Polls about Revenant specializations

[Telgum.6071]

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[ScottBroChill.3254]

Fave - Renegade. Just overall very effective at what it does, really useful with the 1 tap alacrity with zero effort, synergizes well with all the core legends, traits actually provide real choices, although I miss the old retaliation cheese with jalis. Summons work great and are fun to use even in fast paced combat. 

Hardest to play - Core. None of the core legends synergize so no matter how effective the build it stills feel janky and like it's missing something. Ventari is pointless and mallyx is just no fun anymore with the trait/resistence butchering. Shiro is useful, it's just boring as heck to use.

Easiest to Play - Herald. Straight forward with with quasi-signets. Good stun break and heal. Synergizes well with core legends and is very much just middle of the road. Not very effective at damage or bringing sought after effects, but it is easy.

Comments on Vindi - Not hard to play, utility skills deal some nice damage and are fun to use as actual dps instead of just straight up utility skills. Works well with core legends outside mallyx. But it just doesn't feel impactful and comes off a little bland. Greatsword is just a little too straightforward especially compared to every other rev weapon, it just doesn't have that shiny new espec feel to me.

[Charybdis.3695]

In my experience:

Core - superb support in wvw and pvp, my first choice in any type of competition (shiro/ventari)

Herald - totally self-reliant healer, my main healer for pve (especially fractals)

Renedage - good hybrid options with dps and/or support, boring but useful

Vindicator - great killer in pve and wvw, requires more skill in pvp where stats are limited

[Lighter.5631]

as Pvp

herald and renegade, both favorite.

s/s shiro herald no need to explain, a warrior with flashy moves that zip around.

before i only liked herald, and felt like renegade is bad and lame skill wise.

shortbow really? summoning charrs? i don't like charrs.

so i never played it, but after some tweaks and the surge on renegade builds in pvp, i played it.

summoning charrs tho still not please me aesthetically but it's so fun to use and felt tactical.

but my favorite was the shortbow, omg new shortbow felt so nice and so fun to use, felt like a god summoning arrow out of the rift

and the f2 skill is a beast, paired with alac on f3.

renegade was just to my surprise so good so nice to play and so versatile. 

 

barely played core and vindicator to have an opinion, but herald and renegade easily top of the list amount all other specs i played.

tho willbender took herald place for me recently. but renegade is still the most fun ranged spec i've played.

[Ashantara.8731]

4 hours ago, ScottBroChill.3254 said:

Comments on Vindi - Not hard to play, utility skills deal some nice damage and are fun to use as actual dps instead of just straight up utility skills.

Some use other legends with the Vindicator spec:

I'd like to know, since I just recently started to look into this spec, if it is true that the DPS is significantly better with the other legends?

[Shao.7236]

5 hours ago, ScottBroChill.3254 said:

Hardest to play - Core. None of the core legends synergize so no matter how effective the build it stills feel janky and like it's missing something. Ventari is pointless and mallyx is just no fun anymore with the trait/resistence butchering. 

 

All Legends have some form of synergy, Core is no exception. I cannot fathom how they wouldn't when the latter is obvious if creative enough, Anet constantly nerfing and reworking it instead of tweaking the actual issues is the real problem here as to why Core is back into the lesser options.

 

Jalis is also the legend that is the most versatile, it comes off as glue for any of the legends or elites. Compared to Herald in most cases it's because the professions mechanics are foreign and unfun for the majority, that's why most prefer it and feel comfortable with it. Paired with Shiro who is simple af leads to this simplistic popular build everyone uses for PvP. In PvE it's different and having rotations doesn't have the same brain scattering PvP demands from players but that still has an effect on the playerbase to beg for Herald to somehow make it up in the meta.

[ScottBroChill.3254]

5 hours ago, Shao.7236 said:

 

All Legends have some form of synergy, Core is no exception. I cannot fathom how they wouldn't when the latter is obvious if creative enough, Anet constantly nerfing and reworking it instead of tweaking the actual issues is the real problem here as to why Core is back into the lesser options.

 

Jalis is also the legend that is the most versatile, it comes off as glue for any of the legends or elites. Compared to Herald in most cases it's because the professions mechanics are foreign and unfun for the majority, that's why most prefer it and feel comfortable with it. Paired with Shiro who is simple af leads to this simplistic popular build everyone uses for PvP. In PvE it's different and having rotations doesn't have the same brain scattering PvP demands from players but that still has an effect on the playerbase to beg for Herald to somehow make it up in the meta.

The only core legends that really work in an effective manner are jalis with shiro because they both benefit from power stats, everything else is kinda trash in the sense that you won't have the stats to make ventari or mallyx work. Mallyx use to work with torment runes and resistance, but that stuff isn't viable anymore.

But you're right in that jalis acts as a nice complementary legend, it provides staple utility with stability, condi cleanse, a nice big heal, etc. My thing with the legends not having synergy is that so much of the revs arsenal and damage comes from the legend bar, when you switch legends you are out of whatever you had before for 10 seconds. (lets pretend mallyx is usuable) If you are running mallyx, then your second legend is either jalis or shiro, and each one has no access to condi damage and can't take advantage of any condi stats. Add in that core rev also doesn't have complimentary weapons, your dps will tank hard.  Renegade kinda gets around this problem by having a really decent condi shortbow and kalla being just really really good. 

Basically with core you are stuck with shiro/jalis and sw+sw/Staff and that's about that. If you want to be somewhat effective. 

[Shao.7236]

3 hours ago, ScottBroChill.3254 said:

The only core legends that really work in an effective manner are jalis with shiro because they both benefit from power stats, everything else is kinda trash in the sense that you won't have the stats to make ventari or mallyx work. Mallyx use to work with torment runes and resistance, but that stuff isn't viable anymore.

But you're right in that jalis acts as a nice complementary legend, it provides staple utility with stability, condi cleanse, a nice big heal, etc. My thing with the legends not having synergy is that so much of the revs arsenal and damage comes from the legend bar, when you switch legends you are out of whatever you had before for 10 seconds. (lets pretend mallyx is usuable) If you are running mallyx, then your second legend is either jalis or shiro, and each one has no access to condi damage and can't take advantage of any condi stats. Add in that core rev also doesn't have complimentary weapons, your dps will tank hard.  Renegade kinda gets around this problem by having a really decent condi shortbow and kalla being just really really good. 

Basically with core you are stuck with shiro/jalis and sw+sw/Staff and that's about that. If you want to be somewhat effective. 

Afaik when I was playing Mallyx/Jalis in competitive it would be true that Jalis would introduce a bit of stall into damage output condition wise but it would no less useful to gather conditions along it with it's tankiness before transfering 'em or mitigating in general, the weakness from IR is really easy to cover as well with all the conditions that follow it when you protect Mallyx with Stability.

 

In much of the cases it surely doesn't keep up with Renegade literally being another condition alternative but it's not that bad either given one is gonma be tankier and more versatile than the other.

 

I want to state that while Hammer is not the most popular choice it is still an option, Axe is definitely underrated though as it was the OG power weapon for Revenant before, it still has the conditions and unique unblockable AoE while SW before being the sustain off-hand now is simply a damage dealer, the Chill and Slow is definitely missed, I honestly miss blocks the most.

[Telgum.6071]

1 hour ago, Shao.7236 said:

I want to state that while Hammer is not the most popular choice it is still an option

I don't see how hammer can possibly be an option over staff or even S/A. Generally speaking, not on very certain matchups.

[Shao.7236]

34 minutes ago, Telgum.6071 said:

I don't see how hammer can possibly be an option over staff or even S/A. Generally speaking, not on very certain matchups.

In my experience if you're not running Shiro it does have bad matchups, mostly Aegis reliant professions while if you're not Jalis then Blindness becomes a big issue.

 

I also never would use S/S+Hammer, just like I don't use S/S+GS, in PvP at least it is wasteful on opportunities to self sustain a bit, Unrelenting assault in no way reliable to use as something to sustain with how many things can go wrong with the skill.

 

Phase Smash is incredibly strong on offense and defense with the lowest CD sustain of any Revenant weapons while CoR even though is a buggy mess when it hits it hits hard. Field of the Mists is without a doubt one of the strong projectile denial while DTH with quickness can catch node teamfights, even more so if you just PT unblockables rather than SoTM+Phase Smash.

I want to state also that I think Core is the hardest exclusively because Vindicator utility allows it to sustain better by a long shot, even with having only 1 evade.

Edited June 1, 2022 by Shao.7236

[Tulkas.2576]

PVP/WVW: I love herald and vindicator, currently favouring vindicator though. 

 

PvE: Same as PvP, but I only play power builds and of the two I prefer Vindicator because even using the low intensity build, it outperforms a high intensity herald and it is much easier to use. 
 

I dislike renegade, the alacrity is nice and easy to maintain but I don’t like like condi and the power version is like vindicator without the greatsword. 
 

I like core, but glint is more fun than Jalis imo so if I’m ever in the mood for core I end up switching to herald after a few minutes. 
 

Herald felt difficult at first, but that was the first build I used with rev and I wasn’t used to energy and legends yet. Now that I’m used to it they all feel about a similar level of difficulty (for the power builds at least). The main difference is that you can play Vindi with like 4 buttons and do 30k+ on a golem or you can play your heart out on Herald and just barely get close to that. 
I find power/alac  Renegade to be just slightly more difficult because you have to hit that extra button every once in a while and make sure you have the energy for it. 

[vilesoldier.9826]

((PVP perspective))

Favorite -- Herald. Condi Herald continues to be my one true love. Had a short fling with Vind during the betas, but I came to my senses soon after realizing I hate having 1 dodge.

Easiest -- Renegade/Herald. Can't really decide, both are straightforward with no real galaxy-brain requirement to pick up. Fairly high skill ceiling on both too.

Hardest -- Core. The OG that only Shao and Za Shaloc (not even Anet lol) believe in.

Edited June 1, 2022 by GeneralBM.5781

[Za Shaloc.3908]

There are too many variables depending on gamemode you are playing and build/stats you are running. From a WvW perspective in terms of power roaming, from most to least difficult:

 

Vindicator > Herald > Core > Renegade

 

With dodge food and boosted energy sigils in WvW, Vindicator is more forgiving than in sPvP, but considering the likelihood of being outnumbered in the gamemode, the single dodge can be a death sentence. I think learning to manage two pseudo-legends in Alliance makes the spec automatically harder to play as well. Admittedly, I don't have much time on power Vindi, so I could be way off with this judgment.

 

I could also be way off in thinking core is on the easier end of things, but that is because it's what I play during most of my game time so what I am most comfortable with. I am decent on core but total trash on Herald because I never ever play it. I would say being able to run Jalis is more forgiving than running Herald/Glint because you have really big stab uptime as well as a heal that doesn't require you to think as much of when to use it. If someone is trying to get into power Herald in WvW but is having trouble with the skill curve, I recommend core. 

 

Renegade is by far the easiest the play in roaming. Just shortbow and profit. Enough said.

 

As for my favorite to play: core. Least favorite is easily Renegade because Kalla is an abomination. I dislike that Herald basically laughs in the face of energy management (especially with Draconic Echo), but I'd still say I like it better than Vindi.

[vilesoldier.9826]

18 minutes ago, Za Shaloc.3908 said:

I could also be way off in thinking core is on the easier end of things, but that is because it's what I play during most of my game time so what I am most comfortable with. I am decent on core but total trash on Herald because I never ever play it. I would say being able to run Jalis is more forgiving than running Herald/Glint because you have really big stab uptime as well as a heal that doesn't require you to think as much of when to use it. If someone is trying to get into power Herald in WvW but is having trouble with the skill curve, I recommend core. 

yoo how could i forget u! was a big fan of ur Ventari montages back in the day.

Experience definitely plays a big role, I say core is the hardest but truthfully I haven't meaningfully played it since before Ancient Echo was a thing lol

[Shao.7236]

6 minutes ago, GeneralBM.5781 said:

yoo how could i forget u! was a big fan of ur Ventari montages back in the day.

Experience definitely plays a big role, I say core is the hardest but truthfully I haven't meaningfully played it since before Ancient Echo was a thing lol

Core was extremely difficuly without Ancient Echo, Charged Mists was a must have and that was during the Spellbreaker dominant era, it could stand a chance but it was a really high skill ceiling chance vs the meta.

[Za Shaloc.3908]

13 minutes ago, GeneralBM.5781 said:

yoo how could i forget u! was a big fan of ur Ventari montages back in the day.

Experience definitely plays a big role, I say core is the hardest but truthfully I haven't meaningfully played it since before Ancient Echo was a thing lol

 

Thanks for the love! I have been recording more stuff lately so I'm gonna try to use it as inspiration for more Ventari things.

 

But yeah Ancient Echo was a huge game changer. IMO that and Charged Mists are what enabled core to stake out an identity. Prior to those two things? Yeah it just wasn't worth it and I would've for sure put it above Herald in terms of difficulty.

[Rhingeim.3974]

Only from PVE perspective. 

 

Favorite - Renegade. Decent damage, good sustain, gives unique gameplay due to short bow and interesting skills. 

 

Hardest - Vindicator. Can't figure it out, swapped back to renegade. Constantly dying with it) 

 

Easiest - Herald. True master of attrition. Like to pick it when I want to go into close combat. 

[vilesoldier.9826]

9 minutes ago, Shao.7236 said:

Core was extremely difficuly without Ancient Echo, Charged Mists was a must have and that was during the Spellbreaker dominant era, it could stand a chance but it was a really high skill ceiling chance vs the meta.

jesus I shudder just thinking back to that era... I literally just started taking PVP seriously too. back then was truly "learn or get eaten alive" xD i'll never forget my first full counter bait

 

6 minutes ago, Za Shaloc.3908 said:

 

Thanks for the love! I have been recording more stuff lately so I'm gonna try to use it as inspiration for more Ventari things.

 

But yeah Ancient Echo was a huge game changer. IMO that and Charged Mists are what enabled core to stake out an identity. Prior to those two things? Yeah it just wasn't worth it and I would've for sure put it above Herald in terms of difficulty.

I always liked that Core and Herald played with how energy was managed; Core letting you double-down into a single one, while Herald was light on energy cost but heavy on energy regen management.

wish they'd explore more of that instead of looking to other mechanical tradeoffs like a dodge >.>

[Buran.3796]

   From a PvP/WvW roaming/OW PvE perspective (so: I don't care zergs and most of instanced content):

   Fav: Herald >  Renegade  > core.

   Hardest: Vindicator, no matter the game mode. Is just a cannon fodder. Hard contender of Ele as the downstate meme king.

   Easiest: Condi Renegade> Condi Herald > Power Herald > Condi Core > Power Renegade > Power Core.

   

 

   I play condi Renegade, condi Herald and power Herald at WvW, but lately mostly condi builds. In PvP, either condi Herald, power Renegade or power Herald (this one a lot less lately). In OW power Herald had some limitations (poor AoE damage) but the sustain worked nice. After the nerfs in Battle Scars I just no longer run power Herald in PvE: both condi Herald and condi Renegade do way more damage while having much more HP, armor and sustain over time.

[draxynnic.3719]

Choosing on the basis of reasons other than 'how strong is it':

Favourite is Herald. It suffers a bit from the curse of being first, but it has a strong theme (which is further reinforced by Facet of Nature, which also strengthens the themes of the core legends) that carries through into a fun playstyle. Renegade is what I bring when I want to maximise my utility to a group, Vindicator gets used in Cantha to get the unique lines and to try it out in general, but Herald is the version I keep wanting to go back to.

Hardest to get to grips with is Vindicator. The dodge mechanic forces you to really change up how you interact with the dodge mechanic and avoid damage in general, while making use of the dual legend is an added layer of complexity, especially when both champions tend to also require a lot of skill activations to make the most of.

Easiest could well be anything other than Vindicator, but I went with Renegade by a hair because it has easy alacrity generation, and it's the only revenant variant which really has an effective standoff capability so you don't have to commit to melee if you don't want to.

[Shao.7236]

5 minutes ago, Rhingeim.3974 said:

Hardest - Vindicator. Can't figure it out, swapped back to renegade. Constantly dying with it)

Use your evade like you'd use Phase Smash/Unrelenting Assault. With intend to counter attacking, that's mostly key with Vindicator.

[Aeolus.3615]

17 hours ago, Shao.7236 said:

Use your evade like you'd use Phase Smash/Unrelenting Assault. With intend to counter attacking, that's mostly key with Vindicator.

That's one of the reason i like Aliance/jalis  with GS/hammer

[Shao.7236]

5 minutes ago, Aeolus.3615 said:

That's one of the reason i like Aliance/jalis  with GS/hammer

Hammer works really well with Alliances with all the ranged options, quickness allows easy damage in while resistance makes it so you can force damage into people spamming soft cc too, the fact that it evades backwards helps on using CoR.

 

The damage with Forerunner of Death is sooo satisfying too while Phase Smash synergy is pretty insane with the evade, it's like you're playing some kind of meteor build from all the bouncing.

Edited June 2, 2022 by Shao.7236

[artharon.9276]

I found vindicator easy to play, surprised seeing this poll's results tbh. Maybe vindi is harder than rene in pvp but deffinitely not as much as herald. I bet, condi herald could be one of the most stressful builds in the game to play. and pve? vindi and rene both mega easy and I cant find a use for herald. Using core in open world and wvw.

[Buran.3796]

3 hours ago, artharon.9276 said:

Maybe vindi is harder than rene in pvp but deffinitely not as much as herald. I bet, condi herald could be one of the most stressful builds in the game to play. and pve? vindi and rene both mega easy and I cant find a use for herald. Using core in open world and wvw.

   Power Herald is tricky to play due all his defenses are active and to do damage needs to devote all his stats to power/precission/ferocity, so you need a lot skill (well timed evades, blocks, cc and busrt) to survive. But is not harder than having to devote the same stas to do damage AND on top of that losing one evade and having the cost of your only one doubled. And please don't bring Imperial Guard to the argument since in terms of defensive capabilities the greatsword doesn't top the shield and Infuse Ligth is one of the best heals in the game. Plus, tons of cc.

   Regarding the use of condi Herald, it can solo most of the bosses from fractals and bounties in the game, a thing that Vindicator is just unable to do. Vindi is specially painful vs foes with large amounts of armor (due his severe limitations in terms of condi damage) and can't defend and deliver damage at the same time in the way that condi Herald and condi Renegade can.