Possible Mechanic Spoiler

[Downstate.4697]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/pfmk5f/either_an_accidental_spoiler_for_the_new_engie/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share

 

2nd person on engi that reported this happen to them.

[Xaylin.1860]

Noooo... 😱

[bambi.6214]

I hope it's a bug due to some engine changes. I deeply hope.

I do not want to wait 3 years again with some half-assed elite spec for ANet to realize AI is bad...

Edited September 1, 2021 by Samug.6512

[miriforst.1290]

That is very unfortunate.

 

If the mace from the previous leak is a melee weapon as well (or condi mid range, wouldn't that be hilarious!) i can't see this spec doing well. 

 

If a developer reads this.

 

Engineer has had 2 elite specs so far, both power melee focused. Scrapper in wvw happened because there wasn't any 3rd supportive traitline. Out of these one tried to do summons in what was actually a reasonable fashion that could have worked, if they had stuck to pulsing effects around them and a tighter leash. However it was decided to streamline this into just an aoe that followed the engineer. Fair enough.

 

Then we have the core engineer with a skill type that was heavily featured in promotional material and which is a traditional staple of engineer archetypes in many a game which was deemed troublesome and delegated to afk farming queensdale or whatever (is that why you moved self destruct to the main skill? So that it can't be autocast? Because i don't believe any changes made to turrets are there to actually improve the skill type). 

 

The problem here is that even if these bots or golems or whatever they will be are the best skill in slots for every gamemode (doubt that will last longer than 5 mins before an emergency update, ha!) i still think this was a bad idea. Because we already have an ai type designed to fight for us with rockets, nets, flames and quakes in the ground and if this new skill type does anything else than passively buff you like gyros (which we already replaced with wells) then we already have skills for that and you have just sold us a balance update, and we are down one elite spec compared to everyone else in my book. Fix turrets before you give us golems. And if you cant think of a way to make stationary weapon emplacements work in this game (player controlled or ai) then replace them with something else. You did it with thief traps so i know you can.

 

Please.

[bambi.6214]

3 minutes ago, miriforst.1290 said:

The problem here is that even if these bots or golems or whatever they will be are the best skill in slots for every gamemode (doubt that will last longer than 5 mins before an emergency update, ha!) i still think this was a bad idea. Because we already have an ai type designed to fight for us with rockets, nets, flames and quakes in the ground and if this new skill type does anything else than passively buff you like gyros (which we already replaced with wells) then we already have skills for that and you have just sold us a balance update, and we are down one elite spec compared to everyone else in my book. Fix turrets before you give us golems. And if you cant think of a way to make stationary weapon emplacements work in this game (player controlled or ai) then replace them with something else. You did it with thief traps so i know you can.

Holy crap I didn't even through of AFK farmers, spec with another AI would be a heaven for them! 

[Tails.9372]

If the new spec is indeed the golemancer (which is one of the most commonly requested e-specs for engi) then this "minion" should double as a battle suit so people who don't like to have an AI partner can also spend their time in a combat transformation (or just use the old stuff).

[miriforst.1290]

I'ts the most commonly suggested e-spec in the same way that fishing was the most commonly suggested feature.

 

I just don't have much faith in either. To me it just sounds like a tick box for asura roleplayers (who already have golem racial skills, except they suck. Which brings us back to turrets).

 

I do hope its more of a mech/battlesuit (although i would have preffered a more supportive elite) as you say than a full on minion master (remember they like to reuse skill types). Full minions would be a disaster, and i have seen plenty suggestions on reddit for that as well. Often by people doing a full elite spec suggestion and who haven't played enough engineer or spent enough time in the engineer community to understand why we are highly skeptical of new AI skill types or mechanics.

Edited September 1, 2021 by miriforst.1290

[Dawdler.8521]

The beta patch did introduce some weirdness with existing classes though, such as the necro pets dying on mount or the thief pistol having no activation doubling its dps. Dont think either has been fixed. 

The engineer getting a pet isnt that strange. EoD elites is all about taking other classes abilities.

But the doom and gloom over a potential pet we know nothing about is amusing to watch and I'm generally a doom and gloom person.

[Kodama.6453]

If this really turns out to be our class mechanic, then I fear that the elite spec is destined to be dead on arrival.

 

Anet has an absolute terrible history with pets and AI. They already tried to give us another pet archetype with gyros and utterly failed, so why the hell would they think "let's kittenin do this again!!!"?????

 

And I also have a hard time to imagine how we are supposed to actually control the pet... rangers have their entire f-skill bar dedicated to controlling their pet, but we have our toolbelt occupying that space. Are they going to get rid of the toolbelt entirely? I honestly can't imagine them doing this and the elite spec to still be functional in any capacity, since we are so overly reliant on our toolbelt.

Edited September 1, 2021 by Kodama.6453

[The Boz.2038]

We probably retain F1 from toolbelt, maybe F2. F3, 4, 5? Attack/Heel, Special Skill, Pilot Golem. 

And the first trait level will probably customize it between ranged, melee, condi, power, support, something like that.

[Amadeus.5687]

If the elite spec is focused around an AI it's just gonna plain old suck.
There have never been a time where any of the AI builds in the game felt right, either they have been oppressively stronk or just super underwhelming.
And again if they want us to have AI as an Engineer, fix our turrets first and let people that enjoy AI play around with the turrets. 

Like wise I simply can't understand why people want a "Mecha" elite spec. We have just had an elite spec that's all about entering into another mode: Holosmith's Photon Forge.

Like our two elite specs atm is:

Scrapper; Started out as another AI spec, it sucked and got reworked a ton. Now it's a solid melee brusier that can do a lot of support and it's clear Anet is focusing on it becoming our support elite spec. That is great and for the first time since it came out I actually enjoy Scrapper now.

Holosmith: A purely power dmg focused elite spec, where Photon Forge is so busted stronk that it's still the better option to go Holosmith for condition dmg, even while it don't actually support that kind of playstyle.
It's a prime example of a elite spec doing a bit to much, and have been nerfed again and again ever since PoF released. 

Photon Forge supports the "swapping in and out of a special and powerfull mode" perfectly and we don't need another like that.

The only way I could see peoples dream about getting into a mecha suit could work, is allready done as the Azura Elite skill and that's a big no no.

Transformation elite specs like rampage, lich form ect. are horrible to balance and they are horrible to play around and as.

Please Anet, just give us a solid elite spec that support condition dmg and proberly interact with our kits and core trait lines. That is all we really need right now.

[wolfyrik.2017]

3 hours ago, Samug.6512 said:

I hope it's a bug due to some engine changes. I deeply hope.

I do not want to wait 3 years again with some half-assed elite spec for ANet to realize AI is bad...

ZOMG this would be Gyros all over again. ANET have learned this time and time again, to the point where they completely remade gyros. This was a massive improvement to the class and the game as a whole. They know that AI is a terrible idea. They've seen what happens when they add more AI and have 9 years of evidence across multiple classes, especially Ranger and Engi that prove AI/pets are a mistake.

This is just an unrelated bug.

I'm certain this is just an unrelated bug.

Yes, it's defintitely an unrelated bug.

Edit: Of course it's an unrelated bug. Ranger pet renames aren't attached to the toolbar and they wouldn't do that for engi either! It'd cause so many problems.

 

 

Oh gods, please let this be an unrelated bug!

Edited September 1, 2021 by wolfyrik.2017

[Roads.5130]

I love the fact that people are panicking before having even a glimpse of how the elite spec is gonna work, I even see some of the same people that were arguing that the willbender teaser picture was a thief because of the colors and the pose, also the same level of discussion of those threads complaining how obviously broken willbender was going to be because it gave dashes to a guardian. Turns out, willbender was very underwhelming during the beta and the picture was, in fact, a guardian.

Haters gonna hate, whiners gonna whine, I guess.

[SoftFootpaws.9134]

Even if Engi did get a golem pet as their class mechanic, I imagine it'll be a Soulbeast clone that can "pilot" the golem for those who don't like AI mechanics. The devs have already learned their lesson about this.

Edited September 1, 2021 by Hannelore.8153

[Dawdler.8521]

13 minutes ago, wolfyrik.2017 said:

ZOMG this would be Gyros all over again. ANET have learned this time and time again, to the point where they completely remade gyros. This was a massive improvement to the class and the game as a whole.

Pff says you. I miss the old gyros 😞

The pet actually make sense if you think about. EoD takes mechanics other classes and twist it. The necro gets the elixirs, except they are inverted and cause conditions.

Well the engineer would get the pet and soulbeast merge except instead of the pet merging with the player, the player merge with the pet.

And there is your freely named combat droid (unmerged) and mecha suit (merged).

Just saying, its a possibility 😛

[Amadeus.5687]

1 minute ago, Roads.5130 said:

I love the fact that people are panicking before having even a glimpse of how the elite spec is gonna work, I even see some of the same people that were arguing that the willbender teaser picture was a thief because of the colors and the pose, also the same level of discussion of those threads complaining how obviously broken willbender was going to be because it gave dashes to a guardian. Turns out, willbender was very underwhelming during the beta and the picture was, in fact, a guardian.

Haters gonna hate, whiners gonna whine, I guess.

 

I agree it were silly to whine about willbender, you simply can't compare the two things.
We don't know if the new elite spec will have an AI.

But we voice that we do not wish for an AI, cause there have never been an example of AI being good in this game and it's not what we need in our current elite spec selection.

Guardians actually need a high mobility elite spec, cause they lack one

[MrForz.1953]

1 hour ago, Roads.5130 said:

I love the fact that people are panicking before having even a glimpse of how the elite spec is gonna work, I even see some of the same people that were arguing that the willbender teaser picture was a thief because of the colors and the pose, also the same level of discussion of those threads complaining how obviously broken willbender was going to be because it gave dashes to a guardian. Turns out, willbender was very underwhelming during the beta and the picture was, in fact, a guardian.

Haters gonna hate, whiners gonna whine, I guess.

First, your post makes no sense, they aren't the same people at all. Second, there's precedence for that panic.

AI never worked well. Turrets are mostly dead, Gyros got turned into wells, Necro minions solely exist just to afk farm these days and Rangers welcomed Soulbeast with open arms due to the time being petless. What makes you think that this time, it will be good? And if it ends up being good, then why is everything else condemned to rot?

[Ragebru.1397]

1 hour ago, MrForz.1953 said:

Turrets are mostly dead

H-he implied turrets are alive. 

Idk, I still see most soulbeasts leaving there pet out more often than not. I still see Necros running minions to utilize hit caps and soak damage. The idea of having pets that actually compliment our class and add utility is pretty darn exciting. Someone made a post on reddit about how they envision a engimancer- and I gotta admit it was pretty darn legit. 

https://i.redd.it/lz96f2570rh61.png

Remember that minions gain a command function. Being able to CC on demand, explode on demand, heal on demand, etc.. 

 

edit: it would probably follow more along the lines of the steam concepts, not the asura tech. https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Steam_creature

Edited September 1, 2021 by jwhite.7012

[The Boz.2038]

12 minutes ago, jwhite.7012 said:

it would probably follow more along the lines of the steam concepts, not the asura

OR, based on a trait, the design could change, too! Charr/Asura/Watchknight mode, go!

[MrForz.1953]

17 minutes ago, jwhite.7012 said:

H-he implied turrets are alive. 

Idk, I still see most soulbeasts leaving there pet out more often than not. I still see Necros running minions to utilize hit caps and soak damage. The idea of having pets that actually compliment our class and add utility is pretty darn exciting. Someone made a post on reddit about how they envision a engimancer- and I gotta admit it was pretty darn legit. 

https://i.redd.it/lz96f2570rh61.png

Remember that minions gain a command function. Being able to CC on demand, explode on demand, heal on demand, etc.. 

 

edit: it would probably follow more along the lines of the steam concepts, not the asura tech. https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Steam_creature

Yeah I implied that because people would argue "eeeh ackchually healing turret blah blah".

Anyways, that's cool and all, +1 for Scarlet Briar's legacy although it's only merely, loosely related to the Aetherblades present in Cantha. But the question remains: What makes you think that this time it will work? Soulbeast pets are out just to serve as boon batteries and for exactly one move in PvP. Necro minions make the class slightly harder to kill in exchange of... well, everything which is not a good trade unless you intend to afk farm.

The pets will have to replace something the Engineer has, likely the toolbelt. The commands are fancy and all but relying on pets doing it make it really not reliable. Also remember the turret commands, how they... aren't commands anymore.

Lastly, imagine, on top of hiding behind AI, having to collect parts to build them, that's two meh concepts in one within GW2.

Edited September 1, 2021 by MrForz.1953

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

If it is a golem that can be piloted I'll name mine Deathscythe. 

[Ragebru.1397]

11 minutes ago, MrForz.1953 said:

Yeah I implied that because people would argue "eeeh ackchually healing turret blah blah".

Anyways, that's cool and all, +1 for Scarlet Briar's legacy although it's only merely, loosely related to the Aetherblades present in Cantha. But the question remains: What makes you think that this time it will work? Soulbeast pets are out just to serve as boon batteries and for exactly one move in PvP. Necro minions make the class slightly harder to kill in exchange of... well, everything which is not a good trade unless you intend to afk farm.

The pets will have to replace something the Engineer has, likely the toolbelt. The commands are fancy and all but relying on pets doing it make it really not reliable. Also remember the turret commands, how they... aren't commands anymore.

Minions deal quite a bit of damage on their own. Pets add a significant increase in baseline damage. Sure they might be annoying for aggroing outside of our preferred range of comfort, sure they might get hung up on a mob when we want to just move forward. However, lets not write off the fact that they add nice utility, damage, and cushioning to their respective classes. 

 

edit: what makes you think they'd have to remove our toolbelt utility? Do minions remove shroud? No. Minion commands are promptly tied to their respective utility slot.

Edited September 1, 2021 by jwhite.7012

[Amadeus.5687]

11 minutes ago, jwhite.7012 said:

Minions deal quite a bit of damage on their own. Pets add a significant increase in baseline damage. Sure they might be annoying for aggroing outside of our preferred range of comfort, sure they might get hung up on a mob when we want to just move forward. However, lets not write off the fact that they add nice utility, damage, and cushioning to their respective classes. 

 

edit: what makes you think they'd have to remove our toolbelt utility? Do minions remove shroud? No. Minion commands are promptly tied to their respective utility slot.

 

This entrie thread is based on a SS of Engineer getting the Ranger window to name your pet.
Hence people speculate it's a permanent pet function like the ranger which class mechanic is to control the pet (attack, beast skill, return) and hence people think the trade off for the pet will for it to replace parts of the class mechanic in our case the toolbelt skills.

 

[Ragebru.1397]

3 minutes ago, Amadeus.5687 said:

 

This entrie thread is based on a SS of Engineer getting the Ranger window to name your pet.
Hence people speculate it's a permanent pet function like the ranger which class mechanic is to control the pet (attack, beast skill, return) and hence people think the trade off for the pet will for it to replace parts of the class mechanic in our case the toolbelt skills.

 

Just cant see that happening. If anything it would probably just be a modified toolbelt, similar to how virtuoso's shatters were altered, or how a firebrand's tomes just increase the access. Might just be that we get an altered pet window, or a separate window altogether just for basic pet managements- while leaving the toolbelts intact. They would have to do some pretty serious trait reworks to eradicate the toolbelt skills to serve an Espec, and considering that they seem to be stretched thin enough to not work out other kinks such as turrets and gadgets (or even our core weapons), I doubt we'd see a full overhaul. 

I'd say it would lean more towards a minion mechanic, rather than a full fledged pet. 

[Quench.7091]

The engineer F4 shares the same coordinates on the as the pet management button does on the ranger. Seems like a UI developer could've easily opened up engineer's UI file by mistake, changed the F4's right click function instead of the Pet Management's right click function, saved it, then wondered why it didn't change anything on the ranger.

 

They could've also have used the engineer the F# skills UI to test pet controls and made a mistake by leaving it in.

 

Either way, it's curious as to what could've happened. The UI doesn't seem to save a pet name at the moment and it is curious as to why it is hidden on a combat button with a right click.