About the people who won't get free Curious Creatures Mount Select License after the rollback

[Astralporing.1957]

@"coso.9173" said:that's one of the problems with the approach they took for compensation indeed.I don't think that they thought much how to do it, but I can understand their logic for choosing who to give it to.You said several times that the method they used for selection was okay, because it was a simple method that allowed them to compensate everyone that needed it, even if they compensated a lot of players that didn;t need it at the same time. And that it was okay to be used because they could be sure that people that did not log in also didn;t lose anything. Turns out, that assumption is completely wrong.

basically, we have now a case where compensation is completely independent on whether someone lost something or not. We have both people that lost something not getting compensated, as well as people that didn't lose anything getting "compensated". With a number of people that got compensated (seemingly completely at random) twice.

Do you still think that sending the license to everyone (or not sending it to anyone) would not have been better than this mess?

[Tiilimon.6094]

You should probably read the news section, Astralporing.

"If you find that you are still missing items or account progress, submit a ticket and Customer Support will help you as soon as possible."

[Kasemdria.7138]

Gosh, I think I would have felt a bit sick to the stomach logging in to that kind of a mess. :astonished: I can understand why some of you are not playing until this is resolved.Holding thumbs that it gets sorted out soon! Please keep keep us posted.

(First time I've heard someone say they are an experienced player for playing on a crappy server... Can I say I'm an experienced player cos I have crappy internet and live super far from the servers? :p )

[Selene.5318]

“If you obtained a rare and valuable item during the affected period […] please contact Customer Support for help.”

Group B – These are people that did not intend to play. They indeed lost nothing.

But there is another group – group D.People that could not log in lost all daily activities.
Some people lost a lot of gold on the trading post and still count as people that “lost nothing”.

I’m not claiming that people that played for six hours and lost all that progress are not affected, of course they are the ones that are affected most.

But people that logged in for a minute receive the same compensation, while people that lost all their daily rewards or lots of gold get pretty much nothing.

I really don’t understand how people don’t mind that group C receives the same compensation as A, but think group D should not get the same.

[Shadowmoon.7986]

Sounds to me like NA should have also be shut down and rolled backed to prevent this insanity, and I am a NA player btw. This is the problem with having both economies intermixed, when one is rolled back and other other is not, it opens things up for duping and deletion. At that point, CS only need to worry about refunding people gems bought with real $ during the time period that gets erased.

[Astralporing.1957]

@"Tiilimon.6094" said:You should probably read the news section, Astralporing.

"If you find that you are still missing items or account progress, submit a ticket and Customer Support will help you as soon as possible."That applies equally to those that did log in and received the license.

Both groups lost progress. Both can contact Customer support for help. One group however gets a license, while other doesn't. Notice, how the only difference between those groups is whether they logged in at some point, or not.

In short, the license is not about lost progress or anything like that. It is only a reward for logging in. Not a compensation for anything else.

[Tiilimon.6094]

You should probably read the news again then, anet has also clearly stated what the license was given for.

"Our goal is that players never lose progress in GW2 and in this instance we didn’t live up to that standard. To those who lost progress we gifted the mount select license as a small way to help make that loss up to them."

I don't understand how something this clear can confuse people.

[Gaf.6709]

well i was online when it happened, and got thrown off, repeatedly tried to log in, but got thrown off all the time and got error codes. then they finally got the servers up and running again, and I could get back online, then i see, that i lost a new char I had just started, and some of my legendary crafting had been removed. and after all that, I have still not received any mount from Anet, and that is pretty awful, especially when you can read here on the forum as well as on reddit that several players have received 2 or more, of the new mounts, including people who have not been online at all. but such a person as me who was thrown off and lost things and chars gets NOTHING! Awful!

[Tiilimon.6094]

@Gaf.6709 said:well i was online when it happened, and got thrown off, repeatedly tried to log in, but got thrown off all the time and got error codes. then they finally got the servers up and running again, and I could get back online, then i see, that i lost a new char I had just started, and some of my legendary crafting had been removed. and after all that, I have still not received any mount from Anet, and that is pretty awful, especially when you can read here on the forum as well as on reddit that several players have received 2 or more, of the new mounts, including people who have not been online at all. but such a person as me who was thrown off and lost things and chars gets NOTHING! Awful!

So, have you contacted customer support?

[Friday.7864]

@"Tiilimon.6094" said:You should probably read the news again then, anet has also clearly stated what the license was given for.

"Our goal is that players never lose progress in GW2 and in this instance we didn’t live up to that standard. To those who lost progress we gifted the mount select license as a small way to help make that loss up to them."

I don't understand how something this clear can confuse people.

They can be as clear as they want. Doesn't change the fact they approached this in the wrong way and rushed with the reward instead of rushing with shutting the servers down.After the server rolled back it should have been turned off the moment it happened aka they shouldn't have allowed people to log in and lose progress.This rollback affected anyone who played between Friday (think it rolled back that far) and Monday in one way or another and they should have treated it like that - no matter what the eventual compensation would have been.

[Astralporing.1957]

@"Tiilimon.6094" said:You should probably read the news again then, anet has also clearly stated what the license was given for.

"Our goal is that players never lose progress in GW2 and in this instance we didn’t live up to that standard. To those who lost progress we gifted the mount select license as a small way to help make that loss up to them."

I don't understand how something this clear can confuse people.Perhaps because what they said is not what they did. They did not give the licence to "those who lost progress". They gave it so some that did lose progress and some that didn't, while at the same time they didn;t give it to some that lost progress (and some that didn't). Basically, the intention they stated and the selection criteria did not match.

[yann.1946]

@Randulf.7614 said:

@Selene.5318 said:Can someone help me understand why some people deserve a different, far better compensation than the rest of the affected players?

This is my understanding of the situation:

Everyone that logged in during the time that was rolled back received the superior compensation, regardless of what was lost.

Everyone that received a valuable drop during that time can contact support and the drop will be restored.

Things like login rewards, dailies, including festival dailies, levels and achievement points are lost.

Everyone that did not log in during that time frame but wanted to log in later that day was unable to receive their login rewards, complete their dailies, gain levels, etc. due to the fact that the servers were down and the progress was lost.

People that lost gold on the trading post while the EU servers were down did not receive the superior compensation nor their gold back.

Why is losing progress to a roll back worse than losing the same to unavailable servers?Why is losing a valuable drop temporarily worse than losing gold apparently forever?

Because Anet values the progress players made within that time that could not be restored. People lost the ability to login yes and they compensated everyone because of that a communal bonfire. But those logged in, risked or did have, actual progress wiped from their account. So they ended up playing, losing everything that they played and then ended up in the same boat as everyone else. Because of that actual gameplay loss within that time window where no progress could be restored, Anet gave an extra apologetic gift.

Everyone lost to unavailable servers, but not everyone played and had a partial account wipe as well. Hence the two packages.

The only really valid counter argument is whether the perceived value of the two compensation packages is balanced. If the gift was for example 1 bonfire for all or 2 for those in that window, the response would be almost certainly be muted because it was never realistically about any moral outrage. It was about the mount skin being offered up and the value of that skin vs the bonfire. Anet obviously valued actual progression loss quite high and hence went straight to a decent compensation item.

I can understand that counter argument even if I don't agree with it and am happy enough with what Anet wanted to do (for context, I did not get a mount skin, nor do I believe I deserve one since I lost nothing. I used the time I would have played to do something else)

The real issue will be if this anecdotal info about duplicated or incorrectly rewarded mount skins is correct. Most forum ancedotes related to support incidents have almost always been proven false, however if there is truth to them on this occasion, then Anet will need to address that.

i completely agree with your assesment of the fairness.

Its to bad that fairness doesn't matter in this case. Because the only thing thats relevant is whether people feel like they have been wronged.

[yann.1946]

@Astralporing.1957 said:

@"Tiilimon.6094" said:You should probably read the news again then, anet has also clearly stated what the license was given for.

"Our goal is that players never lose progress in GW2 and in this instance we didn’t live up to that standard. To those who lost progress we gifted the mount select license as a small way to help make that loss up to them."

I don't understand how something this clear can confuse people.Perhaps because what they said is not what they did. They did not give the licence to "those who lost progress". They gave it so some that did lose progress and some that didn't, while at the same time they didn;t give it to some that lost progress (and some that didn't). Basically, the intention they stated and the selection criteria did not match.

it matters because the intent was a fair one.

It does suck that your probably right that they should have given it to everyone. although from my point of view its not because its more fair, i consider it more unfair then the present situation, but its because you cant expect the community stay levelheaded in this situation.

[Tiilimon.6094]

If you're eligible for the license by getting your monday progress wiped after the weekend restoration and didn't get it, just contact customer support.They didn't leave you out of the mailing list out of malice, and will most likely sort it out, but right now it might take time because there's like a million guys writing complaints for not being eligible for the compensation.

[Astralporing.1957]

@yann.1946 said:it matters because the intent was a fair one.The intent might have been a fair one. What has been done to implement it wasn't. In the end, actions speak louder than words.

@Tiilimon.6094 said:If you're eligible for the license by getting your monday progress wiped after the weekend restoration and didn't get it, just contact customer support.They didn't leave you out of the mailing list out of malice, and will most likely sort it out, but right now it might take time because there's like a million guys writing complaints for not being eligible for the compensation.Sorry, but it does not work like that. Losing anything due to rollback does not make you eligible for obtaining mount licence. Only logging in during a specific time (regardless of whether you lost anything or not) does.

The stated intent does not match the actions that were actually taken.

[Cyndercat.7615]

@"Tiilimon.6094" said:You should probably read the news again then, anet has also clearly stated what the license was given for.

"Our goal is that players never lose progress in GW2 and in this instance we didn’t live up to that standard. To those who lost progress we gifted the mount select license as a small way to help make that loss up to them."

I don't understand how something this clear can confuse people.

If the mount was given to everyone who lost progress, why wasnt I given one. I lost around 4-5g from orders on TP. But I didnt log in on Monday, because I thought it was pointless to play a broken game. 4-5G isnt enough to make a support ticked about but 2g worth of dailies for the people who did log in is enough to get 12 euros worth of gemstore items? Wheres the logic or fairness in that.

Id rather lose a full 3 days worth of gameplay and get the mount than what I have now.

[Etria.3642]

I hope everyone who lost anything should get their items and gold replaced.

I am NA so did not in this case lose anything, but to compare: in a SWTOR quest, it bugged, and could be replicated yet when I requested my money back(1.875 million) the customer rep who contacted me had to login to my account to duplicate it. He did duplicate it. SWTOR removed the event following this duplication. But he told me, "I see you have plenty of credits, you'll make this back today."

I was, and am, still furious. Just because yes, I play the market there does NOT mean my millions are less hard-earned than a player who only has a couple.

So I truly truly hope that Anet does not make this same mistake. 100 gold is 100 gold and worth replacing whether that account has 5 gold, 100 gold, 1000 gold or a million gold. If the player cares enough to make a ticket, IT MATTERS TO THEM. Do not brush off or treat it as "inconsequential".

[Tiilimon.6094]

The developers don't view your lost gold as progress, they view it as losing assets. Losing progress for them means having your actual playtime wiped from existence.They also stated what you should do in such a situation, have you contacted support yet?

Did you see into the future on monday or what? How did you know what would happen and what was pointless or not?

[Astralporing.1957]

@Tiilimon.6094 said:The developers don't view your lost gold as progress, they view it as losing assets. Losing progress for them means having your actual playtime wiped from existence.So, we're going to redefine what constitutes game progress in order to fit the narrative now?

@Tiilimon.6094 said:Did you see into the future on monday or what? How did you know what would happen and what was pointless or not?Yes, many of us did indeed see into the future and were telling people that 100% the game will be rollbacked, and everyone playing at the moment will lose progress. If you look closer, you might even see some posts outlining what's going to happen with TP transactions if only EU gets rollbacked. Some of those posts were even mine.

Turns out, all those forecasts did happen exactly as predicted.

It doesn't require magical powers, you know. It's called being IT savvy and knowing how databases work.

[Luthan.5236]

Well ... if gold was only "assets" and not "progress" this would mean precursors and stuff like that ... also were only "assets". But they seem to restore precursors - as said in the announcement.

Yes. You can say "progress" is only stuff like achievements and story progress and leveling (experience). But that does not make sense here. Also farming the gold took time as well I guess.

I guess it is just a technical thing for them with the gold on TP being lost on monday being different than the other stuff gained on monday. If that gold actually had been earned earlier it wasn't progress made on monday. If it was through TP stuff being sold while you were not logged in ... it might be in different logs (TP logs not the actual logs of the servers being played on on monday) ... making it a different process.

I still think they should restore it - or give people that have not logged in but lost money at the TP the licens for this.But well ... they seem to have made their decision. Nothing that can be done about this. (Other than hoping and praying that some time they suddenly will change their mind. Which of course will happen suddenly - because before that there is no real communication because of the communication policy that makes them stay silent until then.)

[Friday.7864]

It doesn't require magical powers, you know. It's called being IT savvy and knowing how databases work.

Even less than that, and many people advised others not to log in for that very reason, knowing anything you do would be lost.Only to end up apologizing later on because Anet let the servers running for hours and handed out stuff for trying to play on broken servers.

[Craine.8162]

@"Tiilimon.6094" said:You should probably read the news again then, anet has also clearly stated what the license was given for.

"Our goal is that players never lose progress in GW2 and in this instance we didn’t live up to that standard. To those who lost progress we gifted the mount select license as a small way to help make that loss up to them."

I don't understand how something this clear can confuse people.

Let me rephrase your comment:"ANet said 'we never want to hurt you' and hit us in the face at the same time.But they said they didnt want to hurt us, so thats what matters."

I hope you see the flaw behind this logic.

[melody.2601]

So to make it clear, everybody who is Online right now in the Game, is not affected, and should not get a compensation, only the people who tried to Log-In are affected and should be compensated.

[Tiilimon.6094]

Hyrai, if you wish to bend the statements made by anet, sure.I'm just quoting the news post.

I'm also posting definitions of words, as people posting in this thread don't seem to understand the difference of the words compensation and reward, and that an item that can be bought for 1200 gems is not the same as 1200 gems, and neither is it worth 12 euros.

You can still contact support if you've lost assets, that information can also be found in the news posted by anet.

[Craine.8162]

Exactly, you just quoted their statement like a parrot without looking at whats happening "behind the curtains".I dont care what their statement says if theyre clearly acting in a different way.