Expanded Weapon Proficiencies Beta Feedback: Ranger

[Rubi Bayer.8493]

Expanded weapon proficiencies are coming in 2024 during the second major update for Secrets of the Obscure, bringing a new weapon and skills for each profession. The expanded weapon proficiency beta event is live now and will run until 10:00 p.m. Pacific Time (UTC-8) on December 3.

You can leave your feedback for the ranger in this thread.

[Aaron Forestman.4758]

The mace skills are looking pretty solid! Recharging themselves will make for quite interesting gameplay when used well. The one thing I was hoping for was a source of group stability, which we didn't get. I think that would be a better effect on the unleashed ambush skill rather than something very similar to staff #4, so heal/support untamed could be competitive with other builds in situations where stability is expected.

[Panda.1967]

I was honestly skeptical of this weapon at first... but after trying it out... this is going to be a nice addition to my Druid... She's been needing a solid damage weapon and I think this will give her just that while still keeping her very support focused.

[Ahlaradra.5837]

I wasn't optimistic when it was advertised as a support weapon, but it actually dealt damage on my Soulbeast.
The feel and impact of the skills is on point and gives the maces a sense of power and weight.

As to its supportive traits, I can not speak. 

[latlat.4516]

So, we just finished our tests with my guild. For context, we are mainly WvW players and are seeing the weapons from this point of view. We did not exactly tests numbers yet.

The ranger weapons are about the only ones for which we don't have concerns about their real viability.

Both the dual masses and the mass/WH seem to be karakosa-compatible, which is actually more than enough to turn any weapon support-oriented. If I could make my chirstmas whishlist, I'd maybe ask for the condition-removal on the fourth skill to affect ally as well (even if when you only apply damage) and the heal on the second skill to become a barrier. But hey, good enough without that.

Also, thank you for not making the fifth skill static (maybe the fifth skill on rev's shield next time ? :p). This was THE thing I was afraid of.

 

Edit

I'll also add that I actually did not try to proc that force of nature buff, just used the mass for double-blasting with WH. I'm not really sure that buff is practical currently, as it requires too much time to build. I really hope it will either be subject to better quality of life or won't be taken into account when balancing the weapon effects 

Edited November 29, 2023 by latlat.4516
Adding nuance

[Arheundel.6451]

Genuinely surprised. The weapon sets feel pretty smooth to play and ....luckily mace off-hand n5 doesn't lock you on the spot which is pretty amazing, thanks for that, the mix of sustain and dmg feels pretty great, cherry on the cake is the ambush skill...a real candy for zerg play. Legendary mace here I come

Edited November 28, 2023 by Arheundel.6451

[kharmin.7683]

In my limited, solo, casual OW testing in Siren's Landing I found these to be viable, as many have said before.  Not sure I will use them.  Maybe for some niche build or something.

Force of Nature felt a long time to build up for very short duration gain.  Cooldown when it wore off seemed a bit off, too.  I had difficulty in building up the 6 stacks unless I was surrounded by a group and then the reward for the effort felt diminished (ha! see what I did there?).  I'd like to see this build up a bit faster and the final effect last a bit longer.  Then, the wear-off cooldown would probably feel about right.

[Beddo.1907]

Feedback from the other thread:
1. Damage numbers seem good and team vigor is really good. Works for both DPS and Sup.
2. Damage numbers seem good, perma regen even with 0 boon duration is good, healing is fine for a 6s CD. Radius should be raised to 240 at least, other than that works for DPS and Sup.
3. Damage numbers are ok for a CC skill, 1/3 to 2/3 prot uptime is decent. Movement range could be better, cause it falls flat compared to mobility these days.
4. Damage doesn't disrupt DPS when used instead of AA, overall pretty well rounded personal defensive skill. Doesn't look like it needs anything changed so far.
5. Feels like miniature Whirling Defense -the defence +CC. Damage is good, but feels like it's missing something. Might be better with a boon or barrier per slam. 
Nature's Strength is pretty difficult to control the timing, but even without trying to control it, it has some value. Needs further testing to see how it does in rotations.

[BadSanta.6527]

ok first 

the mace mace really good ! i really enjoy them 

only one thing is bad in my opino and that the umbush is 0/10 , should be support and change the animation 

[Arheundel.6451]

14 minutes ago, BadSanta.6527 said:

ok first 

the mace mace really good ! i really enjoy them 

only one thing is bad in my opino and that the umbush is 0/10 , should be support and change the animation 

But why? There is already staff and now we have a ranged ambush skill to pair with staff while still supporting. Ranger needed this ranged aoe for zerg fights..and finally they have it!

[Aezen.3086]

It's physically impossible for me to read all of skill 1. I don't know what it's called since it's off the top and bottom of the screen.

[TwistedAlga.4235]

I was surprised how cool and good this looked! I actually liked ranger with maces, very cool and somehow new animations for a few of the skills... please keep giving new animations .

[hugo.4705]

OK so here's my feedback for that new weapon: (Through I do think that it lacks utility/elite skills to be like other specs)

Character animations:  Quite dynamic, with any skill the character seems like on rampage after a Saturday night slamming around.

Skills animations:  The skills animations are nice and in theme of nature and ranger, good visuals.

Mechanics: I guess that force of nature buff is this spec weapon mechanic. Well it works quite well and do give nice boost.

Damages and effects:  Skill 1.. what the heck ahhahaha too many skills infos it goes out of screen! rofl. For boons, not many, through useful ones like protection, stability, vigor and regen. Through a special wepaon tied effect called force or nature increase +25% damage and healing. Honestly? Damage s okay, but i think some skill could have vulnerability or fury.

Frankly? Nice weapon. Yes. Can be used. Definitely good.

[Swagger.1459]

EDIT: Necro Swords Coolness, Design, and Utility Score- 9/10 and will be usable outside of PvE. Ranger Maces 2/10 and are PvE limited weapons.    

--- --- --- 

My 2c. 

I'm glad that the team made the decision to add more weapons.

Following the heels of Hammer, we have another melee weapon. I didn't feel any excitement while trying the maces. Seems like the weapon will only be usable in pve and there may end up being better options than maces. Won't be enjoyable for me to stand at a pve mob or boss pressing buttons mindlessly, and it's not a weapon choice I would use for any other mode.   

I feel like a couple changes could make these weapons much more enjoyable and usable outside of pve. Melee weapons struggle vs ranged weapon counterparts in competitive play because targets don't stand still. If all this weapon set has is a small 450 hop, then it's out of any pvp or wvw mode. Compared to... 

Echoing Eruption - Guild Wars 2 Wiki (GW2W)

Holo Leap - Guild Wars 2 Wiki (GW2W)

 

Also, this could be a good weapon set to give some range to the skills. Examples...

Crystal Configuration: Storm - Guild Wars 2 Wiki (GW2W) (grants sword skills some range)

Rocket Fist Prototype - Guild Wars 2 Wiki (GW2W)

Searing Fissure - Guild Wars 2 Wiki (GW2W)

Tremor - Guild Wars 2 Wiki (GW2W)

 

If it were up to me, then I'd give all #1 skills a 600-900 range component. Skills #2, #3, and #4 give a 900 range component (900 leap on #3). Skill #5 not sure, maybe boost the radius and let the skill linger a bit more and do damage. 

This weapon could be made cool and fun for every mode, but currently it's not. 

 

Edited November 28, 2023 by Swagger.1459

[DarkLancer.1902]

This does what it says on the box. It's a good close-range support/control kit. Damage is lackluster, but you're outliving the enemy anyway. I was pleasantly surprised to find that it does NOT play like a guardian; this kit is its own thing.

8/10 overall rating. Good work.

 

[Ragtter.1265]

Was surprised by how much I enjoyed the maces! In open world, the damage feels good and the abilities flow together nicely to create a solid game-feel! The visual effects and animations were just the right balance of impactful without being distracting or intrusive; very appreciated! Smoothing the transition between the enlarged form and your regular form would be nice, as right now your character just kind of "pops" between large and small. May be a small green poof or whirling wind effect could help? Just a thought! Keep up the great work, really excited to see these hit live servers!

[Gotejjeken.1267]

First, I hate how we need beta characters for weapons--but I digress.

Will need to take it into WvW, maybe unranked sPvP to really get a feel--but in the five minutes I spent using them so far, I can say I do not like the whole growth mechanic.  It's too punishing, it times out after I think 10 seconds, will trigger on any non-auto that fulfills the requirements, and has a timeout period.

Compared to Celestial Avatar it is very punishing.  CA is the closest thing ranger has to this as it is also a resource you build, expend, and then are limited from using for a set period.  The thing is, CA doesn't drain outside of combat--unless I Mandela effected myself, I believe it used to, and it was awful.  

Basically, the stacks of Force of Nature need to remain until weapon swap and should have some actual button for using them--the latter is more QoL as I guess using a skill is a discrete way to do it, but it absolutely should not time out or have a degen mechanic.  

By eliminating the degen mechanic it also allows mace to be used with something other than mace--especially offhand.  At current you really must be running M/M or building enough Force of Nature is going to be tough if not impossible before it expires.

Outside of that don't mind them at present, and as mentioned will need to try something like Mace/Mace + GS to really get a feel for how bruiser this can get.  They do look more promising than Hammer at present.

[Gotejjeken.1267]

Adding to the above, just noticed skill #3 does ZERO damage in competitive as it carries a CC component---this is terribly bad.  Maybe on a 2H weapon set this works (hammer, gs, shortbow, etc.) but here it just feels awful.  

Edited November 29, 2023 by Gotejjeken.1267

[Artemis.8034]

180 radius come on anet! taking the dogpile to the extreme arent we?

Edited November 29, 2023 by Artemis.8034

[BadSanta.6527]

becuse mace is support wepon and it should have open more option to support untame

[Maekrix Waere.2087]

I'll echo what I said in the other thread here:
"I am utterly disappointed that Mace Ambush is not a healing skill.  Heal Untamed really wants a second healing ambush to be freed from having to run double staff and now you're introducing a new support mainhand and instead of an ambush to really help out a new, fledgling build... we get damage and immobilize on a healing weapon.  I cannot understand it."

The mainhand mace looks fine to me.  Good, even.  My Heal Druid is going to love having a weapon that contributes to its main goals while I have warhorn out.  I think the Nature's Strength stacking is kinda weird and I don't think it adds much to the weapon at all.  Overall, the core of the weapon seems good.  Maybe some tweaks here or there (radii could really use widening, IMO) but mostly fine.  I will echo again, though, that I think it's ambush needs to be changed to either heal or give barrier.  Something like that would really let Quickheal Untamed shine, but now that build is even further behind Druid than it already was.

Offhand maces seem to have fine numbers, as much as 1s stability is kind of a meme.  Even more than with the mainhand, Nature's Strength is useless here unless you shackle offhand mace to mainhand mace.  Good luck *ever* stacking it up if you're not using mainhand.  I think it's fine for a PvE bruiser weapon, but it really needs to have Nature's Strength ripped out of it and then balanced for that removal, because that mechanic is basically already locked to mainhand mace so let's make it official.

Edited November 29, 2023 by Maekrix Waere.2087

[Gotejjeken.1267]

Discovered more...it appears you can't maintain Force of Nature in sPvP (not sure about WvW) by using off-hand mace only due to the CDs.  You can BARELY maintain it in PvE if you spam both 4 and 5 skills off CD.  

This is not good.  Locking an entire new weapon set to you HAVE to take both is awful, what's the point of even having 1H weapons then? Sure you can use them independently, but you lose 50% of the entire point of the weapon set.  

I say this needs to be changed to you get force of nature somehow when you have a mace equipped; but considering this is a beta and dev time was spent to ensure each skill gives a certain amount of Force of Nature, I doubt this is happening.  Even if every other weapon only gave a baseline amount when you use the skills, it'd be something.

I do wonder how much practical time the person developing this has with ranger or the game as a whole.  As I've only tested maces for less than an hour and am noticing a ton of flaws--the hard coupling at least should have been a non-starter on the drawing board.  

[CETheLucid.3964]

19 minutes ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

appears you can't maintain Force of Nature in sPvP (not sure about WvW) by using off-hand mace only due to the CDs.  You can BARELY maintain it in PvE if you spam both 4 and 5 skills off CD.

If you want to mix weapons and still have access to Force of Nature, main-hand mace + whatever is the route to go. Though off-hand mace isn't bad at all for what it offers (condi cleanses, barrier, stability, and a CC). The later CC will be kinda useless in PvP/WvW as it's a channel but it'll be great in PvE. You'll really have to push to get Force of Nature with it by itself (off-hand) but it compliments sword and dagger nicely. It slots in well with the available tools we already have. And of course they could always fix it. That would be nice

Naturally mace/mace is the full experience but I'm glad to say they can operate fairly well by themselves, and even maintain the Force of Nature mechanic easily with just one (main-hand). I'm pretty impressed with maces. Straight forward and offers a lot of utility. Maybe I'll do a more elaborate write up later but generally I'm alright with the maces. Pretty clean weapon for a beta test compared to others.

[Gotejjeken.1267]

2 minutes ago, CETheLucid.3964 said:

If you want to mix weapons and still have access to Force of Nature, main-hand mace + whatever is the route to go. Though off-hand mace isn't bad at all for what it offers (condi cleanses, barrier, stability, and a CC). The later CC will be kinda useless in PvP/WvW as it's a channel but it'll be great in PvE. You'll really have to push to get Force of Nature with it by itself (off-hand) but it compliments sword and dagger nicely. It slots in well with the available tools we already have. And of course they could always fix it. That would be nice

No, literally try it on the test golems in sPvP--you can't maintain Force of Nature with the offhand.  I think this is a problem that shouldn't be ignored because the mainhand you can maintain simply because it has an extra skill to spam lol.  

I also don't understand what's so great about mainhand, you get a bland auto, a two skill that you have to wait for the secondary to do anything, and the three skill which does no damage in competitive for the same daze that weapons like shortbow and greatsword yield, but both actually do other things too--and GS in particular has the tools to keep you in melee (the block and counter-attack kick).  

The #3 skill on mace not doing damage is baffling too, because the #5 skill actually does damage AND has a daze as its finishing effect.  That makes...no sense?

I don't think the weapons are useless btw, just that they appear better than they are if you couple them with the rest of the ranger kit.  Maybe that's the intent--just hoping they land on the usable side and not on the hammer / torch / mainhand dagger (for most applications) side...

[Arheundel.6451]

Mace ambush is surely the best thing to be excited about, after 12 years .....ranger finally get a non projectile ranged aoe attack for wvw.....thank you Lord....finally