Physically Challenged having a Tough Time with Rise and Shrine

[Squid.1704]

@ANET,

     If anyone could please consider increasing the jump time of #32 for the Rise and Shrine Quest, the Mine Carts, that would be awesome.  I have just spent the better part of 4 hours trying to complete it and with the time frame and my shakey hands it just about impossible.  I HATE asking for stuff like this but if it isnt complicated I would appreciate it.  If not its all good.  Thanks for a great expac.

 

[Endilbiach.4132]

Yeah I'm gonna second this.  I don't have these kinds of problems but my spouse absolutely does, and even without those problems it still took me a good 5 attempts to actually succeed at it because of how little time it gives you.

In fact, can we please work on accessibility across the board?  How in the name of all the gods do we still not have a colorblind mode?

[DanAlcedo.3281]

Ohh man the minecart one was brutal.

Stick to the side? Nope. 

Stick to the rope above? Nope. 

Stand on the edge? Nope. 

This one I agree could be a bit more new player friendly. 

[Hesione.9412]

I support all the points here. For a number of us with permanent hand problems, perhaps not the people in this thread, the mastery points from getting gold on the flying adventures are unattainable. I have to stop, use my mouse to turn around, and then continue. I had counted on getting the mastery points from both shrine achievements, and at least one is not attainable for me.

Added to the hand problems, high ping makes this even more awful. I tried to do it by gliding, but my ping means that my "start gliding" and "stop gliding" may not be recognised by the server. I tried to do this one by gliding rather than flying. Some of the time, the server never registered that I was supposed to be gliding, and I ended up below my target. Other times it didn't register that I had input the instruction to stop gliding, and I glided straight past the target (and was then too low to stand on the cart).

Please stop creating activities, with mastery points, that are unreasonably difficult for certain players. We all like a challenge, but not one that is insurmountable.

[Remus Darkblight.1673]

As a completely able person this was the first one of these puzzles where I even realised there was a timer on the targets. It is markedly more difficult than any of the others.

To my mind it's more the awkwardness of the mount controls for Skyscale and its tendency to grab on to the oddest of angles when you don't want it to that make it tricky. The jumps just don't lend themselves to smooth traversal.

For all the complaints about things being made too easy or too difficult, this is one I think most would agree could do with giving more leniency for those less able. No one is going to boast about their ability to complete this puzzle, but some are certainly going to get frustrated with it. It's less a matter of "get good" and more one of "get it fixed".

[dbill.7483]

I haven't done this one but I know what you're going through. I also have arthritis and "shaky hands" and there are achievements/activities I just can't complete. So yes, I agree ANET should at least consider that some of these might be a bit too physically challenging some in the player base.

Yeah, I know "git gud" is the default answer from some. But the reality is that physical decline will not stop, so today is best I'll ever be.

[zeyeti.8347]

Had to do it 3 times in order to succeed , and i am kind of a player who like nervous gameplay but i understand this one can be "on the edge" for someone with "shakey" problems , i can give you an advice : i don't know if it will work but try (if you have ) the prototype position rewinder (https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Prototype_Position_Rewinder) and mark the position you are struggling to reach with it , once you are requested to go to this position use the rewinder to go immediately where you marked it , i don't know if it invalidates the success , but could give it a try . This thing also release easy mode for all puzzle jumps as it can act as a backup save point every 30 secs.

If it really doesnt go , you can mp me in the game i'll gladly take a mesmer and port you the position who seems to give you trouble with the good old portal strat. Same name as in the forum.

Edited September 4, 2023 by zeyeti.8347

[Xainou.1502]

Totally agree, this was the first fox chest so far that made me angry.

The timer is way too tight and the parts where you have to skyscale but your mount wants to cling to stuff needlessly instead, urgh. Not fun.

[SoftFootpaws.9134]

unfortunately despite arenanet being a progressive company, i don't feel like they've ever hired many disabled people. there's almost zero accessibility in the game, ranging from simple things like the buffs on your buff bar moving all around constantly, to lack of a colorblind mode.

 

they desparately need to hire an accessibility quality assurance lead.

Edited September 4, 2023 by SoftFootpaws.9134

[Galmac.4680]

Got this after several tries. You have to start on your feet, and glide, and the last two minecarts via skyscyle (mount off to have it count), then above on ground by raptor, and the following way is easy.

[sewenewes.4176]

3 hours ago, SoftFootpaws.9134 said:

unfortunately despite arenanet being a progressive company

They are only progressive when it comes to ticking checkboxes. Putting Taimi into the game required no more effort than putting in any other voiced character. Making the game accessible to disabled players, some of whom are suffering from symptoms much like Taimi's for example, requires not only more coding but a potential redesign of several existing systems. That's time and money that the ones in charge don't want to spare. Companies are not friends with their customers.

[GalenWolffit.3842]

On 9/3/2023 at 4:18 PM, Squid.1704 said:

@ANET,

     If anyone could please consider increasing the jump time of #32 for the Rise and Shrine Quest, the Mine Carts, that would be awesome.  I have just spent the better part of 4 hours trying to complete it and with the time frame and my shakey hands it just about impossible.  I HATE asking for stuff like this but if it isnt complicated I would appreciate it.  If not its all good.  Thanks for a great expac.

 

Agree, that and one other have too short a timeout, given distance, change in elevation, and obstacles.  If they were full on jumping puzzles maybe, but for shrine guardians shouldn't be so tight.

[Hesione.9412]

6 hours ago, Galmac.4680 said:

Got this after several tries. You have to start on your feet, and glide, and the last two minecarts via skyscyle (mount off to have it count), then above on ground by raptor, and the following way is easy.

This is a thread talking about how hard this part of an achievement is for people with hand disabilities. Your suggested method, which includes multiple mode (glide, mount 1, mount 2) changes, isn't a low intensity approach to this problem.

[Hesione.9412]

If Anet don't want to change the timers, I suggest either:

1. only needing to do 33 out of the 35 and/or
2. removing the problem ones entirely from the list (perhaps keep them in as Easter eggs)

I'm happy with either.

[LesserHellspawn.3160]

The carts could do with a little wider area to count per cart. I've managed to finally do it in the 10th try or so, but it was kitten hard. One error with the skyscale, and it takes too long to get it moving into a new direction.

I have completely given up on #35 though, the very last. I never get the second pillar. The skyscale always clings to it instead of getting on top of it, and by the time I've launched into the air and convinced the Skyscale to go down with C, time runs out. I've tried this one so many times that I ragequit it. I've completed my masteries with other options. Thankfully we only need 58/65 mastery points to get them all. I sincerely hope I don't have to revisit this with the new mastery coming in the second update.

[Manasa Devi.7958]

Yep #35 gave me the same kind of trouble. I eventually thought of the position rewinder and that got it done.

[Dreggon.6598]

Hey I made a video this which will hopefully help anybody struggling, especially if you have a disability. I don't know for sure that it will help, but I found the warclaw jump to be the perfect distance. Please let me know if this is useful to you.

 

[Zok.4956]

Here is my way how I finally made it. I've tried to use the Sykscale as little as possible because it keeps getting stuck somewhere and then the circle doesn't register. And because the Skyscale is so sluggish, time is running out quickly.

I found gliding much more relaxed and precise.

#1,#2,#3 (top row) gliding, then gliding and dropping to first cart in bottom row (#4), gliding to #5, gliding (with Jade Bot Glide Booster to increase height) to #6, then mount skyscale and fly to #7, at/above #7 dismount immediately (so it counts and skyscale clinging is ignored), then gliding to the cliff (#8), running to #9 and then gliding and falling down to the last cart #10.

This isn't really "low intensity" but to me it was significantly lower intensity than my Skyscale experiments. So maybe it will help some others.

Edited September 6, 2023 by Zok.4956

[zeyeti.8347]

On 9/4/2023 at 8:45 PM, SoftFootpaws.9134 said:

unfortunately despite arenanet being a progressive company, i don't feel like they've ever hired many disabled people. there's almost zero accessibility in the game, ranging from simple things like the buffs on your buff bar moving all around constantly, to lack of a colorblind mode.

 

they desparately need to hire an accessibility quality assurance lead.

Maybe the game can make some "disable" person having trouble on precise content , but 0 accesssibility ? really ? the power and condi creep is now like every class who plays to deal damage  do it with +25+30% more efficiency , the hp of all mobs haven't change , proof : just do a kryptis rift in an old map like Orr , and compare the hp of your vet undead vs a normal kryptis , the vet has less hp than the normal kryptis.

I don't know what you want but the open world combat style is pretty easy enough , you have ofc some classes who aren't suited for open world like berserker ele with sword , but there is a fair enough amount of accessible builds with pretty easy gear to have who require a very low apm , just play power mecha with rifle , the thing burst trough mobs like butter and is freaking easy to play .

As for having a disabled person in their company , i am for recruiting the most skilled worker , not pushing up a freaking agenda or quotas ... , if you have a guy in a wheelchair but this guy can speak binary and eat net codes for breakfast , well you recruit him because he will be an asset for your company , you do not recruit him because "heh , take him he is in a wheelchair , that will be more 'inclusive' and give our company a good picture" that kind of nonsense is literally utter disrespect to that person to me , because you use a person disability to earn something , you should use his skills instead , stop pointing out the disability and point out that person skills !

You are free to think what you will , but this is how you sink a company , because your company is now flooded with incompetency because you cared more about having diversity over efficiency.

Edited September 6, 2023 by zeyeti.8347

[TheNecrosanct.4028]

31 minutes ago, zeyeti.8347 said:

As for having a disabled person in their company , i am for recruiting the most skilled worker , not pushing up a freaking agenda or quotas ... , if you have a guy in a wheelchair but this guy can speak binary and eat net codes for breakfast , well you recruit him because he will be an asset for your company , you do not recruit him because "heh , take him he is in a wheelchair , that will be more 'inclusive' and give our company a good picture" that kind of nonsense is literally utter disrespect to that person to me , because you use a person disability to earn something , you should use his skills instead , stop pointing out the disability and point out that person skills !

You are free to think what you will , but this is how you sink a company , because your company is now flooded with incompetency because you cared more about having diversity over efficiency.

Nice try. It seems someone touched a nerve there. 🙄

Nobody was talking about agendas or quota. Just that it's obvious they don't have (m)any disabled people employed who can catch these inaccessibility issues for disabled people. This wasn't about employment inclusivity. This "accessibility quality assurance lead" SoftFootPaws was talking about doesn't even have to be a disabled person. They just need awareness of how disability can impact player experience.

You can stop pointing out a person's disability but that doesn't make it go away. It will still impact their life. But it's always easy to look away or say it doesn't matter when it doesn't impact you personally. Yes, you don't treat a person any which way based on a disability, but you also don't ignore said disability. It's like the whole "I don't see color" argument. It's unbearably naïve.

[zeyeti.8347]

46 minutes ago, TheNecrosanct.4028 said:

Nice try. It seems someone touched a nerve there. 🙄

Nobody was talking about agendas or quota. Just that it's obvious they don't have (m)any disabled people employed who can catch these inaccessibility issues for disabled people. This wasn't about employment inclusivity. This "accessibility quality assurance lead" SoftFootPaws was talking about doesn't even have to be a disabled person. They just need awareness of how disability can impact player experience.

You can stop pointing out a person's disability but that doesn't make it go away. It will still impact their life. But it's always easy to look away or say it doesn't matter when it doesn't impact you personally. Yes, you don't treat a person any which way based on a disability, but you also don't ignore said disability. It's like the whole "I don't see color" argument. It's unbearably naïve.

Thats true , i may be a bit overstepped there , but the zero accessibility and the boon + condi buffs bar changing ( while i agree with the colour blind mode lacking ) got me a bit triggered , this boon and condi are a very condensed mechanicbundle all grouped together for easy reading , example : confusion is every curse in gw 1 who is like "take x damage when you do Y" .I mean the game in open world is fairly easy , they are some thinks like puzzle jumps who can get tricky for some persons , but what can you do about that ? put a checkpoint every 100 m , anet did this on many puzzle jump , also the game need to keep a fairly nervous combat , cause it gameplays involve that .

this is why i asked if the people needed help while utilisng all mechanics of the game. For example i had several players in my guild who were literally unable to do mad king puzzle jump , they have no disabilities at all , just unable to do it properly , i gave them the option to share their account and did the puzzle for them , what would be the other solution ? slow down the puzzle green area rising so everyone else experience is baffled ? Some changes can be made , but the whole game cannot just adapt to every disability , but again yeah , i am a bit perplex about the colour blind option lacking in the game as it shouldn't be very difficult to add.

So ok we can end the subject about inclusive and quotas who was , i admit , not necessary (my bad) and focus on helping , bringing a solution and not blaming anet for being not so "disable" friendly , which i don't agree personnaly.

[Tuna Bandit.3786]

As someone that also deals with hand issues, I did this on griffon myself. Plus I use mouse steer so I can control more gently.

With WASD I too easely mess up due to my hands. 

[Manasa Devi.7958]

1 hour ago, zeyeti.8347 said:

Thats true , i may be a bit overstepped there , but the zero accessibility and the boon + condi buffs bar changing ( while i agree with the colour blind mode lacking ) got me a bit triggered , this boon and condi are a very condensed mechanicbundle all grouped together for easy reading , example : confusion is every curse in gw 1 who is like "take x damage when you do Y" .

I've had times when doing new content and being confronted with new mechanics for the first time that I had serious problems doing a mouseover on an icon I hadn't seen before, because boons/conditions being applied and expiring all the time kept the icon dancing around. When you're acquainted with everything that appears, there's no issue, because you recognize every icon, but it can be seriously irritating when something you're trying to read jumps out from under your cursor all the time.

[Sobx.1758]

On 9/5/2023 at 3:25 AM, Hesione.9412 said:

This is a thread talking about how hard this part of an achievement is for people with hand disabilities. Your suggested method, which includes multiple mode (glide, mount 1, mount 2) changes, isn't a low intensity approach to this problem.

Did it on my first try (just went there because of this thread) by using gliding on the first row of the carts + down to the row below, then mounted skyscale to get through the last 2 carts and remained on skyscale until the end. Latched onto 0 things, didn't juggle between mounts at all. I'd say give it another try.

Edited September 6, 2023 by Sobx.1758

[zeyeti.8347]

45 minutes ago, Manasa Devi.7958 said:

I've had times when doing new content and being confronted with new mechanics for the first time that I had serious problems doing a mouseover on an icon I hadn't seen before, because boons/conditions being applied and expiring all the time kept the icon dancing around. When you're acquainted with everything that appears, there's no issue, because you recognize every icon, but it can be seriously irritating when something you're trying to read jumps out from under your cursor all the time.

When i confront that kind of stuff i just spam "print screen" and hope to get a glimpse of it , but yeah those unique effect should be on a separate "boon" line.