The Consequences of the February 2020 Patch

[Zagerus.8675]

The Feb. Patch that came at the beginning of the year changed a lot for PvP players. I was deeply disappointed with it - Ranked combat felt like it had slowed to a crawl. Playing aggressively didn't seem to do much anymore. So much effort was needed to do anything. It became more valuable for me to try and interrupt stomps and land poison on a down rather than cleave like crazy. I hated it. I yawned during matches. I felt it was boring. I wanted the fast paced meta back in action instead of this.. turtle race to 500 points. Out of stubbornness (and love) I refused to hop out of GW2 as my main MMO to play, so I bitterly tried to figure out how I could make PvP fun again as I tried to progress my account forward.

I had no clue just how much that February patch was going to change me as a player. Not just for GW2 but for gaming in general. Restraint and patience would (painfully) become a recurring thought during fights. Predatory instinct would shift over and strike a balance with controlled logical decisions in 1v1s. I would have to use skills with more purpose than simply trying to down my opponent as soon as possible. The patch forced me to embrace a type of thought process and playstyle that I couldn't stand (nor had the patience for) in order to function at any semi-decent level in Ranked matches. And I'm so grateful for it. Balance outliers aside, looking at the mechanical/philosophical insight hidden in GW2's Conquest PvP environment and what that experience can provide to players in 2020 - and how brightly it all shines now - I think that it is remarkable and potent. It's wonderful to be able to use a video game to delve into these kinds of aspects of the mind and actually target and train them in an effective way.

[Khalisto.5780]

Congrats for your positive feedback, not much of those here in forums

Now we achieved the second class balance, like necro all thief specs are equaly viable it could be faster, like 4 classes

[la penombre.2415]

I am happy to see some post like that.Yes, the February patch gave players "more time" to interract with each other in a fight, whereas before then, players were looking to avoid it, trying to get rid of their ennemies the fastest way possible.

[Leonidrex.5649]

@"la penombre.2415" said:I am happy to see some post like that.Yes, the February patch gave players "more time" to interract with each other in a fight, whereas before then, players were looking to avoid it, trying to get rid of their ennemies the fastest way possible.

they still do get rid of enemies the fastest way possible, its just not working anymore, Install arcdps, turn it on. start playing glass cannon build.fight any of the meta broken bullshit builds. realize that you can do 250k dmg in 1min fight and everyone is still full hp.Duel people, deal 30k+ dmg and they are still full, since everything heals to extreme, bet it holo with constant pulsing heals, rev with 2 healing skills on top of loads of small heals, or necros running around with 60k+ EHP, and this is not counting supports that also can heal them.Burn DH is a stupid build but I embrace it with open arms to deal with those fucking bunkers. God Bless.

[Bazsi.2734]

@Leonidrex.5649 said:snipBurn DH is a stupid build

Yes and it's a problem. PvP should be a safespace of sustain and boons, noone should die just because they facetanked an entire combo from some build.

but I embrace it with open arms to deal with those kitten bunkers. God Bless.

Oh my god do you want player characters to die in a game? I thought you're a good person.

[Leonidrex.5649]

@Bazsi.2734 said:

@Leonidrex.5649 said:snipBurn DH is a stupid build

Yes and it's a problem. PvP should be a safespace of sustain and boons, noone should die just because they facetanked an entire combo from some build.

but I embrace it with open arms to deal with those kitten bunkers. God Bless.

Oh my god do you want player characters to die in a game? I thought you're a good person.

Im a mesmer, I create copies of myself with simple intention if detonating them, that is the way.

[lare.5129]

what I ready aslo see, more often both teams can't reach 500 point per match

[Psycoprophet.8107]

The feb patch was definitely well recieved and the follow up was great as well, I mean the flourishing pvp population shows this,Great job anet :)

[Stand The Wall.6987]

but but metabattle is half zerk amulets

[Ziggityzog.7389]

The last great patch was well worth it. It slowed down the nuke builds that simply didn't make sense. How could you be a mesmer with 100 ways to avoid damage from evade, dodge, stealth, invulnerability, and hiding around your clones but still be able to spike people to death in 5 seconds with condition dmg kills. There were other broken builds but that's the best show of why it was needed.

Builds should have a give and take. Yes mesmer is squishy but when you chain enough anti damage things together for a long sting of time while spamming deadly condi. You are in reality a broken build.

Either be immune to all damage by means of dodge, evade..... Or have conditions that can kill a enemy in 5 seconds. Not both.

[Jobber.6348]

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:but but metabattle is half zerk amulets

Who needs defensive amulets when the meta picks have so much sustain without? :^)

Next PvP Patch : Remove all amulets with toughness, vitality or healing power.

[Crab Fear.1624]

@Yasai.3549 said:

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:but but metabattle is half zerk amulets

Who needs defensive amulets when the meta picks have so much sustain without? :^)

Next PvP Patch : Remove all amulets with toughness, vitality or healing power.

They really should, it would balance the pace out.

I really cant see the point in armor weights or health tiers with these kind of mitigations.

[Fueki.4753]

I don't mind the reduction of power damage from the February patch.

What I do mind however, is are the following reductions, that ought to have accompanied said power damage reduction, were (and still are) missing:condition application and damageboon uptimesustain and healingStealth uptimenon-player healthcrowd control applicationIf all these had been appropriately reduced, PvP might still be in a pseudo-balanced way, instead of being the CC and Condi clown show that sPvP is since February.

Another thing I disagree with is the butchering of the damage on CC skills.

[NorthernRedStar.3054]

TL;DR, simplified: game's been too low risk / low reward since Feb. One can argue it was too high reward before that, but it certainly went overboard the other way after.

[Leonidrex.5649]

@Fueki.4753 said:I don't mind the reduction of power damage from the February patch.

What I do mind however, is are the following reductions, that ought to have accompanied said power damage reduction, were (and still are) missing:condition application and damageboon uptimesustain and healingStealth uptimenon-player healthcrowd control applicationIf all these had been appropriately reduced, PvP might still be in a pseudo-balanced way, instead of being the CC and Condi clown show that sPvP is since February.

Another thing I disagree with is the butchering of the damage on CC skills.

its power meta as it always was

[Khalisto.5780]

@Yasai.3549 said:

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:but but metabattle is half zerk amulets

Who needs defensive amulets when the meta picks have so much sustain without? :^)

Next PvP Patch : Remove all amulets with toughness, vitality or healing power.

I do think we'll see all 4 stats amulets gone or severely nerfed soon

[Multicolorhipster.9751]

@Khalisto.5780 said:I do think we'll see all 4 stats amulets gone or severely nerfed soon

Oh boy, even less to play with! Man, this game sure is balanced and fun. I can't wait for more things to be nerfed and removed from the game, this is great.

Continue to stay positive, fellows. And thank you for that amazing patch =)

Also I agree OP, its taught me a lot. Not just about the game, but about myself. I've learned so much... About other games

[Jobber.6348]

@Multicolorhipster.9751 said:Oh boy, even less to play with! Man, this game sure is balanced and fun. I can't wait for more things to be nerfed and removed from the game, this is great.

I mean, just take a look at the balance trend our current balance team seems to be doing every patch.They aren't balancing anything, they just play wack a mole until players stop complaining.

They smack something into the dirt, something else takes its place, they smack that next.They keep doing this while refusing to look at key problems of the dominating builds, namely insane sustain combined with easily applied damage, be it condi or otherwise.CC is still a problem - 100% they just gonna increase cooldowns/energy costs and be done with it.

What? Sustain is an option?

1. Hmmm I can rebalance the traits or rework them so they aren't that problematic and oppressiveor
2. Remove amulets which give durability.

OH BOY I WONDER WHICH OPTION IS THE EASIER ONE THEY'LL GO FORSo as a result, the cream of the crop meta builds which dominate the PvP scene are those which can use pure damage amulets while relying on innate build sustain to survive, because gee, Anet hates fun and toughness/vitality 4 stat amulets are definitely gonna get hit again anyway.

[Multicolorhipster.9751]

@Yasai.3549 said:What? Sustain is an option?

1. Hmmm I can rebalance the traits or rework them so they aren't that problematic and oppressiveor
2. Remove amulets which give durability.

Where's your positivity?! It's not just the ones that give durability! Remember Viper's Amulet?Like my dear friend @"Ziggityzog.7389" was saying:

Either be immune to all damage by means of dodge, evade..... Or have conditions that can kill a enemy in 5 seconds. Not both.

Truly Viper's Amulet which was meant to do only one of those instead of both was ludicrously overpowered and needed to be straight up deleted from the game. There was no patch that could have helped sate that absolute monster of an amulet. It had to go.

And don't even get me started on Celestial. Celestial ammy had carried people to Legend for so many seasons before ranked was a thing, but nevermind that. It was the pinnacle of unbalanced..ness... Unbalancedness!

OH BOY I WONDER WHICH OPTION IS THE EASIER ONE THEY'LL GO FORSo as a result, the cream of the crop meta builds which dominate the PvP scene are those which can use pure damage amulets while relying on innate build sustain to survive, because gee, Anet hates fun and toughness/vitality 4 stat amulets are definitely gonna get hit again anyway.

Fun? Hahahaha! Look inside yourself and ask:"What makes a good video game? How fun it is or how balanced it is?"

Now, don't answer all that. Instead, abandon common sense and go read some forum posts. Balance is all that truly matters according to the highly educated masses.

I for one hope Anet- Well, not Anet actually. I think there's honestly like 1 person in charge of PvP balance stuff now and they can't even interact with the skills team, so they're actually very limited in what they can do, but I hope they continue down this righteous path of nerfing and removing as much as possible and as arbitrarily as possible. Keep it up ?

[Kuma.1503]

Sadly, my dozens of threads warning people that this very scenario would happen were not enough. Perhaps it was inevitable, but hey, once Holo, Rev, and thief get kicked into the dirt, the game will be "balanced" right?

Pfff, no, we'll all start complaining about burn guards.

[Leonidrex.5649]

@"Kuma.1503" said:Sadly, my dozens of threads warning people that this very scenario would happen were not enough. Perhaps it was inevitable, but hey, once Holo, Rev, and thief get kicked into the dirt, the game will be "balanced" right?

Pfff, no, we'll all start complaining about burn guards.

holo thief and rev are still good, and removing celestial was a good choice

[Grand Marshal.4098]

:)EoD releases. New Especs. You wanted more fun? Prepare to see the death of subpar (as of now and probably for the next months) builds!

I try to not get into balance talks much, but damn am I waiting for EoD like crazy. I want to see what happens. Like people realize that it was bad with each Expac, but now? With pretty much 27 ways of playing? How will the new stuff be incorporated?

I may be getting ahead of myself, but seeing how little content overall ANET will be producing until EoD, I doubt another patch will come out until then. So let's be patient I guess.

[Kuma.1503]

@Leonidrex.5649 said:

@"Kuma.1503" said:Sadly, my dozens of threads warning people that this very scenario would happen were not enough. Perhaps it was inevitable, but hey, once Holo, Rev, and thief get kicked into the dirt, the game will be "balanced" right?

Pfff, no, we'll all start complaining about burn guards.

holo thief and rev are still good, and removing celestial was a good choice

I agree, that's why I brought up those three classes. You could easily make the argument (and I'm sure people will once we adapt new builds) that these classes are still broken and need further nerfs. I myself have given examples of build alterations Holo and Rev can make to continue to perform well in spite of the nerfs.

Celestial is a topic for another time.