Warrior walk out

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

20 minutes ago, Delta.1074 said:

That is not how it works, it's still still 3x5 damage dealt, not 3x15.

If a new target becomes available and a previous target becomes unavailable each wave of Arc Divider will hit the new set of eligible targets up to the target cap of 5 per wave, this does not usually happen with 15 unique targets occurring, but that is how the skill works. It is possible to see more than 5 targets hit with the current version of the skill though on a regular basis.

 

See other comment Re: typo.

Edited June 15, 2023 by Lan Deathrider.5910

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

7 minutes ago, Jzaku.9765 said:

I sincerely hope for you that this is a typo. 

It is, still caffeinating. I'll go fix it.

 

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

7 minutes ago, DirtyDan.4759 said:

 

so what you are saying is 

3 x 5 = 3 x 15

See the above comment about the typo. Each wave can hit up to 5 targets with each wave checking for eligible targets, so it is possible to hit 15 unigue targets during the casting of the current skill. That is what JTG is pointing out when he is saying that the current Arc Divider is 3x better than what the new one would be. Azure is pointing out that the newer faster one will be more difficult to stow cancel to not whiff into blinds or blocks that get activated mid cast as well as the current one being useful expressly because the first wave will clear blinds and 1 shot blocks so that the rest of the skill does damage and activates traits. So, from a versatility viewpoint, and max possible damage delivered to an opposing set of targets it will be worse. It will be a large amount of damage in one AoE though, and will be the subject of a lot of QQ threads in the WvW forum just like Gunflame for the same reasons, but this change turns it into a meme rather than something truly useful.

[Delta.1074]

26 minutes ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

See the above comment about the typo. Each wave can hit up to 5 targets with each wave checking for eligible targets, so it is possible to hit 15 unigue targets during the casting of the current skill. That is what JTG is pointing out when he is saying that the current Arc Divider is 3x better than what the new one would be. Azure is pointing out that the newer faster one will be more difficult to stow cancel to not whiff into blinds or blocks that get activated mid cast as well as the current one being useful expressly because the first wave will clear blinds and 1 shot blocks so that the rest of the skill does damage and activates traits. So, from a versatility viewpoint, and max possible damage delivered to an opposing set of targets it will be worse. It will be a large amount of damage in one AoE though, and will be the subject of a lot of QQ threads in the WvW forum just like Gunflame for the same reasons, but this change turns it into a meme rather than something truly useful.

Yea but that is still not 3x15.

Sure you can hit up to 15 targets.

But you have 3 hits. That is still 3 * 5 which, who would've guessed, equals 15.

[Red Haired Savage.5430]

You're all also forgetting that Arc Divider currently it hits 3x for 1 casting  and from earning 10 adrenaline and hitting will strike 3x giving 3 adrenaline. So after the changes go live it'll only strike once shorting you adrenaline. Which I believe someone else pointed out GS isn't the best weapon for getting adrenaline. So how many Arc Dividers do you think you'll now get off in a berserk to make up for it only hitting 1/3 of what it previously hit? Especially with the blind spam we have to deal with.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

18 minutes ago, Delta.1074 said:

Yea but that is still not 3x15.

Sure you can hit up to 15 targets.

But you have 3 hits. That is still 3 * 5 which, who would've guessed, equals 15.

See previous comment.

[Jzaku.9765]

11 minutes ago, Red Haired Savage.5430 said:

You're all also forgetting that Arc Divider currently it hits 3x for 1 casting  and from earning 10 adrenaline and hitting will strike 3x giving 3 adrenaline. So after the changes go live it'll only strike once shorting you adrenaline. Which I believe someone else pointed out GS isn't the best weapon for getting adrenaline. So how many Arc Dividers do you think you'll now get off in a berserk to make up for it only hitting 1/3 of what it previously hit? Especially with the blind spam we have to deal with.

Burst skills do not (and have never) granted you adrenaline per strike unless provided externally by traits such as Axe Mastery or Furious. 

[Leo G.4501]

2 hours ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

What you are missing in what JTG is saying is that those 3 strikes can each end up hitting 5 different targets, for a total of 15 potential damage procs. That is where the 3x5 is coming from. The new Arc divider will not have that benefit.

I think the fixation on targets hit is irrelevant.

The point is, each swing has 5 potential hits for a total of 15 hits. This game has so many variables such as blind, evade, block and movement as well as on hit effects from buffs, skills, traits, sigils, ect. 

So new AD seems to have a numerical advantage in dps over time but loses in hits per activation and hits over time which could potentially have higher application proc on-hit effects. Back when we had retaliation, that was a potential negative...

[Grand Marshal.4098]

I'll say it once more.

Warrior will always be benefited by multi-hit skills, saying otherwise is crazy cope.

[Red Haired Savage.5430]

2 hours ago, Jzaku.9765 said:

Burst skills do not (and have never) granted you adrenaline per strike unless provided externally by traits such as Axe Mastery or Furious. 

I guess I've been playing spellbreaker too much. My main point I think still stands the current iteration gets a lot more bang for it's buck from 10 adrenaline than the proposed one.

[JTGuevara.9018]

11 hours ago, Jzaku.9765 said:

Once again you seem to be under the fundamental misunderstanding of either:

1) Not understanding that Arc Divider's listed damage mod is the total of all 3 hits

or 

2) Not understanding that damage dealt is directly proportional to the damage mod of the skill

 

Without correcting either of these fundamental misunderstandings of how the game works, we would just be talking straight past each other. For reference, Axe 5 (Whirling Axe) has a power mod of 4.47(WvW) over 15 hits. Please apply your Math to Whirling Axe and see if it continues to make remotely any sense.

No, I understand Arc Divider's damage modifier and how damage calculation works. Here's the damage formula from the wiki with a sample weapon strength of 1045, power of 1000 and target armor of 2300. The mods are pvp.

Old Arc Divider(total):  1045  x  1000  x  (2.112)  /  2300  =  2207040  /  2300  =  959.6

Old Arc Divider(per hit)  1045  x  1000  x  0.704  /  2300  =  735680  /  2300  =  319.9 (all you're doing is dividing by 3)

New Arc Divider(total): 1045  x  1000  x  (1.8)  /  2300  =  1881000  /  2300  =  817.8

Also, again. It doesn't matter whether you divide up the hits or get the total if the end-result is the same. Also, don't forget, you get only one strike.

 

[Red Haired Savage.5430]

3 hours ago, JTGuevara.9018 said:

No, I understand Arc Divider's damage modifier and how damage calculation works. Here's the damage formula from the wiki with a sample weapon strength of 1045, power of 1000 and target armor of 2300. The mods are pvp.

Old Arc Divider(total):  1045  x  1000  x  (2.112)  /  2300  =  2207040  /  2300  =  959.6

Old Arc Divider(per hit)  1045  x  1000  x  0.704  /  2300  =  735680  /  2300  =  319.9 (all you're doing is dividing by 3)

New Arc Divider(total): 1045  x  1000  x  (1.8)  /  2300  =  1881000  /  2300  =  817.8

Also, again. It doesn't matter whether you divide up the hits or get the total if the end-result is the same. Also, don't forget, you get only one strike.

 

And that one strike cost you adrenaline to get to use, and probably has a lot of traits riding on that 1 hit to connect.

[felix.2386]

9 hours ago, Grand Marshal.4098 said:

I'll say it once more.

Warrior will always be benefited by multi-hit skills, saying otherwise is crazy cope.

warrior will not benefit from hard stuck in long channel skills, sadly.

i'd be find if it's 0.8 second 3 hit skills.

sadly, long cast time is worse than having low hit count.

Edited June 16, 2023 by felix.2386

[Downstate.4697]

The faster animation is going to feel better in PvP and enable more interesting interactions such as head butt guaranteeing a hit or a 100 blades follow up.

[Warscythes.9307]

23 hours ago, JTGuevara.9018 said:

No, I understand Arc Divider's damage modifier and how damage calculation works. Here's the damage formula from the wiki with a sample weapon strength of 1045, power of 1000 and target armor of 2300. The mods are pvp.

Old Arc Divider(total):  1045  x  1000  x  (2.112)  /  2300  =  2207040  /  2300  =  959.6

Old Arc Divider(per hit)  1045  x  1000  x  0.704  /  2300  =  735680  /  2300  =  319.9 (all you're doing is dividing by 3)

New Arc Divider(total): 1045  x  1000  x  (1.8)  /  2300  =  1881000  /  2300  =  817.8

Also, again. It doesn't matter whether you divide up the hits or get the total if the end-result is the same. Also, don't forget, you get only one strike.

 

You do realize they reduced cast time too right. 

[JTGuevara.9018]

4 hours ago, Warscythes.9307 said:

You do realize they reduced cast time too right. 

Yes I do! Maybe it's the fact that one strike is faster than three. Just a thought....

[Cuks.8241]

Maybe a strange concept, you can follow it up with another ability 🤯

[UncouthTRex.4098]

9 minutes ago, Cuks.8241 said:

Maybe a strange concept, you can follow it up with another ability 🤯

Yeah like Hundred Blades, because it's really important to stand still in the middle of your mobility weapon rotation.

Unless they fix Greatswords' other damaging option (because outside of its auto, 3 and 5 are just meant to get you places and 4 is more of a utility), hamstringing Arc Divider into a one-burst high risk high reward skill just makes the whole weapon back into the barely functional hunk of junk it is on Core Warrior.

I suffered through that already man, DON'T KICK ME BACK DOWN THE STAIRS.

[Warscythes.9307]

1 hour ago, JTGuevara.9018 said:

Yes I do! Maybe it's the fact that one strike is faster than three. Just a thought....

Right, so why isn't that part of the math? If a skill has double the cast time of another, then you need to factor that in. Otherwise technically something like hundred blades would be one of the highest damage skill in the entire game and we both know that is not true.

Edited June 16, 2023 by Warscythes.9307