With the Necro Icon confirmed, Only Icon that Fits Warrior is the Bullet

[draxynnic.3719]

8 hours ago, Verdict is Vengence.6912 said:

If you want to play support go to guardian class. Warriors are fighters. Nothing more, nothing less.

That's not the way ArenaNet thinks. One of the selling points in the manifesto was that professions weren't to be pigeonholed like this.

[Grand Marshal.4098]

We rly still talking about the manifesto from 2012? 

 

It's up to whichever team is currently making the specs and how they feel they should play out. 

[Mungrul.9358]

Down to the way ANet have implemented Elite specs in the past, I strongly doubt that more than one profession will have a specialisation using the same weapon.

 

I suspect the rules are:

With an expansion, every existing profession must get a new elite specialisation.

That elite specialisation must allow the profession to use a weapon they've never had access to before.

No two elite specialisations in any one expansion can have access to the same weapon.

 

This is why some elite spec weapons have felt completely mad and out of context, such as torch for Berserker.

ANet are held hostage by their design template.

 

I also suspect there's  an unconscious bias directing which professions get which weapons, with certain professions (warrior) ending up with the short straw. They start out with the specs that excite them the most, but by the time they get to the end, they've run out of ideas, and end up creating rather tepid implementations.

Oh, and hey, Warrior begins with W, putting it at the end of every list of professions when organised alphabetically.

It sounds stupid, but I suspect this is directly responsible for a lot of warrior's problems.

It's always the last to be looked at.

 

Associating a particular weapon with elite specs was a bit of a silly move to begin with, and long term, I think ANet would have been better off not bothering. Just implement the trait line. No need for anything else.

 

I also suspect that ANet thinks that Elite Specs are easier to implement and balance than completely new professions.

But I think that's pretty easy to prove wrong. If they were balanced, you'd still see core builds being as viable and effective as elite specs. But when's the last time you saw someone using a core build outside of base game?

And with every expansion, the expectation is that every profession will get a completely new elite spec. So instead of just introducing one new profession that you need to balance, you've introduced nine.

On top of which, as can be seen from the speculation in this thread, we're swiftly running out of weapons to tie to specs.

 

In short, while I admire them for trying something different to most other MMOs, and trying to recapture some of the old dual-class magic from GW1 with elite specs, I think elite specs were the wrong way to go.

[tyrellian.3706]

3 minutes ago, Mungrul.9358 said:

I suspect the rules are:

With an expansion, every existing profession must get a new elite specialisation.

That elite specialisation must allow the profession to use a weapon they've never had access to before.

No two elite specialisations in any one expansion can have access to the same weapon.

 

Nope.

* Firebrand and Mirage both got Axe.

* Spellbreaker and Soulbeast both got Dagger

* Holosmith and Weaver both got Sword.

 

There definitely isn't a rule that says only one class gets a given weapon type per expansion.

[Mungrul.9358]

Ah, thanks for pointing that out 🥴

Shows how much I ignore Guard, Necro and Engi 😅

[Lazze.9870]

14 hours ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

Spellbreaker being Warrior/Mesmer

 

Well... Spellbreaker is a warrior salvaging skills from the GW1 dervish. Isn't much mesmer there, unless you're forcing it.

[Peacekid.1463]

so where not getting staff?

[Grand Marshal.4098]

11 minutes ago, Peacekid.1463 said:

so where not getting staff?

Probs not even though I'd have loved to finally have a decent 2h utility weapon and drop GS for a bit. 

 

Maybe they nail pistols. Maybe they don't. Maybe the mechanic for warrior is very epic to play with so weapons won't matter. But if they don't make interesting animations and skills (cough, reuse thief and engi stuff, cough) and make the spec revolve around it I'll be dissapointed. 

 

I don't expect much tbh. It's just that if we are to know just show us the goddamn spec, don't make us wait until November or October to get fully dissapointed. 

 

Also, I'm not talking kitten for EoD before it even arrives. I'm just setting the bar low, because that's where warrior is and will be. 

[Jzaku.9765]

10 hours ago, Vancho.8750 said:

Dying from laughter, kittener got the base barbarian and the tank specks that are default for all games, and complains they catered to me who wants more options, I for one can't be an effective tank in raid or boon support, or a healer, all I have is hit kitten with a stick, exactly the thing you want, ooo it has banners even though they just give stats and are little bit better signets, the rest of the classes just share the stats with a trait, and the best part no one will take you if you don't have them since, why would you take the big fighting warrior that doesn't bring utility over a guardian that can fill all the spots by pressing a button to switch its build. they were put there so they don't throw the whole profession in garbage bin since it doesn't bring anything else to the table.  

His favourite was hammer/bow, lol the worst and most boring weapon bundles in the game mechanically .

Torch wasn't the big thing on berserker it was the bursts, SB wasn't the daggers it was the burst.

The elites and base are what you want from it, is a fighting warrior with stick that hits people, 3 variation of the same kitten, aren't you happy. Same mechanic on everything and then he complains that warrior is ruined even though they made it like he wanted, you monkey pawed yourself , there is not much options in the walk to something and hit it with a stick gameplay, and here he is saying lets have another go at the same kitten, cause it is working so great right now.

I want options, you want to how you said to pigeon hold it in same old kitten. 

WvW player.    

Well said. There's way too many people here that don't understand that the themes they want have already literally been handed to them via Berserker (pure damage) and Spellbreaker (tanky frontliner), the entire class just happens to be mediocre and people just desperately want a reroll with a new spec instead of waiting for buffs that never come. Thematically and mechanically, Warrior is long overdue for a support spec, and no, this doesn't have to mean shooting magical beams to heal allies. 

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

1 hour ago, Lazze.9870 said:

 

Well... Spellbreaker is a warrior salvaging skills from the GW1 dervish. Isn't much mesmer there, unless you're forcing it.

It was from their own admission not my description. 

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

5 minutes ago, Jzaku.9765 said:

Well said. There's way too many people here that don't understand that the themes they want have already literally been handed to them via Berserker (pure damage) and Spellbreaker (tanky frontliner), the entire class just happens to be mediocre and people just desperately want a reroll with a new spec instead of waiting for buffs that never come. Thematically and mechanically, Warrior is long overdue for a support spec, and no, this doesn't have to mean shooting magical beams to heal allies. 

This. It doesn't have to be magical beams, or even creative use of fields and finishers. It could well be that we get 'Commands', or that Anet brings back Arias, Echos, and Finales from GW1, or that we get entirely new F1-F4/F5 skills that are bad kitten support skills.

We are long overdue for a support spec, we are also long overdue for a new ranged weapon, and hopefully an actually decent one.

 

Pistol could pair very well with shield and warhorn. OH Pistol depends on how they build it, if they put something major like a pulsing smoke field that blinds in an aoe then I can see it getting used over shield.

But it could also end up being complete garbage and we remain in the GS + x/shield meta forever.

 

If we do get pistols this time, and Anet survives long enough for a fourth expansion (which I highly doubt), then I bet we'd get staff then, and if there is a fifth expansion (hahahahaha) then I bet we'd get shortbow.

[Lazze.9870]

1 hour ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

It was from their own admission not my description. 

 

Well, then its Anet forcing it I guess. Everything from skill names to how spellbreaker strips boons is dervish-like.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

5 minutes ago, Lazze.9870 said:

 

Well, then its Anet forcing it I guess. Everything from skill names to how spellbreaker strips boons is dervish-like.

Oh I don't disagree. Their mesmer focus on it has more to do with how they counter magic though.

[artharon.9276]

Yeah it's obvious now. Icon design suggests, we should get ready for yet another makeshift, boring and undercooked espec. 

[Peacekid.1463]

4 hours ago, Grand Marshal.4098 said:

Probs not even though I'd have loved to finally have a decent 2h utility weapon and drop GS for a bit. 

 

Maybe they nail pistols. Maybe they don't. Maybe the mechanic for warrior is very epic to play with so weapons won't matter. But if they don't make interesting animations and skills (cough, reuse thief and engi stuff, cough) and make the spec revolve around it I'll be dissapointed. 

 

I don't expect much tbh. It's just that if we are to know just show us the goddamn spec, don't make us wait until November or October to get fully dissapointed. 

 

Also, I'm not talking kitten for EoD before it even arrives. I'm just setting the bar low, because that's where warrior is and will be. 

oh well were again in expect the unexpected mode or expect the worst still, i like warrior so bring them on

[Grand Marshal.4098]

I still kinda hope for the oni icon to be usbut it will probably be thief ig. Whatever. Bullet symbol looks the lamest of them all. 

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

11 minutes ago, Grand Marshal.4098 said:

I still kinda hope for the oni icon to be usbut it will probably be thief ig. Whatever. Bullet symbol looks the lamest of them all. 

No less so than the Spellbreaker or Berserker icons.

[Red Haired Savage.5430]

5 hours ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

Pistol could pair very well with shield and warhorn. OH Pistol depends on how they build it, if they put something major like a pulsing smoke field that blinds in an aoe then I can see it getting used over shield.

 

And if pistols are condi based it could pair with OH sword somewhat (yes I know it'll probably need buffed if pistols are condi).  Also I'd assume if it's pistol we'd get OH too because other professions have more skills than us and more to choose from than us because of their profession mechanic buttons or because of profession mechanics in general.  Only one in a similar boat as us with that would be thief, but their F1 changes based on who/what they steal from, which would have it's own drawbacks. If I were to rank profession mechanic buttons I'd probably put Ele, Necro, Engi, Druid ranger, and FB guard at the top. Next group would probably be Rev, and Soulbeast. After that would be Mesmer, Ranger, rest of Guardian. The last group would probably be thief and warrior. I mean warrior F1 was so bad at the beginning that we were punished for even using it.

 

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

34 minutes ago, Red Haired Savage.5430 said:

And if pistols are condi based it could pair with OH sword somewhat (yes I know it'll probably need buffed if pistols are condi).  Also I'd assume if it's pistol we'd get OH too because other professions have more skills than us and more to choose from than us because of their profession mechanic buttons or because of profession mechanics in general.  Only one in a similar boat as us with that would be thief, but their F1 changes based on who/what they steal from, which would have it's own drawbacks. If I were to rank profession mechanic buttons I'd probably put Ele, Necro, Engi, Druid ranger, and FB guard at the top. Next group would probably be Rev, and Soulbeast. After that would be Mesmer, Ranger, rest of Guardian. The last group would probably be thief and warrior. I mean warrior F1 was so bad at the beginning that we were punished for even using it.

 

It was more like we were better rewarded for not using rather than being punished for using it, but yeah.

[sneakytails.5629]

It better not be condi trash.

[Grand Marshal.4098]

4 hours ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

No less so than the Spellbreaker or Berserker icons.

Tbh, the spellbreaker and berserker icon have a specific feel to them. Zerker looks strong, a radiant flame with a sword. Very primal. Spellbreaker seems accurate yet strong, given how the daggers work. 

 

Now a speeding bullet? Bleh

[Raizel.1839]

I just hope it represent an arrow (=shorbow=Chuka) instead of a pistol's bullet.

[Firstpyre.8439]

8 hours ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

This. It doesn't have to be magical beams, or even creative use of fields and finishers. It could well be that we get 'Commands', or that Anet brings back Arias, Echos, and Finales from GW1, or that we get entirely new F1-F4/F5 skills that are bad kitten support skills.

We are long overdue for a support spec, we are also long overdue for a new ranged weapon, and hopefully an actually decent one.

That's part of the reason I want a proper support from Warrior. All the other supports are flashy-magical stuff, but the idea of basically being a battlefield commander type support would be great in a way that banners, frankly, doesn't feel like. 

Healshout is a step in the right direction but it won't ever be really accepted as long as it doesn't give quickness/alacrity lol.

 

Edited August 12, 2021 by Firstpyre.8439

[Dadnir.5038]

10 hours ago, Mungrul.9358 said:

I also suspect there's  an unconscious bias directing which professions get which weapons, with certain professions (warrior) ending up with the short straw.

It's not like there is a lot of interesting weapon left for the warrior to get: Staff (boring), short bow (not really exciting), pistols (meh), scepter (warrior with a scepter?) and focus (🥱 ).

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

Here is another take on support via a new espec.

 

New F1-F5 skills. Core bursts lost, adrenaline is not spent completely on use, each skill only uses 10 adrenaline, 30 adrenaline is still the cap. All have 10s CD, all have 900 radius range, and affect 10 targets, and no cast time. Numbers are ball park figures.

 

F1: Anthem of Courage: affected allies deal 1500 damage on their next attack. Can critically hit. Triggers on burst hit traits as a level 1 burst.

F2: Anthem of Determination: affected allies inflict 2 stacks of burn for 3s (uses your condition damage, their condition Duration) on their next attack. Triggers burst traits on hit as a level 1 burst.

F3: Anthem of Compassion: affected allies are healed for 3,000 hp and are cleansed of 3 conditions when they are next struck. Buff last for 5s.

F4: Anthem of Fortitude: affected allies gain Protection and Resolution for 5s, and 3000 barrier when next struck. Buff last for 5s.

 

If any of our core burst traits get changed to be on burst use, all the above would count as T1 bursts, otherwise just the first two would count.

 

Gives some physical and condi damage support, some condition removal, some sustain, and some defense. Being at 900 range would let you sit with a pistol at 900 and still get allies engaged in melee.

 

Traits could augment them further, and being instant cast would let you weave them in with other actions.