How many hours I have to waste to do once meta in Dragon's End?

[Milosz.5938]

I know that you already nerfed meta there but still 4th time it's fail for me with full squad. Is this your joke, same like you treated elementalist's staff since years?  

Meta there is not single raid-boss fight (+-10 minutes) it takes 1,5h soo 4x1,5=6h for one meta :)))))) and fail, fail. I love gw2 for being casual friendly, this meta is not friendly.

You are aware that most of your players are not PVE raiders? (can't do DPS - check mechanics, that's OK) 

Please make Dragon's End meta pleasant experience.   

[vanfrano.1325]

I wasted many days back in April (yes, days) trying to clear Dragon's End, after my first win I tried to do it again several times and see if it was worth including in my fun routine. It's not and it fails too often, I don't mind a challenge, this is not challenging, this is tedious and unfun and the pre-events are lazy and repetitive.

All in all, EoD may as well not exist, I'm back to what I did before this failed expansion.

If you need help though and want to organize a squad I don't mind helping you getting rid of this thing and forget about it, like a lot of people did.

[Cyninja.2954]

Here is a short "how-to" prepare and get into a proper DE map:

1. Did you join a commander via the LFG specifically advertising for the DE meta? If yes, good. If not, why not? If a random commander tags up on your map, great but you are already rolling the dice here.

2. Is the commander explaining the fight or at least asking for quickness and alacrity providers to separate into different groups so he can make proper groups at the start of the event? If yes, good. If no, leave the squad/map and join a different one.

3. While doing the pre-events, are players completing break-bar challenges or do break-bars fail? If break-bars are done, good. If break-bars continue to fail, not good. While on this subject, make sure to take EMPs and be aware of your own cc skills to contribute to break-bars being done.

4. Are commanders or other players dropping food and waystations? If no, make sure to at least use your own food but expect a majority of the squad to not have food buffs which is not a good thing.

5. Is there ANY organization for lanes or the final fight being done by the commander? If no, again not great.

There, pay attention to those things and you will eventually succeed.

Simply joining Dragon's End maps over and over hoping for the best is NOT a sure way to get this event done. If you are on a map with random or no commander who basically just tagged up for funsies, expect that most players are there either for only events to acquire Imperial Favor, or those players are just as unorganized as you hoping for the best.

Edited June 17, 2022 by Cyninja.2954

[Paradoxoglanis.1904]

What I dont get is why they decided this meta needs to have such punishing time restrictions. Open world content should reward time invested, not punish it. If people are willing to spend the time they should eventually be able to finish it without getting kicked from the map because some arbitrary condition wasnt met.

Anet boasts the "60% success rate" yet I highly doubt they consider all the maps that have enough people, but dont even bother attempting it because they werent organized 30 minutes beforehand.

[yoni.7015]

At least on EU there are several commanders and groups that do the meta event every evening and advertise in LFG. They have a very high success rate. Just join them and you are good to go. 

[Xerxez.7361]

1 hour ago, Milosz.5938 said:

I know that you already nerfed meta there but still 4th time it's fail for me with full squad. Is this your joke, same like you treated elementalist's staff since years?  

Meta there is not single raid-boss fight (+-10 minutes) it takes 1,5h soo 4x1,5=6h for one meta :)))))) and fail, fail. I love gw2 for being casual friendly, this meta is not friendly.

You are aware that most of your players are not PVE raiders? (can't do DPS - check mechanics, that's OK) 

Please make Dragon's End meta pleasant experience.   

 

If your going to join a Dragon's End run for the clear join Squads that have the best setup for success. 5 man Groups (Quick + Alac) buffs only target 5 players and prioritize Group over Squad. The commander is actively making players aware of the fight mechanics. (Open World so there is a good chance you have a good chunk of players doing the Meta for the first time).

 

If content takes 1h+ why wouldn't you organize for the best chance of success rather than wasting everyone's time. Dragon's End isn't the first Meta that fails without setup. (Triple Trouble) and most likely won't be the last.

[Raizel.8175]

This thread... AGAIN?!

I hope that this will get closed soon. DE is perfectly fine. It's good to have some content that isn't entirely free.

[LuRkEr.9462]

DE Meta is fine. I have done DE pretty much daily for almost two months now without a failure. About half those were the DE after reset, but sometimes I run the one before reset and its fine as well. 

Just be sure you're pulling your own weight and are joining organized squads (squads with quickness and alac roles defined.) The fight is much easier than it used to be, but if your not utilizing boons you will likely fail.

[Fueki.4753]

Just don't bother with Dragon's End's meta. This meta is meant for the minuscule number of higher end players.

Arenanet is not going to bother adjusting it to make it fair for average players and they likely are not going to implement rewards after each stage of the meta, so why should average players waste time in it?

 

Edited June 17, 2022 by Fueki.4753

[SandraSolace.7682]

I am in no means an "higher end player" (thanks Fueki.4753 for giving me the right words!)

I don't have exotic anything, use the foods that are common, mostly the ones from festivals.

I've done the meta less then 20 times on more then one char. Failed a few cause of time. But also made it through to the very end on most. Some with leaders, some with people giving tips in chat, some in a group. 

I just can't seem to understand why others are having so much trouble?

Yet there are so many posts about this. 

[AliamRationem.5172]

It's definitely a cool fight, but the pre-event phase is obnoxiously long, boring and repetitive.  In particular if you aren't lucky enough to get on a map that skips the 30 minute forced wait.  When you finally reach the epic boss fight you're just hoping the group has it together enough to get the job done, which is pretty hit or miss.  If it's a miss you just wasted a couple of hours for pretty much nothing.  Worse, you spent most of that time doing boring events.

This is why I got 1 win and never went back.  There's some feedback for you, ANet.

[Harfang.1507]

First time I chime in on yet another one of these threads. "It's ridiculously hard to complete" vs. "It's not broken, don't fix it." I look at Cyninja.2954's reply. It is quite helpful and to the point for those of us who want to get the thing done and over with. Ultimately, the complaints we hear are less about how to get it done and more about a disconnect between what us casual and semi-casual players have come to expect and enjoy of an Open World metas and what is asked of us in this keystone one.

I enjoy Open World metas because they are fun and rewarding and they fit in my unpredictable/irregular gaming schedule. In that regard, Dragon's End meta does not fit well in my schedule; it is just too long and inconveniently-schedule. If I do not raid, it is exactly for that reason. Add the fact that the success rate for casuals is doubtless much lower than 60% and it sums up for many of us as "why bother?" + epic-level frustration.

I have seen the ArenaNet blog post about why they made it so challenging. I can see the logic. Unfortunately, once more, they did not play to their strength, nor their (wider) audience.

 

[IAmNotMatthew.1058]

The meta takes about an hour, so.. yeah, you need to waste about an hour on it.

[Gibson.4036]

11 minutes ago, IAmNotMatthew.1058 said:

The meta takes about an hour, so.. yeah, you need to waste about an hour on it.

I haven't done it in a while, but last I did, success required about two hours.

Find a decent group in LFG at an hour before meta. Spend 20 minutes getting your buffs and the zone ready. Hang out for 40 minutes doing whatever. A little under an hour to do the meta itself.

Showing up close to the meta in order to do it in about an hour was a recipe for not finding a good group/instance.

Maybe things have changed since then, and good groups are forming at the 20 til mark?

Edited June 17, 2022 by Gibson.4036

[IAmNotMatthew.1058]

1 minute ago, Gibson.4036 said:

I haven't done it in a while, but last I did, success required about two hours.

Find a decent group in LFG at an hour before meta. Spend 20 minutes getting your buffs and the zone ready. Hang out for 40 minutes doing whatever. A little under an hour to do the meta itself.

Showing up close to the meta in order to do it in about an hour was a recipt for not finding a good group/instance.

Maybe things have changed since then, and good groups are forming at the 20 til mark?

My last attempt doesn't really count for how long it takes, because I dropped into the map like 5 minutes before the fight with Soo Won(The Kralky part was on).
I stopped joining the map on meta start around the late March change to the meta. With that it's 30+20 for me.

The meta not being done by everyone now that it's no longer new and flashy helps in joining maps halfway through the prep part. You also no longer need to spend a ton of time on the map stacking the buff to 10, you only need like 5 now and the escort does the rest.

[Raizel.8175]

35 minutes ago, Harfang.1507 said:

First time I chime in on yet another one of these threads. "It's ridiculously hard to complete" vs. "It's not broken, don't fix it." I look at Cyninja.2954's reply. It is quite helpful and to the point for those of us who want to get the thing done and over with. Ultimately, the complaints we hear are less about how to get it done and more about a disconnect between what us casual and semi-casual players have come to expect and enjoy of an Open World metas and what is asked of us in this keystone one.

I enjoy Open World metas because they are fun and rewarding and they fit in my unpredictable/irregular gaming schedule. In that regard, Dragon's End meta does not fit well in my schedule; it is just too long and inconveniently-schedule. If I do not raid, it is exactly for that reason. Add the fact that the success rate for casuals is doubtless much lower than 60% and it sums up for many of us as "why bother?" + epic-level frustration.

I have seen the ArenaNet blog post about why they made it so challenging. I can see the logic. Unfortunately, once more, they did not play to their strength, nor their (wider) audience.

 

I really dislike how subcommunities are depicted in the forums. Neither "casuals" nor "semi-casuals" nor "raiders" are monolithic blocks. There are - in fact - "casual" people who read their traits and skills and do well while there are also "raiders" who copy some meta build without understanding it.

The problem is that the vast majority of open world content was - and still is - basically "free". Just get there and you get your rewards as participation trophy. DE actually needs people to do something. In that regard, the disconnect isn't between "casuals" and "raiders" but rather "people who actually play the game" and "people who treat the game as an interactive movie".

DE is basically 99% mechanics. In general, GW2 puts a lot more emphasis on mechanics rather than DPS - that is even true for hardcore content like raids. In addition to mechanics though, people need to understand traits and skills - which is fundamental to this particular game since the build-system is one of GW2 fundamental game design choices.

As long as you've understood basic game mechanics, DE is simple. The problem is that people were spoiled beyond redemption in the majority of open world content. People didn't even need to properly communicate with each other and a considerable part of the community still doesn't want to communicate at all - which is one of the reasons why meta events like Chak Gerent still occasionly fail.

[AliamRationem.5172]

58 minutes ago, IAmNotMatthew.1058 said:

The meta takes about an hour, so.. yeah, you need to waste about an hour on it.

No.  It takes an hour minimum.  That's if you're lucky enough to jump into a map that is organized and ready to begin.  Otherwise it's more like 1h30m+.  But you knew that.

[IAmNotMatthew.1058]

8 minutes ago, AliamRationem.5172 said:

No.  It takes an hour minimum.  That's if you're lucky enough to jump into a map that is organized and ready to begin.  Otherwise it's more like 1h30m+.  But you knew that.

Read my comment a bit below the one you quoted. 

Ever since the late March change to the meta I stopped joining on reset and instead joined around XX:30 with one being at XX:55.

You don't need to spend 1h30m on the meta, not like that's much when many other metas take the same time.

[AliamRationem.5172]

1 hour ago, IAmNotMatthew.1058 said:

Read my comment a bit below the one you quoted. 

Ever since the late March change to the meta I stopped joining on reset and instead joined around XX:30 with one being at XX:55.

You don't need to spend 1h30m on the meta, not like that's much when many other metas take the same time.

It's a combination of the time required, the boring tasks, and the high failure rate.  The final boss itself is great.  It's unfortunately ruined by these design decisions.  So, I hope ANet takes note for future designs.

[IAmNotMatthew.1058]

2 hours ago, AliamRationem.5172 said:

It's a combination of the time required, the boring tasks, and the high failure rate.  The final boss itself is great.  It's unfortunately ruined by these design decisions.  So, I hope ANet takes note for future designs.

The "high failure rate" is the only thing exclusive to DE.
Dragon's Stand, Drizzlewood, also involve repetitive and long tasks that are essentially the same. 

[AliamRationem.5172]

4 minutes ago, IAmNotMatthew.1058 said:

The "high failure rate" is the only thing exclusive to DE.
Dragon's Stand, Drizzlewood, also involve repetitive and long tasks that are essentially the same. 

I think DE would have been a lot better if it had been designed the same way DS was.  Unfortunately, that isn't the case and for every map you get to skip into with the pre events done, a bunch of people had to push the map to that point so you were able to do so.

[Gibson.4036]

9 minutes ago, IAmNotMatthew.1058 said:

The "high failure rate" is the only thing exclusive to DE.
Dragon's Stand, Drizzlewood, also involve repetitive and long tasks that are essentially the same. 

Drizzlewood rewards you significantly along the way. The south events have more variety than the DE zone prep events.

[Fueki.4753]

7 hours ago, Gibson.4036 said:

Drizzlewood rewards you significantly along the way. The south events have more variety than the DE zone prep events.

Dragon's Stand is also decently rewarding, if you stockpile some machetes for the pods.

Edited June 18, 2022 by Fueki.4753

[Sobx.1758]

How many hours? About 1,5. Use lfg, get in an organized squad, pull your weight and you have a pretty good chance actually .

Edited June 18, 2022 by Sobx.1758

[SlayerXX.7138]

In addition to what is mentioned bring ascended food if nobody is already placing it. The value of one peppercorn feast buff over the birthday cake one is enormous.