Dean Calaway.9718 Posted June 22 Share Posted June 22 Just now, Bladestrom.6425 said: Which means increasing the price, which ofc is unfair on those that already have the seasons. I paid full price for the base game and it has been free for donkey years now, get over it, bundle the seasons with the expansions for free already. 2 1 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bladestrom.6425 Posted June 22 Share Posted June 22 25 minutes ago, Dean Calaway.9718 said: I paid full price for the base game and it has been free for donkey years now, get over it, bundle the seasons with the expansions for free already. Many many have, and? The Gem store needs interesting things to buy, and Anet needs income or all of us get reduced content. 2 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CETheLucid.3964 Posted June 22 Share Posted June 22 5 hours ago, Zychuu.7294 said: How would you even explain the LW monetisation scheme to new player without instantly scaring them away? "DLC. Once upon a time it used to be free but now you have to pay since you didn't join me when I asked you to. You fool. You absolute buffoon. 🤪" 1 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sobx.1758 Posted June 22 Share Posted June 22 (edited) "If you want more content, you can buy living world episodes/seasons which fill the story between the expansions and -after 2nd season- come with new maps" I think that explains it? Edited June 22 by Sobx.1758 6 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashen.2907 Posted June 22 Share Posted June 22 Tor the most part GW2 has allowed two primary methods of "paying" for post box price content. The accepted currencies have been time and money. You can exchange your time in game, earning gold, for gems or you can buy those gems with real money. LW chapters are no different. Anet set the price for LW chapters at either spending the time to log in or by purchasing gems. I logged for every LW chapter but did not get them for free. I spent one of the two currencies ANet set, my time. Someone who chooses to not pay with one currency will either have to go without or pay with the other. Calling it a scam for someone to charge for the product of their labor is ludicrous. It is also probably hypocritical. How many people would tell their employer, "you paid me for last month, and are going to pay me for next month, so this month you get my labor for free?" 1 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zebulous.2934 Posted June 22 Share Posted June 22 2 hours ago, Bladestrom.6425 said: Gads at low comprehension. Pricing is objective and quantifiable and not subjective. Your 'experience' does not skew the reality of the cost. Pricing is not objective, otherwise there would not be haggling irl, competition would not exsist, and there would not be sales. I could make the argument that the sale price is the true price and that the regular "full price" is just padding. It is easy to a avoid paying full price for LW seasons, simply wait for a sale. They still run events occasionally that offer LW seasons for free, simply wait for an event. Therefore the true price for LW must be free, people just have to wait. Oh that is a sale's tactic, an incentive, a bribe to engage more with the game. Then offer that incentive year round. Make the real money selling gems. If customers wait too long then some other seller with a similar product will catch their attention. Prices have never been objective, it all depends on what customers are willing to pay, and how badly a seller wants to make sales right now. A seller can't hold out forever. Especially if that seller has competition. 1 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashen.2907 Posted June 22 Share Posted June 22 12 minutes ago, Zebulous.2934 said: could make the argument that the sale price is the true price and that the regular "full price" is just padding. Sure, and your argument would be a matter of opinion, subjective, but the actual price would still be the price objectively. That price might change later but objectivity does not require a thing to be static. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dean Calaway.9718 Posted June 22 Share Posted June 22 2 hours ago, Bladestrom.6425 said: The Gem store needs interesting things to buy, and Anet needs income or all of us get reduced content. If they already made the base game free there's no reason they can't include these free with the expansions as well, this isn't an "interesting thing to buy" with gems it's annoying and I've had several people try the game and bail when they start adding all that up. Literal nickle and dime. So to quote you directly... 2 hours ago, Bladestrom.6425 said: is unfair on those that already have the seasons (...) Many many have, and? 1 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zebulous.2934 Posted June 22 Share Posted June 22 38 minutes ago, Ashen.2907 said: Sure, and your argument would be a matter of opinion, subjective, but the actual price would still be the price objectively. That price might change later but objectivity does not require a thing to be static. Ah, I see. I am arguing about value, and you are arguing about price. Gotcha. Value is subjective, the perceived worth. Price is the number printed on a tag. 3 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashen.2907 Posted June 22 Share Posted June 22 4 minutes ago, Zebulous.2934 said: Ah, I see. I am arguing about value, and you are arguing about price. Gotcha. Value is subjective, the perceived worth. Price is the number printed on a tag. Got it. That said the reasoning behind a price can be subjective. "I think people will pay X for my product based on my perception of its value, the current economy, etc," for example. Such reasoning can be mistaken of course. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
voltaicbore.8012 Posted June 23 Share Posted June 23 (edited) 9 hours ago, Danikat.8537 said: "The Living World is just their name for DLC packs". That's literally what I've said to people who asked me what it is and why it costs extra. As far as I know no one had a problem with that answer. I second this approach, it makes sense to a lot of folks coming in from other games. LW are smaller DLC packs, expansions are much larger DLC that take more time and (at least traditionally) add deeply impactful/gameplay-changing updates. You get to avoid the weird conversation about "well I (and many others) actually got LW all for free because we were actively playing when they launched, but you have to pay, sucks to be you." Edited June 23 by voltaicbore.8012 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sindust.7059 Posted June 23 Share Posted June 23 I agree that this weird piecemeal DLC sale is ridiculous, especially because what's not being sold in the "all DLCs" bundle is vital to the main story and is in between those DLCs which makes it impossible to play the story chronologically unless you buy everything before you start doing the story. But as to how to approach it without scaring your friend, just say that he can buy them with in-game gold, and introduce him to some efficient gold farming methods, like fractals. It'll still take him months to unlock everything, but he wouldn't have had to pay for it, and he would be doing something fun in the mean time. Also make him create alts to park at some chests that give high value drops daily to accelerate the process. 2 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheNecrosanct.4028 Posted June 23 Share Posted June 23 6 hours ago, Dean Calaway.9718 said: If they already made the base game free there's no reason they can't include these free with the expansions as well, this isn't an "interesting thing to buy" with gems it's annoying and I've had several people try the game and bail when they start adding all that up. Literal nickle and dime. So to quote you directly... Except there's a difference. Making the base game free makes it easier for people to try out the game and, if they like it, purchase it and continue playing with full features. It lowers the threshold for new customers. And every customer brings with them the potential to buy items off the gemstore (like the LW seasons). But that doesn't really apply to LW seasons, does it? People already have the game then so there is no new customer to gain. That's the reason you were looking for. 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linken.6345 Posted June 23 Share Posted June 23 7 hours ago, Zebulous.2934 said: They still run events occasionally that offer LW seasons for free, simply wait for an event. Therefore the true price for LW must be free, people just have to wait. After return to before end of dragons release when have it been free? The rush events have not given access to living seasons. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Healix.5819 Posted June 23 Share Posted June 23 The living world was intended to replace expansions. Why would DLC that can be purchased with gold scare someone away? I'd imagine a new player would be more upset buying the complete collection, only to later find out how easy it would have been to buy with gold, or not getting the ultimate instead and having 1024 gems left over after buying the seasons on sale. For a real pro move, if you're going to buy the seasons with real money, buy additional accounts instead - act now and create some free accounts to farm the daily, then buy the game when it's on sale. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dean Calaway.9718 Posted June 23 Share Posted June 23 6 hours ago, TheNecrosanct.4028 said: Except there's a difference. Making the base game free makes it easier for people to try out the game and, if they like it, purchase it and continue playing with full features. It lowers the threshold for new customers. And every customer brings with them the potential to buy items off the gemstore (like the LW seasons). But that doesn't really apply to LW seasons, does it? People already have the game then so there is no new customer to gain. That's the reason you were looking for. You're making zero sense and contradicting yourself. Let me put this plain and clean... I don't know any other MMO that makes players buy some 5 expansions now AND THEN buy a bunch of premium currency to buy the stories in between those expansions which are integral for the main plot. It's a 100% an awful customer experience and one I've personal see drive away several potential customers. This whole thing is a non argument because when Anet started releasing these episodes they were free, the idea wasn't to make money from them, it was to prevent players from taking a break by baiting them with these episodes that if they miss them THEN they'd have to pay for it. But it's been a complete oversight on "what if a player only starts today...?" Having a massive backlog of "it was free THEN but now we charge you for it because you came late to the party" is nonsensical, charging for these seasons isn't doing its original intent anymore and right now it's just annoying, unnecessary, confusing, and quite frankly often enough a deal breaker. 1 1 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashen.2907 Posted June 23 Share Posted June 23 (edited) LW was never free. There was payment required for every chapter. That payment was in a currency other than but no less valuable than cash. That said, I do recognize that the DLC in many other games centers around side stories not integral to the main plot. LW in GW2 is more important to its story as it connects the expacs. For this reason I do think that some sort of bundling with the relevant expac for a given LW season could be a good idea. Perhaps, if an expac is $20 then expac plus LW season might be $27.50. Of course someone could just buy the expac and save up gold to buy the LW instead if they choose. Edited June 23 by Ashen.2907 1 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dean Calaway.9718 Posted June 23 Share Posted June 23 15 minutes ago, Ashen.2907 said: LW was never free This is just a flat out lie, period full stop. You could even get Season 4 episodes for free without buying PoF, and I can make that statement of fact because I did, I unlocked all those episodes for free years before I bought PoF. 1 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuks.8241 Posted June 23 Share Posted June 23 They should just make LS2 free or bundle with Hot. Hot doesn't really make sense without it. You start Hot and there are a bunch of new annoying character talking in your head acting like they know you and talking nonsense. Also Ls2 is the least value for it's price. At least it would get players into first expansion seamlesly. Later iterations are a bit more self contained. I've only played Destiny 2 that is also as confusing (actualy way more) as GW2 but they did offer a bundle for everything for a very decent price when I bought it. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inculpatus cedo.9234 Posted June 23 Share Posted June 23 1 hour ago, Dean Calaway.9718 said: This is just a flat out lie, period full stop. You could even get Season 4 episodes for free without buying PoF, and I can make that statement of fact because I did, I unlocked all those episodes for free years before I bought PoF. Unlocked, but could not access(play) them until you purchased Path of Fire. 2 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dean Calaway.9718 Posted June 23 Share Posted June 23 1 minute ago, Inculpatus cedo.9234 said: Unlocked, but could not access(play) them until you purchased Path of Fire. And the point being... THEY WERE A FREE UNLOCK even without pay/playing Path of Fire, so any claim "they were paid in currency" is false. Any account, even a free one, would have unlocked these for free as long they log in on the original release or in the return event just before End of Dragons. 2 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inculpatus cedo.9234 Posted June 23 Share Posted June 23 Your statement suggested one could unlock and play; just making clear what actually happened back then. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashen.2907 Posted June 23 Share Posted June 23 (edited) 46 minutes ago, Dean Calaway.9718 said: And the point being... THEY WERE A FREE UNLOCK even without pay/playing Path of Fire, so any claim "they were paid in currency" is false. Any account, even a free one, would have unlocked these for free as long they log in on the original release or in the return event just before End of Dragons. A currency as valuable as, but different from, money. Please explain how you unlocked the chapters without spending time? Oh, right, you admit it when you said, "as long as...." "It's free as long as you pay the price set by the merchant..." Hilarious. Edited June 23 by Ashen.2907 1 3 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dean Calaway.9718 Posted June 23 Share Posted June 23 7 minutes ago, Ashen.2907 said: A currency as valuable as, but different from, money. Please explain how you unlocked the chapters without spending time? Oh, right, you admit it when you said, "as long as...." "It's free as long as you pay the price set by the merchant..." Hilarious. Get free GW2. Log in on free window, get them FOR FREE. Simple as. Anything you can do is damage control your erroneous assertions, that's why you're spinning wheels ~ 2 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuks.8241 Posted June 23 Share Posted June 23 11 minutes ago, Ashen.2907 said: A currency as valuable as, but different from, money. Please explain how you unlocked the chapters without spending time? So how much time does it cost now? I'm sure all players would like to spend some time (literary a few secs to login) instead of gems. This spending time statement is just silly. For me it was completely free. 3 1 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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