ANet, please bring back player character pronouns

[DancingShadow.5689]

32 minutes ago, babana.7521 said:

That is all I am going to say about this, it's a risky thing to touch ..... slowly back away from the topic.

Yes it is risky and it shouldn't be. If none of us talk about what we like/dislike about new content, nothing will change and ANet will just do whatever, so I'd say it's better people talk about it, no matter how risky the topic

Edited September 5, 2023 by DancingShadow.5689

[Kiki.9450]

Adding my 2¢ to this...

I'd prefer to keep referring to my character by he/him because that's what we've been doing for the past ten years. It was jarring to suddenly be they/them. It's a matter of consistency. 

If we can't be consistent in pronoun usage, then please avoid pronouns all together.

[Morvran.8265]

16 hours ago, Xelqypla.6817 said:

Keep it as "they".

I don't really care, but it probably saves time and money.

Remove voice acting and bring back he/she, saves even more money so everyone is happy, right?

[Morvran.8265]

10 hours ago, kharmin.7683 said:

I highly doubt that Anet decided to do this on purpose because of current events.

Yes, this is an isolated case. Just like the previous 54 isolated cases /s

[Kiki.9450]

29 minutes ago, Morvran.8265 said:

Remove voice acting and bring back he/she, saves even more money so everyone is happy, right?

This sounds like an awful idea. The amount of voice over in this game is one of those things that helps it stand out in a sea of "high fantasy-themed WoW-ish MMOs." 

[Balsa.3951]

plot twist non of our chars has a gender 

we are all not equipped down there if u know whay i mean wink wink

anyhow anet should close this threat its getting ridiculous ppl fighting for the gender of their pixels

Edited September 5, 2023 by Balsa.3951

[nosleepdemon.1368]

Felt pretty weird to me too, it's a bit jarring. I had chalked it down to ANet being accurate to Sylvari, as I am playing a Sylvari female (IIRC, Sylvari are technically neither male nor female? Might be wrong). Knowing ANet's stance on these things AND the ... less shall we say, 'in your face'ness of said things in the new expansion, I am going to assume 'they' was thrown in there as a middle finger to whoever told them to stop flipping writing teenage drama queen characters all the time ;).

[Tiviana.2650]

It was pretty weird when zojja calls me they, then in the next scene calls Dagda her, seems odd and disjointed. Its like im a non entity.

[Tiviana.2650]

9 hours ago, phandaria.4891 said:

Unknown... Mursaat?: Traveling through the Mists can be taxing on the mind.

Not Taimi: They've got experience with this kind of thing. You'll pull through, huh?

Not Taimi: Hi there, Commander. Been a while.

Burly Norn: We need to keep moving, Zojja. How's your friend doing?

Zojja: They're fine, they're fine! Little rift-lagged, is all.

<Character name>: Rift-lagged... and... Zojja? What are you doing here?

Dagda: You brought the Harbinger? To kill me...?

Zojja: They're here to help! They're a friend!

Dagda: They're here to end me, as they've ended so many others.

I see, these are the excerpts of what you mentioned. In my opinion, I still feel this is a cost cutting/content cutting measure, whereas they don't need to include multiple voice lines to differentiate he/she. These lines were so easily missed and not in your face like Yao. Either way your feedback is valid and Arenanet could make changes to it.

At least, it is possible to change the script to exclude any politicized pronoun. For example:

They're fine => Should be fine.

They're here to help! They're a friend! They're here to end me as they've ended so many others => We're here to help! We're allies! You are here to end me, like all the others you have slain.

Frode: Commander, over here.

Uenno: Ah. They are taller than I thought.

Frode: Commander, Uenno. One of our oldest members.

 

That just dont sound right when speaking about someone in their presence. Should say she /he is taller than i thought, but yet when talking to or about the npc's its she /he/ him /her. I have never been addressed this way in my life and frankly its odd. 

Edited September 5, 2023 by Tiviana.2650

[Tiviana.2650]

8 hours ago, Xelqypla.6817 said:

Singular they/them has often been used when a gender is unknown, since "it" refers to an object. At least since the 1800's, but probably longer. Many games used it prior to non-binary being a consideration.

But the point is its not an unknown im standing there right in the npcs face being introduced. They has always been used as a plural to a group of 2 or more people. If im being introduced to someone and im standing there and the person introduces me as a they, how awkward is that? I will  be looking around and asking the person...who are they? Its pretty obvious its a political move, and i hate real world politics in games. i play to escape the real world tyvm.

Edited September 5, 2023 by Tiviana.2650

[Parasite.5389]

so this is the new hot topic right now in gaming, huh?
first people blowing up about Starfield giving people the options; and now GW2 (saving time by not having to record multiple takes of the same voiceline) removing the option.

people need to find a hobby

[Funky.4861]

I agree with the OP. It sounded and felt strange to be non-gendered (even male and female sylvari have the appropriate parts in the lore). Zojja has met us before several times, there is no excuse to refer to our avatar as 'they' when she knows we are male or female. I don't have an issue with having an nb or agender option at char creation, just don't force it on the rest of us.

[DancingShadow.5689]

13 minutes ago, Parasite.5389 said:

so this is the new hot topic right now in gaming, huh?
first people blowing up about Starfield giving people the options; and now GW2 (saving time by not having to record multiple takes of the same voiceline) removing the option.

people need to find a hobby

We do have a hobby, it's called Guild Wars 2. And we aren't 'blowing up', simply expressing our disliking of a change in our hobby hoping ANet will take our feedback into account when making future content

[Kiki.9450]

The way I'm seeing it, it's like if Anet suddenly decided to retcon Zojja into being a norn... But just for SotO. You could go back to the personal story and HoT and replay it and still see asura Zojja, but when you play SotO suddenly she'd be a norn. No in-game explanation, just the expectation that she has always been this way. It makes no sense.

I hope this perspective helps some of them "big deal it's just pronouns" folk. It's not about the pronouns per se, it's about consistency with what was written prior over the last decade.

[Peregrine Falcon.5496]

In a week ask yourselves "If pronouns aren't a big deal then why did they delete this thread?"

[Parasite.5389]

19 minutes ago, Peregrine Falcon.5496 said:

In a week ask yourselves "If pronouns aren't a big deal then why did they delete this thread?"

they deleted the thread people people were getting super aggressive, off-topic, and salty on both sides

[DancingShadow.5689]

5 minutes ago, Parasite.5389 said:

they deleted the thread people people were getting super aggressive, off-topic, and salty on both sides

I'm trying to keep am eye on it and mediate so that it stays up, but keep it civil. This is something that needs to be said and getting needlessly emotional won't convey it well.

[DreamyAbaddon.3265]

1 hour ago, Parasite.5389 said:

so this is the new hot topic right now in gaming, huh?
first people blowing up about Starfield giving people the options; and now GW2 (saving time by not having to record multiple takes of the same voiceline) removing the option.

people need to find a hobby

Starfield case is completely different. At least in that game you have an OPTION to choose your pronouns.

In GW2, your pronoun is whatever sex you choose when creating your character and many of us who are binary would prefer to remain that way for our characters in order to not break our immersion and to remain consistent throughout the story we play... I don't want my female or male characters to be referred to as they/them. Not having the option to opt-out is a problem.

[DreamyAbaddon.3265]

2 hours ago, Tiviana.2650 said:

But the point is its not an unknown im standing there right in the npcs face being introduced. They has always been used as a plural to a group of 2 or more people. If im being introduced to someone and im standing there and the person introduces me as a they, how awkward is that? I will  be looking around and asking the person...who are they? Its pretty obvious its a political move, and i hate real world politics in games. i play to escape the real world tyvm.

The biggest issue I have when using non-standard pronouns or using standard pronouns like they/them in a non-standard way is that when used, it feels like broken English to me which completely breaks my immersion and adds element of confusion. This is why I dislike it when characters refer to me as they/them/it  etc. I think having options to choose pronouns is fine as long as it's optional. Otherwise, standard pronouns and usage should be more than enough as a default to tell a story while keeping everything consistent.

[Xelqypla.6817]

4 hours ago, Tiviana.2650 said:

But the point is its not an unknown im standing there right in the npcs face being introduced. They has always been used as a plural to a group of 2 or more people. If im being introduced to someone and im standing there and the person introduces me as a they, how awkward is that? I will  be looking around and asking the person...who are they? Its pretty obvious its a political move, and i hate real world politics in games. i play to escape the real world tyvm.

The actual context of my statement was about how singular They/Them is NOT broken English. It's standard and has been used in that way for literal centuries. You don't need to take my word for it; you have the entire internet to browse.

When games started letting you choose your gender, they used the singular they/them so the game wouldn't need to check your gender, nor would they need to spend time adding in more dialog just for gender. No one gave a flying fig newton. Most of us still don't give a flying fig newton.

When I say "unknown" I mean in a game setting, as it used to be. Back before anyone cared.

I have two problems now:

1. People are whining, in thread after thread, about how Anet is being cheap on everything EXCEPT this, which is somehow ONLY a political thing.

2. The people quibbling over not using pronouns now because "Politics!" are opening the door for more than just he/she. What's good for the goose is good for the gander; If you get your pronouns, it's only fair that everyone gets their pronouns too.

The fantasy game is a fantasy. Any connection to the real world is irrelevant. Even if Anet wants to shoehorn in everything I am against politically... it's still just a fantasy and has no affect irl.

[DancingShadow.5689]

26 minutes ago, Xelqypla.6817 said:

When games started letting you choose your gender, they used the singular they/them so the game wouldn't need to check your gender, nor would they need to spend time adding in more dialog just for gender. No one gave a flying fig newton. Most of us still don't give a flying fig newton.

I have two problems now:

1. People are whining, in thread after thread, about how Anet is being cheap on everything EXCEPT this, which is somehow ONLY a political thing.

2. The people quibbling over not using pronouns now because "Politics!" are opening the door for more than just he/she. What's good for the goose is good for the gander; If you get your pronouns, it's only fair that everyone gets their pronouns too.

The fantasy game is a fantasy. Any connection to the real world is irrelevant. Even if Anet wants to shoehorn in everything I am against politically... it's still just a fantasy and has no affect irl.

If it was always they/them, no one would care, not even me... but it wasn't. For 10 years. The real problem here is continuity. They/them could be added as choosable pronouns, but 10 years of story just wouldn't include it. They can start only reffering to us as they and it'll break the immersion of many of those who paly the story chronologically.

The best solution would probably be for ANet to stop cutting corners already and just keep it as it was since literally no one complained about it and it was actually a plus for the game. Hopefully at least whatever comes after SotO will do so or something like it.

Edited September 5, 2023 by DancingShadow.5689

[rune.9572]

Best part of this thread is people collectively hallucinating that the player character ever had pronouns, instead of having been referred to as "commander", "valiant", "sapling", "krewe", "cub" etc. for the last 10 years. 🤡

QQ more.

Edited September 6, 2023 by rune.9572

[AlenaVolkova.8179]

They should address me as Commander as usual, not they, how dare they reduce my position in Tyria after I averted so many end time scenario like every player does?

[Kiki.9450]

46 minutes ago, rune.9572 said:

Best part of this thread is people collectively hallucinating that the player character ever had pronouns, instead of having been referred to as "commander", "valiant", "sapling", "krewe", "cub" etc. for the last 10 years. 🤡

QQ more.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/The_Departing

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shining_Blade_Secrets

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/The_Machine

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Deep_Trouble_(story)

Here's a handful. I'm sure there's others. These examples span from LWS2 all the way to Gyala Delves.

Yes, these really were recorded differently for males and for females. They didn't take shortcuts previously.

[nosleepdemon.1368]

28 minutes ago, AlenaVolkova.8179 said:

They should address me as Commander as usual, not they, how dare they reduce my position in Tyria after I averted so many end time scenario like every player does?

Honestly that was part of it, too. Like, how *dare* THEY. Those jerks.