Joxer.6024 Posted April 23, 2023 Share Posted April 23, 2023 (edited) Ok, so not totally new but its been over 6yrs so yea, Im rusty. Now, I looked up proper build and all that for roaming and its fun, but wholly &%$^ how do you all fight so fast? I mean sure, NPC mobs in pve are slower and all that but kitten people, you all just off the charts! And i read the guides and such as to what to do, cleanse, cc, kite....all that stuff but for the most part its me screaming OH S***!! and spamming buttons. Now I have managed to go toe to toe with some folks and have a few kills, but I reckon they just sucked worse than me. Did have one player who was pretty cool, we went at it for what seemed like a long time to me and I almost got him, then they me, then back until finally he got me. But what was cool is they left me in downstate to rez, and just buggered off. Had I been able to say thanks and such I would have, was just cool in my book but I am sure rare as. And thats the other thing....do 500 people really need to pound on one lil person? LOL, nah I kid, I get that that whats its all about, just wish i could figure out how one is able to use this skill, then this one, then dodge....and then appear from nothing! I'm sure its a learning curve so I shall stick with it as its a part of the game I havent done much and am keen. Dare i go pvp??!! (oh, and i am on a Harbinger...maybe Reaper better?) Edited April 23, 2023 by Joxer.6024 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funky.4861 Posted April 23, 2023 Share Posted April 23, 2023 I'd recommend scourge over either- reaper is too melee-centric and harb sacrifices hp for damage, leading to greatly reduced survivability. Unless ofc u have a nearby fb/tempest healbot. Scourge has range, barrier and area threat, plus better mobility through punishment skills than reaper or harb. For stats you're probably best off with dire or trailblazer to begin with, changing to more offense as you get more confident with your playstyle. Or you could just choose another class (ranger, thief, mesmer, guard). Good luck! 1 1 1 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joxer.6024 Posted April 23, 2023 Author Share Posted April 23, 2023 28 minutes ago, Funky.4861 said: I'd recommend scourge over either- reaper is too melee-centric and harb sacrifices hp for damage, leading to greatly reduced survivability. Unless ofc u have a nearby fb/tempest healbot. Scourge has range, barrier and area threat, plus better mobility through punishment skills than reaper or harb. For stats you're probably best off with dire or trailblazer to begin with, changing to more offense as you get more confident with your playstyle. Or you could just choose another class (ranger, thief, mesmer, guard). Good luck! ok, thanks for that! I just might give Scourge a go and see how I do. 😉 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kash.9213 Posted April 23, 2023 Share Posted April 23, 2023 I'm not great, got a left side that can lock up a bit sometimes, and I'm also usually half watching tv or whatever. I tune in more when I'm covering other people and I'm probably scoping out a wider radius when I'm doing that to get ahead of stuff. Even pve mobs scare me so maybe the panic and urgency of trying to keep people up keeps me up more as consequence. It can get me killed when I probably shouldn't go down sometimes though, but that's a real kind of karma that can catch on and get you back later. Read the maps and play for nodes and bags. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enkidu.5937 Posted April 23, 2023 Share Posted April 23, 2023 2 hours ago, Joxer.6024 said: Ok, so not totally new but its been over 6yrs so yea, Im rusty. Now, I looked up proper build and all that for roaming After several years of mainly roaming, I took a 1 year break and when I returned it was like starting completely new 😚 So just take some weeks to get back into it. Ofc it gets much easier to join some other players before going solo roaming. Just get some experience with playing vs. other classes, and avoid Willbenders 😎 I would activate the combat chat, where you can see what skills hit you hard, just hold windows button + G to record a video that you can watch after a fight. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CafPow.1542 Posted April 23, 2023 Share Posted April 23, 2023 (edited) i am also relativly new to wvw. and i play necro aswell. Scourge i play exclusivly in Zerg (Power-Curses), it's a glass cannon in this build so it's useless for roaming. Reaper on the other hand is pretty solid on roaming. when fighting, sometimes i delete an enemy, and sometimes i get deleted. Sometimes i shine like a god, sometimes i am like a total noob. It's part and parcel i think, to meet people who are better than you. Finally, the best thing you can do is try, fail, try again. Learn from mistakes, and stick with a build or two, you feel comfortable with. (at least when roaming - in a zerg it's more about synergy) try to pick up fights tho, you never know if you fail or win and you can always learn. obviously, don't run into 5 People alone tho ^^ when you feel comfy, get to another build / profession and try that out. i guess that's the best advise... learn and fail and learn and fail again and again. you will meet people who just delete your face in a (felt) second while you barely scratch their barriers and you're just baffled about your inexistence of chances to win. you just deal with it. when i get something like that, i tend to change the map and do "something else" 🙂 Edited April 23, 2023 by CafPow.1542 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zyreva.1078 Posted April 23, 2023 Share Posted April 23, 2023 (edited) 2 hours ago, Joxer.6024 said: ok, thanks for that! I just might give Scourge a go and see how I do. 😉 Scourge is by far the worst necro spec for roaming (probaly the worst spec overall for roaming). Better stick with harbinger, it's the best necro spec for roaming and small scale and with a proper build (cele!) very strong right now. Getting better at the combat is mostly a matter of practise - and sPvP can actually help quite a bit with that, because of the much higher fight frequency. It is much tougher to learn in WvW, because fights are often uneven and either you get run over, or the enemy, without much of actual fighting happening. Edited April 23, 2023 by Zyreva.1078 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zevelon.6512 Posted April 23, 2023 Share Posted April 23, 2023 scourge is good for kills when you roam, you don’t get a lot but you give plenty xD. WvW in general takes practice and getting use to. Play what class you enjoy and see if some one has roam builds for it. But as ling as it is not scourge you should be fine. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGrimm.5624 Posted April 23, 2023 Share Posted April 23, 2023 3 hours ago, Joxer.6024 said: Ok, so not totally new but its been over 6yrs so yea, Im rusty. Now, I looked up proper build and all that for roaming and its fun, but wholly &%$^ how do you all fight so fast? I mean sure, NPC mobs in pve are slower and all that but kitten people, you all just off the charts! And i read the guides and such as to what to do, cleanse, cc, kite....all that stuff but for the most part its me screaming OH S***!! and spamming buttons. Now I have managed to go toe to toe with some folks and have a few kills, but I reckon they just sucked worse than me. Did have one player who was pretty cool, we went at it for what seemed like a long time to me and I almost got him, then they me, then back until finally he got me. But what was cool is they left me in downstate to rez, and just buggered off. Had I been able to say thanks and such I would have, was just cool in my book but I am sure rare as. And thats the other thing....do 500 people really need to pound on one lil person? LOL, nah I kid, I get that that whats its all about, just wish i could figure out how one is able to use this skill, then this one, then dodge....and then appear from nothing! I'm sure its a learning curve so I shall stick with it as its a part of the game I havent done much and am keen. Dare i go pvp??!! (oh, and i am on a Harbinger...maybe Reaper better?) The upside to sPvP is you get more fights in a shorter time and can therefore practice rotations. The downside is with the restrictions you may not match your current setup so results may be close but vary. But based on the comment of speed it sounds more like rotations and in that case, sPvP might be a good place to go and work on that. You can try dueling as well but I will leave others to discuss that option. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuks.8241 Posted April 23, 2023 Share Posted April 23, 2023 3 hours ago, Joxer.6024 said: Ok, so not totally new but its been over 6yrs so yea, Im rusty. Now, I looked up proper build and all that for roaming and its fun, but wholly &%$^ how do you all fight so fast? I mean sure, NPC mobs in pve are slower and all that but kitten people, you all just off the charts! And i read the guides and such as to what to do, cleanse, cc, kite....all that stuff but for the most part its me screaming OH S***!! and spamming buttons. Ok lets get the basics first. Do you have everything keybound and can use the binds/skills without thinking what they do? Does dodging come naturally to you and can you reliably and automatically assess if dodge is needed or you can just move out of danger? Do you use double tap to dodge? Stop now and use a dedicated key. Can you move, use skills and look around completely independently from each other at all the times? Are you activelly looking at your character boon table and target frame and are aware what boons/condies and other class effects are present. Once you can answer all of the above with yes you have the basics and can actually start diving into the counterplaying specific classes and meta and all that stuff. How to get to there? Play the game and don't slack on the things above. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funky.4861 Posted April 23, 2023 Share Posted April 23, 2023 53 minutes ago, Zyreva.1078 said: Scourge is by far the worst necro spec for roaming (probaly the worst spec overall for roaming). Better stick with harbinger, it's the best necro spec for roaming and small scale and with a proper build (cele!) very strong right now. Harb is only better than scourge if you can cope with the hp loss and loss of area threat. It is probably better at small-scale roaming/duelling as it has higher burst, but you have to hope you're better than your opponent as necro can't stunlock to ensure their hits land. 1 2 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuks.8241 Posted April 23, 2023 Share Posted April 23, 2023 2 minutes ago, Funky.4861 said: Harb is only better than scourge if you can cope with the hp loss and loss of area threat. It is probably better at small-scale roaming/duelling as it has higher burst, but you have to hope you're better than your opponent as necro can't stunlock to ensure their hits land. Youre comparing one of the strongest (harb) and one of the worst (scourge) roaming/dueling builds out there. Harb has one of the most insane CC with their shroud 5 (many will tell you its completely OP because of its instant animation and it can single handedly secure kills), a daze on shroud 4 and then it depends on weapons. Many play with pistol where you get another stun and staff where you get fear and if you really need more you can pick some more fear on utilities. 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zyreva.1078 Posted April 23, 2023 Share Posted April 23, 2023 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Funky.4861 said: Harb is only better than scourge if you can cope with the hp loss and loss of area threat. It is probably better at small-scale roaming/duelling as it has higher burst, but you have to hope you're better than your opponent as necro can't stunlock to ensure their hits land. Less hp than other necros (with still means 20k+ with cele gear) is pretty irrelevant with perma prot, 3k toughness, great healing, weakness spam and lots of easy to land pressure as well as great cc ("gravity well" on 25s cd!) and an overpowered elite skill that works both offensively and defensively. Winning on cele harb is rarely a matter of "having to outplay your opponent". Edited April 23, 2023 by Zyreva.1078 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funky.4861 Posted April 23, 2023 Share Posted April 23, 2023 42 minutes ago, Zyreva.1078 said: Less hp than other necros (with still means 20k+ with cele gear) is pretty irrelevant with perma prot, 3k toughness, great healing, weakness spam and lots of easy to land pressure as well as great cc ("gravity well" on 25s cd!) and an overpowered elite skill that works both offensively and defensively. Winning on cele harb is rarely a matter of "having to outplay your opponent". Which melts to condi, has no escapes (spectral walk is core) no way of dealing with ranged damage and two stunbreaks if you choose them as utils. Winning on cele harb relies on having an in-depth knowledge of your build and how to deal with incoming pressure- re-read the OP. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funky.4861 Posted April 23, 2023 Share Posted April 23, 2023 50 minutes ago, Cuks.8241 said: Youre comparing one of the strongest (harb) and one of the worst (scourge) roaming/dueling builds out there. Harb has one of the most insane CC with their shroud 5 (many will tell you its completely OP because of its instant animation and it can single handedly secure kills), a daze on shroud 4 and then it depends on weapons. Many play with pistol where you get another stun and staff where you get fear and if you really need more you can pick some more fear on utilities. That shroud cc is only around the necro- useless for ranged attackers. You can take pistol for a short duration stun sure, but all your other cc's are fears apart from spectral grasp- not much of an issue if you're ranged but condi cleanses and/or converts exist on all classes. The OP is just getting back into wubwub and is looking to not be farmed so easily, so i'm recommending tankiness/endurance over clutch plays. He says he's on harb already, but of all the necro specs it objectively has the worst defense as the shroud reduces your hp and compensates with two gap closers and an aoe float. Compared to reaper with projectile destruction, aoe chill and stability/fear, or scourge with huge barrier, fear and condi cleanse. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zyreva.1078 Posted April 23, 2023 Share Posted April 23, 2023 (edited) So much nonsense ... Scourge barrier and reaper shround melt in seconds under pressure (or they just run out by themself) and both specs have way worse healing than harb, are squishier overall (less synergy with dm), less mobile, and have a way harder time actually pressuring their opponent. Harb has pretty much everything the other necro specs have and more, the only thing missing is the second health bar and that is more than compensated for. Harb is better for roaming in pretty much every single regard and recommening the worst possible spec instead of one of the strongest ones is delusional. Edited April 23, 2023 by Zyreva.1078 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hotride.2187 Posted April 23, 2023 Share Posted April 23, 2023 58 minutes ago, Funky.4861 said: Which melts to condi, has no escapes (spectral walk is core) no way of dealing with ranged damage and two stunbreaks if you choose them as utils. Winning on cele harb relies on having an in-depth knowledge of your build and how to deal with incoming pressure- re-read the OP. Yeah this is why cele needs to go. Imagine someone actually believing they are being skillful on cele harb in order to win. Come to conquest is all I can say to this load of bs. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joxer.6024 Posted April 23, 2023 Author Share Posted April 23, 2023 3 hours ago, Cuks.8241 said: Ok lets get the basics first. Do you have everything keybound and can use the binds/skills without thinking what they do? Does dodging come naturally to you and can you reliably and automatically assess if dodge is needed or you can just move out of danger? Do you use double tap to dodge? Stop now and use a dedicated key. Can you move, use skills and look around completely independently from each other at all the times? Are you activelly looking at your character boon table and target frame and are aware what boons/condies and other class effects are present. Once you can answer all of the above with yes you have the basics and can actually start diving into the counterplaying specific classes and meta and all that stuff. How to get to there? Play the game and don't slack on the things above. Ok, yes to all but the last one. At 62 my reflexes arent what they used to be and even more so on a keyboard. But yea, have always keybound stuff with every MMO so no issue there, just need to learn where to pay attention and work on the muscle memory. 😉 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonderm.4639 Posted April 23, 2023 Share Posted April 23, 2023 8 hours ago, Funky.4861 said: I'd recommend scourge over either- reaper is too melee-centric and harb sacrifices hp for damage, leading to greatly reduced survivability. Unless ofc u have a nearby fb/tempest healbot. Scourge has range, barrier and area threat, plus better mobility through punishment skills than reaper or harb. For stats you're probably best off with dire or trailblazer to begin with, changing to more offense as you get more confident with your playstyle. Or you could just choose another class (ranger, thief, mesmer, guard). Good luck! Whatever you do, don't follow this advice. Scourge is a free bag for most professions. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funky.4861 Posted April 23, 2023 Share Posted April 23, 2023 Those who are recommending harb because it has better healing than scourge/reaper where is that healing coming from in the harb traitline? If your relying on rune/sigil effects that's completely separate. 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stormemperor.3745 Posted April 23, 2023 Share Posted April 23, 2023 Celestial Harb roam 1v1, not suitable for zerg. Marauder Scourge boon rip for zerg. Marauder Reaper if you have sufficient support in zerg. Please go reaper or scourge when roaming, I want free kills. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joxer.6024 Posted April 24, 2023 Author Share Posted April 24, 2023 7 hours ago, Funky.4861 said: Those who are recommending harb because it has better healing than scourge/reaper where is that healing coming from in the harb traitline? If your relying on rune/sigil effects that's completely separate. im using this.....https://guildjen.com/celestial-harbinger-roaming-build/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zepoolpe.9217 Posted April 24, 2023 Share Posted April 24, 2023 On 4/23/2023 at 3:09 PM, Joxer.6024 said: And thats the other thing....do 500 people really need to pound on one lil person? LOL, nah I kid, I get that that whats its all about, just wish i could figure out how one is able to use this skill, then this one, then dodge....and then appear from nothing! I'm sure its a learning curve so I shall stick with it as its a part of the game I havent done much and am keen. Dare i go pvp??!! (oh, and i am on a Harbinger...maybe Reaper better?) Harbinger is in a very good place right now for roaming, solo or in small group and the cele variety is just OP that you can use it while being brain dead (yes blight reduce your max HP but you also get a HP regen and elixirs are on a short enough CD plus you are a lot more mobile and you have tons of CCs). Reaper is not so bad but since it's mostly melee it can be hard in some situations if your foe can kite you or can pewpew at high range and you need to know how to use your environment for LoS and movements. Core is alright-ish (the terrormancer kind) but I find it boring. Scourge is about the worse of all for roaming, specially solo because if you want damages, you do not produce barriers good enough to resist any decent burst. Check out this video from Hollts where he plays different necro builds/elite specs (builds are in the comments section): Hollts stopped playing a few months ago but the builds are still good (i recommend the cele harb one for starters). Somewhere in his channel there is a vid about positioning and using environment to your advantage (check the the vid called "GW2 | Power Scourge = Kiting GOD (How to kite)". You can also watch his other vids: they are a really good way of learning how to fight on necro for small scale stuff. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlCapwnd.7834 Posted April 24, 2023 Share Posted April 24, 2023 On 4/23/2023 at 9:09 AM, Joxer.6024 said: Ok, so not totally new but its been over 6yrs so yea, Im rusty. Now, I looked up proper build and all that for roaming and its fun, but wholly &%$^ how do you all fight so fast? I mean sure, NPC mobs in pve are slower and all that but kitten people, you all just off the charts! And i read the guides and such as to what to do, cleanse, cc, kite....all that stuff but for the most part its me screaming OH S***!! and spamming buttons. Now I have managed to go toe to toe with some folks and have a few kills, but I reckon they just sucked worse than me. Did have one player who was pretty cool, we went at it for what seemed like a long time to me and I almost got him, then they me, then back until finally he got me. But what was cool is they left me in downstate to rez, and just buggered off. Had I been able to say thanks and such I would have, was just cool in my book but I am sure rare as. And thats the other thing....do 500 people really need to pound on one lil person? LOL, nah I kid, I get that that whats its all about, just wish i could figure out how one is able to use this skill, then this one, then dodge....and then appear from nothing! I'm sure its a learning curve so I shall stick with it as its a part of the game I havent done much and am keen. Dare i go pvp??!! (oh, and i am on a Harbinger...maybe Reaper better?) Harb is very good at roaming. Use Flesh wurm prior to engage so that you have a out in a fight if needed. Use Spectral walk and you can juke a lot of people with it. I turn off auto targeting when roaming because shroud 4 and 3 are good movement skills and you dont want to shroud 3 back into the enemy. Take heal elixer, stun break elixer, and elite elixer. I use pistol/dagger and staff. Try to transfer conditions using dagger 4 and staff 4. As for the build... I will not post my build here cause i dont want it to spread lol. Good luck! 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patton the great.7126 Posted April 24, 2023 Share Posted April 24, 2023 Lots of whisky and Klondike bars. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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