzle woods once and never again.

 

Edited June 2, 2022 by Albi.7250

[Fueki.4753]

17 minutes ago, Sigmoid.7082 said:

The problem here would be that, one way or another, the instanced version would have greater or unique rewards. 

 

Then the complaints would shift into the common territory of it's not that you are getting more for doing a haeder,instanced, version, it's that you are getting less for not doing that and doing the normal version.

Given that Dragon's End has next to no rewards in the first place, Arenanet might not too add much more to the hypothetical instanced version (if anything at all).

Edited June 2, 2022 by Fueki.4753

[Sigmoid.7082]

3 minutes ago, Fueki.4753 said:

Given that Dragon's End has next to no rewards in the first place, Arenanet might not too add much more to the hypothetical instanced version (if anything at all).

I don't think that really matters what it may reward wise then or now the sentiment will remain the same, especially if they add anything  unique. Be it a title, skin, etc. "Anet, why is the OW version not worth doing for the rewards but in the instanced version you are getting X / Y more of Z. This is unfair and needs to be fixed!"

 

As much as you try to hand wave or diminish this, history has taught us that this is almost 100% be the case and reaction. 

[Cuks.8241]

11 minutes ago, Fueki.4753 said:

Given that Dragon's End has next to no rewards in the first place, Arenanet might not too add much more to the hypothetical instanced version (if anything at all).

Oh this nonsense again. The second most gph farmtrain in the game has "next to no rewards". I mean I agree with many points haters have but this one is just plain lies.

I have a feeling some of you complainers never even play the event.

Edited June 2, 2022 by Cuks.8241