World Restructuring Beta Update

[AikijinX.6258]

2 minutes ago, Meridian.9103 said:

No I don't think so. It's very obvious to me that World Restructering hasn't been actively worked on (or only in very small capacity) for a long time between 2021 and when it was first announced. These were dark times for gw2 where everything besides LW was simply "not a priority". What we've got to see yesterday was not the result of years of work with thousands of man-hours spend.

Definitely not years of work and absolutely not held to a high priority, Hence what I said above. 

[Amarok.2147]

Gonna throw this out there, but you guys know that in other games when new content gets released there's a beta test as well. However it's only to a select few, Guild Wars instead will do an "early release" trial with a beta. Keep in mind the expected day of release isn't until later. Also if you've never worked with code, 1 line of code that causes a bug could completely destroy everything else. It didn't necessarily have to be the overall system, give them time.

 

Not sure where a few got the idea that they gave up either simply because they pulled it instead of keeping it live. If there was a bug present making WvW almost unplayable, why would you want to keep trying to play and get tilted at an already known issue? Play with the old system for a bit longer and stay tuned for the next date for testing. Have a great weekend! o7 Praise Joko!

[rzalexander.8237]

I really appreciate the communication again. Being willing to take risks and try new things is part of the fun. 

[Tinnel.4369]

The fact is they've had years since they said it was coming, no assumptions or extrapolations from the community, it's what they said. Does they include Grouch, or anyone even still at ANet? Who knows, but it's still the collective they. If this is the product of those years then we have problems.

Indeed, it's beta. However, what many who are having an adverse reaction to are doing is putting what happened in the context of what's happened for 9 years; an inability to connect with the community and follow through with professionally delivered experiences. There's no wild assumptions being made when you view things in this context. How were the flaws not on the checklist? If they were on the checklist why was there no contingency plan for them? Again, convention tells us it's because this is how they operate; constantly playing from behind from failure to deliver up front. Are the devs and leadership different groups of people? Of course, but they both have individual responsibilities and if you think one isn't informing the other; setting goals, giving reassurances, etc. you're mistaken.

The only thing that's changed of recent is that we've gone from receiving new content and beta testing it for free as they iterate on it live, regardless of its quality or appropriateness, to actual beta testing on a non-beta server (live) where they're willing to take it down and go back to the drawing board (we hope) with 'more' communication and 'transparency'. Had this been on a beta server, I believe the goal would have been crystal clear and a botched outcome would have had much less backlash. Again, it's a failure to deliver professionally; beta testing isn't some revolutionary thing with no precedence about how to conduct it.

A bunch of us are, of course, going to continue playing. The game continues to ride the coat tails of what was delivered at inception in a genre that's dieing and offers no competition to the core of what makes the game great.

Telling devs, leadership, etc. it's ok you'll be able to do better next time instead of holding them accountable and operating in reality won't help us get a better game, it will only keep us in the same cycle of relative mediocrity and frustration.

Edited September 25, 2021 by Tinnel.4369

[Dawdler.8521]

3 hours ago, cesmode.4257 said:

I simply don't think this change is a good one.  Its too complicated and can create too many problems.  I say scrap it and come up with something else 😞 

 

The server cluster idea, I think, is OK.  Create alliances within that across servers within your server cluster.  Whats wrong with this?

Every suggestion posted on the forum that is "simple" and "flawless" is usually way overcomplicated or so kittenbackwards it achieves nothing or replace it with not WvW. I dont even know what this "server cluster" idea you are speaking of is, but I hope to god its not the one I think it is.

Edited September 25, 2021 by Dawdler.8521

[Woop S.7851]

Sorry for the double post, as always, appreciate the effort, hope the team & coders have a relaxing weekend & some rest! 🙂

Edited September 26, 2021 by Woop S.7851

[Woop S.7851]

double posted from the shock 🥶...*joke😁...please delete..

Edited September 26, 2021 by Woop S.7851

[Woop S.7851]

On 9/24/2021 at 1:06 PM, Fire Attunement.9835 said:

Hi all,

We've encountered a number of issues with the initial beta of World Restructuring and we've decided that our best course of action is to revert back to the World Linking system while we address those problems. We're going to cycle the WvW maps (forcing players out), send players back to their original worlds, and then bring WvW back up. Map state (score, objective ownership) will remain the same.

Thank you for your patience and participation. We've learned a lot and will be looking to run another attempt in a few weeks. We'll also follow up with an assessment of the issues we encountered today.

 

Thanks for the communication & effort! 😄 There's no victory without adversity, and every adversity means additional possibilities, WvW has always been quite unique & consists of untapped potential, will be waiting for the updated algorithm & next beta! 👍

[Coda.9185]

i just have 1 thing to say so right now.... 

Beta was disaster..... That's ok
Rolling back to original and acknowledging you have issues.... That's ok

But.... it's Sunday and there is no post yet or news or any official statement about alliance or further beta or any kind of info. 
that's not really okay.... people deserve better than that from Anet 

[Dawdler.8521]

1 hour ago, Coda.9185 said:

But.... it's Sunday and there is no post yet or news or any official statement about alliance or further beta or any kind of info. 
that's not really okay.... people deserve better than that from Anet 

... it's sunday...

[OutOfMyMind.9613]

On 9/24/2021 at 4:50 PM, Booey Bubblehead.4890 said:

"...Why in the WvWvWvW would you NOT have tested this before making announcements..."

Maybe because they don't have the number of free ANet employees to even populate 1 team. As far as public beta servers I doubt that they would get the number of players giving up their regular play time to populate the 6 teams needed to test out the functions that failed. The only way to do it was a large scale test like the one that just failed.

[Grand Marshal.4098]

Expected. Not surprised. Won't wait for the feature. Will play for the friends. Friends want to play NW. I may join them too. I'll keep roaming ig. 

[fluffypaws.2860]

New world has an Australian server. I got 14 ping in Beta.

 

Sure beats 250 ping !

[Swamurabi.7890]

15 hours ago, Coda.9185 said:

i just have 1 thing to say so right now.... 

Beta was disaster..... That's ok
Rolling back to original and acknowledging you have issues.... That's ok

But.... it's Sunday and there is no post yet or news or any official statement about alliance or further beta or any kind of info. 
that's not really okay.... people deserve better than that from Anet 

Some feedback that I would be interested in is:

 

1. How many players were trying to play WvW? I know you won't specify exact numbers but maybe numbers relative to past weeks average?

 

2.  Do you know if all queued maps were actually full? If not, why not?

 

3. How many matches would you expect to create with alliances? What percentage of players that joined WvW did NOT pre-select a WvW guild? Did that cause an issue?

 

4. With re-linking happening soon, are you going to use post re-link player data and compare it to pre link player data to modify alliance algorithm to try to mitigate alt-account problems?

[Divirel.4953]

11 hours ago, Swamurabi.7890 said:

1. How many players were trying to play WvW? I know you won't specify exact numbers but maybe numbers relative to past weeks average?

Grouch mentioned that thousands crashed into the system (no idea if it was at reset or signed up for it)

[Klypto.1703]

7 hours ago, Divirel.4953 said:

Grouch mentioned that thousands crashed into the system (no idea if it was at reset or signed up for it)

Yeah thousands of people who are in those PvE Multi Guilds that since the warclaw have been plaguing WvW.  These players do not bring what most WvW players would consider basic essentials.  So they are so under geared that you can watch them move across terrain and hit one of those glitches where it causes falling damage and the whole squad of them will just instantly die.

[Divirel.4953]

2 hours ago, Klypto.1703 said:

Yeah thousands of people who are in those PvE Multi Guilds that since the warclaw have been plaguing WvW.  These players do not bring what most WvW players would consider basic essentials.  So they are so under geared that you can watch them move across terrain and hit one of those glitches where it causes falling damage and the whole squad of them will just instantly die.

That's a valuable experience. Become a lootbag. Adapt as a lootbag. Improvise as a lootbag. And suddenly you will triumph.

[guan.1829]

It's over before I've even experienced it! Much to my regret

[Coda.9185]

On 9/27/2021 at 3:15 AM, Swamurabi.7890 said:

Some feedback that I would be interested in is:

 

1. How many players were trying to play WvW? I know you won't specify exact numbers but maybe numbers relative to past weeks average?

 

2.  Do you know if all queued maps were actually full? If not, why not?

 

3. How many matches would you expect to create with alliances? What percentage of players that joined WvW did NOT pre-select a WvW guild? Did that cause an issue?

 

4. With re-linking happening soon, are you going to use post re-link player data and compare it to pre link player data to modify alliance algorithm to try to mitigate alt-account problems?

1- i lead WvW guild, and we allied in 1 community guild. about 300 playes.... let's say 90% actually specified their WvW guild. 
we were 120~130 on voice at reset... the kick off for alliance 

2- some were fake queue and some were real... coz i tried to relog and i was 1 hour in queue until they rolled back 

3- that i cannot give u a reliable answer for 

4- yea sure.... why not.. i do anything that helps in any case 

[Josh Davis.7865]

It's been a busy week! The team has been digging into the data we gathered last week and we're at a point where we have a really solid understanding of what went wrong and what we need to do before we can attempt it again. In my last post I mentioned we're going to share a post-mortem of the issues we ran into and what we learned. Now that we've identified the root issues and we have a plan in place to tackle them, the writing comes next! We're out of office tomorrow, but our goal is to have it posted next week sometime. I'll let you know if our plans change.

 

Happy re-links tomorrow! I hope to see some of you at reset.

 

-j

[AikijinX.6258]

Oh wow, pretty good news. Unfortunate that it happened. But it was expected. Hope to see some more good news next week. Enjoy the day off.

Edited September 30, 2021 by AikijinX.6258

[Turiya Raver Xll.7068]

10 hours ago, Josh Davis.7865 said:

It's been a busy week! The team has been digging into the data we gathered last week and we're at a point where we have a really solid understanding of what went wrong and what we need to do before we can attempt it again. In my last post I mentioned we're going to share a post-mortem of the issues we ran into and what we learned. Now that we've identified the root issues and we have a plan in place to tackle them, the writing comes next! We're out of office tomorrow, but our goal is to have it posted next week sometime. I'll let you know if our plans change.

 

Happy re-links tomorrow! I hope to see some of you at reset.

 

-j

Josh, thank you for the update. I saw you in LA last reset, though you went into a different borderland than the one i was queued for and i did feel for you. I assumed you must have been gutted to see just how severe the problems were, resulting in the role back and i hoped there was not too much abuse going on in map/team chat to dishearten you.

WvW players have, which has been acknowledged by anet, felt neglected for some time, you appear to be genuinely trying to change that. The guild I am in has been around since the early days of guild wars and carried on through guild wars 2. We saw anet delete (rather than fix) issues with team arenas in guild wars 1, never fixing the abuse of player afk in fort aspenwood etc. We never understood why anet just didn't port across team arenas, GvG, fort aspenwood (where borders change and merchant become available to whichever faction controled that border etc) to GW2 all of which were great ideas and great to play but died on day 1 of GW2.

In guild wars 2 we see the abuse of orbs in the original version of wvw and that gets deleted entirely rather than fixed, the removal of a map to be replaced by what appears to be a very unpopular map, the issue of certain professions being unable to hit oil fixtures or npc archers on tower walls etc while other profession hit them with ease, I don't mean AOE skills, just spamming skill 1. The way wvw xp is accumulated is also affected by profession, and this has been acknowleged in that support players get far less in terms of rewards etc. The bugs/glitches/lag/latency/disparity have been around for a very long time, 9 years in fact. So many of us were really hyped about the new changes, and of course just as disappointed, as you must have been, when this did not work out. You can imagine a lot of people have now bought "new world", the most common comment i have heard is "i don't really want to go to new world as i think gw2 wvw is unique that no other mmo has, the combat mechanic is second to none and i wish anet would fix it, and explain exactly what this new system is and how it works...but they won't". As far as i am aware the length of queues to get into new world are horrendous, and that will be a window, which may close, to address wvw in gw2, but if it becomes the same as the 1hour + queue that we currently experience in gw2 on friday nights (and other nights depending on what tier you are in) then you may lose players on a more permanent basis.

As far as i am aware alliances have been promised for 4 years but little to no info given during this time which unfortunately reinforces negative views from wvw players about how they are perceived and treated. The idea of alliances, dx11 to help with fps etc. are all moves in the right direction (is the net coding being looked at as well?). May I suggest you reach out to the guild leaders of guilds who play wvw consistently and ask for suggestions/feedback on top of you already asking for general feedback/suggestions.

What does anet envison wvw as? At times wvw seems to be more of a solo roamer vs solo roamer, or cloud vs cloud than it does guild vs guild or "Guild Wars". Should there be anything done to encourage players to be in a guild within wvw?

You appear to be taking this seriously, and I thank you for that, and i look forward to your next post.

Edited October 1, 2021 by Turiya Raver Xll.7068
typos

[Klypto.1703]

On 9/27/2021 at 8:27 PM, Divirel.4953 said:

That's a valuable experience. Become a lootbag. Adapt as a lootbag. Improvise as a lootbag. And suddenly you will triumph.

They don't understand the concept of a lootbag as they have never killed any other players to know how to get one.

[Chichimec.9364]

On 9/30/2021 at 2:36 PM, Josh Davis.7865 said:

It's been a busy week! The team has been digging into the data we gathered last week and we're at a point where we have a really solid understanding of what went wrong and what we need to do before we can attempt it again. In my last post I mentioned we're going to share a post-mortem of the issues we ran into and what we learned. Now that we've identified the root issues and we have a plan in place to tackle them, the writing comes next! We're out of office tomorrow, but our goal is to have it posted next week sometime. I'll let you know if our plans change.

 

Happy re-links tomorrow! I hope to see some of you at reset.

 

-j

Thanks for the update. I've been waiting to see the post-mortem.

[Pulsefire Jayce.4753]

On 9/30/2021 at 3:36 PM, Josh Davis.7865 said:

It's been a busy week! The team has been digging into the data we gathered last week and we're at a point where we have a really solid understanding of what went wrong and what we need to do before we can attempt it again. In my last post I mentioned we're going to share a post-mortem of the issues we ran into and what we learned. Now that we've identified the root issues and we have a plan in place to tackle them, the writing comes next! We're out of office tomorrow, but our goal is to have it posted next week sometime. I'll let you know if our plans change.

 

Happy re-links tomorrow! I hope to see some of you at reset.

 

-j

Are we gonna get a recap / explanation this week?  This is just a friendly reminder. 🙂