Bombs and Grenades

[jaif.3518]

I normally play WvW, and I've used the mortar kit since the patch with good success. I decided to take the bomb and grenade kits out in PvE...and I wasn't that impressed. I think the bombs are too hard to place for the value they bring. The grenade kit is fine with lots of mobs, but if I'm going back to WvW I'll just use the mortar at that point and take a slight damage hit for range, a the fury trait, and an extra skill slot.

Anybody else tried these? I'd like to make things go boom. :-)

-Jeff

[Yasai.3549]

They should make Short Fuse cause Bombs to instantly explode.Will make Bombs a great "melee" kit for Engineer.

[Tinnel.4369]

I actually think grenades with explosives trait line in WvW is pretty great.

[wolfyrik.2017]

I always feel let down by both. Grenades are in a better place generally but bombs just feel completely off. Maybe having bombs look and feel how I'd want them would simply result in a clunky OP kit. Explosions from bomb kit should look and feel big, they should have impact. Instead they're more like timed farts.

A survey on the forum sometime ago, saw more respondants thinking bombs were fine than not and one of the options iirc was to have longer cooldowns for more damage / effects. I still think that would be much better.
Make each bomb a 20-30 second cooldown and a shared cooldown between uses like Elementalist's element change but with equivalent force and impact of BoB and we'd have something worthy of being called a bomb kit. I'm not saying each one should have knockback/cc but that they should each feel powerful.

As I said, maybe I'm way off on this and it would be far too powerful. That's just how I feel.

[XIII.9615]

Back in the day Bomb Kit was only really viable in conquest to force a decap. Bombs can zone an opponent out, but they don't really guarantee any damage, because it's easy to time them or just walk away.

Bomb Kit needs a trait that adds utility for it to be viable. It's the same with grenades, which you wouldn't run without the trait that increases throw velocity. You could argue that something like this should be baseline like the trait that increased the aoe of bombs back in the day.

That's why I would rather see something interesting like a trait that gives bombs a remote trigger, or multiple charges, or turns them into sticky bombs.

[jaif.3518]

For grenades, and again this is from a WvW perspective, I'd rather use the mortar kit. I lose some damage and some condi. I gain 1500 range, and a perma-fury trait.

For bombs, I agree something dramatic is needed.

-Jeff

[Tinnel.4369]

@jaif.3518 said:For grenades, and again this is from a WvW perspective, I'd rather use the mortar kit. I lose some damage and some condi. I gain 1500 range, and a perma-fury trait.

For bombs, I agree something dramatic is needed.

-Jeff

I use both kits situationally with engi runes. Grenade #1 is nice damage, nicer with explosive entrance. Grenade barrage is nice damage, nicer with explosive entrance. With firearms, grenade #2 into a decent size group is nice might stacks and the poison grenade gives 1k ticks with celestial.

Mortar gives the better range and fields, again nice with explosive entrance.

[kharmin.7683]

I play OWPvE almost exclusively and the engineer kits aren't viable for me and my experience. Loved turrets until they nerfed the ability to toss them. I do enjoy my holosmith, but I still don't use any kits. I'm sure that I'm not getting the most out of the profession, but I really don't feel it works all that well for open world.

[Skro.2691]

Hammer + Bomb kit Scrapper is the highest viable DPS build in WvW right now if you are running an organized comp. Only thing that can compete with it is a full glass Weaver provided they aren't getting harassed by cloud.

[ApaWanka.2698]

I’ve used to love bombs in the old core times when cóndition engi based on confusion were a thing as a wvw roamed. That was the build that I’ve enjoy the most, the one that made engi my main

Right now bomb kit is not pair with present times.

To come back needs to include at least the quick detonation baseline or with a trait and the buff of condi engi traits that are completely sub-par almost any other profesion in condition aplication.

[Dawdler.8521]

@jaif.3518 said:For grenades, and again this is from a WvW perspective, I'd rather use the mortar kit. I lose some damage and some condi. I gain 1500 range, and a perma-fury trait.I met a holo using mortar vs my condi vanilla. Some celestial style build I think - he had pistols but didnt seem to do any particular condi damage.

Oh dear lord how utterly useless that mortar was. I dont think he hit a single shot of it while I danced around and pewpewd him to death.

There is a reason you never ever see engineers using mortar in actual combat, lol.

[Zzik.5873]

I think grenade and mortar are too similar and sadly not fun to play, each skill do almost the samething except with a different color flavor. Yes the old mortar was kind of issssh but I prefer those skill. For bomb well its on the same level boring to play and not that great design wise. I would not mind a total rework of those 3 kits Mortal could become more of a rocket launcher with an auto attack that shoot auto guided rockect kind of, some missle barrage, maybe a laser, etc. Grenade is not half bad but his skill could use some more variety. Bomb welp bomb is just trash dont know what to do with it, maybe more of a mine setter/bomb hybrid.

[ILoveMonotony.1479]

The kit play style is hit or miss really. You either like it or hate it.

For me personally it has always been the most fun part of the profession. I'm really happy that kits got some love recently and I'm hoping that there is more to come. Especially for the PvP portion of the game.

[EUmad.7645]

Bombs are good if you play condi .... bomb2 and bomb3 are not bad at all in a condi setup. They are not a power weapon more .

[Tinnel.4369]

That Grenadier and Short Fuse traits compete is really too bad. Where do Engi's find fury?!?!

[ILoveMonotony.1479]

@Tinnel.4369 said:That Grenadier and Short Fuse traits compete is really too bad. Where do Engi's find fury?!?!

There's plenty going around in the PvP section.

[Tinnel.4369]

@Elmo Benchwarmer.3025 said:

@Tinnel.4369 said:That Grenadier and Short Fuse traits compete is really too bad. Where do Engi's find fury?!?!

There's plenty going around in the PvP section.

Yeah, not always so much in WvW though.

[MrForz.1953]

@Tinnel.4369 said:That Grenadier and Short Fuse traits compete is really too bad. Where do Engi's find fury?!?!

Firearms, No Scope. Problem is... It's Firearms.

[Tinnel.4369]

@MrForz.1953 said:

@Tinnel.4369 said:That Grenadier and Short Fuse traits compete is really too bad. Where do Engi's find fury?!?!

Firearms, No Scope. Problem is... It's Firearms.

Exactly

[UNOwen.7132]

@Tinnel.4369 said:That Grenadier and Short Fuse traits compete is really too bad. Where do Engi's find fury?!?!

True that is slightly awkward, but Ive mostly been relying on Elixir B for Fury and its been working out well for me. Plus there is Hidden Flask and Utility Goggles.

[Turkeyspit.3965]

@Tinnel.4369 said:I actually think grenades with explosives trait line in WvW is pretty great.

I tried it over the weekend on my Scrapper, but it just wasn't delivering for me, even with running Grenadier. In the end I just opted to run a 3rd Gyro (Purge) for higher superspeed uptime, extra condi cleanse, and the poison field toolbelt. The Mortar Kit alone justifies the Explosives traitline in group fights - just gotta dodge those reflects lol.

[Turkeyspit.3965]

@Skro.2691 said:Hammer + Bomb kit Scrapper is the highest viable DPS build in WvW right now if you are running an organized comp. Only thing that can compete with it is a full glass Weaver provided they aren't getting harassed by cloud.

In a GvG or between organized groups, sure. But if the enemy is clouding, your melee push won't get the enemy density to see that DPS from bombs. I found once shredder gyro + hammer were on cd, switching to mortar kit was the best option. But if we were doing a melee push onto another stacked group, yeah, those bombs will do a number on any that are immob/cc or in downed state.

The amount of siege I took down by using mortar kit from walls was hilarious. In some spots you can arc the projectiles out over the edge of the wall, but still be safe from the usual AoE (marks, SoJ, font) and you can easily sidestep out of a meteor shower or barrage. Lucky few people run mesmers anymore, since I'm sure I would have been pulled off once elixir was on CD.

[Shroud.2307]

On the subject of Bombs, I think it would be nice if they were reworked to be thrown instead of placed and without the need for ground targeting like Grenade Kit.

To clarify, imagine throwing Bombs at people with the same animation as Throw Mine except having them explode on impact and not needing to ground target. 900 range, still creates a field where it lands, can be double pressed to detonate early so you can still blow them up point blank if you want to combo on yourself. That way the kit can double as melee and ranged also with a faster cast time.

[Dawdler.8521]

@"SpellOfIniquity.1780" said:On the subject of Bombs, I think it would be nice if they were reworked to be thrown instead of placed and without the need for ground targeting like Grenade Kit.

To clarify, imagine throwing Bombs at people with the same animation as Throw Mine except having them explode on impact and not needing to ground target. 900 range, still creates a field where it lands, can be double pressed to detonate early so you can still blow them up point blank if you want to combo on yourself. That way the kit can double as melee and ranged also with a faster cast time.Get all the pros and none of the cons!

Sidenote because I forgot to mention it above:

"Bomber och granater!" is actually one of Captain Haddocks many, many ways of swearing in Swedish.