Latest Warclaw update

[Sealreth.1425]

I'd like to see all CC skills to dismount player. Finding small scale fights is even harder now. when everyone can just outrun. I believe it is fine with simple abilities and jus ta movement buff between fights....

[Naxos.2503]

I'm still confused, I read a dev saying the 10 people down kill was a typo, and did not in fact reflect the skill, doesn't that mean it was Simply nerfed from 5 to 3 ?

[Turk.5460]

Reducing the mount's mobility with the leap was definitely a step in the right direction. Why not give the mounts a defiance bar if you are set on having them continue to be immune to CC?

[Turkeyspit.3965]

@Turk.5460 said:Reducing the mount's mobility with the leap was definitely a step in the right direction. Why not give the mounts a defiance bar if you are set on having them continue to be immune to CC?

We don't know if the rejected the idea, only that it's much faster to reduce mobility / leap than it is to code in a defiance bar.

Given the amount of changes we've seen in only 48 hours is proof ANET is watching the mount very closely, and aren't hesitating to make quick changes. While that may bother some players, especially if they don't like the changes, let's all acknowledge that ANET is paying attention to WvW (at least for now), so we should feel somewhat comforted in that fact.

[Loosmaster.8263]

@Naxos.2503 said:I'm still confused, I read a dev saying the 10 people down kill was a typo, and did not in fact reflect the skill, doesn't that mean it was Simply nerfed from 5 to 3 ?

I think he meant the tool tip has not been updated to reflect the change, to me anyway.

[Naxos.2503]

@Loosmaster.8263 said:

@Naxos.2503 said:I'm still confused, I read a dev saying the 10 people down kill was a typo, and did not in fact reflect the skill, doesn't that mean it was Simply nerfed from 5 to 3 ?

I think he meant the tool tip has not been updated to reflect the change, to me anyway.

Ah, fair enough, the many patches recently had me confused, thanks

[Duckota.4769]

@Ghosst of Seraphim.8167 said:With the leap ability now useless you might as well just get a speed-buff and move on foot. The chain pull is a waste of supply, the damage is nerfed into uselessness. Too bad, I would have bought skins but you killed the kitten before even the first weekend.

The leap ability is not useless. Anyone saying this hasn't much thought into it. Or you don't realize the power of having 3 chainable dodges. You're probably dying more often in situation where due to your poor positioning you should die and you're not getting away for free now and now we're at the point of your post. Chain pull could be buffed yeah. Where its valuable not only when siege capped. Its not killed. Its actually still far too strong to be fair. It needs less health and it needs to be ccable. Or dismounts need to be easier. Either way it is still busted.

[Silverwing.8750]

With the latest leap range reduction the mount now feels like I am riding a "fat cat" rather than an agile lion.

I wish there was another way to fix the exploits as I find the mount less enjoyable now. I had hoped this mount would make me want to play WvW more than before, but this change is disappointing.

[Loosmaster.8263]

@"Silverwing.8750" said:With the latest leap range reduction the mount now feels like I am riding a "fat cat" rather than an agile lion.

I wish there was another way to fix the exploits as I find the mount less enjoyable now. I had hoped this mount would make me want to play WvW more than before, but this change is disappointing.

Yep, I'm back to running of foot. Before it's all over, the mount will be a vanity item you can buy skins for.

[Turk.5460]

@Loosmaster.8263 said:

@"Silverwing.8750" said:With the latest leap range reduction the mount now feels like I am riding a "fat cat" rather than an agile lion.

I wish there was another way to fix the exploits as I find the mount less enjoyable now. I had hoped this mount would make me want to play WvW more than before, but this change is disappointing.

Yep, I'm back to running of foot. Before it's all over, the mount will be a vanity item you can buy skins for.

Good.

[Zaoda.1653]

Any update from the devs as to whether we'll get the original leap distance of the Warclaw back, once they've fixed the exploitable areas?

In terms of what I'd like to see with the Warclaw for improvements:

• original leap distance come back once the exploitable areas have been fixed, as this distance is a really nice thing to have. The current distance in the leap is too short.

• Make it easier to engage and disengage gates with the 3rd skill. Right now you have to use skill #3, followed by skill #1, and be facing the right way, within a specific radius that is invisible/shows no way of knowing if you're close enough to the gate (basically you have to have all your eggs in 1 basket with your fingers all crossed at once). This is simply too frustrating.

Make it, instead, so that all you have to do is be within the area of the gate (perhaps have a red circle/radius indicator appear when your warclaw gets close enough to a gate), use skill #3, and it automatically starts tugging at the gate - and if an enemy starts attacking you, make it so that you can move out of the way - and when you move, you instantly disengage from the gate. Right now, if you're already engaging with a gate and someone is attacking your mount, it's really difficult to disengage and run away. That's a real downside in my opinion.

[mixxed.5862]

I'd like to know as well. The longer leap was so much more fun, I hope it's only a temporary fix until they've addressed the exploits.Of course it was very easy to escape with before and the burst speed was pretty high with 3 dodges but I rather they reduce the number of dodges to 2 (with mastery) instead of making it feel worse.

A few more ideas I've picked up:

• Maul dismounts enemies hit.
• You're revealed while mounted. (There's enough ganking from stealth in the game already.)
• Reduce the health a bit for the sake of solo roaming.
• Cripple, chill, immobilize slow the warclaw by ~33% and also reduce the leap's length. (Doesn't stack.)

But overall I think the Warclaw is a good addition to the game mode. It's something fresh and fun and makes movement across the big maps far more enjoyable.I just wish they put in some more work to balance it a little better for roaming, and revert the leap nerf eventually!

[displayname.8315]

Too bad it got nerfed, it made WvW a lot more fun. Still useful but just barely. Hope the leaps come back.

[Duckota.4769]

You guys realize the leap distance was quite literally OP and it got nerfed 100 range at best and shouldnt have existed to begin with?

[Kylden Ar.3724]

@Sealreth.1425 said:I'd like to see all CC skills to dismount player. Finding small scale fights Ganking is even harder now. when everyone can just outrun. I believe it is fine with simple abilities and jus ta movement buff between fights....

FTFY.

@Turk.5460 said:Reducing the mount's mobility with the leap was definitely a step in the right direction. Why not give the mounts a defiance bar if you are set on having them continue to be immune to CC?

Either a defiance bar, OR the engage should also dismount the target. They added a dismount ability to balista after all.

[displayname.8315]

@Duckota.4769 said:You guys realize the leap distance was quite literally OP and it got nerfed 100 range at best and shouldnt have existed to begin with?

I always though OP meant someone has an advantage. Since all classes/races can use it not sure that applies. Maybe you didn't like that amount of gap closer but it can leave you stranded too you know.

[schokelmei.8271]

Many classes mobility is op for years, stealth is op for years, but the amount of mount issues that "suddenly" coming up baffles me. Let's fix the issues with stealth and mobility aka balancing first and leave the mount as it is? Deal?

[Duckota.4769]

@"gebrechen.5643" said:Many classes mobility is op for years, stealth is op for years, but the amount of mount issues that "suddenly" coming up baffles me. Let's fix the issues with stealth and mobility aka balancing first and leave the mount as it is? Deal?

The thing is they are only issues if you don';t have to give up anything for that mobility. So since we all have mounts and all have mobility we gonna give core thief damage and sustain back? I highly doubt that is something people would want to do. Some classes didn't give up anything like condi mirage. However that needed to be fixed (kinda was this past patch to be fair). Not everyone needed mobility to make up for the few classes that lacked it when they excelled in other areas.

[Aeolus.3615]

@Sealreth.1425 said:I'd like to see all CC skills to dismount player. Finding small scale fights is even harder now. when everyone can just outrun. I believe it is fine with simple abilities and jus ta movement buff between fights....

I would love dragon maw fron DH CC'ing the mount xD

isnt Dh lore ment to hunt beasts?

[displayname.8315]

@Duckota.4769 said:

@"gebrechen.5643" said:Many classes mobility is op for years, stealth is op for years, but the amount of mount issues that "suddenly" coming up baffles me. Let's fix the issues with stealth and mobility aka balancing first and leave the mount as it is? Deal?

The thing is they are only issues if you don';t have to give up anything for that mobility. So since we all have mounts and all have mobility we gonna give core thief damage and sustain back? I highly doubt that is something people would want to do. Some classes didn't give up anything like condi mirage. However that needed to be fixed (kinda was this past patch to be fair). Not everyone needed mobility to make up for the few classes that lacked it when they excelled in other areas.

Mounts can't be used in combat. Can't be compared to what happens in a fight.

[mixxed.5862]

@Duckota.4769 said:

@"gebrechen.5643" said:Many classes mobility is op for years, stealth is op for years, but the amount of mount issues that "suddenly" coming up baffles me. Let's fix the issues with stealth and mobility aka balancing first and leave the mount as it is? Deal?

The thing is they are only issues if you don';t have to give up anything for that mobility. So since we all have mounts and all have mobility we gonna give core thief damage and sustain back? I highly doubt that is something people would want to do. Some classes didn't give up anything like condi mirage. However that needed to be fixed (kinda was this past patch to be fair). Not everyone needed mobility to make up for the few classes that lacked it when they excelled in other areas.

Your mobility advantage in combat is just as big as it always was. You can still beat every build you could previously. You can't mount up while in combat! So the mount didn't change a thing in that regard. Plus you can disengage a fight even more easily than before. Just use your mobility or stealth to get out of combat and then mount up.Thus your argument seems rather weak.The only diffrence is that for example thiefs can't get out of combat to heal up anymore to then rengage for a second chance. They can't sniper unsuspecting squishies from stealth any longer or oneshot with a malicious backstab. I think that's a healthy change and I prefer roaming on thief myself.

But it should still be easy enough to catch a mounted player in transit to engage her/him in a fight. That needs some more work. Because otherwise roaming in a map filled with zerglings gets boring quickly.

[Duckota.4769]

@displayname.8315 said:

@Duckota.4769 said:

@"gebrechen.5643" said:Many classes mobility is op for years, stealth is op for years, but the amount of mount issues that "suddenly" coming up baffles me. Let's fix the issues with stealth and mobility aka balancing first and leave the mount as it is? Deal?

The thing is they are only issues if you don';t have to give up anything for that mobility. So since we all have mounts and all have mobility we gonna give core thief damage and sustain back? I highly doubt that is something people would want to do. Some classes didn't give up anything like condi mirage. However that needed to be fixed (kinda was this past patch to be fair). Not everyone needed mobility to make up for the few classes that lacked it when they excelled in other areas.

Mounts can't be used in combat. Can't be compared to what happens in a fight.

They most definitely can be compared considering you have to put yourself in combat to deal with a mount. It doesnt even make sense why they wouldnt be able to be compared. You use CDs to dismount someone. You have less when you do dismount them or they jump off. You use mobility abilities to keep up with said mount. I think it definitely matters.

Edit: Also what? I just thought about it. Your statement is totally wrong. Mounts can be used in combat. If they couldn't be you'd be dismounted the moment I hit you. I know another game that did that and mounts there aren't complained about in competitive game modes. Hm.......

[Duckota.4769]

@mixxed.5862 said:

@Duckota.4769 said:

@"gebrechen.5643" said:Many classes mobility is op for years, stealth is op for years, but the amount of mount issues that "suddenly" coming up baffles me. Let's fix the issues with stealth and mobility aka balancing first and leave the mount as it is? Deal?

The thing is they are only issues if you don';t have to give up anything for that mobility. So since we all have mounts and all have mobility we gonna give core thief damage and sustain back? I highly doubt that is something people would want to do. Some classes didn't give up anything like condi mirage. However that needed to be fixed (kinda was this past patch to be fair). Not everyone needed mobility to make up for the few classes that lacked it when they excelled in other areas.

Your mobility advantage in combat is just as big as it always was. You can still beat every build you could previously. You can't mount up while in combat! So the mount didn't change a thing in that regard. Plus you can disengage a fight even more easily than before. Just use your mobility or stealth to get out of combat and then mount up.Thus your argument seems rather weak.The only diffrence is that for example thiefs can't get out of combat to heal up anymore to then rengage for a second chance. They can't sniper unsuspecting squishies from stealth any longer or oneshot with a malicious backstab. I think that's a healthy change and I prefer roaming on thief myself.

But it should still be easy enough to catch a mounted player in transit to engage her/him in a fight. That needs some more work. Because otherwise roaming in a map filled with zerglings gets boring quickly.

Right but all of those disengage tools I have to burn just to engage a mounted player. That is a balance issue. If I have to do that I should get something in return since my mobility once in combat is severely limited. However the more sensible thing to do is like you said. Bring mounts to a more reasonable level.

[Dawdler.8521]

@displayname.8315 said:

@Duckota.4769 said:You guys realize the leap distance was quite literally OP and it got nerfed 100 range at best and shouldnt have existed to begin with?

I always though OP meant someone has an advantage. Since all classes/races can use it not sure that applies. Maybe you didn't like that amount of gap closer but it can leave you stranded too you know.If all classes had an elite skill that dealt 50k AoE damage at 1200 range with a 5s cooldown, would that be totally ok and not OP?

Just wondering where we draw the line here.

[mixxed.5862]

@Duckota.4769 said:

@mixxed.5862 said:

@Duckota.4769 said:

@"gebrechen.5643" said:Many classes mobility is op for years, stealth is op for years, but the amount of mount issues that "suddenly" coming up baffles me. Let's fix the issues with stealth and mobility aka balancing first and leave the mount as it is? Deal?

The thing is they are only issues if you don';t have to give up anything for that mobility. So since we all have mounts and all have mobility we gonna give core thief damage and sustain back? I highly doubt that is something people would want to do. Some classes didn't give up anything like condi mirage. However that needed to be fixed (kinda was this past patch to be fair). Not everyone needed mobility to make up for the few classes that lacked it when they excelled in other areas.

Your mobility advantage in combat is just as big as it always was. You can still beat every build you could previously. You can't mount up while in combat! So the mount didn't change a thing in that regard. Plus you can disengage a fight even more easily than before. Just use your mobility or stealth to get out of combat and then mount up.Thus your argument seems rather weak.The only diffrence is that for example thiefs can't get out of combat to heal up anymore to then rengage for a second chance. They can't sniper unsuspecting squishies from stealth any longer or oneshot with a malicious backstab. I think that's a healthy change and I prefer roaming on thief myself.

But it should still be easy enough to catch a mounted player in transit to engage her/him in a fight. That needs some more work. Because otherwise roaming in a map filled with zerglings gets boring quickly.

Right but all of those disengage tools I have to burn just to engage a mounted player. That is a balance issue. If I have to do that I should get something in return since my mobility once in combat is severely limited. However the more sensible thing to do is like you said. Bring mounts to a more reasonable level.

I agree with you on that part!A few resources spent on dismounting a passer-by isn't necessarily a bad thing as long as it doesn't get too annoying and is doable for most roaming builds.

I meant to argue: I believe mounts aren't inherently broken or bad for roaming. The Warclaw needs a couple of tweaks and it will be pretty great even for small scale.