Do raids need easy/normal/hard difficulty mode? [merged]

[Brynioch.1873]

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@nia.4725 said:Do you really feel entitled to have a full easy mode game?

Yes!

We come to this game for an all easymode game! That's why we aren't playing a hard mode game. If we wanted hard mode, we'd be playing something else! Having a game that is 99% one thing and then 1% another is the worst, because it means that people who enjoy most of the game have some portion forever closed off to them. This is why we need an easy mode, so that 100% of the game is open to those who enjoy most of it.

This game was never advertised as full easy mode nor will it ever be full easy mode. There ist noone to blame other than yourself for your wrong expectations.Also there are people that enjoy this game in general, not just the harder parts.Also we would need full ai WvW and sPvP otherwise there are still things you couldn't enjoy. So either bei consequent and stop the cherry picking or stop it.

[Voltekka.2375]

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@"nia.4725" said:

entitled

adjective UK ​ /ɪnˈtaɪ.təld/ /ɪnˈtaɪ.t̬əld/ disapproving​feeling that you have the right to do or have what you want without having to work for it or deserve it, just because of who you are:

Is the 100% of the game open for me, that I don't enjoy casual "do whatever" playing? Should anet do a hard mode of every content in the game? No?

The whole "entitled" meme really needs to go, or at least apply it accurately to raiders who feel that they are uniquely entitled to everything the devs have attached to raids.

@Feanor.2358 said:So play the easy mode. It's 95% of all the content. Is the existence of those 5% for others such a big problem so you cannot possibly let them have it?

I would if they would add it, which is my point in being here. There is other content, but it is not an easy mode raid, so it's entirely irrelevant to this discussion. I have no problem with raiders having their hard mode versions, so long as easy mode versions also exist for everyone else.

The entitlement meme will go away till you realise what it means, and when you stop projecting your own faults into others. Raid content is there, in its current forum with its current rewards. YOU ask for free shinies. Oh man. It is really not hard to understand.

[Feanor.2358]

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@"nia.4725" said:

entitled

adjective UK ​ /ɪnˈtaɪ.təld/ /ɪnˈtaɪ.t̬əld/ disapproving​feeling that you have the right to do or have what you want without having to work for it or deserve it, just because of who you are:

Is the 100% of the game open for me, that I don't enjoy casual "do whatever" playing? Should anet do a hard mode of every content in the game? No?

The whole "entitled" meme really needs to go, or at least apply it accurately to raiders who feel that they are uniquely entitled to everything the devs have attached to raids.

@"Feanor.2358" said:So play the easy mode. It's 95% of all the content. Is the existence of those 5% for others such a big problem so you cannot possibly let them have it?

I would if they would add it, which is my point in being here. There is other content, but it is not an easy mode raid, so it's entirely irrelevant to this discussion. I have no problem with raiders having their hard mode versions, so long as easy mode versions also exist for everyone else.

Raid, by definition, is not "easy mode". If you want something easy that requires participation of many players, you're wrong, the game is literally full of it - from group dynamic events, through metas, to world bosses.

[nia.4725]

@Feanor.2358 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@"nia.4725" said:

entitled

adjective UK ​ /ɪnˈtaɪ.təld/ /ɪnˈtaɪ.t̬əld/ disapproving​feeling that you have the right to do or have what you want without having to work for it or deserve it, just because of who you are:

Is the 100% of the game open for me, that I don't enjoy casual "do whatever" playing? Should anet do a hard mode of every content in the game? No?

The whole "entitled" meme really needs to go, or at least apply it accurately to raiders who feel that they are uniquely entitled to everything the devs have attached to raids.

@Feanor.2358 said:So play the easy mode. It's 95% of all the content. Is the existence of those 5% for others such a big problem so you cannot possibly let them have it?

I would if they would add it, which is my point in being here. There is other content, but it is not an easy mode raid, so it's entirely irrelevant to this discussion. I have no problem with raiders having their hard mode versions, so long as easy mode versions also exist for everyone else.

Raid, by definition, is not "easy mode". If you want something easy that requires participation of many players, you're wrong, the game is literally

full

of it - from group dynamic events, through metas, to world bosses.

But that won't give him the shiny, special effects Envoy armor. Feelsbadman.

[Ohoni.6057]

@Miellyn.6847 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@nia.4725 said:Do you really feel entitled to have a full easy mode game?

Yes!

We come to this game for an all easymode game! That's why we aren't playing a hard mode game. If we wanted hard mode, we'd be playing something else! Having a game that is 99% one thing and then 1% another is the worst, because it means that people who enjoy most of the game have some portion forever closed off to them. This is why we need an easy mode, so that 100% of the game is open to those who enjoy most of it.

This game was never advertised as full easy mode nor will it ever be full easy mode. There ist noone to blame other than yourself for your wrong expectations.Also there are people that enjoy this game in general, not just the harder parts.Also we would need full ai WvW and sPvP otherwise there are still things you couldn't enjoy. So either bei consequent and stop the cherry picking or stop it.

Regardless of how the game was originally advertised, I played GW2 for three years withiout any raids, and with the reasonable expectation that they would not go in that direction. I don't know how this confuses people.

@"Feanor.2358" said:Raid, by definition, is not "easy mode".

Easy mode raids are. Many games with raid content have easy mode versions of it. "You are aware of this," I say with zero question marks invovled.

If you want something easy that requires participation of many players, you're wrong, the game is literally full of it - from group dynamic events, through metas, to world bosses.

Yes, but those are not raid content and do not offer raid rewards, so they are irrelevant to the topic at hand.

@nia.4725 said:But that won't give him the shiny, special effects Envoy armor. Feelsbadman.

Exactly!

[Sephylon.4938]

@Miellyn.6847 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@nia.4725 said:Do you really feel entitled to have a full easy mode game?

Yes!

We come to this game for an all easymode game! That's why we aren't playing a hard mode game. If we wanted hard mode, we'd be playing something else! Having a game that is 99% one thing and then 1% another is the worst, because it means that people who enjoy most of the game have some portion forever closed off to them. This is why we need an easy mode, so that 100% of the game is open to those who enjoy most of it.

Also we would need full ai WvW and sPvP otherwise

He did ask for an ai pvp at 1 point

[Brynioch.1873]

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Miellyn.6847 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@nia.4725 said:Do you really feel entitled to have a full easy mode game?

Yes!

We come to this game for an all easymode game! That's why we aren't playing a hard mode game. If we wanted hard mode, we'd be playing something else! Having a game that is 99% one thing and then 1% another is the worst, because it means that people who enjoy most of the game have some portion forever closed off to them. This is why we need an easy mode, so that 100% of the game is open to those who enjoy most of it.

This game was never advertised as full easy mode nor will it ever be full easy mode. There ist noone to blame other than yourself for your wrong expectations.Also there are people that enjoy this game in general, not just the harder parts.Also we would need full ai WvW and sPvP otherwise there are still things you couldn't enjoy. So either bei consequent and stop the cherry picking or stop it.

Regardless of how the game was originally advertised, I played GW2 for three years withiout any raids, and with the reasonable expectation that they would not go in that direction. I don't know how this confuses people.But only if you tried really hard to ignore it. Raids were announced 2.5 years after release. Aetherpath, Triple Trouble, Tequatl rework, fractals, the statements before launch, LS2, some of the LS1 group events were way harder than the rest of the game. Even Orr at release indicated this game was never supposed to be all easy. All indicated ArenaNet planned something with raid like difficulty and tried to raise the difficulty in general. You tried to ignore it and forced your own expectations onto reality and it didn't work. Still noone other to blame than yourself.

@"Feanor.2358" said:Raid, by definition, is not "easy mode".

Easy mode raids are. Many games with raid content have easy mode versions of it. "You are aware of this," I say with zero question marks invovled.Those many games also focus on said raid mode instead of GW2 were it is side content. Also something you desperately want to ignore.@Sephylon.4938 said:

@Miellyn.6847 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@nia.4725 said:Do you really feel entitled to have a full easy mode game?

Yes!

We come to this game for an all easymode game! That's why we aren't playing a hard mode game. If we wanted hard mode, we'd be playing something else! Having a game that is 99% one thing and then 1% another is the worst, because it means that people who enjoy most of the game have some portion forever closed off to them. This is why we need an easy mode, so that 100% of the game is open to those who enjoy most of it.

Also we would need full ai WvW and sPvP otherwise

He did ask for an ai pvp at 1 point

He also tried for an easier ascension and the PvP community shot him down. But theres matchmaking and no manual groups so you can get it eventually without getting kicked from most groups.

[mortrialus.3062]

I'm going to cross post this message I made back when the first Easy Mode discussion popped up on the new forum."This is a debate I've been hearing since Vanilla World of Warcraft added Molten Core. I heard these arguments after Dark Souls became a smash success. And now I'm hearing it with GW2. Easy mode in raids would absolutely be unhealthy for GW2.

I've only started raiding in GW2 relatively recently. I joined a guild that advertised raid training and I really wanted that experience. For a long time, I didn't have a real guild outside of a couple of real life friends I played with. GW2 was for a long time a game that was actually pretty easy to mostly play on your own. And when Raids came out and I started getting really into the game again I really wanted to be a dedicated raider. About a couple of months ago I pulled the trigger and joined a raiding guild and I’ve never been happier playing the game.

And what makes raids appealing is the fact that they are exclusionary. More specifically, what makes raids appealing to me is the fact that I can be (And was for quite sometime) excluded from them because of the difficulty. I couldn't just solo my way through them or even reliably pug it. It was the same thing with Raiding in World of Warcraft. It was a very similar thing with Demon’s Souls and Dark Souls. The fact that there is real risk that I can’t see the content is what makes the content exciting. It creates a sense of danger, anticipation, and a sense of accomplishment that you just can’t get otherwise. Even if there was an easy mode, and I never ever touched the easy mode and just did the hardmode, the fact that it's possible for me to hit a switch and see all the content removes all the tension and danger and fear of failure.

I’ve never cared to get the achievement Migraine. Because I’ve already killed Mordremoth. I already know how that fight goes down. There’s just no interest in doing it for me. I’ve seen it all before. If Raids had an easy mode that I could have steamrolled, I would have 0 interest in doing them anymore. And I certainly wouldn’t have joined a raiding guild and become a part of a community. I have more more friends and people I play with in game because the exclusionary nature of raids forced me to finally stop being a loner and find and join other like minded players.

Regarding the story, Deimos isn’t that interesting of a character because of his dialogue or his character arc. He’s interesting explicitly because he is incredibly difficulty and the mechanics of his fight. He’s incredibly threatening and extremely intimidating because he’s hard. If there was an easy mode players could just steamroll or a story mode then Deimos losing a huge part of his character. Without that, there’s little more to him than being a weird demon we’ve never seen before that’s mean to Saul. That’s it. Matthias would be a weird crazy mage and that's it. Xera would be a Mesmer you fight in a trippy arena and that's it. They'd be like Zhaitan or the Primordus / Balthazar encounter in Flashpoint. Cinematic fights with interesting things visually, but ultimately huge jokes. Their difficulty, the time players have had to spend mastering their fights, have actually manage to give these raid characters actual character. I'm always going to remember Matthias and Slothazor and Xera and Deimos. I couldn't tell you any of the named white mantle boss's names from Living World Season 3 aside from Caudecus himself. Because the difficulty makes the story and writing shine.

It was the same thing with WoW and Dark Souls. Ragnaros was only interesting and iconic because he was hard and it took so much work and group effort to fight and defeat him(Over at least a month if the guild is starting from scratch like mine did to get someone the reputation with the Hydraxian Waterlords high enough to fight him). Aside from that he was just a really, really large fire elemental . C’thun was only interesting because of how difficult of a fight he was . Ornstein and Smough are only interesting because of how difficult they are. If Dark Souls wasn’t hard, people would blow through that game in literally two or three hours their first playthrough and it wouldn’t leave anywhere near the impact it had on players and everyone would have forgotten about it.

This might seem like a bit of a tangent, but I don't WvW. It's just not a game type I find interesting and will only dip my toe into it to get a Gift of Battle for a legendary weapon and that's it. And if WvW ever someday gets an update that adds new interesting things to it I'm not going to be upset about it. I think WvWers should have the coolest and most fun experience even if I don't ever set foot in a WvW map ever again. Warbringer is the coolest looking legendary backpack, but I'm never going to get it. And I'm fine with that. I don't want or need an easy mode that lets me immediately get the back pack, or lets me never have to fight other players or removing the possibility of dying while playing that content. If they add a new WvW map that's the coolest zone ever added to the game I'm not going to complain "Oh why can't they add a PvE version of this map. It's so unfair that WvW players get to run around this cool new zone that I don't get to enjoy because I don't WvW."

It seems like you have one section of the nonraiding crowd who wouldn't be happy unless raids were nothing more than wireframe hallways with fights against wireframe monsters with 0 value outside of their exact fight mechanics because "If all you want is hard content then that's all it should be." . Raids should be the coolest possible content they can possibly be in every regard, fights, zones, music and story. I think that should be true of every aspect of the game.

Another problem is that some players just don't want to put in the effort and try. You have people who are incredibly offended at the idea that you should use food and utilities in raids or fractals (And don't get me started on the people who get pissed that you ask that you use pots for Fractals) and consider the suggestion you telling them how to play and take away their free will and individuality. They look at things like meta builds as elitists telling them how to play, instead of the community and theory crafters coming together to try and help everyone see the content as easily as possible. People spend time theorycrafting, analyzing and testing stat sigil and rune combinations, crunching numbers, practicing rotations, doing practical runs of the raids for testing, and writing detailed guides on builds and strategies are for each class during each boss because they're trying to help you. They want you to kill the bosses and see the content. Not because they arbitrarily decided that warriors should use this playstyle and that all people must use this playstyle all the time because if you don't you're stupid and my build must be the most popular.

Guilds are always advertising that they provide raid training. You'll see raid training groups in LFG all the time. If you put in the effort to have a good build, to be able to pull off good rotations and provide good damage, if you show up to the group with food, you'll have a much better time.

But a lot of players don't think the game should be challenging period. That they shouldn't have to worry about actually being good at the game or putting up an effort for anything. They want everything to be like the world boss train where it's this big sloosh of nothing and no effort and easy loot. These people shouldn't be listened to catered to.

Easy mode would be a disastrous mistake. It would drain all of the appeal and mystique of raiding and fracture the community built up around them. I'm really happy with Arenanet's response on this.

"

[Bladestrom.6425]

@"mortrialus.3062" said:I'm going to cross post this message I made back when the first Easy Mode discussion popped up on the new forum."This is a debate I've been hearing since Vanilla World of Warcraft added Molten Core. I heard these arguments after Dark Souls became a smash success. And now I'm hearing it with GW2. Easy mode in raids would absolutely be unhealthy for GW2.

I've only started raiding in GW2 relatively recently. I joined a guild that advertised raid training and I really wanted that experience. For a long time, I didn't have a real guild outside of a couple of real life friends I played with. GW2 was for a long time a game that was actually pretty easy to mostly play on your own. And when Raids came out and I started getting really into the game again I really wanted to be a dedicated raider. About a couple of months ago I pulled the trigger and joined a raiding guild and I’ve never been happier playing the game.

And what makes raids appealing is the fact that they are exclusionary. More specifically, what makes raids appealing to me is the fact that I can be (And was for quite sometime) excluded from them because of the difficulty. I couldn't just solo my way through them or even reliably pug it. It was the same thing with Raiding in World of Warcraft. It was a very similar thing with Demon’s Souls and Dark Souls. The fact that there is real risk that I can’t see the content is what makes the content exciting. It creates a sense of danger, anticipation, and a sense of accomplishment that you just can’t get otherwise. Even if there was an easy mode, and I never ever touched the easy mode and just did the hardmode, the fact that it's possible for me to hit a switch and see all the content removes all the tension and danger and fear of failure.

I’ve never cared to get the achievement Migraine. Because I’ve already killed Mordremoth. I already know how that fight goes down. There’s just no interest in doing it for me. I’ve seen it all before. If Raids had an easy mode that I could have steamrolled, I would have 0 interest in doing them anymore. And I certainly wouldn’t have joined a raiding guild and become a part of a community. I have more more friends and people I play with in game because the exclusionary nature of raids forced me to finally stop being a loner and find and join other like minded players.

Regarding the story, Deimos isn’t that interesting of a character because of his dialogue or his character arc. He’s interesting explicitly because he is incredibly difficulty and the mechanics of his fight. He’s incredibly threatening and extremely intimidating because he’s hard. If there was an easy mode players could just steamroll or a story mode then Deimos losing a huge part of his character. Without that, there’s little more to him than being a weird demon we’ve never seen before that’s mean to Saul. That’s it. Matthias would be a weird crazy mage and that's it. Xera would be a Mesmer you fight in a trippy arena and that's it. They'd be like Zhaitan or the Primordus / Balthazar encounter in Flashpoint. Cinematic fights with interesting things visually, but ultimately huge jokes. Their difficulty, the time players have had to spend mastering their fights, have actually manage to give these raid characters actual character. I'm always going to remember Matthias and Slothazor and Xera and Deimos. I couldn't tell you any of the named white mantle boss's names from Living World Season 3 aside from Caudecus himself. Because the difficulty makes the story and writing shine.

It was the same thing with WoW and Dark Souls. Ragnaros was only interesting and iconic because he was hard and it took so much work and group effort to fight and defeat him(Over at least a month if the guild is starting from scratch like mine did to get someone the reputation with the Hydraxian Waterlords high enough to fight him). Aside from that he was just a really, really large fire elemental . C’thun was only interesting because of how difficult of a fight he was . Ornstein and Smough are only interesting because of how difficult they are. If Dark Souls wasn’t hard, people would blow through that game in literally two or three hours their first playthrough and it wouldn’t leave anywhere near the impact it had on players and everyone would have forgotten about it.

This might seem like a bit of a tangent, but I don't WvW. It's just not a game type I find interesting and will only dip my toe into it to get a Gift of Battle for a legendary weapon and that's it. And if WvW ever someday gets an update that adds new interesting things to it I'm not going to be upset about it. I think WvWers should have the coolest and most fun experience even if I don't ever set foot in a WvW map ever again. Warbringer is the coolest looking legendary backpack, but I'm never going to get it. And I'm fine with that. I don't want or need an easy mode that lets me immediately get the back pack, or lets me never have to fight other players or removing the possibility of dying while playing that content. If they add a new WvW map that's the coolest zone ever added to the game I'm not going to complain "Oh why can't they add a PvE version of this map. It's so unfair that WvW players get to run around this cool new zone that I don't get to enjoy because I don't WvW."

It seems like you have one section of the nonraiding crowd who wouldn't be happy unless raids were nothing more than wireframe hallways with fights against wireframe monsters with 0 value outside of their exact fight mechanics because "If all you want is hard content then that's all it should be." . Raids should be the coolest possible content they can possibly be in every regard, fights, zones, music and story. I think that should be true of every aspect of the game.

Another problem is that some players just don't want to put in the effort and try. You have people who are incredibly offended at the idea that you should use food and utilities in raids or fractals (And don't get me started on the people who get pissed that you ask that you use pots for Fractals) and consider the suggestion you telling them how to play and take away their free will and individuality. They look at things like meta builds as elitists telling them how to play, instead of the community and theory crafters coming together to try and help everyone see the content as easily as possible. People spend time theorycrafting, analyzing and testing stat sigil and rune combinations, crunching numbers, practicing rotations, doing practical runs of the raids for testing, and writing detailed guides on builds and strategies are for each class during each boss because they're trying to help you. They want you to kill the bosses and see the content. Not because they arbitrarily decided that warriors should use this playstyle and that all people must use this playstyle all the time because if you don't you're stupid and my build must be the most popular.

Guilds are always advertising that they provide raid training. You'll see raid training groups in LFG all the time. If you put in the effort to have a good build, to be able to pull off good rotations and provide good damage, if you show up to the group with food, you'll have a much better time.

But a lot of players don't think the game should be challenging period. That they shouldn't have to worry about actually being good at the game or putting up an effort for anything. They want everything to be like the world boss train where it's this big sloosh of nothing and no effort and easy loot. These people shouldn't be listened to catered to.

Easy mode would be a disastrous mistake. It would drain all of the appeal and mystique of raiding and fracture the community built up around them. I'm really happy with Arenanet's response on this.

"

you do realise you are part of a minority don't you? this isn't wow, the guild wars ethos is not exclusivity at all.

[TexZero.7910]

@vesica tempestas.1563 said:you do realise you are part of a minority don't you? this isn't wow, the guild wars ethos is not exclusivity at all.

Sure it isn't.....That certainly explains why different modes of play have exclusive rewards.

[Tyson.5160]

@Feanor.2358 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@Feanor.2358 said:Except it doesn't and I would not necessarily do it anyway. When I started raiding I was a casual scrub who was curious about raids and had the vague feeling of wanting my main clad in all legendary.

But you seem to enjoy raiding

now,

and now is when you're making the argument that those who don't enjoy raiding shouldn't have any alternative paths.

My enjoyment here is irrelevant and my objection is on principle. For instance, I would object the same way if you asked for an alternative path toward The Ascension. Which I like, don't have, and won't have, since I don't enjoy PvP. So see, it's not the subjectivity, it's the principle I'm defending here. Exclusive rewards are necessary. And changing the rules for rewards that have existed and people have earned is utterly unfair. That's why it can't happen.

Just curious, if they added a pvp legendary ring to PvP and it’s the only way to get the second ring, so for example, they gave the raid ring, Aurora, pvp ring, WvW amulet and another accessory for something else, would you have any objections?

[Sarrs.4831]

@vesica tempestas.1563 said:He also tried for an easier ascension and the PvP community shot him down. But theres matchmaking and no manual groups so you can get it eventually without getting kicked from most groups.

He's asked for the trading post to be made easy mode as well.

[Bladestrom.6425]

@TexZero.7910 said:

@vesica tempestas.1563 said:you do realise you are part of a minority don't you? this isn't wow, the guild wars ethos is not exclusivity at all.

Sure it isn't.....That certainly explains why different modes of play have exclusive rewards.

lol perhaps you want to look up the word exclusivity in the dictionary.

[Tyson.5160]

@nia.4725 said:

@Feanor.2358 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@nia.4725 said:

entitled

adjective UK ​ /ɪnˈtaɪ.təld/ /ɪnˈtaɪ.t̬əld/ disapproving​feeling that you have the right to do or have what you want without having to work for it or deserve it, just because of who you are:

Is the 100% of the game open for me, that I don't enjoy casual "do whatever" playing? Should anet do a hard mode of every content in the game? No?

The whole "entitled" meme really needs to go, or at least apply it accurately to raiders who feel that they are uniquely entitled to everything the devs have attached to raids.

@Feanor.2358 said:So play the easy mode. It's 95% of all the content. Is the existence of those 5% for others such a big problem so you cannot possibly let them have it?

I would if they would add it, which is my point in being here. There is other content, but it is not an easy mode raid, so it's entirely irrelevant to this discussion. I have no problem with raiders having their hard mode versions, so long as easy mode versions also exist for everyone else.

Raid, by definition, is not "easy mode". If you want something easy that requires participation of many players, you're wrong, the game is literally

full

of it - from group dynamic events, through metas, to world bosses.

But that won't give him the shiny, special effects Envoy armor. Feelsbadman.

I don’t understand the appeal for this Armor, it’s hideous... like just bad looking... it hurts me that it took two years to develop. ?

[TexZero.7910]

@vesica tempestas.1563 said:

@TexZero.7910 said:

@vesica tempestas.1563 said:you do realise you are part of a minority don't you? this isn't wow, the guild wars ethos is not exclusivity at all.

Sure it isn't.....That certainly explains why different modes of play have exclusive rewards.

lol perhaps you want to look up the word exclusivity in the dictionary.

Are you seriously saying that the Glorious Hero's isn't exclusive, isn't for the top of the top of PvP only and thus promoting exclusivity ?

[Sephylon.4938]

@Tyson.5160 said:

@nia.4725 said:

@Feanor.2358 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@nia.4725 said:

entitled

adjective UK ​ /ɪnˈtaɪ.təld/ /ɪnˈtaɪ.t̬əld/ disapproving​feeling that you have the right to do or have what you want without having to work for it or deserve it, just because of who you are:

Is the 100% of the game open for me, that I don't enjoy casual "do whatever" playing? Should anet do a hard mode of every content in the game? No?

The whole "entitled" meme really needs to go, or at least apply it accurately to raiders who feel that they are uniquely entitled to everything the devs have attached to raids.

@Feanor.2358 said:So play the easy mode. It's 95% of all the content. Is the existence of those 5% for others such a big problem so you cannot possibly let them have it?

I would if they would add it, which is my point in being here. There is other content, but it is not an easy mode raid, so it's entirely irrelevant to this discussion. I have no problem with raiders having their hard mode versions, so long as easy mode versions also exist for everyone else.

Raid, by definition, is not "easy mode". If you want something easy that requires participation of many players, you're wrong, the game is literally

full

of it - from group dynamic events, through metas, to world bosses.

But that won't give him the shiny, special effects Envoy armor. Feelsbadman.

I don’t understand the appeal for this Armor, it’s hideous... like just bad looking... it hurts me that it took two years to develop. ?Two years twice ;)

[Tyson.5160]

@Sephylon.4938 said:

@Tyson.5160 said:

@nia.4725 said:

@Feanor.2358 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@nia.4725 said:

entitled

adjective UK ​ /ɪnˈtaɪ.təld/ /ɪnˈtaɪ.t̬əld/ disapproving​feeling that you have the right to do or have what you want without having to work for it or deserve it, just because of who you are:

Is the 100% of the game open for me, that I don't enjoy casual "do whatever" playing? Should anet do a hard mode of every content in the game? No?

The whole "entitled" meme really needs to go, or at least apply it accurately to raiders who feel that they are uniquely entitled to everything the devs have attached to raids.

@Feanor.2358 said:So play the easy mode. It's 95% of all the content. Is the existence of those 5% for others such a big problem so you cannot possibly let them have it?

I would if they would add it, which is my point in being here. There is other content, but it is not an easy mode raid, so it's entirely irrelevant to this discussion. I have no problem with raiders having their hard mode versions, so long as easy mode versions also exist for everyone else.

Raid, by definition, is not "easy mode". If you want something easy that requires participation of many players, you're wrong, the game is literally

full

of it - from group dynamic events, through metas, to world bosses.

But that won't give him the shiny, special effects Envoy armor. Feelsbadman.

I don’t understand the appeal for this Armor, it’s hideous... like just bad looking... it hurts me that it took two years to develop. ?Two years twice ;)

I didn’t want to say it. ?

[Tyson.5160]

@TexZero.7910 said:

@vesica tempestas.1563 said:

@TexZero.7910 said:

@vesica tempestas.1563 said:you do realise you are part of a minority don't you? this isn't wow, the guild wars ethos is not exclusivity at all.

Sure it isn't.....That certainly explains why different modes of play have exclusive rewards.

lol perhaps you want to look up the word exclusivity in the dictionary.

Are you seriously saying that the Glorious Hero's isn't exclusive, isn't for the top of the top of PvP only and thus promoting exclusivity ?

I’m not, my perspective on this topic has altered slightly, especially since they will be adding a new set of Glorious Armor. I think each mode should reward its players.

Honestly people were concerned that the PvP Legendary Armor would be the easiest to obtain, however you are stuck doing 3 seasons of League, no matter what way you cut it. Then you have 3600 ascended shards for the precursor and armor upgrade it. Nothing quick about it.

[Sephylon.4938]

@Tyson.5160 said:

@Sephylon.4938 said:

@Tyson.5160 said:

@nia.4725 said:

@Feanor.2358 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@nia.4725 said:

entitled

adjective UK ​ /ɪnˈtaɪ.təld/ /ɪnˈtaɪ.t̬əld/ disapproving​feeling that you have the right to do or have what you want without having to work for it or deserve it, just because of who you are:

Is the 100% of the game open for me, that I don't enjoy casual "do whatever" playing? Should anet do a hard mode of every content in the game? No?

The whole "entitled" meme really needs to go, or at least apply it accurately to raiders who feel that they are uniquely entitled to everything the devs have attached to raids.

@Feanor.2358 said:So play the easy mode. It's 95% of all the content. Is the existence of those 5% for others such a big problem so you cannot possibly let them have it?

I would if they would add it, which is my point in being here. There is other content, but it is not an easy mode raid, so it's entirely irrelevant to this discussion. I have no problem with raiders having their hard mode versions, so long as easy mode versions also exist for everyone else.

Raid, by definition, is not "easy mode". If you want something easy that requires participation of many players, you're wrong, the game is literally

full

of it - from group dynamic events, through metas, to world bosses.

But that won't give him the shiny, special effects Envoy armor. Feelsbadman.

I don’t understand the appeal for this Armor, it’s hideous... like just bad looking... it hurts me that it took two years to develop. ?Two years twice ;)

I didn’t want to say it. ?

only thing fun about it imo XD

[Tyson.5160]

@Sephylon.4938 said:

@Tyson.5160 said:

@Sephylon.4938 said:

@Tyson.5160 said:

@nia.4725 said:

@Feanor.2358 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@nia.4725 said:

entitled

adjective UK ​ /ɪnˈtaɪ.təld/ /ɪnˈtaɪ.t̬əld/ disapproving​feeling that you have the right to do or have what you want without having to work for it or deserve it, just because of who you are:

Is the 100% of the game open for me, that I don't enjoy casual "do whatever" playing? Should anet do a hard mode of every content in the game? No?

The whole "entitled" meme really needs to go, or at least apply it accurately to raiders who feel that they are uniquely entitled to everything the devs have attached to raids.

@Feanor.2358 said:So play the easy mode. It's 95% of all the content. Is the existence of those 5% for others such a big problem so you cannot possibly let them have it?

I would if they would add it, which is my point in being here. There is other content, but it is not an easy mode raid, so it's entirely irrelevant to this discussion. I have no problem with raiders having their hard mode versions, so long as easy mode versions also exist for everyone else.

Raid, by definition, is not "easy mode". If you want something easy that requires participation of many players, you're wrong, the game is literally

full

of it - from group dynamic events, through metas, to world bosses.

But that won't give him the shiny, special effects Envoy armor. Feelsbadman.

I don’t understand the appeal for this Armor, it’s hideous... like just bad looking... it hurts me that it took two years to develop. ?Two years twice ;)

I didn’t want to say it. ?

only thing fun about it imo XD

As a Rev main, I want my Armor black, like the classic dark knight, however the armor really only dyes things like Shadow Abyss which is super dark, to a shiny grey.

[Sykper.6583]

@vesica tempestas.1563 said:

you do realise you are part of a minority don't you? this isn't wow, the guild wars ethos is not exclusivity at all.

Fancy news, you can't actually prove that. Good try though.

[Sykper.6583]

You would have been better off arguing that his story was 'Anecdotal' but once again no one except Arenanet can make any sort of logical claims about what the population wants, given they hold all the data, text logs, constructive feedback through reporting, yada yada.

[Sephylon.4938]

@Tyson.5160 said:

@Sephylon.4938 said:

@Tyson.5160 said:

@Sephylon.4938 said:

@Tyson.5160 said:

@nia.4725 said:

@Feanor.2358 said:

@Ohoni.6057 said:

@nia.4725 said:

entitled

adjective UK ​ /ɪnˈtaɪ.təld/ /ɪnˈtaɪ.t̬əld/ disapproving​feeling that you have the right to do or have what you want without having to work for it or deserve it, just because of who you are:

Is the 100% of the game open for me, that I don't enjoy casual "do whatever" playing? Should anet do a hard mode of every content in the game? No?

The whole "entitled" meme really needs to go, or at least apply it accurately to raiders who feel that they are uniquely entitled to everything the devs have attached to raids.

@Feanor.2358 said:So play the easy mode. It's 95% of all the content. Is the existence of those 5% for others such a big problem so you cannot possibly let them have it?

I would if they would add it, which is my point in being here. There is other content, but it is not an easy mode raid, so it's entirely irrelevant to this discussion. I have no problem with raiders having their hard mode versions, so long as easy mode versions also exist for everyone else.

Raid, by definition, is not "easy mode". If you want something easy that requires participation of many players, you're wrong, the game is literally

full

of it - from group dynamic events, through metas, to world bosses.

But that won't give him the shiny, special effects Envoy armor. Feelsbadman.

I don’t understand the appeal for this Armor, it’s hideous... like just bad looking... it hurts me that it took two years to develop. ?Two years twice ;)

I didn’t want to say it. ?

only thing fun about it imo XD

As a Rev main, I want my Armor black, like the classic dark knight, however the armor really only dyes things like Shadow Abyss which is super dark, to a shiny grey.

I mean poking fun about the fact that it too 2 years twice :P, armor itself looks meh: barely noticeable dyes on the crystals, forehead gem of light floats inches away from your forehead, helm battle mode looks like it should be on a medium armor, and the legendary bikini, and the giant butt mode. Already reskined that thing several times over =P

[TexZero.7910]

@Tyson.5160 said:Honestly people were concerned that the PvP Legendary Armor would be the easiest to obtain, however you are stuck doing 3 seasons of League, no matter what way you cut it. Then you have 3600 ascended shards for the precursor and armor upgrade it. Nothing quick about it.

I wasn't referring to you, but the other person claiming that this game doesn't cater to exclusivity. It clearly does cater to it for specific niche's, be it top tier PvP or Raids.

[Tyson.5160]

@TexZero.7910 said:

@Tyson.5160 said:Honestly people were concerned that the PvP Legendary Armor would be the easiest to obtain, however you are stuck doing 3 seasons of League, no matter what way you cut it. Then you have 3600 ascended shards for the precursor and armor upgrade it. Nothing quick about it.

I wasn't referring to you, but the other person claiming that this game doesn't cater to exclusivity. It clearly does cater to it for specific niche's, be it top tier PvP or Raids.

Yeah I agree with you, Tex. Plus it makes the armor more important and unique.