Wizard's Vault account limits highly incentivize multiboxing

[gerberlyfe.9736]

So they got rid of daily log in but made it even worse -- if you open a second account, you can easily get extra cheap Legendary Starter Kits,  cheap 90 bags of coins, cheap 60  mystic coins, cheap heavy crafting bags.

These rewards are once-per-account so dedicated players get screwed while it's a bonanza for multiboxers.

What a nightmare of a patch.

 

[vares.8457]

3 minutes ago, gkoogz.3089 said:

So they got rid of daily log in but made it even worse -- if you open a second account, you can easily get extra cheap Legendary Starter Kits,  cheap 90 bags of coins, cheap 60  mystic coins, cheap heavy crafting bags.

These rewards are once-per-account so dedicated players get screwed while it's a bonanza for multiboxers.

What a nightmare of a patch.

 

More nonsense, oh boy
You would have to play your second account and do the dailies and weeklies to earn enough currency to buy them, no? 
 

[gerberlyfe.9736]

Just now, vares.8457 said:

More nonsense, oh boy
You would have to play your second account and do the dailies and weeklies to earn enough currency to buy them, no? 
 

If I have 5 hours of time, (and assuming the weekly is ~1 hour)  I am now HIGHLY incentivized to play 1 hour on each of 5 alt account rather than 5 hours on my main account. That's the problem. By capping the extremely lucrative rewards on 1 account, you basically HIGHLY incentivize people to log onto secondary accounts to get them again.
I've already heard schemes of people opening 20 accounts do the rewards continuously.

[Randulf.7614]

Fair enough. Good luck to them. I doubt most players care what others do with their multi accounts

Not really definable as a “nightmare”

[vares.8457]

9 minutes ago, Randulf.7614 said:

Fair enough. Good luck to them. I doubt most players care what others do with their multi accounts

Not really definable as a “nightmare”

Yeah I couldn’t care less. At least they are playing the game instead of just clicking through multiple accounts. 
Some here really seem to spend a lot of time inventing problems 

Edited August 31, 2023 by vares.8457

[DeanBB.4268]

If they are only playing their main account 1/5 of the time, that is much less time to advance that account -- achievements, collections, gold earning, etc.

How do the Legendary starter kits help? Or are you assuming they will also get GoB and GoE on these alt accounts? Sounds like they are just playing the alts instead of the main, so why shouldn't they get rewards?

[SoftFootpaws.9134]

i think multiboxing is fine, its login reward farming that was the problem. one requires playing the game while the other doens't.

[illuminati.8453]

1 hour ago, gkoogz.3089 said:

So they got rid of daily log in but made it even worse -- if you open a second account

So, you are saying they should not take your money?  This is *exactly* what they want the army of alt accounts to do.   They want each one of those to buy SoTo.   That army, by the way, also didn't really have issues with building legendaries so I'm not sure they really care if a few extra thousand legendaries hit the TP.   In their mind, they have lowered the prices for people to buy legendaries from the TP if they choose or if a player doesn't want to do that they have given them the same opportunity at a low cost crafted legendary as well.  

Win/Win in Anet's mind.

Edited August 31, 2023 by illuminati.8453

[QueenKeriti.5176]

2 hours ago, gkoogz.3089 said:

So they got rid of daily log in but made it even worse -- if you open a second account, you can easily get extra cheap Legendary Starter Kits,  cheap 90 bags of coins, cheap 60  mystic coins, cheap heavy crafting bags.

These rewards are once-per-account so dedicated players get screwed while it's a bonanza for multiboxers.

What a nightmare of a patch.

 

These are gated behind accounts that bought SoTO.

All the heroic edition heroes/cheapo PoF or EoD multiboxers can get the bags of coins and mystic coins, but not the starter kits or heavy crafting bags.

Your account also has to have a level 80 on it, so, if their heroic account was picked up "recently" and/or they haven't been religious in logging into it, they probably don't have enough tomes to just zoom zoom to 80 and will have to play for a few hours to get one. You will also exhaust the 90 bags + 60 mystic coins within a couple weeks or so just doing the dailies/weeklies, if you find the dailies/weeklies worthwhile, and then you have to make the decision on if "playing" the accounts is actually worth it for the very pricy other items or if just logging in for the 5 acclaim until the store resets is the better deal.

Where did you get that the rewards are once per account? From one of the blog posts: "As you complete objectives you’ll earn Astral Acclaim, a new account-wide currency, which can be exchanged for rewards of your choosing, such as new weapons and armor skins, a small selection of items previously exclusive to the gem store, crafting materials, gold, mystic coins, legendary crafting starter kits, and more. Those rewards will refresh on a quarterly basis."

If someone is shelling out the additional $25+ for the expansion for multiple accounts, good on them. They can do what they want with their money, plus it makes Anet's metrics look good for NCsoft.

[ShadowCatz.8437]

2 hours ago, QueenKeriti.5176 said:

These are gated behind accounts that bought SoTO.

All the heroic edition heroes/cheapo PoF or EoD multiboxers can get the bags of coins and mystic coins, but not the starter kits or heavy crafting bags.

Your account also has to have a level 80 on it, so, if their heroic account was picked up "recently" and/or they haven't been religious in logging into it, they probably don't have enough tomes to just zoom zoom to 80 and will have to play for a few hours to get one. You will also exhaust the 90 bags + 60 mystic coins within a couple weeks or so just doing the dailies/weeklies, if you find the dailies/weeklies worthwhile, and then you have to make the decision on if "playing" the accounts is actually worth it for the very pricy other items or if just logging in for the 5 acclaim until the store resets is the better deal.

Where did you get that the rewards are once per account? From one of the blog posts: "As you complete objectives you’ll earn Astral Acclaim, a new account-wide currency, which can be exchanged for rewards of your choosing, such as new weapons and armor skins, a small selection of items previously exclusive to the gem store, crafting materials, gold, mystic coins, legendary crafting starter kits, and more. Those rewards will refresh on a quarterly basis."

If someone is shelling out the additional $25+ for the expansion for multiple accounts, good on them. They can do what they want with their money, plus it makes Anet's metrics look good for NCsoft.

You only get one Legendary Starter Chest which is account bound and to craft one out of three Legendary Weapons you need at least one map completion and 250 mats, so it isn't something a multivoxer would do without putting some work behind.

It is only Per cursor or Legendary weapon that can be sold on TP.

Edited August 31, 2023 by ShadowCatz.8437

[QueenKeriti.5176]

4 minutes ago, ShadowCatz.8437 said:

You only get one Legendary Starter Chest which is account bound and to craft one out of three Legendary Weapons you need at least one map completion and 250 mats, so it isn't something a multivoxer would do without putting some work behind.

It is only Legendary weapon that can be sold on TP.

Yup! 100% this! ^

There are many reasons why I would rather step on a bed of Lego rather than doing core map comp plus GoBs on my alt accounts. 🫠

[fatihso.7258]

There is already a discussion on subreddit about this people share their math and tactics for multiboxing for the limited time vault rewards. There is a lot gold to grab for the first weeks of a season. 

[ShadowCatz.8437]

5 minutes ago, fatihso.7258 said:

There is already a discussion on subreddit about this people share their math and tactics for multiboxing for the limited time vault rewards. There is a lot gold to grab for the first weeks of a season. 

A lot of Gold to grab? I suppose you also have a lot real money to pay for upgrading your account with SoTO ?

Purchasing several upgrades for multiboxing and then turn that into Gold, seem counter intuitiv.

It would be cheaper to just use Gem to Gold in that case.

Before upgrading my old account with SoTO that iten where locked, so you had to have SoTO or you couldn't buy that Starter Chest and you where also locked out from Special in Wizard's Vault which give most Astral Acclaim from completing story or achievement related to SoTO content.

[gerberlyfe.9736]

17 minutes ago, ShadowCatz.8437 said:

A lot of Gold to grab? I suppose you also have a lot real money to pay for upgrading your account with SoTO ?

Purchasing several upgrades for multiboxing and then turn that into Gold, seem counter intuitiv.

It would be cheaper to just use Gem to Gold in that case.

Before upgrading my old account with SoTO that iten where locked, so you had to have SoTO or you couldn't buy that Starter Chest and you where also locked out from Special in Wizard's Vault which give most Astral Acclaim from completing story or achievement related to SoTO content.

Dude, nobody said you have to upgrade to Soto. The account limits are clearly abusable without soto.

In fact, they are so abusable that most of the wealth in this game will likely be multiboxed accounts reaping mystic coins and bags of coins. It's that simple.

ArenaNet by limiting the number of rewards per account have basically opened the doors to the entire economy of the game being dominated by people willing to open legions of accounts, setting vault to pvp only, then playing 1-2  pvp matches per day on each account.

Why would I play 5 hours on the same account, and get no rewards, when someone could play 30 minutes on each of  10- accounts, and get 5-10x the rewards?

ArenaNet has designed an incentive structure that highly--and I mean RICHLY--rewards people who creates throwaway accounts.

[Danikat.8537]

16 minutes ago, gkoogz.3089 said:

Dude, nobody said you have to upgrade to Soto. The account limits are clearly abusable without soto.

In fact, they are so abusable that most of the wealth in this game will likely be multiboxed accounts reaping mystic coins and bags of coins. It's that simple.

ArenaNet by limiting the number of rewards per account have basically opened the doors to the entire economy of the game being dominated by people willing to open legions of accounts, setting vault to pvp only, then playing 1-2  pvp matches per day on each account.

Why would I play 5 hours on the same account, and get no rewards, when someone could play 30 minutes on each of  10- accounts, and get 5-10x the rewards?

ArenaNet has designed an incentive structure that highly--and I mean RICHLY--rewards people who creates throwaway accounts.

Is it more of a problem than it used to be under the old system, when they could get many of the same rewards just for logging in?

[ShadowCatz.8437]

8 minutes ago, Danikat.8537 said:

Is it more of a problem than it used to be under the old system, when they could get many of the same rewards just for logging in?

@gkoogz.3089

I have same question, do this system with Vault actually make any difference? Is this a problem with PvP?

As far as I know from when I played unranked a couple times it do take some time to get into a match, so log in and do a couple of matches with random players will still take some time.

How is that any different to play on several accounts or only a few accounts?

Wouldn't Mystic Coin also get down in value as market get swammed with more MC (or any item that can be sold on TP) when supply will go up and demand will not follow in the same step which would  make items cheaper then before?

Anyway there will always be some people that brag about "how easy" it is on Internet and get Gold for "free", but it something else to actually show evidence for doing this on regular basis and that it will have any impact on how trade post work.

The Daily reward only net 40 AA for each task, so how will those people get enough AA to buy massive amount of MC or anything that can be bought with AA and turn it into Gold?

[QueenKeriti.5176]

1 hour ago, gkoogz.3089 said:

Dude, nobody said you have to upgrade to Soto. The account limits are clearly abusable without soto.

In fact, they are so abusable that most of the wealth in this game will likely be multiboxed accounts reaping mystic coins and bags of coins. It's that simple.

ArenaNet by limiting the number of rewards per account have basically opened the doors to the entire economy of the game being dominated by people willing to open legions of accounts, setting vault to pvp only, then playing 1-2  pvp matches per day on each account.

Why would I play 5 hours on the same account, and get no rewards, when someone could play 30 minutes on each of  10- accounts, and get 5-10x the rewards?

ArenaNet has designed an incentive structure that highly--and I mean RICHLY--rewards people who creates throwaway accounts.

People were already doing that with the old login rewards. There was someone who bragged about having 100+ accounts. Since that was one of the "best," easy ways to get mystic coins + laurels for the material bags, they profited hella hard just for logging in. That's something like 2000* MCs a MONTH for just logging in, and it just required you to have at minimum the heroic version of the game, where people heavily abused promotions that gave away FREE heroic edition codes. So, thousands of MCs per month...for FREE and for NO EFFORT.

Anet just made it so you actually have to do something to get rewards. If you just login now, you only wind up with ~385 acclaim per reset period, which is not going to break the market. If someone wants to multibox 100 accounts per reset period, dang, good on them.

Also, rewards reset every quarter.

The upgrade to SoTO thing was referenced because you talked about heavy bags and legendary starter kits, which someone else pointed out aren't really worth much if you don't make the legendary, which still requires you to get a GoB + exploration + some other stuff. At best, you get 500g-600g worth towards a legendary, but the really "difficult"/time consuming parts are still there.

Edited August 31, 2023 by QueenKeriti.5176
My Idaho math education came out and failed me

[Danikat.8537]

4 minutes ago, QueenKeriti.5176 said:

The upgrade to SoTO thing was referenced because you talked about heavy bags and legendary starter kits, which someone else pointed out aren't really worth much if you don't make the legendary, which still requires you to get a GoB + exploration + some other stuff. At best, you get 500g-600g worth towards a legendary, but the really "difficult"/time consuming parts are still there.

Apparently the precursors from the legendary starter kits are account bound, so they're not worth anything if you don't make the legendary.

[ShadowCatz.8437]

14 minutes ago, QueenKeriti.5176 said:

People were already doing that with the old login rewards. There was someone who bragged about having 100+ accounts. Since that was one of the "best," easy ways to get mystic coins + laurels for the material bags, they profited hella hard just for logging in. That's something like 5400 MCs a MONTH for just logging in, and it just required you to have at minimum the heroic version of the game, where people heavily abused promotions that gave away FREE heroic edition codes. So, thousands of MCs per month...for FREE and for NO EFFORT.

Anet just made it so you actually have to do something to get rewards. If you just login now, you only wind up with ~385 acclaim per reset period, which is not going to break the market. If someone wants to multibox 100 accounts per reset period, dang, good on them.

Also, rewards reset every quarter.

The upgrade to SoTO thing was referenced because you talked about heavy bags and legendary starter kits, which someone else pointed out aren't really worth much if you don't make the legendary, which still requires you to get a GoB + exploration + some other stuff. At best, you get 500g-600g worth towards a legendary, but the really "difficult"/time consuming parts are still there.

I don't know how fast their supposed "super computers" have to be to be able to log in more then 100+ accounts as it still take time to start Launcher, load each account, log in and wait for server to respond and get in from character screen to do this stuff, not to forget that this sound more to be a something that needs be done by some kind of script to do over several account at once. Otherwise it would take a lot of time to do this one by one account and also automatic click on Wizard's Vault item to buy and claim each Astral Acclaim reward.

Compared with the old system where one only needed to log in (get log in reward), do three task (gather with Glyphs that collect several nodes at once; do simple task like having character stand at Vista etc and then transfer that to main account in form of Gold), this system would need much more scripted actions to actually be worth it with 100 accounts.

In the end I don't see why anybody would do this?

Just to get Gold for what? Do they even play this game or is it for bragging rights?

Edited August 31, 2023 by ShadowCatz.8437

[QueenKeriti.5176]

29 minutes ago, ShadowCatz.8437 said:

I don't know how fast their supposed "super computers" have to be to be able to log in more then 100+ accounts as it still take time to load each account, log in and wait for server to respond and get in from character screen to do this stuff, not to forget that this sound more to be a very automatic (as using some kind of script which sounds like they are breaking TOS).

You don't login all 100 at once, and there are programs that Anet doesn't support but won't ban you for without cause that let you log into multiple accounts quickly. My computer can load 3 accounts to the character screen at the same time in ~30 seconds with no issues. From there I manually click each client (Windows makes it pretty easy), click a char per client, load into all their maps in ~10 seconds, and then right click the chest to instantly claim it. My new computer could probably load 15-20 clients or so at the same time before it'd get angry. You don't need to use scripts to do it.

It still took/takes less time than multiboxing accounts for dailies the way you would have to now. Especially since multiboxing in combat at the same time can possibly put your accounts at risk if a GM messages you or otherwise tries to interact with you and you don't respond.

And I mathed wrong on the MCs per month: It's only like 2000, lmao. I misread someone's post and definitely math'd gud.

Edited August 31, 2023 by QueenKeriti.5176
Numbers edit

[Arianth Moonlight.6453]

I never understood people doing that, but each to their own, I guess.

[QueenKeriti.5176]

Ez money in 5 minutes. 🫠I only had 3 alt accounts, and that extra 60 MCs + heavy bags from laurels helped a lot with legendary crafting.

[Cyninja.2954]

So what you are saying is: the rewards for actively playing the game are so good, some players (with tons of time) might do so on multiple accounts?

Versus before (if multiple accounts are a concern) when merely loging in with near 0 interaction yielded a higher return.

Yet somehow in todays day and age, changes which encourage playing the game to get rewards are bad?

Really giving it all to try to make anything stick now aren't you? What is this, your 3rd or 4th attempt to get some negative thread going? @gkoogz.3089

Edited September 1, 2023 by Cyninja.2954

[phandaria.4891]

9 hours ago, gkoogz.3089 said:

n fact, they are so abusable that most of the wealth in this game will likely be multiboxed accounts reaping mystic coins and bags of coins. It's that simple.

ArenaNet by limiting the number of rewards per account have basically opened the doors to the entire economy of the game being dominated by people willing to open legions of accounts, setting vault to pvp only, then playing 1-2  pvp matches per day on each account.

It was already been done with the old Daily giving out free Mystic Coins for people who bought multiple accounts. All SoTo changes is those people need to actually play the game for few minutes to get similar result, instead of 5 second logging in and out for each account.

The worse part is that none of the above is an offence, it is fully legal way to earn Mystic Coins, hence it is highly abuseable.

On the other hand, multiboxing is very different and can result in an offence under certain circumstances (https://help.guildwars2.com/hc/en-us/articles/360013658134-Policy-Dual-or-Multi-Boxing). Getting those easy Mystic Coins and Gold on Wizard's Vault doesn't seem to be very easy anymore compared to the old standard.

[Danikat.8537]

11 hours ago, ShadowCatz.8437 said:

I don't know how fast their supposed "super computers" have to be to be able to log in more then 100+ accounts as it still take time to start Launcher, load each account, log in and wait for server to respond and get in from character screen to do this stuff, not to forget that this sound more to be a something that needs be done by some kind of script to do over several account at once. Otherwise it would take a lot of time to do this one by one account and also automatic click on Wizard's Vault item to buy and claim each Astral Acclaim reward.

Compared with the old system where one only needed to log in (get log in reward), do three task (gather with Glyphs that collect several nodes at once; do simple task like having character stand at Vista etc and then transfer that to main account in form of Gold), this system would need much more scripted actions to actually be worth it with 100 accounts.

In the end I don't see why anybody would do this?

Just to get Gold for what? Do they even play this game or is it for bragging rights?

It's important to remember that actual multiboxing like you're describing - using scripts to not only log into but automatically play several accounts - is (and always has been) against the rules. I'm not sure how Anet monitors it but if anyone gets caught doing it they could get all their accounts banned.

I think it's permitted to log into accounts automatically (if you have a launcher for each one with the username and password saved all you need to do is have Windows launch them automatically) but from the moment it gets into the character select screen you need to be operating it yourself, and only 1 account at a time (software to copy manually input commands to multiple accounts so they all move together is also banned).

It still happens of course, because making a rule against something doesn't make it impossible, but Anet do ban people for it, especially if they're stupid enough to talk publicly about how they do it.

So anyone who is openly claiming they're doing dailies on 100+ accounts does mean doing them manually each time, and yes that would take a lot of time (if we assume a conservative estimate of 5 minutes per account - which is probably low - that would be over 8 hours) which makes it seem unlikely. But this system has only been in place for 11 days so it wouldn't surprise me if some people who had dozens of accounts to farm login rewards are trying out what they can do to keep farming with them and what the profit vs. time is. The question is whether they'll keep it up or conclude it's not actually worth it.