Carnifex.3275 Posted February 28, 2022 Share Posted February 28, 2022 Why? To kill off PoF specs and move onto EOD? 5 1 6 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyT.7192 Posted February 28, 2022 Share Posted February 28, 2022 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Dave.6819 said: Why? To kill off PoF specs and move onto EOD? Yes Edit: "create breathing room for the new specs coming in" Edited February 28, 2022 by BobbyT.7192 8 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carnifex.3275 Posted February 28, 2022 Author Share Posted February 28, 2022 (edited) Jeez... i was actually expecting it. But still i've hoped they won't touch FBs. Such a cheap move. Edited February 28, 2022 by Dave.6819 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skyroar.2974 Posted February 28, 2022 Share Posted February 28, 2022 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Dave.6819 said: Jeez... i was actually expecting it. But still i've hope they won't touch FBs. Such a cheap move. They explicitly said that FBs would be nerfed this patch. Also, nerfing overpowered specs does not automatically mean that they were "killed off". People love to cry about how their professions are "nerfed to the ground" everytime Anet hits an overpowered spec, even when that isn't always enough to take them out of top tier. Edited February 28, 2022 by Skyroar.2974 9 2 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carnifex.3275 Posted February 28, 2022 Author Share Posted February 28, 2022 (edited) 40 minutes ago, Skyroar.2974 said: They explicitly said that FBs would be nerfed this patch. Also, nerfing overpowered specs does not automatically mean that they were "killed off". People love to cry about how their professions are "nerfed to the ground" everytime Anet hits an overpowered spec, even when that isn't always enough to take them out of top tier. Sure. It's just a "convenient timing" that's all. I mean sure, i don't mind wiping, some other healers will step up. "Just dodge" will suffice i suppose. And i wouldn't say FB was overpowered. Aegis was one of the core mechanics of Guardian. Removing it feels like removing fundamental skill of Guard. Remove something else - change cooldowns, lower the amount of healing or quickness or even remove one charge. But removing Aegis altogether? That's too much. It just feels like removing dodge or clones from mesmer and not giving anything in exchange. Again.. i think it's not really a change that would've been made if there were no EoD launch. It's specifically targeted to cripple some specs so people would move on to EoD. I mean look at epidemic, what they did to scourge lol. I think it's obvious what they are doing. Edited February 28, 2022 by Dave.6819 9 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zedd.8239 Posted February 28, 2022 Share Posted February 28, 2022 (edited) 31 minutes ago, Skyroar.2974 said: They explicitly said that FBs would be nerfed this patch. Also, nerfing overpowered specs does not automatically mean that they were "killed off". People love to cry about how their professions are "nerfed to the ground" everytime Anet hits an overpowered spec, even when that isn't always enough to take them out of top tier. There's a big difference between weakening aspects of a spec and killing a spec. Aegis is critical to firebrand support builds. This change doesn't merely weaken those. It kills them because it severely reduces access to one of the main forms of damage mitigation. If the goal is to make it more difficult for firebrands to do DPS and support at the same time, a trait change could be made to make players choose between DPS and support. I'd prefer to see a shift that requires players to make a choice between doing DPS and performing a support role. I'm all for making changes to help make room for new elite specs. But this? It's overkill and fixes something that isn't broken. Extra protection and resolution to compensate for the change is a joke. Those are both already really easy to apply. Edited February 28, 2022 by Zedd.8239 5 1 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LucianDK.8615 Posted February 28, 2022 Share Posted February 28, 2022 Surely you could see that Firebrands have been way overperforming. 3 5 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anbujackson.9564 Posted February 28, 2022 Share Posted February 28, 2022 (edited) Heal Firebrand still has shield 4 and retreat, like any other guardian. Quickness wasnt nerfed, damage wasnt either (the CD reduction doesnt count when you just consider single target). And you call that killing? Really? 😕 It will still dominate 100% (pve perspective btw) Edited February 28, 2022 by anbujackson.9564 2 2 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skyroar.2974 Posted February 28, 2022 Share Posted February 28, 2022 (edited) 9 minutes ago, LucianDK.8615 said: Surely you could see that Firebrands have been way overperforming. The profession boards are echo chambers where everyone believes they are unfair victims of Anet's bias. You can't really have a good discussion without people from other classes weighting in, which usually doesn't happens in these boards. Edited February 28, 2022 by Skyroar.2974 1 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hotride.2187 Posted February 28, 2022 Share Posted February 28, 2022 How is that gonna work in wvw though? The mantra is already useless as a heal since the final charge was removed? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zedd.8239 Posted February 28, 2022 Share Posted February 28, 2022 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Hotride.2187 said: How is that gonna work in wvw though? The mantra is already useless as a heal since the final charge was removed? It isn't. The extra resolution and protection don't exactly do anything either since boons are corrupted/stripped instantly in WvW. Boon uptime is pointless. Perhaps some of the other skill changes/specs will help make up for that. But I'll believe it when I see it. Edited February 28, 2022 by Zedd.8239 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hotride.2187 Posted February 28, 2022 Share Posted February 28, 2022 (edited) Also how does that work with granting quickness via stalwart speed? Again, in wvw? Though honestly in fractals also, the ones where you can't stack all the time an extra 3 seconds of quickness from the aegis was good to have... Why do I have a feeling nobody is looking at talent trees before making changes to professions? It is also going to reduce your healing output via invigorated bulwark and pure of heart... just lol. Edited February 28, 2022 by Hotride.2187 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
otto.5684 Posted February 28, 2022 Share Posted February 28, 2022 Wow. Does that mean the skill healing is buffed to compensate? No other boons? Why even bother equip this heal in any game mode now?! 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carnifex.3275 Posted February 28, 2022 Author Share Posted February 28, 2022 (edited) 52 minutes ago, Hotride.2187 said: Also how does that work with granting quickness via stalwart speed? Again, in wvw? Though honestly in fractals also, the ones where you can't stack all the time an extra 3 seconds of quickness from the aegis was good to have... Why do I have a feeling nobody is looking at talent trees before making changes to professions? It is also going to reduce your healing output via invigorated bulwark and pure of heart... just lol. That's how it seems to me too. Before doing changes they completely ignore/forget how the traits work. Stalwart speed won't synergize with mantra heal anymore. Sadge.. not only Willbender is a letdown but they nerfed FBs too. Instead of being hyped about xpac and sticking to my main class i'm actually thinking of rerolling to Mesme/Engi or some other class. That's usually how it happens with Xpacs. People jump on the classes that are fun and leave the nerfed ones behind. Edited February 28, 2022 by Dave.6819 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kontrolle.3514 Posted February 28, 2022 Share Posted February 28, 2022 thats overnerfed, wow 6 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howluffu.7259 Posted February 28, 2022 Share Posted February 28, 2022 R.I.P. Welcome back unwanted double mesmer and only mesmer tanking... 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quaniesan.8497 Posted February 28, 2022 Share Posted February 28, 2022 Lol, you know how much it heals for as a heal skill right now? it's absolutely miniscule. They just don't know what they are doing anymore I feel like. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zealex.9410 Posted February 28, 2022 Share Posted February 28, 2022 It was disgustingly busted in pve. 2 2 2 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axl.8924 Posted February 28, 2022 Share Posted February 28, 2022 4 hours ago, Skyroar.2974 said: The profession boards are echo chambers where everyone believes they are unfair victims of Anet's bias. You can't really have a good discussion without people from other classes weighting in, which usually doesn't happens in these boards. The problem with that theory is that people of other professions at time don't care and just want to be number 1 and win in PVP/WVW/PVE. True that people at forums can exaggerate but better to have a conversation with people who play the class than people who are revenant or nec mains who are biased or who don't care about the class. If a person doesn't play a class how can you expect them to know or care about changes? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kuma.1503 Posted February 28, 2022 Share Posted February 28, 2022 (edited) At least Anet gave compensation for this nerf, most other builds got nothing in exhange for nerfs that were just as, if not more harsh. Prot and Resolution are very underrated boons. 30% damage reduction is huge and it gives both boons on a spammable low cooldown skill. If you've played other MMO's, groups will frequently go out of their way to include classes which can give damage reduction. Even 10% is considered valuable. Much the same way that people value the defense pots in fractals. Ele even depends on them. Firebrand has also been the single most dominant spec in PvE for a very long time, so much so that groups would frequently stack them. Scrapper is frequently overlooked as a quickness source because firebrand just does what it does but better. Harbinger and Catalyst would face the same problem if it wasn't toned down in some way. (There's a good chance firebrand will still overshadow these builds) Keep in mind, they can still pump out on demand aegis with retreat and shield 4 in order to cheese mechanics, so I doubt their dominance in the meta will change any time soon. They're still going to be a top tier source of quickness, Top tier condi dps, and the best source of aegis for cheesing mechanics if they build for it. Edited February 28, 2022 by Kuma.1503 4 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monarc.9726 Posted February 28, 2022 Share Posted February 28, 2022 I’m so over these skill breaking nerfs. It’s extremely annoying and has been going on for too long. Almost every spec I enjoyed during PoF has had multiple ridiculous nerfs making so many skills and traits useless. And sorry, nerfing FB isn’t going to make WB suck any less, it’s just going to make FB less optimal. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brokensunday.4098 Posted March 1, 2022 Share Posted March 1, 2022 imagine in pvp mantra now healing for 600 if use all 3 in a row not even the traits can save it now lol 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carnifex.3275 Posted March 1, 2022 Author Share Posted March 1, 2022 7 hours ago, Monarc.9726 said: I’m so over these skill breaking nerfs. It’s extremely annoying and has been going on for too long. Almost every spec I enjoyed during PoF has had multiple ridiculous nerfs making so many skills and traits useless. And sorry, nerfing FB isn’t going to make WB suck any less, it’s just going to make FB less optimal. Exactly. I always compare how classes were at the start of HoT/PoF and how they are now. It just sucks out the joy with that kind of balancing strategy. Making specs less appealing is definitely not a wise way to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hotride.2187 Posted March 1, 2022 Share Posted March 1, 2022 8 hours ago, Kuma.1503 said: At least Anet gave compensation for this nerf, most other builds got nothing in exhange for nerfs that were just as, if not more harsh. Prot and Resolution are very underrated boons. 30% damage reduction is huge and it gives both boons on a spammable low cooldown skill. If you've played other MMO's, groups will frequently go out of their way to include classes which can give damage reduction. Even 10% is considered valuable. Much the same way that people value the defense pots in fractals. Ele even depends on them. Firebrand has also been the single most dominant spec in PvE for a very long time, so much so that groups would frequently stack them. Scrapper is frequently overlooked as a quickness source because firebrand just does what it does but better. Harbinger and Catalyst would face the same problem if it wasn't toned down in some way. (There's a good chance firebrand will still overshadow these builds) Keep in mind, they can still pump out on demand aegis with retreat and shield 4 in order to cheese mechanics, so I doubt their dominance in the meta will change any time soon. They're still going to be a top tier source of quickness, Top tier condi dps, and the best source of aegis for cheesing mechanics if they build for it. You do know that nothing has been buffed to replace the all-in-one-boons coming from fb? So it will still stay dominant, even if its worse now. I could understand "well we removed group quickness and gave it to 2 other professions" or "we moved some of the aegis fb can provide to other 2 professions". Or even better "we added group stab to 2 other professions". As it stands they've done nothing - you will be worse as the group fb, but there is still no replacement for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puck.3697 Posted March 1, 2022 Share Posted March 1, 2022 15 hours ago, Dave.6819 said: Jeez... i was actually expecting it. But still i've hoped they won't touch FBs. Such a cheap move. Firebrand is litterally one of the most broken speccs in the game, how did you think it wouldn't get nerfed? 48 minutes ago, Hotride.2187 said: You do know that nothing has been buffed to replace the all-in-one-boons coming from fb? So it will still stay dominant, even if its worse now. I could understand "well we removed group quickness and gave it to 2 other professions" or "we moved some of the aegis fb can provide to other 2 professions". Or even better "we added group stab to 2 other professions". As it stands they've done nothing - you will be worse as the group fb, but there is still no replacement for you. There doesn't need to be a replacement for it?! Why do we advocate for this game to build stupidly broken speccs which trivalize content and make everything babysit mode. Nothing needs to ever be as strong as firebrand was it made content too easy quite litterally. Yes spreading it out woulda been better and I do hope warrior get a banner which pulses stab when it's reworked. But no proffession should monopolise stab aegis and Quickness in a single build. 1 2 1 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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