Feedback: Official Living World Season 4 Episode 3 Feedback [MANY SPOILERS]

[ugrakarma.9416]

@"TheQuickFox.3826" said:

3. Map design.The map feels a bit uninspired. I miss inspiration in both the landscape as the architecture. I think it is the worst living world map so far, at least to my personal taste. A missed opportunity, because Kourna was so beautiful in Guild Wars Nightfall. I think the story with the undead corruption really hurt the map design and experience here.

Yeah, the map there is not even have that aura of "mysterious place" that the other maps have. it's basically Silverwastes reused textures with more water.

[Rockin Twilight Sparkle.26]

@Zaklex.6308 said:

Don't care about the snipped part, but you're 100% wrong on the meta part, it's designed exactly as it takes place, and the reason you and anyone else should figure this out is that we can't use the central entrance to Gandara because of the 3rd Generation Scarab Plague infected awakened that are being kept in check by the Twin Queens forces, that blocks off that path.Secondly, the meta is specifically about corralling the Scarab Plague, and where would we do that but in the labs in which the Awakened Inquest are working on it, and those happen to be in the Eastern side of Gandara. There's nothing in the Western side that we would even care about so there's no reason to go there, hence the wall.As for the Corsair ships, if you go into the Bay of Gandara there are Corsair ships in both the Western and Eastern portions, though they are beyond the accessible portion of the bay and you will be pushed back by those incredibly strong currents if you try to reach them, and based on conversation they are doing their job of keeping and plague ships from leaving Gandara.

Yeah see, you can explain something with a story all you like, but if its bad or its unsatisfying? The meta in Kourna is boring. I get why we're doing it, why it runs like it runs, but that doesn't save it.

[Rockin Twilight Sparkle.26]

I like the Beetle. It seemed a little bit silly to lock it behind several collections and make us work like that, but I guess they did the same thing with the griffon and hey: Petey doesn't cost a metric buttload of gold.

The map is... okay. But well, old Kourna is always gonna be better (the state of Gandara makes me cry. ;-; Also, Joko didn't rename it Palawadara, really?) And really, when are we gonna see present-day Sunspear Sanctuary... and what Joko did to the Monument to his defeat?

Story wise... a really good villain who was made pretty damn important might have gotten completely wasted and thats an honest shame. The whole business with the scarabs being a threat but no not really because I ran them over with a griffon was pretty silly, having to breed two more generations of them to kill everyone was sillierAnd the scarabs only affect humans now? Why? Joko's invasions being all over Tyria kinda demonstrate he's pretty equal opportunity for who he killsAnd then it doesn't even matter if the PC is human, we're just immune to the scarab plague because we died that one time but ended up getting better.Which... I mean, I dunno. I wanna say that cheapens the stakes a little? Yeah we're still on the front lines which is the most important thing, but consider Faren

Faren is just as much of a hero as us. Sure, he's a hopeless idiot but dude braved a plague that he's probably had someone read like, part of a book to him about it, (I think?) the most significant plague in recorded history. And why did he do it?

For Kryta. For Amnoon.

So we make this rush for the gate, blow it open and then realize that blowing it open was both a waste of our time and foolish, because scarab zombies. We can't just run these scarabs over because they're third generationI'm not going to knock the ghost army here. The two queens who were blamed for the plague wiping out their country leading their undead countrymen to stem the tide and stop such a tragedy befalling another nation? Thats solid

But I do have to say something about literally everyone staying on the bridge while only we get to chase after Braham.This isn't gonna be a tangent but I'm still pretty well in the 'I don't like Braham' camp.

SOD IT, TANGENTFrom: The First City (Daybreak quest)Taimi: Cross those two wires...and hit that button.Asura Console: Replay complete.Braham Eirsson: (furious roar)

Braham then proceeds to smash a wall with his mace to no effect."If I hit it with my mace enough times, it'll go away!" is how you satirize the idiot Norn, not how he should actually be written!

Joko's taunts, his quips, the torture chamber? Dude promised me painPalawa Joko: Come back here, pathetic mortal! This is your last chance. I will return to reclaim my throne.Palawa Joko: And I will have my revenge on those who put me here, who left me here, and who dared take advantage of my absence.Palawa Joko: The torture... ah yes, I have plotted it out...Palawa Joko: I will just laugh as their wretched pleas for a longer life turn to desperate cries for a faster death.

Reading this dialogue again? Its not like he didn't know about our dragon at all, he certainly knew about it by the time that we fight him in Long Live the Lich... gives me a little hope

On subject... Joko promised that a pain-train was coming and its pretty clear that we're a thorn in his side, we've made him made. We have his attention and honestly, that and the stealthy mission are where this chapter did flourish

I probably could have done without the trap hallways that throw everything at you and also the checkpoint is right on top of the flame vent (and that ring needs either a longer duration or a shorter cooldown or both)

Actual fight with Joko? Once me and my friend figured out that we had a magic ring and we should use it, went smooth enough. I liked it. That cutscene? One of the most illuminating and infuriating things to see.

So all in all? I'm honestly kind of disappointed. I'm invested and its free: I'll see how the next chapter turns out. But I liked Path of Fire, I could even dig Daybreak. Bug in the System was alright, this was justI'm not gonna say you Last Jedi'd it, but don't take notes from Last Jedi, okay?

[notebene.3190]

Small Suggestion: There is an event to escort a caravan from Allied Encampment to Arkjok Farmlands. I don't think it counts towards progress of either heart. Maybe it should count for Arkjok?

[aimasira.3786]

This episode was full of content i couldn't ask more. However i have only 2 concerns.1) i cannot understand why the roller beetle upon mounting it has to have the special skill bar(dodge bar) empty, its very time consuming if you need it to travel with it in general, and if you want to break a wall you have to wait for it to charge. Also while able to break crystals and get volatile magic i find it very tricky to do because you need to get a greater speed that normal and by using its skill to speed up it makes it difficult for Low spec PCs to identify the Crystals Early in order to drive towards them, if you add a light like the HOT chests it will be great.2) My only concern about the map is the meta, it kinda feels short and way easy with very low rewards, and by spending time doing the pre-meta is not ideal to stick around and wait for it or do it multiple times. I already see fewer and fewer ppl caring about it, they leave it as it is and doing other stuff, this never happened with Ep1 & Ep2 maps.

[Perses.9683]

S4E3 started out awesome! Forewarned is forearmed was a very fun mission. The new map looked good and I loved the setting and how it was set up for a large siege/battle.

Then it kinda flopped. The actual story missions leading up to the invasion were very short and quick - which could have been forgiven if the last battle had been better. We go and blow open the front gate with a large army we’ve brought in....but now just 2 of us are going to sneak in through the sewers? Meh. The fight with Joko wasn’t bad - I enjoyed the ending.

As many have already covered the meta is just outright disappointing. It’s a shame because it could’ve been a really awesome assault on the fortress instead of essentially a 1 lane excursion.

The beetle mount is nice I didn’t mind the collection aspect of it.

The map feels kinda empty and that’s with everyone there because it’s new. I can only imagine what it’ll be like down the road. I wouldn’t mind at all if they spent part of a future update adding more to the current map cause it feels like there’s a lot of wasted potential with the map.

[Sir Vincent III.1286]

First run of the Forearmed quest, I got overzealous and took out the catapults only to find out that they are part of the objective in the second phase. So I logged out thinking I have to start the quest over from the beginning, but I find out that it starts in the second phase. For that, thank you.

Second, I love the Roller Bettle. I played a lot of Roller Beetle race back in GW.

Third, EPIC-ENDING-EVER!!! I got tired of Joko's monologues but it was worth it to see that ending.

================================================================================However, I would have enjoyed fighting through enemies all the way to Kourna. Rifting to it kind of cheating and immersion breaking.

In the book Ghosts of Ascalon, Krytan cannot even teleport to Ebonhawke without establishing an Asura gate first, then calibrating it. Same goes for the Asura gate in Fort Trinity.

Yet Blish can pull off a teleport to a place he's never been without even thinking of the possibility that he might send the commander inside a mountain or volcano.

I would have preferred to fight/sneak my way to Kourna then place a beacon in that camp so Blish can then calibrate it to create the rift for reinforcements. This would have given my character a sense of purpose without breaking immersion.

=================================================================================

Overall, this episode is better than episode 2, but not better than episode 1.

[notebene.3190]

Another small suggestion. It would be nice to be able to complete a zone's meta with story completion and other zone things - 'without' having to do any 'special' story achievements. Like "Kill 40 things in 30 seconds hopping on one foot using a broom before Canach finishes his monologue after hanging your brother's clothes on the lower peg before writing your letter home". I'm going to 'just' be able to squeeze this one in, I think, but I'm doing it with one easy story (the trial one), and a few I just 'fluked' into. I got lucky...this time.

[hugo.4705]

I'm sceptic for north and plague zombies... the only lab and experiments are located in the south, and after taking a look over the door, it seems that nothing is modeled or solid further in the fortress.

North and west was meant to be part of meta but cancelled and they just replaced doors by bones walls, you don't put bridge for nothing... here is my throughts: for the western entrance it was planned to use the champion inquest reperposed golem to destroy thr gate and go further but got cancelled.

HOLD ON! Maps events happens before the story: in sandswept, the cube isn't destroyed and still have the shield. So here in kourna, 3rd gen isn't created yet, so we could attack north, it's just that the devs haven't finished the meta.

[Bast.7253]

Just dawned on me that if we're right, the team that created this episode did Bitterfrost and Siren's Landing. Bitterfrost had a mastery with the Kodan Torch that involved purchasing upgrades for the torch as kind of a map-specific combat mechanic, and then Siren's Landing had the songs that nobody really used all that much or knew how to use. Now in this map we have the turret system, which almost seems like it could have been a similar mastery at some point.

So I guess this team really likes implementing the more quirky kind of new toys to their maps. I think the kodan's torch is pretty much only used for opening chests. But aside from that each of these things added with these releases is pretty much never used, or isn't really necessary in the maps they're in. The turrets might be interesting in a really difficult map, like a heart of thorns level difficulty map with mobs everywhere. The kodan torch is just... maybe it was always just meant for the beacons and chests but they added random combat mechanics to it to make it feel less stale? Or maybe it was meant to play a part in the region that we need the elixir for? And Siren's Landing doesn't really have challenging group content or a heavy meta to require something like the songs that are more for a group benefit I feel like than solo play.

I wonder what the next system will be episode 6. If we do wind up dealing with Kralk and that winds up being the episode in which we fight him, I hope the system they implement has something to do with riding Aurene and fighting on her. Something that has a bit more immersion and flow with the episode or use within the map, and that the map is challenging enough to warrant its use.

Also, where'd the combat tonic go this episode? I've been looking forward to those! And bought the choya tonic hoping it would be but knowing it probably wouldn't. lol

I always ask for guild hall decorations and hope beyond hope for some to be added with each episode but I thought surely a combat tonic wouldn't be a pipe dream!

[hugo.4705]

About guild hall, since 80% of the moon fortress is unused, why not turning her into a guild hall? She looks pretty nice with her docks and buildings.

[Zushada.6108]

Story Feedback:

Last Boss fight -- Overall, I liked the last fight and thought it was really well done. It wasn't as repetitive and annoying as Daybreak (Daybreak caused me to avoid episode 2 until recently)

Signet Ring -- I really hated the duration of the Signet Ring and the CD on it. I don't mind special action abilities, I just felt the duration of the effect was far too short.

Story Checkpoints -- You really need to start listening to the community's request for more check points in stories and the ability to start/restart from a particular checkpoint. If I want to run an achievement in Be My Guest on a character that already completed the story, I don't want to run through the whole story again. And if I want to run the story on a different character, I may not want to pause my progress to focus on an achievement.

Forearmed is Forewarned -- was wickedly long and to DC in the middle of that would have been so frustrating. It could have been more than 2 parts. Also it is still buggy and needs some focussed Quality testing

Beetle -- The endurance being zero when you mount is really annoying and cancels it out of my list of favs to use. It is also difficult to control but that is likely more player skill than design. Thank you for listening regarding the collections and NPC respawns and drop rates. It wasn't fun for me to complete at all so I hope these changes make it easier/funner for others.

General -- We didn't need another version of Unbound Magic for this season and we don't need anymore currencies! People gathering UBM without LW3 would still need to buy the episodes to get the trinkets with those stats so the purchase logic isn't a valid argument

General -- We don't need anymore new maps right now. We need to return to our existing maps. Everytime we get a new LW map, it causes a HUGE disconnect between the stories and the core/expansion maps. My point is, that if you look at the first Living Story Season (World), it happened in Central Tyria which is what made it really unique and really cool. Now, we are being so far removed from the core maps and the expansion maps, it is starting to feel disconnected and clunky. I loved this game because you have a knack for making old maps fresh and appealing but now, we have so many maps, we are starting to see empty maps with no-one around to help with group content. This episode could have been completed in the Ruins of Orr, or Vabbi or somewhere already explored. Yes there is Siren's Landing, Doric and Bitterfrost from LW3 connected to central Tyria but those are still their own maps. Why not just implement the new content in the existing maps and associate the gathering nodes with the content unlock? It seems to me that if it is level 80 content then any level 80 should be able to be access and complete the meta etc much like SW/DT. There is nothing wrong with letting non-POF players, run meta content that happens to occur in Core Tyria. If you really want to isolate players to the expansion maps, you could have used LW4 as an opportunity to add metas to the PoF maps. I think, you are far too focussed on paywalls with LW episodes and I think you need to re-evaluate what worked in Living Story Season 1 and 2 and stop focussing so much on isolating players into new maps.

Map Feedback

Bokoss Prison Ruins -- Should have an actual WP for meta. People don't understand or notice the portal in Allied Encampment because it is in a wonky location compared to WP.

Meta Loot Access Key -- Probably one of the worst loot design decisions I have seen implemented in a game. Sure it is a great way to ensure that only those participating get loot; however, you failed to see that people get downed and others rez them so when the Asura respawns at 10% those rezzing or downed/dead don't get enough damage to get a key. Leave the downed dead and you have 5-10 ppl + who actually participated without an access key and hoping a kind mesmer ports them. The Access Key should drop in the chest at the end and should be an applied boon rather than sending it to inventory.

Bounties -- No Bounty achieves? Not sure the logic here but there should be an achievement for downing the map bounties otherwise ppl won't do them

Scarab swarm events -- You seem to enjoy releasing content that features infinitely spawning face humping kill you in 2-5 shot mobs. Fine, I can deal with it. However, I am not a fan of doing an event that instructs "Trample scarabs with your mount to contain the outbreak" and being knocked off and then 3 shotted by an Awakened Occultist. I am not saying it is too difficult, and I am not saying it is an L2P issue, I think, some of the adds need their damage dialed back a bit or the mounts need increased HP/Defence. You should get knocked off the mount, but it shouldn't be in 3 seconds. Especially when you use Bond of Life, and when it ends, the mounts health hasn't recovered.

Moon Fortress -- What a waste of space! We have yet to return to a previous LW map in a future episode, so I imagine we will not return here. But what a waste of the Moon Fortress space! To have a battle in one corner with all that empty space just waiting for a full out assault is shameful. As I said above, all of the issues with this map and implementation would have been resolved by having this season occur in the existing Tyria/PoF maps. Those maps have no HoT like meta and are rather empty/boring at times. The metas introduced this season would have really breathed life back into those maps.

[Blocki.4931]

Forearmed is Forewarned is already 2 separate instances. If you leave or DC after liberating the camp you start right there. The instance itself only takes a few minutes because a 3k range spammable instant teleport makes traveling a breeze

[daviesforu.6291]

I just came here to say that I thought the this story was great. I love the way Joko is, and I especially liked how the mechanics were obviously displayed. The fight at the end actually felt rewarding and the scarabs on the floor were easy to see, the mobs weren't overpowered and hitting too hard, you could actually dodge things and it was quite obvious with what you need to do. The build up was good and I would happily play it again.

The fight with the beastmaster wasnt great though, it was just a chase and kill kind of thing, not too much thought involved. It would have been nice to have to use our raptor to chase him down and use our raptors skill to make him fall off his mount, or for him to release a load of low hp high hitting creatures (like pocket raptors) to try to kill us.

The bit where you chase braham was also a bit odd, he jumped down two ledges and then disppeared on mine, would have been nice to see him run it all through, even if he does it faster than we could. He could use the guardian skill to run quickly and we could go into the sewer, be hit with a cutscene of him sneaking and killing an awakened monster or examining clues (the blood trail maybe?)

The roller beetle collection is a bit... lackluster, it doesnt really integrate you too much with the map. It would be nice to have to find more things in the map, talk to npcs and do things for them to receive the collection items, and just stick to the one map. preferably not timed or gated things either, just a long trail of things that you can do and then feel accomplished achieving.

Overall, I loved it. Cracking story and Joko is such an awesome character. It would have been nice to see some of his minions with more thought and control over their actions, acting strategically and completely dedicated to Joko, but other than the things mentioned, love it.

[notebene.3190]

Okay, just realized this today:

Dynamic EventKill rats: 10/10Kill Tenrat

:lol:

[Ashantara.8731]

@Blocki.4931 said:Forearmed is Forewarned is already 2 separate instances. If you leave or DC after liberating the camp you start right there. The instance itself only takes a few minutes because a 3k range spammable instant teleport makes traveling a breeze

Exactly. Don't get why people call it an awfully long mission. It is not.

@hugo.4705 said:About guild hall, since 80% of the moon fortress is unused, why not turning her into a guild hall? She looks pretty nice with her docks and buildings.

Now, there's an idea! <3

[Zushada.6108]

@Ashantara.8731 said:

@Blocki.4931 said:Forearmed is Forewarned is already 2 separate instances. If you leave or DC after liberating the camp you start right there. The instance itself only takes a few minutes because a 3k range spammable instant teleport makes traveling a breeze

Exactly. Don't get why people call it an awfully long mission. It is not.

@hugo.4705 said:About guild hall, since 80% of the moon fortress is unused, why not turning her into a guild hall? She looks pretty nice with her docks and buildings.

Now,

there's

an idea! <3

Because this is a feedback thread to the Devs. People are giving their feedback to the team based on their experience. For you it may have been short but for others it took a long time. Also, my original comment was misread. I said more than 2.

[hugo.4705]

@notebene.3190 said:Okay, just realized this today:

Dynamic EventKill rats: 10/10Kill Tenrat

:lol:

Yup and in the next event, in research vault alpha, the rat is named Twelverat xD why? because the awakened asura is also considered as a rat xDD

[notebene.3190]

Pretty excited about all the new dogs too. Just noticing those now, as I'm getting close to finishing up saving for some of the longer collections.

I see some Teq in my future to get all my karma back.

[smitske.4912]

@"Gaile Gray.6029" said:

WARNING: THIS THREAD CONTAINS STORY SPOILERS -- READ AT YOUR OWN RISK.

Here's the traditional "highpoints" gathering place. Please share your general feedback about Episode 3 in this thread. If you have found any issues, the best place to report those is the Bugs Subforum, and of course if you have detailed feedback about any element of the episode, a separate thread is welcome.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts about LWS4/E3! :)

Are you sure you want feedback?

[DepartedSha.1563]

Why do i get a feel from this new map that someone made really big effort to make it fun to explore with lot of little things you could find. And then content people came and just crapped all over it. You can't get in to the city proper. There is lot of invisible walls on the streets like not just the structures but like before them. I have had so many chest inside places that you can't access to because they were explorerable before someone made it not accessible.Meta event feels empty like it was supposed to continue from where it was left. And the story... You kill Joko in the basement, no armies fighting, no grand boss encounter you just go there and kill the damn lich Atleast make the fight hard for god sake.

[Ashantara.8731]

After one and half weeks, I have to say that grinding shards has become a truly tedious task. :s I fear that, by the time I finish the dauntless banner, I will have grown tired of the whole map. :(

[Udolpho.1209]

I have one complaint: Joko is gone. I got pretty attached to him! Is he really gone for good? :anguished:

I loved the part where he called you stupid and made you think you were the real villian, that was great. But then he gets eaten, by a relatively small lizard/dragon. I mean, really? What about his mysterious ancient undead lich powers? Can he maybe, take over Aurene and become a lich dragon? That would be cool.

I never played GW1. But I hoped that Joko would just always be around & occasionally stirring up trouble in the theoretical GW3. That people never learn from history and keep on approaching him for help when they shouldn't. And he just goes on being undead for the rest of time & plotting his machinations. Maybe he gets bored and becomes a monk and meditates for an entire century. Maybe he's weakened and has to live as an undead nobody until he gains his powers back. He has an emo-immortal period where he reads sad poetry and insufferably bemoans wanting to be mortal again. He becomes an artist for a while, decides self-portraits are passé, and crafts enormous abstract sculptures from bones and flesh and that are still partially alive and destroy whole villages ("Oh, everyone's a critic!")

Zhaitan, Mordremoth, Balthazar I was okay when they seemed, all too easily, to be killed off. I thought maybe things would be changed up instead of just "yep, dead." I'm disappointed at a future with no Joko. Please bring him back? As in "The Lich is dead. Long live the Lich!"

Praise Joko. /sniffles

[Dakk.8025]

Thank you for making Kourna bigger than Istan & Sandswept Isles. Map size was my only real gripe about Living World Season 4 thus far. But Kourna seems cool so far. I love all the extra voice acting and story content for PoF +Season 4. Keep it coming peeps. Thanks for making new maps for each episode thus far too. Much appreciated.

[Nogothanc.5014]

Overall alot of nice new toys and stuff in the episode except for the story... like Path of Fire... Arenanet seems desperate to get rid of all the GW1 loose ends. And the only solution for loose ends is DEATH. I dont understand why we not trick Joko again to be sealed away or whatever, just give the fans the possibility that he shows up later or maybe even far later in GW3 whenever this might be. Palawa should be something like a running gag.. a "minor" villain that once in a while shows up, causes some troubles and gets locked away again and again. Like the comic villains.... Seriously since PoF I am so disapointed in the story. Dont get me wrong i like the expansion ,I like the presentation of the story and all the other new stuff. But I dont like the story itself... Hey here we take something from GW1 the players had a connection to.. Here we show it to you once again, here it is once more, remember the good times and all the fun you had with it SMACK! NOW KILL IT... Why? Well you fired two guys from the story department so maybe there is hope for the future.