End of Dragons and the masterful implementation of difficulty progression

[Raizel.8175]

We're now two weeks into the expansion and most of us should have a pretty decent impression of End of Dragons by now. In my opinion, EoD is a well made and an especially well thought-out expansion. Of course there are parts of EoD that probably aren't up to standard - some of the new elite specializations feel rather lackluster, some maps could use some improvement and - albeit both well told and well staged - the story itself was quite predictable and the premature death of a certain character is such a shame - that loose cannon (or rather two, since said person is a Revenant?) could have been such an amazing character in upcoming story arcs.

Nonetheless, I'd like to talk about a particular design philosophy which Arena Net masterfully implemented and for which Arena Net deserves praise and appreciation. End of Dragons in itself is a well thought-out school which teaches the player how to function both as a proper member of a MMORPG-community and as a proper player of a MMORPG. You start the story as a nobody and even have to learn the most basic of basic gameplay mechanics: how to dodge and/or block, about CC and defiance bars, about Combo Fields and even a little bit about 3D movement through a very basic Jumping Puzzle. The story then progresses through several instanced boss fights in which you both have to apply your (newfound) knowlegde about game mechanics and further said knowledge though newly introduced mechanics:

At the first major boss fight, you have to apply your knowledge about CC and defiance bars, you have to dodge and/or block properly by dodging and/or going out of orange and red circles and/or telegraphs; you learn that you have to defeat adds in order to make the boss vulnerable again and you learn about basic positioning. At the second major boss fight, you further your application of learned mechanics and further learn about movement-inhibiting mechanics and the importance of enemy movement. Further into the story at the third major boss fight, you deepen your understanding of enemy movement and positioning. You also learn that you want to keep certain enemies apart from another since they're "stronger together" - a signal that you too will be stronger if you stack at one point with other players. At the last major story boss fight, you have to apply your knowledge fighting the facets of the Elder Dragons.

The story fights are all rather easy and teach those who want to learn the basics about gameplay mechanics. The open world meta events then add the social component: You learn how squads work and that you will have to split in order for the meta events to work. At Seitungs meta boss, you have to apply your knowledge about dodging, using CC in critical moments and you have to kill adds in oder to make the boss vulnerable again. Kainengs meta boss pretty much works the same way. Echovalds meta boss adds hard phase transitions and introduces one-hit-mechanics which you have to counter by standing at a certain position. These meta bosses are all fairly easy, but they force people to engage with the content. Dragons End is the culmination of what you've learned thus far. There are almost no new mechanics involved besides greens - everything else has already been taught by prior story or meta bosses.

You then can further deepen your understanding of gameplay mechanics and the social aspect of MMORPGs by joining Strike Missions. Since they don't have a timer, Strike Missions - at the very least the first three - are fairly doable and reiterate on their story equivalent. The last Strike Mission, Harvest Temple, is a glorious instanced 10-player-take on the story finale. The encounter weaves the facets of the Elder Dragons well together and - albeit without time limit - creates a quite challenging encounter. The four EoD Strike Missions basically represent a raid wing. They're mechanically on the rather challenging side. If you've managed to beat everything and then Harvest Temple, you're certainly able to challenge any PvE-content the game offers; you went from a newborn at the beginning of the story to an adult member of the community.

You really can't praise Arena Net enough for EoD. The difficulty progression and difficulty variety especially in open world content is something GW2 urgently needs. I do hope that Arena Net will keep up the story in upcoming content. Forcing players to properly engage with the game will enable Arena Net to be far more creative in future open world content since "interactive movie" won't be the lowest common denominator anymore. In the long term, this kind of game design will also be helpful to forge a better community: GW2 suffers from a very fragmented community since skill levels vastly differ - up to a point where you can argue if GW2 even has a cohesive community. Raising the basic skill level required will pull the extremes of the community closer together which in turn will lead to more cohesion inside the community. In that regard, may praises and appreciation be with Arena Net. Please keep up the good work with future content.

[TrollingDemigod.3041]

Didn't find any "sarcasm" marking so I assume you are serious with this post.
They did terrible job with that though, because explanation of mechanics like CC's should be in a C O R E game after doing very first story instance, not in the 3rd expansion. Then step by step the understanding and difficulty of mechanics should be progressive with the game like in core should be demanding dodging and positioning, HoT use of CC skills at correct times with burn phases, PoF adding more mechanics on bosses on top of the previous ones and finally EoD summirizing it. 
Game doesn't explain a kitten since 2012, people still run in white items pick random traits and skills and A-net suddenly DEMANDS raid builds, they screwed it up.
EoD isn't even difficult in the first place, there's really no increase in that aspect in the slightest, IDK where did you even get that idea. 
I'm waiting for A-net to add forced teleport to nearest waypoint immediately when you die on world bosses, it's 2022 and people still refuse to do that.

[Sarius.9285]

21 minutes ago, TrollingDemigod.3041 said:

Didn't find any "sarcasm" marking so I assume you are serious with this post.
They did terrible job with that though, because explanation of mechanics like CC's should be in a C O R E game after doing very first story instance, not in the 3rd expansion. Then step by step the understanding and difficulty of mechanics should be progressive with the game like in core should be demanding dodging and positioning, HoT use of CC skills at correct times with burn phases, PoF adding more mechanics on bosses on top of the previous ones and finally EoD summirizing it. 
Game doesn't explain a kitten since 2012, people still run in white items pick random traits and skills and A-net suddenly DEMANDS raid builds, they screwed it up.
EoD isn't even difficult in the first place, there's really no increase in that aspect in the slightest, IDK where did you even get that idea. 
I'm waiting for A-net to add forced teleport to nearest waypoint immediately when you die on world bosses, it's 2022 and people still refuse to do that.

the game overall used to do a poor job, yea.

 

But EoD by itself does a great job of scaling difficulty 

[Raizel.8175]

23 minutes ago, TrollingDemigod.3041 said:

Didn't find any "sarcasm" marking so I assume you are serious with this post.
They did terrible job with that though, because explanation of mechanics like CC's should be in a C O R E game after doing very first story instance, not in the 3rd expansion. Then step by step the understanding and difficulty of mechanics should be progressive with the game like in core should be demanding dodging and positioning, HoT use of CC skills at correct times with burn phases, PoF adding more mechanics on bosses on top of the previous ones and finally EoD summirizing it. 
Game doesn't explain a kitten since 2012, people still run in white items pick random traits and skills and A-net suddenly DEMANDS raid builds, they screwed it up.
EoD isn't even difficult in the first place, there's really no increase in that aspect in the slightest, IDK where did you even get that idea. 
I'm waiting for A-net to add forced teleport to nearest waypoint immediately when you die on world bosses, it's 2022 and people still refuse to do that.

Yes, I'm perfectly serious about my initial post. You're right that Arena Net did a very poor job actually explaining game mechanics prior to EoD. Nonetheless, players were confronted with several game mechanics during open world events. If you stand in orange circles at Chak Gerent for example, you're going to die. If you don't kill adds at DBS, you won't be able to damage the boss. If you don't CC the Wyvern Matriarch, you're going to have a rather annoying time. I also agree that open world events prior to EoD - at least in their vast majority - were far too easy and that the game suffered from a lack of difficulty progression and variety. Nonetheless you have to start at one point and that point now is EoD which serves as a comprehensive guide to how to play the game properly. It teaches all relevant basic gameplay (and social) mechanics you need for GW2. There's no rocket science involved, it's merely the basics.

I have to strongly disagree with you on two points: First, there is difficulty progression in EoD - in story content, in open world content and in Strike Missions. It may seem easy to you and me, but it may very well be a decent learning experience for the average player. Second, Arena Net doesn't demand raid builds. You don't need a raid build for anything in EoD.

[Zok.4956]

Sure, there is a little tutorial. But its too little, too late. Overall, the game, including EoD, is doing a very poor job in preparing average players for the final map meta end boss in DE.

And the story-instances did not scale well. I played them with 3 friends and everything was melting so fast, I could not even see most of the intended mechanics.

 

 

 

Edited March 14, 2022 by Zok.4956

[Pyriel.4370]

1 hour ago, Raizel.8175 said:

We're now two weeks into the expansion and most of us should have a pretty decent impression of End of Dragons by now. In my opinion, EoD is a well made and an especially well thought-out expansion. Of course there are parts of EoD that probably aren't up to standard - some of the new elite specializations feel rather lackluster, some maps could use some improvement and - albeit both well told and well staged - the story itself was quite predictable and the premature death of a certain character is such a shame - that loose cannon (or rather two, since said person is a Revenant?) could have been such an amazing character in upcoming story arcs.

Nonetheless, I'd like to talk about a particular design philosophy which Arena Net masterfully implemented and for which Arena Net deserves praise and appreciation. End of Dragons in itself is a well thought-out school which teaches the player how to function both as a proper member of a MMORPG-community and as a proper player of a MMORPG. You start the story as a nobody and even have to learn the most basic of basic gameplay mechanics: how to dodge and/or block, about CC and defiance bars, about Combo Fields and even a little bit about 3D movement through a very basic Jumping Puzzle. The story then progresses through several instanced boss fights in which you both have to apply your (newfound) knowlegde about game mechanics and further said knowledge though newly introduced mechanics:

At the first major boss fight, you have to apply your knowledge about CC and defiance bars, you have to dodge and/or block properly by dodging and/or going out of orange and red circles and/or telegraphs; you learn that you have to defeat adds in order to make the boss vulnerable again and you learn about basic positioning. At the second major boss fight, you further your application of learned mechanics and further learn about movement-inhibiting mechanics and the importance of enemy movement. Further into the story at the third major boss fight, you deepen your understanding of enemy movement and positioning. You also learn that you want to keep certain enemies apart from another since they're "stronger together" - a signal that you too will be stronger if you stack at one point with other players. At the last major story boss fight, you have to apply your knowledge fighting the facets of the Elder Dragons.

The story fights are all rather easy and teach those who want to learn the basics about gameplay mechanics. The open world meta events then add the social component: You learn how squads work and that you will have to split in order for the meta events to work. At Seitungs meta boss, you have to apply your knowledge about dodging, using CC in critical moments and you have to kill adds in oder to make the boss vulnerable again. Kainengs meta boss pretty much works the same way. Echovalds meta boss adds hard phase transitions and introduces one-hit-mechanics which you have to counter by standing at a certain position. These meta bosses are all fairly easy, but they force people to engage with the content. Dragons End is the culmination of what you've learned thus far. There are almost no new mechanics involved besides greens - everything else has already been taught by prior story or meta bosses.

You then can further deepen your understanding of gameplay mechanics and the social aspect of MMORPGs by joining Strike Missions. Since they don't have a timer, Strike Missions - at the very least the first three - are fairly doable and reiterate on their story equivalent. The last Strike Mission, Harvest Temple, is a glorious instanced 10-player-take on the story finale. The encounter weaves the facets of the Elder Dragons well together and - albeit without time limit - creates a quite challenging encounter. The four EoD Strike Missions basically represent a raid wing. They're mechanically on the rather challenging side. If you've managed to beat everything and then Harvest Temple, you're certainly able to challenge any PvE-content the game offers; you went from a newborn at the beginning of the story to an adult member of the community.

You really can't praise Arena Net enough for EoD. The difficulty progression and difficulty variety especially in open world content is something GW2 urgently needs. I do hope that Arena Net will keep up the story in upcoming content. Forcing players to properly engage with the game will enable Arena Net to be far more creative in future open world content since "interactive movie" won't be the lowest common denominator anymore. In the long term, this kind of game design will also be helpful to forge a better community: GW2 suffers from a very fragmented community since skill levels vastly differ - up to a point where you can argue if GW2 even has a cohesive community. Raising the basic skill level required will pull the extremes of the community closer together which in turn will lead to more cohesion inside the community. In that regard, may praises and appreciation be with Arena Net. Please keep up the good work with future content.

The level of praise and the rest of the feedback seen on the forums just makes you look like you are White Knighting. Literally. It's cringeworthy.

I'll go point by point as constructively as I can.

I agree with the story and elite specs. Room for improvement on some parts but ok.

Let's look into "well thought out": 
 - The specs are pretty uninspired except maybe the spectre. It's like they don't like their own lore. Easy ones would have been as follows: Spear for guard with banners (commander), hammer for ranger with attunements (warden), dual scepter for ele with spirit weapons (channeller), shield for necro with spirits(ritualist), dual swords for thief with stances (bodyguard), Staff for Warriors with meditations (battle-monk), etc.
   
 - The siege turtle mount fiasco is a dumpster fire due to the meta, the strike mission required and what the mount is / does. Nothing of note. THIS WAS A MAIN FEATURE.
 - The areas were kinda small, map completion was nothing like in PoF or HoT. 3 Hearts in 3/4 maps. 
 - Very little capitalisation on the popular alliances, Kurzick and Luxons. While in lore they were conquered, there's no reason why they culturally couldn't be distinct still.

Next we will look into difficulty scaling:
 - The story boss fights are pretty on par with PoF boss fights except for the end one which is very good in my eyes and feels a lot like Balthazar (well done there Anet).
 - The Meta's are not easy, otherwise this wouldn't be up for a debate, let alone defence from you.

Strike missions: Further and deepen understanding? Bit wishful there, most have anxiety about going into strikes or raids because of how the community who engages with it, engage with a "git gud" attitude online, while it may not be 100% true, it is certainly the most visible (lookin at you Teapot).

"can't praise enough". Yes you can, its a relatively short expac with not much in the way of dungeons, extra fractals, map size and features. Fishing and skiffs are nice but not really blockbuster features. E.g. HoT introduced

Guild Halls and a MAJOR upgrade to the guild system, Gliding, Masteries, Elite specialisations, a New Profession, New enemy races, Raids, overhauled sPvP with new currencies/reward tracks/PvP leagues incl lego Backpack for PvP, Stronghold game type, new WvW maps, 4 new fractals and level increased to max 100 for fractals, 8 new stat combinations, adventures, updated commander view.  

PoF introduced:
5 new maps (huge ones at that), the mount system incl 5 mounts, definitively well designed elite specs, 3 new raids, bounties, 3 new stat combinations, 5 armor sets, 1 guild hall.

EoD introducted: 
4 medium maps, new elite specs that are a bit uninspired, 1 mount (if you can get it), skiffs, fishing, arborstone (a new EotN tbf), 4 strike missions, jade bot, 5 armor sets, 2 new stat combinations.

The main thing that you need to be aware of? No player should be "forced" to do something, they shouldn't have to. They should be encouraged. This is not raising basic skill level. It's making people sub on discord.

Edited March 14, 2022 by Pyriel.4370

[Raizel.8175]

29 minutes ago, Pyriel.4370 said:

The level of praise and the rest of the feedback seen on the forums just makes you look like you are White Knighting. Literally. It's cringeworthy.

I admit that I wanted to create some contrast to the overly negative feedback on the forums. That doesn't mean I'm being a White Knight though. EoD has several flaws. I admittedly glossed over these. Overall though, Arena Net did a really good job with EoD.

[Pyriel.4370]

4 minutes ago, Raizel.8175 said:

I admit that I wanted to create some contrast to the overly negative feedback on the forums. That doesn't mean I'm being a White Knight though. EoD has several flaws. I admittedly glossed over these. Overall though, Arena Net did a really good job with EoD.

see above edit, felt I could do a better response for you.

[Peterson.5172]

11 minutes ago, Raizel.8175 said:

I admit that I wanted to create some contrast to the overly negative feedback on the forums. That doesn't mean I'm being a White Knight though. EoD has several flaws. I admittedly glossed over these. Overall though, Arena Net did a really good job with EoD.

i support you because all players' opinions should be heard

but not talking about/ackowledging the bad things opens up your opinion to a lot of criticism (especially with that thread title)

Pyriel has addressed most points so i wont rehash, i just want to say anet does a horrible job of teaching players how to play

the training area in seitung is equivalent to teaching addition (a decade after game release), then expecting people to do multiplication (final meta)

[fixit.7189]

hi, you got raids, fractals, and strikes for 'hard' content so if those are not good enough for you then i suggest talking to the devs about it and leave OW alone. thanks!

[Desh.7028]

The three first map metas actually do this:

Seitung teaches adds - which every map I've been in are largely ignored which leads to tons of downstates thanks to the shredders but he's just zerg'ed down anyway.

Kaineng teaches breakbars and splitting up - but if you are quick you can help out with multiple of the replicators and the breakbar lesson here is mainly "bring waystations from Drizzlewood for EMP" (that's not wining any design awards). The pre-event stage is hellishly boring though.

Echovald teaches dodging and standing in the right place at the right time - issue here is a massive discrepancy in experience for melee and ranged playstyles.

 

The idea here however seems pretty clear even if not everything is perfect I'd say it is thoughtful design.

Issue however is when difficulty ramped up from 2 to 3 to 5, then Dragon's End is still at 11 for a true open world pug.

Rewards are inverse to the difficulty, Seitung being the best and Dragon's End being complete dumpster. They're not good for any of the metas though.

 

 

2 hours ago, Peterson.5172 said:

Pyriel has addressed most points so i wont rehash, i just want to say anet does a horrible job of teaching players how to play

 

 

This only ever happens in MMOs that are notoriously hard with no easy mode. Like EVE.

Or games so simple there is nothing to teach. Not every player is willing to learn the depths of GW2 boons, stat scaling or coefficients, some actually might not be able to and there is still can be room for them.

[Kaliwenda.3428]

53 minutes ago, Desh.7028 said:

The three first map metas actually do this:

<snip>

Echovald teaches dodging and standing in the right place at the right time - issue here is a massive discrepancy in experience for melee and ranged playstyles.

<snip>

I just did the Echovald meta this afternoon, I happened along right before it started and someone was setting up food and banners at the start point.

I'm new to the zone so part of it was still unexplored for me, but I was able to get to a couple of the red zones before the last parts in the junkyard.

The end felt like pure chaos...so much visual noise going on that I had no idea what it was trying to teach me but I did see someone say something in map chat about standing in white circles after a bunch of us got clobbered. Still it was very hard to tell what was going on and hard to tell what the NPC was shouting about in the midst of all the combat noises.

I pretty much followed everybody else when the last thing moved from place to place, got stomped a few more times but made it thru to the end (glad that's over).

Dragon's End is like this but dialed up to 11? And takes two hours to complete?

Hoo boy, not looking forward to that at all.

 

Edited March 15, 2022 by Kaliwenda.3428

[blp.3489]

I agree with the part about the story incrementally teaching you mechanics.

On the other hand, going through the story doesn't prepare you for the DPS requirements in the DE meta.  The missing parts are raising any awareness of what your DPS is let alone how to raise it, absolutely nothing about boons, and nothing about organizing large groups with subgroups with boon providers etc.  These three things are needed or greatly greatly facilitate success in the final meta.  And as I have said elsewhere, the fatal flaw with the DE meta is that it incorporates a DPS check in the form of a timer limit.  Anet seemingly forgot that there are wildly varying levels of DPS in the player base (reportedly more than a 10x difference) and that it is impossible to mix high DPS players with low DPS players into a single event with a DPS check in it.  At least without causing huge conflict in the player base.  Then they made it all much worse by gating the new mount behind winning the meta and by giving no loot at all when you fail, raising the stakes in that conflict even more.

[Ashantara.8731]

13 hours ago, TrollingDemigod.3041 said:

They did terrible job with that though, because explanation of mechanics like CC's should be in a C O R E game

That sentence makes no sense. The fact that it should have been in the core game (which I agree upon) has nothing to do with how well (or badly) it was implemented into EoD. Its quality of implementation in EoD has nothing to do with the fact that it was not implemented earlier, into the core game.

[vandrefalk.6823]

14 hours ago, TrollingDemigod.3041 said:

They did terrible job with that though, because explanation of mechanics like CC's should be in a C O R E game after doing very first story instance, not in the 3rd expansion. Then step by step the understanding and difficulty of mechanics should be progressive with the game like in core should be demanding dodging and positioning, HoT use of CC skills at correct times with burn phases, PoF adding more mechanics on bosses on top of the previous ones and finally EoD summirizing it. 

It's too late to explain it in starter areas and during leveling since its active player base are now mostly veterans with level 80s, who now require teaching a bit more about these mechanics they have been neglecting. What better way than use the first area of EoD, and even a story step, to refresh those mechanics.

I have great confidence in the player base/community when Dragon's End meta is now more and more often completing successfully, however I have little confidence in all those individuals who *still* simply refuse to look at their skills for the new "Defiance" tooltip and use/reserve those skills for when the entire map chat asks for "CC"... they are selfish and ignorant and happy to mash buttons and probably use all their skills off cooldown without regard for what they do. Their 1-2k dps coupled with at least seems to suggest so. And this is not a jab at doing low dps; learning rotations and running proper builds is another step up and fair enough, others can make up for DPS to some degree. But they should at least be caring enough for the entire squad that is fighting around you and doing a little bit to help - when your character definitely is able to - instead of choosing to just lean back and press 11111, well, it's time this game asks something of you if you want all the new rewards.

[kharmin.7683]

1 hour ago, Dondarrion.2748 said:

It's too late to explain it in starter areas and during leveling since its active player base are now mostly veterans with level 80s, who now require teaching a bit more about these mechanics they have been neglecting. What better way than use the first area of EoD, and even a story step, to refresh those mechanics.

 

Why not put it in starter areas and later zones (as a refresher)?

Edited March 15, 2022 by kharmin.7683

[vandrefalk.6823]

22 minutes ago, kharmin.7683 said:

Why not put it in starter areas and later zones (as a refresher)?

I would think the starter areas would require a lot of modifications in possibly "spaghetti code" to add something like this. While in an entirely new map, there is a lot more space and less clutter to fit this in.

But ultimately - of course, that would have been the best.

Edited March 15, 2022 by Dondarrion.2748

[battledrone.8315]

5 minutes ago, Dondarrion.2748 said:

I would think the starter areas would require a lot of modifications in possibly "spaghetti code" to add something like this. While in an entirely new map, there is a lot more space and less clutter to fit this in.

But ultimately - of course, that would have been the best.

but wasnt it like that before NPE? didnt they nerf it out because people complained?

thats the way i recall it, i may be wrong though

[vandrefalk.6823]

54 minutes ago, battledrone.8315 said:

but wasnt it like that before NPE? didnt they nerf it out because people complained?

thats the way i recall it, i may be wrong though

When NPE first came out, I remember starting a new character and feeling completely alienated from the game compared to what I'd loved when I originally started. I was probably encumbered by first impression and having learned it and now facing a dumbed-down NPE. But apparently to new players, it is better now?

[Desh.7028]

14 hours ago, Kaliwenda.3428 said:

Dragon's End is like this but dialed up to 11? And takes two hours to complete?

 

 

Dragon's End is easier to learn when it comes to it's mechanics imho and what's about to happen is clearer, it's only a lot after the 20% add phase when kitten gets a little wild. The stomp is something that will surprise you if you don't already know about it. The mechanic here is to zoom out far enough to see when and where he puts down the salvage pit and already start moving into that direction and stand there when there's a white (not green? Anet why?) circle.

If you have it do the fight on a Scourge or condi Mech next time, this will be less clutter where you generally are and you'll get a better overview. the number of attacks is actually low but many moves put down more than one circle of bad and the "pull you into this direction" mechanic won't be to everyone's liking but keep people from falling asleep.

 

1 hour ago, Dondarrion.2748 said:

I was probably encumbered by first impression and having learned it and now facing a dumbed-down NPE. But apparently to new players, it is better now?

 

You also weren't actually a new player, right? 

 

One of the main issue no one wants seems to want to say is people simply refuse to read the tooltips to begin with. No need to even talk about out of game resources like the wiki. I've had this in many games leading even in higher level raiding where some actually didn't read their kitten which should be the very first thing you should do in any hotkey MMO.

Wonder how that could be worked into a tutorial. Imho Eve got it somewhat done but the starting NPE is actually fairly lengthy (but not obnoxious).

Also there should've been a dashboard you're forced to interact with in the Monastery zone which pops up a table telling you about boons and then gives you tiny quizzes about them for heart completion and then you get to hit something without might three times and then 25 stacks are applied and you get to hit it again and get to go "OMFG WHAT ARE THESE kittenING DRUGS?".

And maybe even a second one telling you about tertiary stats, condion/power and scaling.

[Kaliwenda.3428]

3 hours ago, Desh.7028 said:

 

Dragon's End is easier to learn when it comes to it's mechanics imho and what's about to happen is clearer, it's only a lot after the 20% add phase when kitten gets a little wild. The stomp is something that will surprise you if you don't already know about it. The mechanic here is to zoom out far enough to see when and where he puts down the salvage pit and already start moving into that direction and stand there when there's a white (not green? Anet why?) circle.

If you have it do the fight on a Scourge or condi Mech next time, this will be less clutter where you generally are and you'll get a better overview. the number of attacks is actually low but many moves put down more than one circle of bad and the "pull you into this direction" mechanic won't be to everyone's liking but keep people from falling asleep.

<snip>

Thank you Desh.

You're right about the camera zoom out, when I got back from being stomped the first (or second? third? time -  hard to remember) my camera got zoomed out for me automatically which gave me a much better view.

[Kuya.6495]

I dont know if it's a lack of reading comprehension from some posters but I noticed a few replies that keep bringing up other aspects about the expansion and about how somethings needed to be taught in core game as, apparently, some sort of rebuttal to the OP?  The OP literally stated the goal of his post: to praise the increased difficulty and the attempt to layer the difficulty progressively in EoD.  The OP isn't talking about elite specs. The OP isn't talking about the plot. The OP isn't talking about core, HoT and PoF.  He's talking about difficulty ramp up in EoD specifically.

 

If people are going to critique a post they should at least address it directly and not try to derail a thread with a completely separate topic. 

 

To the OP: I'm sorry. You might as well be speaking another language to half the people in this forum. They completely failed to grasp what you were saying and then proceeded to rant about whatever perceived personal slights the expansion has committed against them. 

Edited March 15, 2022 by Kuya.6495

[Pyriel.4370]

13 hours ago, Kuya.6495 said:

I dont know if it's a lack of reading comprehension from some posters but I noticed a few replies that keep bringing up other aspects about the expansion and about how somethings needed to be taught in core game as, apparently, some sort of rebuttal to the OP?  The OP literally stated the goal of his post: to praise the increased difficulty and the attempt to layer the difficulty progressively in EoD.  The OP isn't talking about elite specs. The OP isn't talking about the plot. The OP isn't talking about core, HoT and PoF.  He's talking about difficulty ramp up in EoD specifically.

Read the first paragraph of their post and the OPs second post acknowledging that they glossed over some parts of EoD. Also to really judge EoD you need to compare and contrast, not doing so is completely insane. I would also like to point out that because you like one aspect of a design philosophy, doesn’t mean the whole package is as good as the OP post states.

On 3/14/2022 at 8:04 PM, Raizel.8175 said:

You don't need a raid build for anything in EoD.

The lack of awareness in the above statement also shows the OP is making the above praise either by ignorance or wilfully disregarding that the DE meta and strike required for the turtle do in fact need raid builds currently. Never mind doing strikes themselves.

[Eloc Freidon.5692]

There was a ton of mechanics in the finale of the Jade Sea meta that wasn't in events used leading up to it.

 

HoT's lanes had tons of mechanics and tasks that were mostly about movement and focusing targets that helped you build up to the final confrontation.

 

This expansion was soured by the poor pacing of this one meta.

[TheQuickFox.3826]

ANet got quite some criticism in the past of not explaining core mechanics well enough. And rightfully so. In the execution of EoD I can clearly see that the devs took this criticism to the heart and did something with it. Mechanics ARE explained now and players are repeatedly incentivized to actually use them throughout the expansion. It's not enough to bring players up-to-speed for the final meta but I clearly see the improvement.