What Class Has The Most Engaging and Snappy Gameplay From Start To Finish?

[Cammy.7468]

 

Okay, so I'm a new player because a friend bought me the game and I really enjoyed the first 30 or so levels playing with him. My friend can't play often though and has a lot of maxed-out characters, so I figured I'd play a character solo, get through all the core game and expansions on one character, and go from there. Problem is, even though I've tried out a couple of classes, I'm having a hard time deciding what class to do it all on. I've taken a few into the leveling phase and also into the PVP lobby but it's taken a lot of time, and still hard to tell if it's what I'm looking for. Was hoping you good people on the forums would help me out because google and youtube are not. (Btw I hope I'm posting in the right place, also my first time on a forum so please bear with me.)

 

Let me detail out exactly what I'm looking for and not looking for and see if that helps.

What I mean by engaging and snappy gameplay from start to finish is a class that has a lot of variety in combat, something with quick attacks, that can be creative with the gameplay, but also packs a good punch, and generally stays that way throughout all elite specs (at least 2 of 3) so I can best enjoy all expansion content in one go.

 

For example, Guardian is the class I tried solo first, and I really liked the Greatsword with the quickness elite skill because it hit hard and fast, with a bunch of different options and effects. But at the same time, the Guardian started to get tiring really quick, because if I go up against an enemy that is even a little challenging, I just end up hitting every single button on my Hotbar, with seemingly very little effect. I throw down the sword of justice, the fire circle, activate quickness, hit F1, hit 4 on greatsword, then spin. All of that is just for a yellow Veteran worm for a heart quest, and repeating that for every mob is exhausting. And as for damage options, right now that's about all I got.

 

Necro had the same kind of issue, where it just felt like I was slamming my face into the keyboard to lay down a variety of green circles, although axe and shroud 5 was fun to use, I didn't get very far with this one so maybe I'm wrong, although the ability descriptions didn't exactly wow me.

 

The character I made with my friend was a Thief, and I really liked that you had quickness as just a skill, then when you hit an enemy even with an auto-attack it felt like you were doing some real damage, at the very least the animations and sounds made it feel that way, which is also really important. The downside IMO is that it's a little lacking in the weapons department, being limited to only those few, but I can look past it if it's worth sticking around. That and I wasn't sure if I should just level another Thief on my own, without looking into other options.

 

I dabbled in a couple more like Ranger, and really enjoyed that for the first while, but I heard people hated that it gets so pet-centric, and Mesmer just didn't mesh with me from the jump, but I'm open-minded to both if they have what I'm looking for.

 

If you have an opinion I would love to hear it, I'm willing to try anything if you think it hits all the marks I'm looking for, even making another thief for my own purposes, or sticking with a class ive detailed minor issues with. Hope everything was clear, and am willing to clarify anything I may not have elaborated on.

Thanks

 

Edited December 18, 2022 by Cammy.7468

[Elricht Kaltwind.8796]

I would say necromancer for sure, especially reaper spec. You can really feel how hard reaper hits when you're in a big group of enemies. You enter shroud and use your distance-closer to rush into a big mob, then you have a crazy high-damage whirling AoE attack with big range. It just feels immediately very destructive and hard-hitting. Then outside of shroud you have the greatsword which really bonks, and if used cleverly, can recharge it's hardest-hitting skill instantly, making it spammable.

 

Without the reaper spec unlocked, it's still very hard-hitting, with axe and focus probably being the best balance of fun and damage in my opinion.

[Dr Meta.3158]

11 hours ago, Cammy.7468 said:

 

Okay, so I'm a new player because a friend bought me the game and I really enjoyed the first 30 or so levels playing with him. My friend can't play often though and has a lot of maxed-out characters, so I figured I'd play a character solo, get through all the core game and expansions on one character, and go from there. Problem is, even though I've tried out a couple of classes, I'm having a hard time deciding what class to do it all on. I've taken a few into the leveling phase and also into the PVP lobby but it's taken a lot of time, and still hard to tell if it's what I'm looking for. Was hoping you good people on the forums would help me out because google and youtube are not. (Btw I hope I'm posting in the right place, also my first time on a forum so please bear with me.)

 

Let me detail out exactly what I'm looking for and not looking for and see if that helps.

What I mean by engaging and snappy gameplay from start to finish is a class that has a lot of variety in combat, something with quick attacks, that can be creative with the gameplay, but also packs a good punch, and generally stays that way throughout all elite specs (at least 2 of 3) so I can best enjoy all expansion content in one go.

 

For example, Guardian is the class I tried solo first, and I really liked the Greatsword with the quickness elite skill because it hit hard and fast, with a bunch of different options and effects. But at the same time, the Guardian started to get tiring really quick, because if I go up against an enemy that is even a little challenging, I just end up hitting every single button on my Hotbar, with seemingly very little effect. I throw down the sword of justice, the fire circle, activate quickness, hit F1, hit 4 on greatsword, then spin. All of that is just for a yellow Veteran worm for a heart quest, and repeating that for every mob is exhausting. And as for damage options, right now that's about all I got.

 

Necro had the same kind of issue, where it just felt like I was slamming my face into the keyboard to lay down a variety of green circles, although axe and shroud 5 was fun to use, I didn't get very far with this one so maybe I'm wrong, although the ability descriptions didn't exactly wow me.

 

The character I made with my friend was a Thief, and I really liked that you had quickness as just a skill, then when you hit an enemy even with an auto-attack it felt like you were doing some real damage, at the very least the animations and sounds made it feel that way, which is also really important. The downside IMO is that it's a little lacking in the weapons department, being limited to only those few, but I can look past it if it's worth sticking around. That and I wasn't sure if I should just level another Thief on my own, without looking into other options.

 

I dabbled in a couple more like Ranger, and really enjoyed that for the first while, but I heard people hated that it gets so pet-centric, and Mesmer just didn't mesh with me from the jump, but I'm open-minded to both if they have what I'm looking for.

 

If you have an opinion I would love to hear it, I'm willing to try anything if you think it hits all the marks I'm looking for, even making another thief for my own purposes, or sticking with a class ive detailed minor issues with. Hope everything was clear, and am willing to clarify anything I may not have elaborated on.

Thanks

 

 

This may be what you're looking for.

[Zyreva.1078]

Based on your very vague desciption i'd say avoid necro, because it tends to be a bit slower paced, and thief, because it's dps rotations tend to lack variety. But other than those two (and to some extent even those) every class can fit your description of "engaging and snappy" one way or another.

You need to keep in mind that low dmg output during leveling is most likely a matter of an unfinished and therefore pretty bad build and doesn't neccessarily translate into later stages of the game with fully unlocked elite specs, good gear and an appropriate build.

Also in regards to ranger, it isn't that pet focused in PvE at all, soulbeast basically gets rid of the pet entirely (not really, but you just play perma merged with the pet) and even for the other two specs that use pets, the impact of the pet is lower than during leveling, where the pets are at their strongest relative to the player. So if you didn't mind the pet during leveling i don't know why it would bother you later.

In order to give more advice, it would good to know what type of content and role(s) you want to play, whether you prefer ranged or melee gameplay or have a certain preference regarding the theme of the specs (eg caster or fighter, ...) and so on.

Edited December 18, 2022 by UmbraNoctis.1907

[Infusion.7149]

I'm honestly amazed someone recommended CATALYST to a new player... even more so when they are looking for fast hitting classes and catalyst has 1.5 to 3 second channel times on its hammer skills and 0.75 second autoattack on earth attunement.
I would say the best bet is power revenant (herald with draconic echo for quickness especially). In challenging content you can always swap to condi renegade with a shortbow which allows you to attack quickly (the primary complaint here) while also allowing for range. Its power builds are also quite forgiving in openworld due to traits such as Battle Scars and vindicator now with two dodges has very high cleave with greatsword for openworld. Moreover revenant is one of the most flexible professions and an added bonus is celestial gear you get from level 80 is actually usable on renegade. If you are struggling with a skill rotation there are also easy options that can achieve 27K+ DPS more or less autoattacking on herald while also benefitting the party with boons.
 

Spoiler

Example:

 

 

Ranger would be a decent pick if you don't fall into the trap of letting the pet tank for you in core tyria while leveling. The meme of longbow rangers (which are slow attacking due to projectile time and can only pierce and not cleave) with a bear is commonly ridiculed; axe is fast attacking with low cleave (only hits two targets). Sword and greatsword aren't much faster than sword on revenant and greatsword maul (skill #2) has an obvious long animation time. Untamed is fast paced but most people consider the Fervent Force skill rotation to be facing a nerf soon and hammer isn't innately a fast weapon. Its druid alacrity support option is terrible for mobile situations and druid overall is poor damage so it isn't really tailored for openworld. If you intend to play WvW in the future this is more or less the worst class to pick if you play casual WvW and just want to join random commanders.
edit: do note the meta variants of power rangers will run offhand axe which roots you in place but unless you are playing power soulbeast which has One Wolf Pack into Whirling Defense combo you can get around this by running warhorn

If you are not doing anything that is particularly challenging in PVE (i.e. leveling is not challenging content) then warrior is a good pick especially for a core profession as core axe warrior is strong enough and relatively fast attacking (with spellbreaker being a strong melee pick). Axe's first two attacks connect with 1/4 second activation time which is on par with spellbreaker's mainhand dagger. In more challenging content warrior doesn't have a strong ranged option other than condi berserker with a longbow. So I don't think is a fitting choice if you want to stick with one class throughout even if it has a strong quickness option.

The issue I see with playing thief is the design for dagger is more or less single target when you aren't using offhand dagger for death blossom. It is fast attacking but with low cleave (only hits 2 targets). In addition, thief overall is designed around evasion and stealth which is not new player friendly sometimes depending on your playstyle. Daredevil likely remains the best openworld spec for thief due to mobility (3 dodges) and a power staff weapon with good cleave. It is rarely asked for so in the long run I would not prioritize thief, especially since its support spec (specter) has extremely low uptake meaning getting into instanced content will consist of playing as DPS exclusively.

Poor choices for fast power attacks include necro (except harbinger which is mainly condi), engineer (the fastest weapon is sword on holo), elementalist (sword weaver is a struggle for most especially due to lack of weaponswap), mesmer (virtuoso dagger has a flight time and sword is not really faster than rev sword), guardian (greatsword is slow , sword is not as fast as rev, and axe is mainly on condi).

 

Edited December 18, 2022 by Infusion.7149

[Cammy.7468]

4 hours ago, UmbraNoctis.1907 said:

Based on your very vague desciption i'd say avoid necro, because it tends to be a bit slower paced, and thief, because it's dps rotations tend to lack variety. But other than those two (and to some extent even those) every class can fit your description of "engaging and snappy" one way or another.

 

 

4 hours ago, UmbraNoctis.1907 said:

In order to give more advice, it would good to know what type of content and role(s) you want to play, whether you prefer ranged or melee gameplay or have a certain preference regarding the theme of the specs (eg caster or fighter, ...) and so on.

I tried to be as specific as possible in my likes and dislikes with my limited knowledge, but I get what you're saying. Let me detail what I mean a little more. The varied themes and playstyles of the Elite Specs makes it hard to tell what has what. I'm looking for a class that has a good and hard hitting playstyle and feel throughout every single expansion and their coinciding Elite Specs. Preferably I would like melee or at least close range options And ranged, that I can swap between when swapping weapons. I dont want a passive gameplay experience and would prefer that if I press a button it has an immediate and interesting effect. Doesnt necessarily have to do damage, but Id prefer it not be a "press x to put y effect on an enemy around you" if that effect doesnt have a good visual tell. If Im just completing a heart quest, its doesn't really matter much to me if the enemy is slowed or weakened or something, because they're just going to die in six seconds anyway, and is probably a hinderance to my overall goal of just deleting the enemy. This is a first time, explore, delete heart quest enemy, or story mission enemy, move on, type character. Boons or conditions or whatever, might be really great for group content, but if my own solo character cant feel the effect, and instead I just fight on as normal, against a regular open world mob, or undead minion in a story mission, I can see how I would grow bored very quickly, especially by the time I reach the PoF expansions and beyond.

In terms of content and roles, for right now I just want to focus on damage and creativity, so that the story content, open world content, open world bosses, maybe a dungeon here or there, and maybe dabbling in pvp or wvw at a later stage, is as engaging as possible, while also not slow and tedious.

By creativity, I mean multiple options and choices for a variety of situations, which is vague and im sure most classes can cover this, but I mean literally creative. Like having a really satisfying combo, or a time where using my elite skill changed how I played in a fight and I feel like I chose the right thing at the right time. I dont so much mean setup ( see my guardian example in the post), as i dont want to feel like I need to slap down 5 circles on the ground, then buff myself once, and then pull the one random yellow trash mob. Same thing was my concern with mesmer, as I felt I needed to pop out 3 clones before I got to the point where I could attack the mob. (might be off base with this one though who knows. im new). But something where I can set myself up with one ability or weapon skill, and then capitalize on what Ive done with another one, that seems exciting to me. 

(Think how in open world games like Breath of the Wild, I choose the weapon for the situation, and every fight can feel different. A bow headshot here, a parry there, a freeze arrow, then lightning sword combo, not necessarily the elements but the effect, a stun and then a more damaging attack because of that stun/combo, etc.)

edit: I am aware that something like this probably isnt totally possible in the grand scheme of the mmo genre, but the principle of set them up and take them down, or something similar in style and function. Whether it be from a class mechanic or a weapon or utility skill, if i feel that Im making choices in a fight rather than hitting every enemy with everything I got every single time Im gonna feel like I have room to grow as I move forward in the stories and expansions. 

Obviously because of this I dont want to make a healer, because Im playing solo for the most part, and on this specific character maybe enitirely until all expansions are complete, and healing/support isnt something I need to do often. I dont mind having the option to at a later date, and really might not even mind having that option, but for the first 80 levels and however many hours of story content, living world, mastery and achievements etc. Im going to do for a first full runthrough solo, Im not going to be using healing skills, or otherwise "party enhancing" skills, that dont effect me damage or effect wise.

 

hope this clarifies well, I can expand on whatever. Thanks

Edited December 18, 2022 by Cammy.7468

[oscuro.9720]

Let me tell you of the Warrior, my friend. You see Warrior is not a fast class in the traditional sense; it’s skills have longer cast times and are mostly single hit. It has a lot of self roots, and it’s movement skills yeet you off into the distance 4 out of every 10 uses. 
HOWEVER, do you endeavor to step foot into the realms from which man hath been barred? Do you wish to know that your successes and failures are the result of thine own efforts, and not some lowly gimmick upon which the other, lesser professions rely? Do you wish to seek out a power that shall transcend the gods and dragons, so that when you awake in the morning they offer to you their supplications for fear you turn your blade upon them? Are you willing to never yield in the pursuit of a true strength that comes from within, that the inferior professions are incapable of finding? Do you wish to liberate thine self from the shackles that bind thee, the chains ye hath forged, link by link, as you relied upon the crutches which other hath convinced you to take up in an effort to justify their own dependence on power that is not their own?

Then, my brother, now is the time! Cast aside thine doubts! These fetters are but an illusion borne from thy weakness that hath festered for far too long. Pick up thine sword and begin swinging. Spread thy legs and sink into a horse stance. Slowly, inch by inch, step by step, crawling if you have to, begin climbing the mountain. Climb, until your arms become gnarled like the branches of a great oak, until your legs thicken to rival the trunk’s thickness, and thy back widens to provide more shade than its broad foliage. Until you footsteps rattle the earth, and the others look upon you while feigning disgust to hide their own insecurities. 
Come with us, my brother of war, into the endless pursuit of dominance over infinity! Together, we shall move forward endlessly! And if we shall encounter the end, we shall sacrifice everything for just one more step. Just one more inch. Never shall we relent. Never shall we cease, for the hunger that burns within us like a torrent of a thousand exploding suns is all consuming, devouring whatever may come within reach. Rise from the stupor that you have long since forgotten you have fallen into, let the fire of thine soul roar with bloodlust and vengeance that shall only be satiated with the blood of thine enemies running down thy arms and their despair filling thine belly. Take up thine sword, my brother, and join us upon the path of the Warrior.

Edited December 19, 2022 by oscuro.9720

[Rogue.8235]

17 hours ago, Cammy.7468 said:

 

Okay, so I'm a new player because a friend bought me the game and I really enjoyed the first 30 or so levels playing with him. My friend can't play often though and has a lot of maxed-out characters, so I figured I'd play a character solo, get through all the core game and expansions on one character, and go from there. Problem is, even though I've tried out a couple of classes, I'm having a hard time deciding what class to do it all on. I've taken a few into the leveling phase and also into the PVP lobby but it's taken a lot of time, and still hard to tell if it's what I'm looking for. Was hoping you good people on the forums would help me out because google and youtube are not. (Btw I hope I'm posting in the right place, also my first time on a forum so please bear with me.)

 

Let me detail out exactly what I'm looking for and not looking for and see if that helps.

What I mean by engaging and snappy gameplay from start to finish is a class that has a lot of variety in combat, something with quick attacks, that can be creative with the gameplay, but also packs a good punch, and generally stays that way throughout all elite specs (at least 2 of 3) so I can best enjoy all expansion content in one go.

 

For example, Guardian is the class I tried solo first, and I really liked the Greatsword with the quickness elite skill because it hit hard and fast, with a bunch of different options and effects. But at the same time, the Guardian started to get tiring really quick, because if I go up against an enemy that is even a little challenging, I just end up hitting every single button on my Hotbar, with seemingly very little effect. I throw down the sword of justice, the fire circle, activate quickness, hit F1, hit 4 on greatsword, then spin. All of that is just for a yellow Veteran worm for a heart quest, and repeating that for every mob is exhausting. And as for damage options, right now that's about all I got.

 

Necro had the same kind of issue, where it just felt like I was slamming my face into the keyboard to lay down a variety of green circles, although axe and shroud 5 was fun to use, I didn't get very far with this one so maybe I'm wrong, although the ability descriptions didn't exactly wow me.

 

The character I made with my friend was a Thief, and I really liked that you had quickness as just a skill, then when you hit an enemy even with an auto-attack it felt like you were doing some real damage, at the very least the animations and sounds made it feel that way, which is also really important. The downside IMO is that it's a little lacking in the weapons department, being limited to only those few, but I can look past it if it's worth sticking around. That and I wasn't sure if I should just level another Thief on my own, without looking into other options.

 

I dabbled in a couple more like Ranger, and really enjoyed that for the first while, but I heard people hated that it gets so pet-centric, and Mesmer just didn't mesh with me from the jump, but I'm open-minded to both if they have what I'm looking for.

 

If you have an opinion I would love to hear it, I'm willing to try anything if you think it hits all the marks I'm looking for, even making another thief for my own purposes, or sticking with a class ive detailed minor issues with. Hope everything was clear, and am willing to clarify anything I may not have elaborated on.

Thanks

 

I would say warrior.  Warrior is an extremely simple profession, compared to the others, which scales with actual player skill.  I'd compare warrior to fighting games which have a character with a small move-list but is top-tier based on how well the player can use that small move list.  Essentially, it's not complex game mechanics, but how you use the warrior that makes it effective.

The warrior has a wide variety of methods to kill everything.  Note, this is under the context of open-world and story PvEE.  You can dabble with amny weapon combinations to find a set you enjoy.  Just remember, choose condition damage or strike damage (power) as you level.  With an incomplete build, you won't be able to make a hybrid build with great success.  

Anyways, warrior has many ways to tackle content, it all depends on how you use the tools you choose to bring.  I have several warriors, each with multiple, different builds, taht I use all over the game, to include PvE, PvP, and WvW (though less often).  

Another thing, survivability in the game is about active damage mitigation.  Avoid damage by dodging, blocking, blinding, stunning, repositioning, evading,  and invulning.

In particular, warrior has a lot of CC skills for outright stunning an enemy (preventing them from attacking) or hindering enemy movement (cripple and immobilize) to allow easy repositioning, some mobility skills, skills that block attacks, skills that make you invulnerable to attacks, at least one skill that blinds (longbow),  and the standard two dodges available to every profession.

With your weapon swaps, you can go from large, heavy attacks to quick, mobile attacks.   There are a lot of ways to combo skills, including cross-weapon combos.

Warrior is honestly good in all content, though I never played raids so can't speek for raiding.  The meta is different between PvE, PvP, and WvW, but warrior is still good to go in all 3.  Again, the effectiveness of warrior scales with player skill, so success is dependent on outplaying your enemies.

 

I, personally, find thief to be the most engaging profession in terms of player skill, but am suggesting warrior as it is generally easier to play for new players.  Thief requires above average skill in utilizing active defenses to survive, whereas the stats of warrior makes gameplay more forgiving.

 

[Zyreva.1078]

 

2 hours ago, Infusion.7149 said:

I'm honestly amazed someone recommended CATALYST to a new player...

Just because someone is new doesn't mean they are incapable of learning and playing classes that are a bit more difficult to get into. If a new player likes ele, there is absolutely no reason to discourage them from playing it.

I second the rest from your post tho. Rev might be the best pick in this case. Very versatile, good (power) dps options for all 3 specialisations. Decent solo. Can adapt to different situations very well.

Or stick with ranger, since Cammy.7468 seem to like it so far and only got discouraged because someone else told bad stuff about it (never let someone else tell you to not play something you enjoy!), tho druid is probably not the way to go, which leaves 2 specs to try.

Edited December 18, 2022 by UmbraNoctis.1907

[Infusion.7149]

1 minute ago, UmbraNoctis.1907 said:

 

Just because someone is new doesn't mean they are incapable of learning and playing classes that are a bit more difficult to get into. If a new player likes ele, there is absolutely no reason to discourage them from playing it.

I second the rest from your post tho. Rev might be the best pick in this case. Very versatile, good (power) dps options for all 3 specialisations. Decent solo. Can adapt to different situations very well.

Or stick with ranger, since Cammy.7468 seem to like it so far and only got discouraged because someone else told bad stuff about it (never let someone else tell you to not play something you enjoy!), tho druid is probably not the way to go, which leaves 2 specs to try.

DPS Catalyst has been extremely volatile in terms of balance and even benchmarks are unable to upkeep permanent 10 stack elemental empowerment meaning quickness cata is preferable for someone new to the game if they go that route. I have not seen a single LFG look for catalyst unless it is an all ele meme comp and elementalist is probably the biggest new player trap in the game if intending to do instanced content. To top it off the cleave outside of stonestrike is underwhelming on hammer now, the water attunement nerfs never were reverted (and likely Arenanet won't care since the water auto isn't used in benchmark), fire/air don't cleave at all and are slow attacking. This could have been rationalized by the hammer orbs' cleave but now it is 0.001 coefficient once more with no adjustments to any hammer autoattacks nor jade sphere.

All this means it is undesirable for someone in openworld when they reach 80 to unlock Catalyst and while leveling the best elementalist options remain scepter (slow, delayed attacks and mostly 3 target cleave on fire attunement and garbage DPS on air attunement) and dagger (relatively slow attacks). The original post is asking for quick responsive attacks and if the topic creator is going to to be fed up playing before reaching 80 that would mean frustation that could have been avoided. (The topic creator also noted how mesmer is poor in openworld due to clones, which is unavoidable unless you use a level 80 boost to unlock virtuoso.)

New players should only go for elementalists if they tolerate putting in the extra effort to learn it properly and doing twice the work for the same result. Without hammer a catalyst is essentially elementalist with a F5 Jade sphere and more buffs to upkeep (Elemental Empowerment mainly but also energy). Because jade sphere is not instant damage but a DoT, it also presents a problem of if you are able to use it often enough: the only time it truly felt openworld suitable was when it had 5 cooldown.

Rev was my pick for them because instantly melting CC bars in openworld makes things far easier and also it is something that is a gameplay mechanic to learn. Sword is available before hitting 80; quickness herald has been putting out good results and while quickness scrapper has superspeed, herald has a faster attack rate. Alac renegade was the dominant alacrity provider before mechanist and even while playing DPS it is able to fill in boon gaps. Condi renegade has had consistent 37-40K benchmarks in PVE and generally respectable performance regardless of patch.

 

[Cammy.7468]

5 hours ago, UmbraNoctis.1907 said:

19 minutes ago, Infusion.7149 said:

Rev was my pick for them because instantly melting CC bars in openworld makes things far easier and also it is something that is a gameplay mechanic to learn. Sword is available before hitting 80; quickness herald has been putting out good results and while quickness scrapper has superspeed, herald has a faster attack rate. Alac renegade was the dominant alacrity provider before mechanist and even while playing DPS it is able to fill in boon gaps. Condi renegade has had consistent 37-40K benchmarks in PVE and generally respectable performance regardless of patch.

 

A very detailed response, I appreciate the feedback. I don't understand a lot of the terminology you used, but I think I can catch the drift. After my googling a lot of people have said that the rev isnt beginner friendly because of the energy system, and that it doesnt teach you the game correctly. Do you think that would be too much of an issue, or do you think that the Elite Specs make the class worth sticking with?

Edited December 18, 2022 by Cammy.7468

[Infusion.7149]

8 minutes ago, Cammy.7468 said:

A very detailed response, I appreciate the feedback. I don't understand a lot of the terminology you used, but I think I can catch the drift. After my googling a lot of people have said that the rev isnt beginner friendly because of the energy system, and that it doesnt teach you the game correctly. Do you think that would be too much of an issue, or do you think that the Elite Specs make the class worth sticking with?

If you meant to quote my followup post, revenant has been stable in PVE and in WVW.

Main things I think people new to the game might not understand:
* cleave = damage to other targets other than the one you have highlighted (i.e. how many targets a skill hits) , especially on autoattack
* CC = crowd control to break a defiance bar or breakbar , when this is broken the enemy does nothing and you gain a damage boost against it for 10 seconds (used to be 5 seconds)
* DoT = damage over time, typically a field or area effect

I would not second guess playing rev at all. If some people think energy is difficult then all you need to remember is that like thief initiative that it is a resource. Swap legends when you run out and 99% of the time all problems are alleviated.

On herald you technically don't even need to swap if you run the glint variant but you would not be running the spec optimally. Swapping legends on revenant should come as naturally as swapping weapons on other classes. The difference is the legends' skills actually do upkeep damage or boons generally speaking which means it is far easier to execute a high baseline damage.

See this example of being lazy by a low intensity build maker on this current patch:

and this older video by the content creator and Arenanet partner Mukluk (before recent buffs):

 

Many low intensity / easy builds don't provide any support to other players meaning they are only good in openworld. This is a decent build that actually works in some instanced content except where condition damage is favored (a few raids mainly). Full berserker stats also means you can easily swap to Vindicator for more cleave with Greatsword should you choose to. One experienced player on herald I saw doing the Snowman strike mission was only out damaged by a spellbreaker that was using a full skill rotation.

[Acanthus.8120]

Have you looked at Revenant? When leveling up, dual swords and staff are a lot of fun (hammer provides your range if you need it to be more versatile). When you get to elite specs, there are 3 distinct ways to play.

Firstly, you have the Herald for power damage and boon support/quickness (50% cast animation speed increase). It plays a lot like base Revenant aside from utilities. It also has the benefit of being able to spec into a toughness tank (it has both 2 blocks and a damage inversion to healing) or a healer, though with Centaur utilities and the salvation trait line, you can't provide boons while healing and you can't deal damage well if you don't take devastation (roughly 32.5% raw damage increases when the right conditions are met and increases power damage from might) or retribution (roughly 20% raw damage increases when right conditions are met and helps you take decreased damage), so it's not the best at healing. It can output large green numbers, however. Also, healing and damage are mutually exclusive due to needing the salvation traitline to heal in place of your choice of either Devastation or Retribution (Invocation is required for all builds). You can output passable (but not great) damage, tank, and provide boons by taking celestial stats and using the sword/shield and staff. The staff and shield do provide minor heal support by default.

Renegade is the second elite spec. It focuses primarily on conditions and grants you the only condi-based ranged weapon Revenant can get. Renegade also has the option to provide boons, though not nearly as well as Herald, by virtue of having access to alacrity (basically 20% cd reduction in functionality) on F4 when you take the grandmaster trait related to it. You need 75% boon duration to keep it up permanently. Aside from Alacrity, its buffs primarily affect itself instead of your whole squad. It's effective at using fury (which buffs your conditions with this build), might, and vigor. It can provide some might to allies. The conditions it uses are mostly bleeds, torment, and fire for damage. It also has multiple fire fields, which is one of the best combo fields in the game. This build excels with Ritualist stats if you're providing alacrity and can run Viper or Trailblazer if all you care about is damage. Viper is very squishy, however.

The last elite spec is Vindicator. I know the least about this build, but it is the selfish DPS build of the group. Vindicator focuses on power damage. It can get quickness, but it is a selfish one that is only provided to yourself. This class plays somewhat like Daredevil in that dodging is part of its rotation in doing damage and self-buffing. That's about where the similarities end though. It essentially has 2 legends in one (Alliance Tactics), but they have almost no synergy. Archemorus features high power damage, selfish buffs, and small amounts of conditions. Saint Viktor features group healing and group-wide defensive buffs. You would think, hey, maybe I can run it as a healer, right? Well no. Healers generally need to provide either group quickness or group alacrity to make up for their lack of damage (you give up 2 potential offensive stats for healing power and concentration), but your quickness is only for yourself. One thing Vindicator has going for it though is that it can hit much harder than the other two specs. In terms of DPS, it's not really ahead, but unlike the other two specs, it can burst enemies down.

 

Some example builds:
Herald: https://snowcrows.com/builds/revenant/herald/power-quickness-herald (I would not have the balls or skill to run this without a dedicated healer)

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?Pm1AYx7lpQHMLqhdROMM6hJSfsCKglvkfrE-zxIY1o+/MiQVluU1jPEx4Q61MhzNQFA-e

Renegade: http://en.gw2skills.net/editor/?Pm1AUlfltQHsNqhpROsM6hNSfMDKgjuk/TH-zRJYyR9fZkeV1RqK/DJA+rBE3WgKA-e

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?Pm1AUlfltQHsNqhpROsM6hNSfMDKgjuk/TF-zRJYmR9fZ0RqGSVJ8DJI+rJF3WgKA-e

Vindicator: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PmlAEJlZSHsUqhhSOsT6hpSfsSKgJ/lasD-zRRYihuMHVH6hRVVllqmPEx45PpCohCnWgKA-e

http://en.gw2skills.net/editor/?PmlAEJlZSHsUqhhSOsT6hpSfsSKgJ/lasD-zRZYihuAHVrv5QoBGGVVVWqa+QEjn/kKgGKcaBqA-e

Edited December 19, 2022 by Acanthus.8120

[Law D Dorma.9362]

Try Virtuoso ( condi ), not a lot of buttons to press, does great dmg, high survivability and regens. 

I use this one 

 

[Cuks.8241]

I would recomend revenant. The class is straightforward, without bloat albeit a bit unique but not complicated.  Very versatile and always in the meta. It just shreds while levling. 

If you go with power build sword/sword as the main weapon set and take shiro as one of the legends youll feel like a mobile assassin in heavy armour but with all the utilities rev can have. 

[WhimsicalPacifist.2943]

 

On 12/30/2022 at 2:18 PM, Cuks.8241 said:

I would recomend revenant. The class is straightforward, without bloat albeit a bit unique but not complicated.  Very versatile and always in the meta. It just shreds while levling. 

If you go with power build sword/sword as the main weapon set and take shiro as one of the legends youll feel like a mobile assassin in heavy armour but with all the utilities rev can have. 

Second Revenant.  It's the most similar for me compared to Assassin from GW1 with good mobility, more survivability and also great damage.  Only downer is the lack of a ranged weapon but the Renegade elite spec more than solves that problem.

 

It is the one class that I'm liking enough to buy another slot (I don't like Charr's running animation so just parking that toon on a jumping puzzle).

[draxynnic.3719]

I must admit to wondering if your gear might be an issue if you're having trouble killing veterans sufficiently quickly with guardian. With a low-level character, you should probably be focusing on power over condition damage if you want quick kills, while Purging Flames is more about condition damage and only really comes into its own later on. While you're leveling, what you probably want is to prioritise power first with your equipment for more base damage, then precision for more crits, then ferocity for more damage on crits. If you find that's a bit too fragile, you can try adding some defensive skills, or maybe mixing in some vitality for health.

Some thoughts:

With guardian, perhaps try sword/focus? Generally don't use F1 unless you have the Radiance traitline and something is about to die - elite specialisations get to do fancy things with F1, but with core, it's often better to just keep it on passive while you're still learning. Guardian has a pretty wide toolbox for dealing with different situations - Wall of Reflection can be hilarious against mobs that can't take what they give out.

Revenant is a good choice - possibly the best given your preferences. It's very good at killing a target, getting to another target, and killing that too - it's often been the profession I solo 'complete this within a limited time' achievements with. Most of its skills have a fairly rapid effect and hit hard. For leveling, I'd probably recommend sword/sword and hammer (hammer ain't great, but it's the ranged weapon that's available) while running Shiro and Jalis as legends. Later on, however, you have a lot of adaptability by changing your legends.

Warrior would also work - axe/axe is probably the best core set for snappy damage while leveling. Rifle for ranged is...well, it'll do the job while leveling. Warrior currently lacks some of the versatility and adaptability some other professions have, but power damage is something it's definitely good at.

Thief would definitely count. Can be a bit repetitive, since playstyle is often 'spam the best skill for the situation until the situation changes', but on the other hand, that can lead to some more complex decision-making then just going through a rotation. I'm not sure what the best option for leveling is - as long as you're not using shortbow against a single target, it's probably fine.

Ranger...hrrrmn. I'd probably go axe/warhorn and greatsword while leveling, although you could try sword/axe instead of greatsword. Maul on greatsword may be slow, but it hits hard. I found that the river drake was a good damage pet for leveling, especially if you get its breath bouncing between two targets, but that was a while ago - it might have changed since.

I wouldn't reject mesmer out of hand, either. You can get 2-3 clones out pretty quickly and shatter with sword (any offhand except torch) and greatsword, while also having decent damage coming out of the weapon directly. Mesmer is also known for having a lot of tricks up its sleeve in utility skills, so if you like having a toolbox of potentially tide-turning skills, it's up there with guardian and revenant.

Edited January 1, 2023 by draxynnic.3719
Minor clarifications to opening paragraph.

[ZeftheWicked.3076]

From where I stand you have two issues op, none of them being profession selection.

1. You're playing the wrong gamemode.

You belong in spvp, where facing human opponents forces you to be reactive and not just faceroll the same rotation over and over. And since being slow = being dead you can be sure any profession in there is played to it's fastest, most responsive variant.

2. You're not patient enough. 

Majority of your problems are simply "I did not do my homework" and "I stopped halfway" issues. Most professions are quite deep and offer varied playstyles by default. And are very powerful when used right. But that usually happens at level 80, when you've fully unlocked your traits and can buy/craft end game gear. A level 50 necro feels like a league of legends champion in terms of complexity. But a lvl 80 one has a ton of  build options and there's only more coming once you unlock e-specs from xpac.

This once again points to my earlier point - spvp is for you. There you're insta-leveled to 80 with all stuff unlocked. Ofc in the beginning you'll get destroyed, and ... well we all know what LoL is and what it does to your psyche. But it is your fast-ticket to getting what you want - fast paced, reactive combat and getting a full version of your character minute one. As a bonus, if you enjoy the experience, you'll farm lotsa tomes that will let you level up in PvE without having to do it's usual activities.

Edited January 1, 2023 by ZeftheWicked.3076

[draxynnic.3719]

Another observation:

Unless you really fall in love with the concept of a HoT elite specialisation, it might be better off to start with a PoF or EoD spec. The reason is that HoT specialisations unlock all the adept traits, then the masters, then the grandmasters, so it takes a while before you can set up any build using that elite without having holes in it. PoF and EoD specs, by contrast, unlock in rows, so you can have a completed row much faster, even though it still takes the same number of hero points to unlock all of the options.

[Kuma.1503]

Lets see. Quick. Snappy. Room for creativity. Dynamic combat. 

Might I recommend Holosmith?

 

You've got low cooldown mobility in photon forge. You can trait it into superspeed which is valuable in PvP/WvW. 

You can generate 100% quickness uptime when solo with minimal boon duration investment, and the forge attacks have real impact behind them without feeling sluggish. 

You can generate a lot of numbers on screen very quickly which is good for the dopamine receptors. 

The rotation isn't set in stone. You get more value out of learning how to properly manage your heat and prioritize your hardest hitting skills at high heat than you do out of memorizing a set rotation. This makes combat feel more dynamic and gives it a sort of ebb and flow. 

It's extremely versatile. Holo is an engineer spec, and engi is known for their jack of all trades nature and high versatility. You've got boon rip on throw mine, tons of crowd control to carry break bar phases, minor group support with heal turret and prime light arena, you can run a shield instead of pistol for a very minor DPS loss and gain more CC, a block, and a reflect. You function well in melee and at range thanks to your grenade kit. You can fire your grenades 360 degrees around you, meaning you can run away from a boss during a mechanic but maintain permenant dps uptime by tossing nades behind you. (This is also very strong in PvP). 

You can swap sword for rifle which gives you the ability to provide more AoE might, and immobilize mobs with net shot. (Immob is valuable CC in raids)

One potential downside... Engineer is one of the harder specs to get into when you really start to master it. Kits take some getting used to. There's a lot of combos to learn with them, and you'll eventually want to learn how to utilize combo fields/finishers to really get the most out of what this class has to offer. There's  a lot of pianoing involved with playing engineer.

Overall I reccomend it if you're looking for something with a lot of depth that will have you constantly learning new things about it years after you start playing it.