the unfun matching sytem

[vanflyheight.6832]

These kinds of matches shouldnt be happening as much as they should be, its annoying and gets players overly frustrated that, yes get to be overly "toxic". But this is more anet induced since they cant seem to fix this kind of gameplay to where one single team just zergs the crap outta the other and no way to make a comeback. Plus ive lost li ke 15+ matches and already irritated to the hill with this kind of crud. I was aimin for plat but been smacked down by alot of losses that this is why i ended up quitting pvp in the first place. 

https://imgur.com/a/vZO6URX

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

It's because chase power is roughly double the disengage power. They need to balance chase vs disengage. It's causing a lot of problems 

[Luthan.5236]

This seems like a typical/usual "loss streak" to me. Though strictly speaking "streak" would mean there is no win in between ... I usually go down by 100-150 in rating - with mostly getting losses. In between a win every now and then. Then switching to the opposite: Mostly wins with some losses in between.

Not that bad with the 1 win in between. Some close losses (500 vs 4xx) and losses were the enemy was stronger but not too pwning (500 vs 2xx or so).

The 500 vs <100 are annoying though. Can feel pretty discouraging. Personally I tend to try less hard then ... meaning it will only lead to more losses. (Giving up early in the next match.)

Big rating loss when losing hard - is the most annoying. When you expect to lose only a small amount (less than 10) cause the enemy was (=felt ... but was not according to the rating numbers) so much stronger.

Edited June 6, 2022 by Luthan.5236

[SlayerXX.7138]

The power off getting tilted. Gold 3 to plat 1 is death valley. You can taste the difficulty going up by magnitudes.

[xblankk.4207]

I've been playing other classes for Ascension and I dropped down to G1 and then had Naru in my game the other day - luckily on my team, so I just sat back and watched him win for us. 

Matchmaking 👌

[felix.2386]

1 hour ago, Albi.7250 said:

The power off getting tilted. Gold 3 to plat 1 is death valley. You can taste the difficulty going up by magnitudes.

yes because gold people have no idea how to dodge/play willbender,harb, specter, vindicator and tempest.

either they just get deleted by these classes so fast

or they die so fast trying to play one.

it's so ridiculous.

also because barely anyone play this game anymore.

power of duo queue shines more then ever now.

Edited June 6, 2022 by felix.2386

[Luthan.5236]

Yeah. I have noticed this as well - when I got higher. Used to be between silver 3 and gold 1 only. Cause I played core engineer and I'm a noob. 😄 (Did not like holo and scrapper in WvW/PvP.) With the mechanist I am stable at least 1-2 sub-tiers higher. gold 2 at the moment and not yet gotten to a big loss streak down. Stable there.

Even then at some non-prime time play I have gotten the "prince" and "princess" people on the enemy team. Worst if there are double duos (2 duos grouped up) with 1 duo in the own team only. And the match maker has to fill it up - and not enough plats and gold 3 are there ... and you as gold 2 get matched up into this.

Though in the end it still felt like a group thing. The big duos making the difference. I noticed a harder time 1 vs. 1 and getting killed mostly - even by the thieves. (Though not instantly. Tried to adapt and defend as good as possible.) But when you usually kill the thief and have  an about 50/50 change of winning/losing in 1 vs. 1. ... this makes the difference especially if they move better/more coordinated. (The both duos probably each coordinated and maybe using voice chat - if they are used to duo queue with their partner.)

Edited June 6, 2022 by Luthan.5236

[vanflyheight.6832]

Im mostly a gold tier skilled type player, but sure seems like im more of a silver skilled which makes alot of the decent skilled players get set back by a couple yrs. So ya have to make 4-6x the effort to get least 1 win when pvp is bout rotating between the primary objective (capping nodes) and secondary (bell- capricorn, beasts- forest, stillness/tranquil- silent storm) plus im sure most players dont know the role they play regarding the difference between a side noder, roamer, or teamfighter.

 

Which most of the random pvp players are only doin their own thing which makes em feed mid to the other side which is a no win scenario. And ofc anet doesnt know how to balance classes when its not bout what makes things "even" vs what "counters the other" like mesmer will always be a hard counter to thief. And necro gets hard countered by bursts and or classes that have some kind of boon removal. Not to mention there's not enough condi cleanse in the pvp mode to even survive for dps classes.

 

So the point on that is to increase/buff the cleanse sigil to 2 condi removal which would be a small change, or buff up the dmg/healing for these kind of classes so they'll be more of a threat. If we want to have a better gw2, players need to quit whining bout nerfs that arent necessary and do buffs that are necessary. 

[Eddbopkins.2630]

13 hours ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

It's because chase power is roughly double the disengage power. They need to balance chase vs disengage. It's causing a lot of problems 

Mm chase disengage vs disengage, mm an ez good fix imo to this would be no line of sight, no teleporting to the player/enemy. When disengaging a ranger one tended to try and lose los so they cant be pewpewed, however now ranger has teleports that go threw solid objects. I can go on but ranger is one of the newer culprits to this problem.

[Eddbopkins.2630]

2 hours ago, xKole.9175 said:

I've been playing other classes for Ascension and I dropped down to G1 and then had Naru in my game the other day - luckily on my team, so I just sat back and watched him win for us. 

Matchmaking 👌

Matchmaker expansion only caters to the top 10%. It should be removed for the sake of the other 90% of the player base maybe? If the top teir players have to wait a long time for them to fight someone and be In a game of their ranking that on them. Being put in a game with a 1700-1900 player when litterly everyone else is 1100-1400 defeats the purpose of competitive gameplay.

[Curennos.9307]

Queues have gotten longer, oddly enough - never seen 5, 6 min queues before at the time I usually play. Match quality has dropped - purely personal experience, but I used to check my last 10 games and would see at least 3 or so of them that where 'worth it' and felt competitive (usually telling by the score, anything lower than 500-300, 500-200, etc rarely felt like an earned victory/loss). Now it's down to 1/10 recently and I see nothing but guardians - mostly willbenders - and condi harbringers. It's getting absurd. You'd think, with the prevalence of those two specs, that there'd be some kind of counter available that people would start playing more, but it doesn't seem like that's the case - just more willbenders and harbringers. Far too many games have four guards and/or four necros.

[Paradoxoglanis.1904]

Its not matchmaking that decides that there should be 2 supports and 3 bunkers vs a team of dps that cant focus a target or rip boons and cc the rez. The problem is anet has balanced this game so the most braindead boring kitten wins games.

[JTGuevara.9018]

It's not only unfun, it's bogus. A matchmaking system which enforces a 50/50 win rate and awards you a free rating boost at the end of the season. I'm sick and tired of it. You don't even really progress, the system calculates the progression FOR you.

Get 10 wins in a row, get harder opponents.

Get 10 losses in a row, get easier opponents.

Over and over and over and over....

Absolutely ridiculous. I've laughed at this matchmaking system for years.

[Choyacute.8591]

https://imgur.com/a/xhdUIA1

 

50/50

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

18 hours ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

It's because chase power is roughly double the disengage power. They need to balance chase vs disengage. It's causing a lot of problems 

Nah. I'ma channel my power of bitter and say that if class X being able to run from people is worth constantly nerfing class X so it can't run as effectively, then classes Y and Z that can disengage vs anything but prenerf class X should also suffer the same fate- namely, being unable to run from class W.
 

 

 

 

Edited June 6, 2022 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[Crozame.4098]

6 hours ago, vanflyheight.6832 said:

Im mostly a gold tier skilled type player, but sure seems like im more of a silver skilled which makes alot of the decent skilled players get set back by a couple yrs. So ya have to make 4-6x the effort to get least 1 win when pvp is bout rotating between the primary objective (capping nodes) and secondary (bell- capricorn, beasts- forest, stillness/tranquil- silent storm) plus im sure most players dont know the role they play regarding the difference between a side noder, roamer, or teamfighter.

 

Which most of the random pvp players are only doin their own thing which makes em feed mid to the other side which is a no win scenario. And ofc anet doesnt know how to balance classes when its not bout what makes things "even" vs what "counters the other" like mesmer will always be a hard counter to thief. And necro gets hard countered by bursts and or classes that have some kind of boon removal. Not to mention there's not enough condi cleanse in the pvp mode to even survive for dps classes.

 

So the point on that is to increase/buff the cleanse sigil to 2 condi removal which would be a small change, or buff up the dmg/healing for these kind of classes so they'll be more of a threat. If we want to have a better gw2, players need to quit whining bout nerfs that arent necessary and do buffs that are necessary. 

If you change your mind set that the primary goal 95% of the time, is kills and avoid death, then it will be easier for p1 - p2 players. 

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

7 hours ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

Nah. I'ma channel my power of bitter and say that if class X being able to run from people is worth constantly nerfing class X so it can't run as effectively, then classes Y and Z that can disengage vs anything but prenerf class X should also suffer the same fate- namely, being unable to run from class W.
 

 

 

 

I just recently already explained this in detail. Let me see if I can dig it up.

1) - Has there been a solid solution proposed for base AFKing? - Player vs. Player - Guild Wars 2 Forums

2) - Single biggest impediment to build diversity in the game are teleports - Player vs. Player - Guild Wars 2 Forums

3) - Tired Of Willbender - Get It Under Control Please - Mobility Creep Is A Problem - Page 8 - Player vs. Player - Guild Wars 2 Forums <- Scroll down on the page that this links goes to. This is the original elongated explanation.

Regardless of how generally fast or slow mobility is, the chase vs. disengage factors need to be balanced or this is what starts happening. The more chase power transcends disengage factor, the more lopsided our games get. It also encourages massively zergy team fight strategies where the only important job roles anymore are 1) Supports and 2) whichever builds are currently the top 2 Team Fighters that synergize with the Support. When chase transcends disengage to such a strong degree, we even begin losing the purpose of Roamers and Side Noders. There is no reason to have a dedicated Roamer when Team Fighters are as fast as the Roamer but twice as powerful in combat. There is no reason to have a dedicated Side Node when it gets +'d on immediately as soon as it shows up to a node because powerful Team Fighters can rotate anywhere they want to in 3 to 6 seconds. There is no reason to ever stray from your team's safety in numbers when you "know" that you can't outrun the new level of chase factor in the game, unless you are S++ tier mobility with a lot of stealth potential.

If people were looking for something to blame the overly high frequency of super lopsided games on, this is it. When chase power transcends disengage factor.

When you really sit down and evaluate how the game feels now in year 10 compared to 5 or 6 years ago when chase & disengage were actually balanced, it's easy to see that when chase greatly transcends disengage, it begins to intrinsically cause A LOT of problems to the game of conquest.

To sum it up in a single statement: The more chase power transcends disengage factor, the more lopsided games we begin to get because of forced engagement. This turns the game of conquest into something much more akin to Death Match than Conquest, and puts a much larger priority on zergy kill tactics, leaving rotational strategy in the backseat.

Arenanet needs to balance chase vs. disengage.

Edited June 7, 2022 by Trevor Boyer.6524

[Sahne.6950]

I think part of the problem with matchmaking is, that your Elo is accountwide and not just for a specific profession.

I personally multiclass and i have diffrent performance levels on diffrent professions. For example my Ranger is alot stronger than my Warrior. But from Time to time i just feel like dying and want to play my Warrior. The Matchmaker will put me in the same game as if i was still playing Ranger.. when in reality i will perform worse.

I think this is actually a huge problem.

Another problem is that we are forcing people that are not interested in Rating/titles/whatever into ranked. They will be bad/afk and ruin the experience for anyone that takes it seriously. Rewards have to be moved to unranked, or we have to get rid of ranked/unranked all together

Matchmanipulation: be it, with queuing as a profession, so you get it as enemy and then quickly change to the counter, or simply people being paid to go afk.

And the last problem: ITS STALE. People play the same maps over and over again... we need new modes / objectives / maps.

 

How to fix  matchmaking/PvP

1)The matchmaker should consider only the Elo of your current profession.

2)You can no longer switch profession after you have hit "Accept" when the Queue pops.

3)"Role-specific Matchmaker" you have to choose a role before Queuing. 2 DPS slots | 2 Roamer/Sidenoder slots | 1 Support

4) Matchmaker has to stop "widening" the skillrange should it not find a game for certain people. (In League of Legends the top % have to wait over 20 Minutes for a game, This is 100% more healthy for the population as a whole, instead of letting the top% slaughter some poor gold players. Seriosly i cant stress this enough! should a top% MLG L33T GAMER Queue ranked for a whole day... lets say 15 games... He will most likely ruin/stomp those15 games... aka ruin the fun of 15x9 other players= 135 People will experience a complete R0flstomp game, JUST because the matchmaker doesnt want this one individuum to wait 20 minutes for his games. Performancegap between Gold and the top% players is HUGE.. Yet you meet Naru almost daily as a Gold 2 player.... HMMM)

5) Remove Unranked. 2 new Queues are: "Conquest" | "Mixed Mode" ( consists of 5V5 Deathmatch;Stronghold; brand new "Capture the flag" | and "(vaguely-)Mobalike gamemode on Legacy of Foefire"(You need to kill the enemy Boss, before they kill yours; no capture points)  Just things along those lines, we need new and engaging gamemodes from time to time to keep the casuals interested (Rewards for both gamemodes will be exactly the same, While only Conquest counts towards your Gold/platinum/whatever Badge.)

Edited June 7, 2022 by Sahne.6950

[crepuscular.9047]

On 6/6/2022 at 9:09 AM, vanflyheight.6832 said:

https://imgur.com/a/vZO6URX

±14-16 is generally means a good evenly match team

±13 or ±17 is bordering uneven

that last match -20, OUCH! you had a match manip or something? got smashed by very low ranked players

 

I've had -6 to -10 matches where my team lost by 300+ points, clearly broken matchup than yours

Edited June 7, 2022 by crepuscular.9047

[Master Ketsu.4569]

A big problem right now is team comp matters heavily in the meta, which makes match manipulation comically easy. I won't say how to do it since the less who know the better, but I'll just point out that you only need 3 people in order to reliably rig most matches during off-hours.

[Sahne.6950]

I have never done this but if we count 1 and 1 together... there are 2 mainways of manipulating and this is how it should work.

1) Forcing Countermatchups

Queue as 2 Mesmers -> matchmaker will try to force "mirror matches" -> you will get 1-2 mesmers in enemy team -> swap to Thief and Willbender -> Profit.

manipulating the system is as easy as, queuing as underperforming classes, that you will face those and then picking their direct counters. Thats no secret really.  Simply dont queue as Guardian and Necro and you are already "manipulating" the system, as you are lowering the chances of meeting your "FotM Garbinger and Willywonka/Coresupguard". Anyone queueing as Necro or Guard is just shooting himself in the foot at this point.

2) Forcing someone to be on the opposing team to wintrade with him

You can use this mechanic of "mirrormatching" to force a friend of you into the opposing team... then he can wintrade with you. I guess this only reliably works on offhours... but it should work 100% of the time, if the matchmaker works how i think it does. You and your buddy DuoQ as two mesmers, while the third one is solo queueing as mesmer. should you guys have roughly the same elo, it will almost 100% force the third one into the opposing team.   PROFIT.

never done this... but if you count 1 and 1 together... thats how it should work.  can anyone from the wintrade cartel please confirm this?

@Master Ketsu.4569 The thing is.... if you want something to be fixed. You need to make it public. Let it become such a big problem that they HAVE to fix it. Just being like: "it can be abused but i wont tell people" will not change anything.

Knowing anet they will not fix anything tho and i just made it worse.... but thats on Anet then and not on the people that are pointing out the flaws.

Edited June 7, 2022 by Sahne.6950

[Don Vega Van Kain.9842]

On 6/6/2022 at 1:09 AM, vanflyheight.6832 said:

These kinds of matches shouldnt be happening as much as they should be, its annoying and gets players overly frustrated that, yes get to be overly "toxic".

Yes, it is.

I remember the more I got interested into pvp the more frustrated I become.

I just got back to the game, multiple accounts, solo queue, NA and EU, from higher G1 to higher plat1 (the same person🤣) and I play 2-3 games a day, more if I'm hyped but yea, I'm too toxic now...not in a way that I'm gonna yell at everyone or insult them (I don't even call back or answer angry ppl in the game and even here) but as soon as I see that the matchmaking made an unbalanced match (after 2-3 min of playing), I leave even if I know it's a 15 min of disgrace, I go chilling in new EOD maps or in fractals/Raids and come back after (too bad for the match and the others)

I wasn't like that before but the game made me like that, unfortunately. 🙁