Deadeye needs to be nerfed.

[Airdive.2613]

@DotDotWin.4357 said:So the only people defending DE are people playing them and they say that their class is easy to defend against if you build your spec to specifically fight just them...

I'm not saying that (and you're obviously exaggerating), but my personal philosophy has been that you want to play a build which plays to your strenghts as a player.If you're having consistent trouble fighting deadeyes and only deadeyes, it would be wise to use a different build, the one that would counter them, and outplay everyone else using your personal skill (as fighting them is clearly easier for you).

[Kicast.1459]

I stop gw2 until I see significant DE nerfs.And no...you will not have my stuff ;)

[bbop.9706]

OP you got your wish. 3RB 2>6 initiative is gg deadeye making an already 1 trick build even less viable for thw average player.

[sephiroth.4217]

@bbop.9706 said:OP you got your wish. 3RB 2>6 initiative is gg deadeye making an already 1 trick build even less viable for thw average player.

just use the mal seven trait for the the 7 initiative regain and spam away my friend ?

[DotDotWin.4357]

You know, people keep telling me how they nerfed dead eye but I am still getting his with 11-13K Death's judgements and 4K with 3 round burst and 5K with Deadly Aim.For those of us that aren't great with math, that's 20-23K damage, from stealth, from range, in less than 1.25 seconds. Still kinda problematic.

[DotDotWin.4357]

You know, people keep telling me how they nerfed dead eye but I am still getting his with 11-13K Death's judgements and 4K with 3 round burst and 5K with Deadly Aim.For those of us that aren't great with math, that's 20-23K damage, from stealth, from range, in less than 1.25 seconds. Still kinda problematic.

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

@DotDotWin.4357 said:You know, people keep telling me how they nerfed dead eye but I am still getting his with 11-13K Death's judgements and 4K with 3 round burst and 5K with Deadly Aim.For those of us that aren't great with math, that's 20-23K damage, from stealth, from range, in less than 1.25 seconds. Still kinda problematic.

That combo you specified takes two and 1/4th seconds to pull off and reveals the thief after deaths judgement, unless the thief is using Quick or be Killed, which caps the damage spike you get from taking Mal 7 and premeditation.

No amount of nerfing will save you if you do not dodge, short of removal of the spec.

[Spartacus.3192]

@Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

@"DotDotWin.4357" said:You know, people keep telling me how they nerfed dead eye but I am still getting his with 11-13K Death's judgements and 4K with 3 round burst and 5K with Deadly Aim.For those of us that aren't great with math, that's 20-23K damage, from stealth, from range, in less than 1.25 seconds. Still kinda problematic.

That combo you specified takes two and 1/4th seconds to pull off and reveals the thief after deaths judgement, unless the thief is using Quick or be Killed, which caps the damage spike you get from taking Mal 7 and premeditation.

No amount of nerfing will save you if you do not dodge, short of removal of the spec.

I like how you conveniently ignore that a lot of deadeyes use Binding Shadow which knocks you down and immobilizes you for 2 sec. You can stunbreak the knockdown but if you cant clear the immob you eat the full damage. Even then it takes time to stunbreak and clear immob which means you will eat at least half the burst.

Then add in the fact that only dumb deadeyes attack full health players. That means its still an instant down for most classes.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Binding_Shadow

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

@"Spartacus.3192" said:I like how you conveniently ignore that a lot of deadeyes use Binding Shadow which knocks you down and immobilizes you for 2 sec. You can stunbreak the knockdown but if you cant clear the immob you eat the full damage. Even then it takes time to stunbreak and clear immob which means you will eat at least half the burst.

Then add in the fact that only dumb deadeyes attack full health players. That means its still an instant down for most classes.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Binding_Shadow

If a thief cannot reasonably contest you if you have full health without significant risk that they will instant down, I'd say that having high +1 benefit is working as intended. Why should they also be bad at +1s?

if you keep in mind that:

DE has to mark you before he can KD you with binding shadowDJ does minimal damage with 1 malice

Binding shadow is easy to circumvent.

This skill is irrelevant to the following for noted reasons, as long as they are prepared:Warriors (Endure/Defy Pain/shield reflet),Mirages/Mesmers (Mirage Cloak and mirror, blinks, etc.),Engie (Elixir S, Photon Wall Holosmiths)Rangers (Lightning Reflexes),Revenants that run shiro, Revenants that run staff and stunbreak on swapAnd other thieves (withdraw, shadowstep, blinding powder, dagger storm) by nature of their defensive skills, as long as they are aware.Ele can invalidate it with magnet wave, or, if weaver can twist of fate -> Riptide to avoid the whole setup. Rebound also works.Guard is Thief's hard counter and can reflect the oncoming burst after DJ with bulwark. Their ports ignore immob and they have a number of passive and easily activatable blocks.

It's not that I conveniently ignored it, I just thought it was irrelevant to the argument presented. The original argument was something along the lines of "Deadeye does too much damage too fast, even after the nerfing." Not "There's no way to avoid it."

Granted, if you are unprepared, contesting a node or the like, binding shadow will set you up for an easy death. But given that the thief has to mark you (thus announcing to you that he is within 1200 range), you have warning that you may get bound and can respond by blocking it, attempting to dodge, or just plain disengaging.You're in a losing battle in a 2v1 anyway.

I can certainly see how the sudden damage unload is annoying. But you said it yourself, only dumb thieves attack full health players. Why then, do they have to also be mediocre at attacking injured or occupied players? Not only that, but by nature of the class they often cannot contest the node themselves. They are -specifically- adds in the pvp scene. Just because they do that well doesn't mean theyre broken.

[DotDotWin.4357]

@"Azure The Heartless.3261" said:if you keep in mind that:Binding shadow is easy to circumvent.

Your argument is like saying, "It's perfectly fair to give some players an instant win button they can use every 3 seconds if players have defenses that they can use every 10-30 seconds. Defenders just need to learn not play like noobs!"

Your entire argument is that Deadeye are so over powered you must save all your best defensive abilities JUST in case you run into one and then hope you can kill them before their instant kill combo is off cool down. It's kittenshit and you know it.

[Airdive.2613]

@DotDotWin.4357 said:

@"Azure The Heartless.3261" said:if you keep in mind that:Binding shadow is easy to circumvent.

Your argument is like saying, "It's perfectly fair to give some players an instant win button they can use every 3 seconds if players have defenses that they can use every 10-30 seconds. Defenders just need to learn not play like noobs!"

Binding shadow has a 30 second cooldown.

Your entire argument is that Deadeye are so over powered you must save all your best defensive abilities JUST in case you run into one and then hope you can kill them before their instant kill combo is off cool down. It's kittenshit and you know it.

The argument is that if you cannot deal with the deadeye as is, you do favor to yourself by adjusting your build as well as your playstyle. You as a player are going to have more chances to win. The best defensive abilities will allow some room for mistakes while you're learning to fight the deadeye.

[Curennos.9307]

You could try keeping an eye out for the giant, spinning, pulsating target that pops up underneath your feet when a DE chooses to Mark. It only KD's if you're marked. Then learn the animation of Binding Shadows.

If you're paying so little attention that you miss both of these, that's on you.

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

@DotDotWin.4357 said:

@"Azure The Heartless.3261" said:if you keep in mind that:Binding shadow is easy to circumvent.

Your argument is like saying, "It's perfectly fair to give some players an instant win button they can use every 3 seconds if players have defenses that they can use every 10-30 seconds. Defenders just need to learn not play like noobs!"

Your entire argument is that Deadeye are so over powered you must save all your best defensive abilities JUST in case you run into one and then hope you can kill them before their instant kill combo is off cool down. It's kittenshit and you know it.

No, I was politely saying that if you have at least one dodge and the ability to count to one, you can avoid binding shadow entirely upon being marked by being marginally aware that you are probably going to get bound, and if you happen to fudge that most defensive skills in the game will at least mitigate a portion of the damage, if not allow you to avoid the burst entirely.

And on top of that, Binding shadow has a thirty second cooldown. not a three second one.

I never said that you need to blow all your best defenses on the deadeye. I was merely pointing out that there are a myriad of different ways to deal with if you get hit by binding shadow for a majority of the classes, with the exception of perhaps reaper.

You don't need to strawman. My argument is nothing like what you are saying it's "like".

[Loconut.3017]

I play druid in pvp and I don't have a problem with Deadeyes unless they're in the sniping positions that without teleportation requires you to circle the whole map (forest mid, legacy mid pillars etc).. And the same complaint goes against pew pew ranger builds. So I suggest remove all sniping positions like that. Maps can still be multilevel, but with easier access to them, so classes that don't have any teles or pulls aren't just at a huge disadvantage.

[shadowpass.4236]

@Loconut.3017 said:I play druid in pvp and I don't have a problem with Deadeyes unless they're in the sniping positions that without teleportation requires you to circle the whole map (forest mid, legacy mid pillars etc).. And the same complaint goes against pew pew ranger builds. So I suggest remove all sniping positions like that. Maps can still be multilevel, but with easier access to them, so classes that don't have any teles or pulls aren't just at a huge disadvantage.

You need those no-port spots otherwise thieves, revenants, and to a lesser extent, mesmers would be extremely overpowered with no way to prevent their ganks.

[Bazsi.2734]

LoL this thread still going.

@DotDotWin.4357 said:You know, people keep telling me how they nerfed dead eye but I am still getting his with 11-13K Death's judgements and 4K with 3 round burst and 5K with Deadly Aim.For those of us that aren't great with math, that's 20-23K damage, from stealth, from range, in less than 1.25 seconds. Still kinda problematic.

Absolutely problematic. Did you just assume our damage? Thats very DPS-phobic of you, stop guardsplaining!

On a serious note, that is literally the only thing the spec can do at the moment. Sustained damage was just destroyed with the nerf to TBR, it's either frontloaded burst or nothing. What would be not problematic for you? If you take burst away, DE is a less mobile, more fragile version of the core theif that cannot do anything... so what would your version of DE be able to do?

[Crab Fear.1624]

@Bazsi.2734 said:LoL this thread still going.

@DotDotWin.4357 said:You know, people keep telling me how they nerfed dead eye but I am still getting his with 11-13K Death's judgements and 4K with 3 round burst and 5K with Deadly Aim.For those of us that aren't great with math, that's 20-23K damage, from stealth, from range, in less than 1.25 seconds. Still kinda problematic.

Absolutely problematic. Did you just assume our damage? Thats very DPS-phobic of you, stop guardsplaining!

On a serious note, that is literally the only thing the spec can do at the moment. Sustained damage was just destroyed with the nerf to TBR, it's either frontloaded burst or nothing. What would be not problematic for you? If you take burst away, DE is a less mobile, more fragile version of the core theif that cannot do anything... so what would your version of DE be able to do?

their version would never queue up

[Lucentfir.7430]

I think the best course to take now considering DE's design is to allow a 'soft' reveal when you strike stealthed units. Like it doesn't pull them from stealth or make them targetable. It just shows the transparent character model for a second or two before disappearing again unless you can keep hitting them consistently.

[Aurelius.6829]

@Crab Fear.1624 said:Make shots fired from stealth cost double initiative if they are not stealth attacks.

right.like they need initiative for marking.

[Crab Fear.1624]

@Aurelius.6829 said:

@Crab Fear.1624 said:Make shots fired from stealth cost double initiative if they are not stealth attacks.

make mark cost initiative?

[RisenHowl.2419]

I'll just keep posting this lol

[Deepcuts.9740]

Thieves are the reason I never enjoyed WvW and I only play it for gift of battle.Where is the fun of getting one shot from stealth?Because so many like to call it "esport", where does the sport part come in shooting your opponent from perma-stealth?I understand using tactics and knowing when and how to dodge. But at least give me the opportunity to react to something I see!Stealth should have never been implemented.

[Airdive.2613]

@"RisenHowl.2419" said:

I'll just keep posting this lol

Then again, the enemy team lost points: the time it will take for the enemy to recapture leaves them with less points than they would have if they would just hold the node with you alive, and one player from each team was occupied. So you sorta didn't lose anyway. Or rather lost "a little" for facetanking the build that counters you.

[RisenHowl.2419]

@Airdive.2613 said:

@"RisenHowl.2419" said:

I'll just keep posting this lol

Then again, the enemy team lost points: the time it will take for the enemy to recapture leaves them with less points than they would have if they would just hold the node with you alive, and one player from each team was occupied. So you sorta didn't lose anyway. Or rather lost "a little" for facetanking the build that counters you.

Binding shadow has no tell from stealth, the red mist only occurs if the thief is visible. You can use mark right after BS and the mark takes effect before BS goes off so its guaranteed to go through. Mark also steals stab first, so you cant stop it even with stab up. It's a 1hko on everyone without a passive invuln

Pretty hard to dodge a knockdown + immob you can't see coming

[Airdive.2613]

@RisenHowl.2419 said:

@Airdive.2613 said:

@RisenHowl.2419 said:

I'll just keep posting this lol

Then again, the enemy team lost points: the time it will take for the enemy to recapture leaves them with less points than they would have if they would just hold the node with you alive, and one player from each team was occupied. So you sorta didn't lose anyway. Or rather lost "a little" for facetanking the build that counters you.

Binding shadow has no tell from stealth, the red mist only occurs if the thief is visible. You can use mark right after BS and the mark takes effect before BS goes off so its guaranteed to go through. Mark also steals stab first, so you cant stop it even with stab up. It's a 1hko on everyone without a passive invuln

Pretty hard to dodge a knockdown + immob you can't see coming

Actually, it's evident from your video that you'd just failed to activate your signet that is stun break + instant condition transfer, so it's a basic awareness issue.