Legendary armor is... Locked for some people.

[Obtena.7952]

8 minutes ago, yoni.7015 said:

So use CC and avoid Tequatl’s wave and you get legendary armor? You can’t be serious. 
I doubt that those players really would do this epic grind you are proposing. 

Whether you think people would do the grind or not has no bearing on the discussion. The point being made here is that getting leg armor isn't about 'needing' it, because NO player needs it. It's simply a convenience items. So 'not needing' something isn't a reason for Anet to not consider what's being discussed here, since we already see need isn't why we have leg gear in the first place. 

Edited August 8, 2021 by Obtena.7952

[Xanadrine.4352]

8 minutes ago, yoni.7015 said:

So use CC and avoid Tequatl’s wave and you get legendary armor? You can’t be serious. 
I doubt that those players really would do this epic grind you are proposing. 

Oh just stop this is ridiculous at this point. no one said one boss event, gg. 

[Tails.9372]

30 minutes ago, yoni.7015 said:

That’s why I mentioned the new strikes they are planning for EoD, they will have multiple difficulties.

 

Yes, according to the dev. stream it's "challenging" and "very challenging".

[yoni.7015]

3 minutes ago, Zuldari.3940 said:

Oh just stop this is ridiculous at this point. no one said one boss event, gg. 

Yeah, what you are suggesting here is quite ridiculous. You mentioned the wave and CC as examples for this “epic” grind to get legendary armor. 

Edited August 8, 2021 by yoni.7015

[Xanadrine.4352]

14 minutes ago, Zuldari.3940 said:

But do players who don’t know their spells and are wiping for 2 hours in dungeons really need a legendary armor? 

Coming back to this, like i said if they dont do the cheeve right they wont get it its pretty simple. So that takes away your fear of people getting a leggy set that didnt get the accomplishment for it.

[Xanadrine.4352]

2 minutes ago, yoni.7015 said:

Yeah, what you are suggesting here is quite ridiculous. You are talking about an epic journey with a story. Well, that are raids. They tell a story. 

So do the open world zones, the dungeons, the personal story, the LWS, raids are a small part of that, with the broader parts encompassing the world.

[yoni.7015]

1 minute ago, Zuldari.3940 said:

So do the open world zones, the dungeons, the personal story, the LWS, raids are a small part of that, with the broader parts encompassing the world.

Both living world seasons already have their own legendary: vision and aurora. 
 

[Moradorin.6217]

On 8/2/2021 at 2:43 AM, DanAlcedo.3281 said:

Pretty sure they want you to go druid because it's easier to find DPS then a healer. 

 

Not because SB does low DPS. 

 

 

Yea I wouldnt say Soulbeast DPS isnt good. Granted, it did take decent hit in dps, but I see them doing ok dps and have no problem when people wana use it.

 

I agree that Druid is just handy for static rangers to have, at least as an alternative, because waiting around for a druid can get old and waiting can cause raids to break down and squads to fall appart.

 

That said, I cannot help but feel DH, or staff DD are far easier to play and offer equivalent or better dps to power soulbeast and hybrid is a bit harder to play than power soulbeast.

Edited August 8, 2021 by Moradorin.6217

[yoni.7015]

8 minutes ago, Tails.9372 said:

 

Yes, according to the dev. stream it's "challenging" and "very challenging".

And there I could see that a legendary armor set is possible. 

[Astralporing.1957]

1 hour ago, Nephalem.8921 said:

What i dont understand is why even the casuals in ff14 try out extreme trials sometimes while the players in gw2 don't even bother to read their skill descriptions.

You need to look at it in proper context. Yes, casuals in ff xiv do try extreme trials (for mounts or weapons) - but practically never the current ones. They go after the raids from previous expansions (almost always disabling the level/gear downscale), and sometimes late in the release cycle they try the current expansion raids from the very early cycles. Which means they practically never go at them at their original, intended difficulty.

 

I'd say that the amount of casuals that try out the raids at their intended character/gear level in GW2 is much, much higher than in FF XIV. Even though FF XIV is far more raid focused than GW2 is.

[Astralporing.1957]

10 minutes ago, Tails.9372 said:

 

Yes, according to the dev. stream it's "challenging" and "very challenging".

According to devs dungeons were challenging too.

[Tails.9372]

2 minutes ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

According to devs dungeons were challenging too.

 

For the average casual player: they are.

[Xanadrine.4352]

Well im going to play instead of discussing something in an endless loop.

[Moradorin.6217]

Im kinda curious why people posting on this thread, seem like they dont wana do raid armor or wvw/pvp armor but feel they need legendary armor at all for OW or what ever, but dont wana just get raid legendary armor from the 3 current paths?? Sorry I just dont understand the point.

Edited August 8, 2021 by Moradorin.6217
typo

[Astralporing.1957]

6 minutes ago, Tails.9372 said:

 

For the average casual player: they are.

I was just putting that statement in context - "challenging" can mean anything from the dungeons, shiverpeak strike to raids. Very challenging can be Dhuum CM, but can also be anything else raid-tier (down to, say, Cairn and Mursaat Overseer), or even things like Whisper of Jormag.

It's not like they specified whom those strikes will be challenging to.

Edited August 8, 2021 by Astralporing.1957

[Zalavaaris.5329]

38 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

Yes and the INTERESTING thing about that is for PVP and WvW, there isn't a subset of content that armor is relegated to. In PVE there is. 

Not true, you have to play rated PVP

[hash.8462]

17 minutes ago, Zalavaaris.5329 said:

Not true, you have to play rated PVP

That is 90% of PvP (the gameplay is no different in the other modes).

In WvW you can't get pips in EotM, and in fact there is practically no one there.

In PvE is the opposite.

 

You would have the same problem if in PvP you could get pips only playing Stronghold, that is the difference.

Edited August 8, 2021 by hash.8462

[Zalavaaris.5329]

Just now, hash.8462 said:

That is 99% of PvP (the gameplay is no different in the other modes).

In WvW you can't get pips in EotM, and in fact there is practically no one there.

In PvE is the opposite.

 

You would have the same problem if in PvP you could get pips only playing Stronghold, that is the difference.

Don't start cherry picking. They said there was no sub category. It's wrong. I said it's wrong. It is.

[Astralporing.1957]

21 minutes ago, Zalavaaris.5329 said:

Don't start cherry picking. They said there was no sub category. It's wrong. I said it's wrong. It is.

Ok, if you want to be so pedantic and hung up on unimportant details, let's put it this way: In WvW and SPvP legendary armor is obtained through the core gameplay that all (or almost all) the players of said modes do. In PvE, it requires a niche gameplay only a very small subsection of the whole PvE community plays.

 

Thus, WvW and SPvP armors are meant for like 99% of their subsequent communities. "PvE" armor is  meant for less than 10% of its community. Probably far less nowadays.

Edited August 8, 2021 by Astralporing.1957

[radda.8920]

52 minutes ago, Tails.9372 said:

 

For the average casual player: they are.

 

I find this sentence insulting for casuals

skill level on a game has nothing to do with the time spent on it... a casual can  be very good even during a raid or a CM fractal .

If you don't succeed in a dungeon, it's not because you're a casual it's because you're bad, that's all

[ArchonWing.9480]

19 minutes ago, radda.8920 said:

 

I find this sentence insulting for casuals

skill level on a game has nothing to do with the time spent on it... a casual can  be very good even during a raid or a CM fractal .

If you don't succeed in a dungeon, it's not because you're a casual it's because you're bad, that's all

 

Suppose it depends on how you define casual and hardcore. But yea, it's also about how you spend your time and not just a binary scale.

Then again, the average player is pretty bad (in the context of non open world content), so if we leave the casual part out, it ends up the same.

Edited August 8, 2021 by ArchonWing.9480

[Tails.9372]

31 minutes ago, radda.8920 said:

I find this sentence insulting for casuals

 

That's because you blatantly ignored the "average" part and only focused on the "casual" part of it. Someone can play casually and still be good at playing "raids or fractal CMs" but that's not "the average" and I don't think you want to claim that everyone is just slacking all the time which would be the alternatve here and is way more "insulting".

Edited August 8, 2021 by Tails.9372

[Zalavaaris.5329]

50 minutes ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

Ok, if you want to be so pedantic and hung up on unimportant details, let's put it this way: In WvW and SPvP legendary armor is obtained through the core gameplay that all (or almost all) the players of said modes do. In PvE, it requires a niche gameplay only a very small subsection of the whole PvE community plays.

 

Thus, WvW and SPvP armors are meant for like 99% of their subsequent communities. "PvE" armor is  meant for less than 10% of its community. Probably far less nowadays.

What's niche about it? There's nothing niche about raiding. There is an AI enemy that has a list of abilities they use. We use our abilities and see who dies first. It's the same thing as a difficult bounty that requires multiple people. Pve is pve, stop pretending it's not. Raiding is the highest level of pve just like rated pvp is the highest level of pvp. It's the same core gameplay but more difficult. I'm now accepting more of your "points" to bash holes through. 

Edited August 8, 2021 by Zalavaaris.5329

[Epsilon Indi.2031]

5 hours ago, DoomNexus.5324 said:

“Flashpoint” devs here – ask us anything! : Guildwars2 (reddit.com)
After they've added raid armor they had "no plans to release another set of legendary armor in the future" and a lot of non-raiders complained, hence why PvP and WvW armor were added later and since they originally didn't plan to ever add those, they were rushed and don't have a unique skin like the raid ones have.

Just like how there wasn't going to be any expansion, right?  Or mounts, or capes, or anything to do with Cantha.  It's almost like they saw the opportunity to release new s kins to revitalize game modes and give opportunities to players, like you and the others in this thread, to acquire legendary gear without having to sit through raids.
 

4 hours ago, Obtena.7952 said:

No one is debating otherwise, so your comments are very dismissive here. People have this backwards because ultimately the goal for Anet is to get players engaged in the game. If they aren't, they don't play it. So it's in Anet's best interest to make sure if they develop content and put rewards in the game, that there is good correlation between those content and rewards to what people want to do. This isn't some crazy notion or concept; it's the fundamental basis that MMO's are designed on. Clearly, raids doesn't do that. 

 

So yes, you want something you do the content ... but if there is all this content that has all this things in it and very few people to do that content and get those things ... that's a massive problem for Anet and a big concern for players. To the extreme, that's the kind of thing that ruins any business. Too many missed ROI targets and it's done. 

Yeah, sorry for wanting people to do the content if they want the animated skins, I guess?  As I stated before, any new legendary armor you get isn't going to be the envoy skins.  It'll likely be about as "bland" and "unanimated" as the pvp/wvw skins.  I'm for alternative ways for legendary armor.  I'm against it being any easier than the current three methods and I'm completely against it recycling existing skins.
 

3 hours ago, hash.8462 said:

 

Starting from this quotes I wanna try to reach an agreement... but without using just Strikes (that would be boring)...

 

Let start that way:

#1 - This new PvE armor will need to be unlocked with gems <- Devs will use that income to create more content so everyone is happy (Devs also 🙂)... gold->gems is also ok of course;

#2 - Once unlocked you will get a new Daily to get tokens required for Precursor and Legendary pieces (see later);

#3 - Each piece will require a collection like early 2nd tier weapons;

#4 - No new skin required, the ascended one is ok.

 

1st precursor attempt will just need to be crafted;

2nd precursor attempt will require a collection and 10 tokens then just have to be crafted;

The true precursor will require a collection and 30 tokens then have to be crafted;

Each Legendary piece will require the precursor, 60 tokens and a Gift of Tyria (Gift of Exploration + Maguuma + Desert + Cantha) 😈

Starting from zero each piece will require 100 tokens, so 600 tokens for the whole armor.

 

The new daily (one of each type), tasks will have to be Account Randomized:

- One Easy Task (low effort, examples: easy/medium JP, a Dungeon path, a Fractal T1/T2, a DRM, some champion, events, a meta, things like that);

- One Hard Task (medium effort, examples: hard/long JP, Fractal T3/T4, a DRM with 3cm, some hard champion, hard HP, a Bounty, a Strike, things like that);

- One Extreme Task (extreme effort, examples: hard JP instanced*, Fractal T4cm, a DRM with 3cm in solo*, an hard champion instanced*, hard HP instanced*, a Bounty instanced*, an "hard" Strike without dying or with other penality, things like that);

* With "instanced/solo" I mean a mote will lead you to an instanced map where no one else can help you (you can try the content multiple times if you fail)

- One Valuable Donation (Donation at the player's choice from a fixed selection: a piece of acended weapon or armor, some (15-30) Mystic Coins, 30-50 Gold, maybe other things like that), this one can be swapped for a second Extreme Task.

 

Note: If you are able to get 4 tokens/day you will need about 22weeks to complete the an armor;

If you are so lazy to only get 1 tokens/day you will need about 86weeks to complete it.

 

Question to raiders: Is that effort enough?

Question to casuals: Is that effort too much?

 

Gems for starting a collection?  Is this the china server now?  Are we paying for achievements? That's a hard no from me.

The hard line is any alternative armor set should  require a similar time investment as the currently existing sets of gear.  It doesn't matter what content it  appears in and I've already said I'd be happy with it costing the same as a generation 2 legendary weapon per piece for the convenience of skipping raids, wvw, and pvp.

Basically, you'd have 3 collections
First two give you recipes for making the piece, third is a gift specific to the piece.  You then need the other two gifts for a generation 2 legendary, a gift of mastery, and a mystic tribute.  Put all of this into the forge and, viola, legendary armor piece with minimal wvw, no raids, and no pvp that can mostly be done in the open world as casually as you like.

Alternatively a legendary journey similar to the one found in raids in other difficult content such as CM fractals, CM strikes (when they come out with EoD), etc.

Both of these options shouldn't share skins with any existing armor set.  It's that simple.

[Epsilon Indi.2031]

2 hours ago, Obtena.7952 said:

Actually, explicitly designed rewards with the idea in mind that the majority won't really have access to them IS a MASSIVE problem. That actually makes NO sense for Anet or any other MMO to design content this way. Think about that ... a game dev explicitly designing content/rewards in a way that most people will never get them. Do you not see why this approach is ridiculous in an MMO where Anet is trying to engage as many people as possible in game content? It's especially bad in this case because the reward relevant to the content in question is a CONVENIENCE upgrade, not a performance one. It's a no-brainer in that case to widen the engagement. 

Excuse me what?

Prestigious , exclusive skins and rewards have existed in every MMO and will continue to persist.