"Fun surprise" for the next expansion: Speculation edition

[Uete.3805]

Before winter break Game Director Grouch gave us this amazing interview (https://wccftech.com/guild-wars-2-qa-arenanet-on-switch-to-yearly-expansions-secrets-of-the-obscure-learnings-and-2024-update/) where he states: "We plan to focus on weapons for our next expansion, but we have a fun surprise in store to keep things fresh and exciting."

What do y'all think that "fun surprise" will be?

They've kind of confirmed we aren't getting elite specs (yet), but I'd be glad if they added new Utility skills. I could see them going with:

1. Adding the missing healing and elite skills to some type of utilities (for instance Ele's conjure weapon or Mesmer's glamour healing skills). This could mean getting a new 4th utility option for each Revenant legend to give some needed flexibility to their kit.
2. Adding a new type of utilities (including healing and elite skills). We could finally get glyphs for Necro, that could be used inside of shroud for a different effect, or a new legend for Revs (Jora, Snaff or Gwen could be fun).

Since they seem to be adding a new weapon for each profession as well I doubt they'll do both, but I can still dream. Future expacs could add a new utility set for each elite spec, Willbender could get manipulations, Catalyst wells or elixirs, Untamed could get minions, Vindicator could get another double legend in Jora and Svanir, etc.

Or maybe the surprise is just an overhaul of underwater combat (kidding! or am I?)

[Zzik.5873]

After what I saw with the engi shortbow and the removal of so many cool rune effect. Im not holding my breath. For soto I didnt expect much for my class new weapons, but it seem expecting something else than a mortar 2.0 was still too much... So yeah 😕

As for relic... yeah it is what it is...

[Dadnir.5038]

Going as it's going... They might make a slot in the UI for bundles like the Koda's hammer (the purchasable bundles, Yes the kod's example is actually one of the better one) so that we don't have to open our inventory to find and use those. Maybe even a PvE mastery to make those bundle more potent!

You know, "fun"...

Edited January 10 by Dadnir.5038

[andreiblue.8231]

5 hours ago, Uete.3805 said:

Before winter break Game Director Grouch gave us this amazing interview (https://wccftech.com/guild-wars-2-qa-arenanet-on-switch-to-yearly-expansions-secrets-of-the-obscure-learnings-and-2024-update/) where he states: "We plan to focus on weapons for our next expansion, but we have a fun surprise in store to keep things fresh and exciting."

What do y'all think that "fun surprise" will be?

They've kind of confirmed we aren't getting elite specs (yet), but I'd be glad if they added new Utility skills. I could see them going with:

1. Adding the missing healing and elite skills to some type of utilities (for instance Ele's conjure weapon or Mesmer's glamour healing skills). This could mean getting a new 4th utility option for each Revenant legend to give some needed flexibility to their kit.
2. Adding a new type of utilities (including healing and elite skills). We could finally get glyphs for Necro, that could be used inside of shroud for a different effect, or a new legend for Revs (Jora, Snaff or Gwen could be fun).

Since they seem to be adding a new weapon for each profession as well I doubt they'll do both, but I can still dream. Future expacs could add a new utility set for each elite spec, Willbender could get manipulations, Catalyst wells or elixirs, Untamed could get minions, Vindicator could get another double legend in Jora and Svanir, etc.

Or maybe the surprise is just an overhaul of underwater combat (kidding! or am I?)

All classes get another underwater weapon. Nothing more and probably less.

[Raarsi.6798]

2 hours ago, andreiblue.8231 said:

All classes get another underwater weapon. Nothing more and probably less.

Or is it...

If they were to do something like an underwater expansion (or even some other low-grav or zero-grav expansion for some bizarre reason), there could very well be an overhaul on underwater combat.  Easy way to add new weapons, redefine purposes for current underwater weapons on professions, and even adjust some elite specializations like Renegade or Mechanist so that their kits will actually work underwater. 

It might even be a way of expanding on skimmer mounts if it's for an underwater expansion, or even create a new mount if it's something designed for low-grav or zero-grav environments.  There's indeed a possibility that Anet has seen the general approval of the expansion of skyscale capabilities and might want to see how giving a similar treatment to a different mount type may fair.

[Teknomancer.4895]

59 minutes ago, Raarsi.6798 said:

There's indeed a possibility that Anet has seen the general approval of the expansion of skyscale capabilities and might want to see how giving a similar treatment to a different mount type may fair.

Make the kangabunny great again!

[Fueki.4753]

They could make the utilities from Elite specializations available for the entire profession.

[Phyb.6704]

2 hours ago, Raarsi.6798 said:

Or is it...

If they were to do something like an underwater expansion (or even some other low-grav or zero-grav expansion for some bizarre reason), there could very well be an overhaul on underwater combat.  Easy way to add new weapons, redefine purposes for current underwater weapons on professions, and even adjust some elite specializations like Renegade or Mechanist so that their kits will actually work underwater. 

It might even be a way of expanding on skimmer mounts if it's for an underwater expansion, or even create a new mount if it's something designed for low-grav or zero-grav environments.  There's indeed a possibility that Anet has seen the general approval of the expansion of skyscale capabilities and might want to see how giving a similar treatment to a different mount type may fair.

They wont do an underwater xpac. They had the chance with the literal deep sea dragon. Everyone knows the underwater combat is horrible. Many classes can not even use their builds underwater. REvenant has multiple legends they can not even use. Most avoid the aquatic fractal like the plauge. Its horrible. Get on skimmer with dive mastery and just skip as much as you can. Would have rathered no water combat like in lotro then what gw2 has. 

[Teknomancer.4895]

12 minutes ago, ohericoseo.4316 said:

They wont do an underwater xpac.

I wouldn't mind a new underwater story instance, but yes a whole underwater expansion would be too much. Even with the new mini-expansion thing they're going for now.

[SeTect.5918]

33 minutes ago, ohericoseo.4316 said:

They wont do an underwater xpac. They had the chance with the literal deep sea dragon. Everyone knows the underwater combat is horrible. Many classes can not even use their builds underwater. REvenant has multiple legends they can not even use. Most avoid the aquatic fractal like the plauge. Its horrible. Get on skimmer with dive mastery and just skip as much as you can. Would have rathered no water combat like in lotro then what gw2 has. 

Ha, yeah the good old aquatic.
I love it when some players have all their e-spec mechanics and utility skills still avaible and go like 25k dps on the last boss while i play virtuoso and have my main source of damage shredded (bleed stacks of blade skills of dagger) and go like 10k dps underwater while i m 40k+ on land.
I mean is it that hard to simply give trident and spear the blade tag? spears and tridents are basically blades on a stick.
Not to mention mesmer doesnt even have any real condi underwater weapon. Only auto attack and skill 4 inflict any damaging condis on trident, Spear has not a single one.

But thats the case with most classes. Most underwater weapons dont inflict enough condis to properly work on condi builds or dont synergize with the elite spec.
Or the whole elite spec mechanic being unusable underwater (mechanist).
They really could at least make that elite specs they decide to make also work underwater. Not doing that can lead to immense disadvantages in certain situations like aquatic fractal or even in WvW when an enemy player decides to go underwater to flee.

Edited January 10 by SeTect.5918

[MedievalThings.5417]

Does anyone else remember the like 3-4 day beta we had years ago where we could choose a second profession?  The skills from the second class were very limited, but I imagine this is where we will be heading, not sure how soon though.  Honestly, the only thing I remember from that beta was that everyone chose the thief skills, not sure what the thieves chose.

[SoftFootpaws.9134]

i'm thinking at this point they're basically breaking up new elite specialisations over the course of several mini-expansions, to have a complete release time similar to the delay between the large expansions like path of fire and end of dragons before (which was over four years, i think). what this  likely means is we'll first get weapons, then probably a set of utility skills, and then maybe a new profession mechanic, and then finally a traitline until it all comes together.

 

this is far easier for them to balance because its being balanced over the same amount of time, but not in one huge burst at release.

Edited January 10 by SoftFootpaws.9134

[draxynnic.3719]

4 hours ago, ohericoseo.4316 said:

They wont do an underwater xpac. They had the chance with the literal deep sea dragon. Everyone knows the underwater combat is horrible. Many classes can not even use their builds underwater. REvenant has multiple legends they can not even use. Most avoid the aquatic fractal like the plauge. Its horrible. Get on skimmer with dive mastery and just skip as much as you can. Would have rathered no water combat like in lotro then what gw2 has. 

They left a pretty big dangling plot thread with the whole 'it wasn't Soo-Won causing problems with the underwater civilisations, it was something that showed up after she moved to Cantha' thing.

Underwater combat is, like many things in GW2, something that's almost good but which ArenaNet abandoned instead of fixing the issues it had. Overhauling it to address the problems would certainly be worthwhile.

Aquatic fractal's problems aren't that it's underwater IMO, it's that it has a lot of mechanics that would still be annoying without the water environment. Builds being shut down entirely due to being underwater certainly doesn't help, to be sure, but that could be part of the aforementioned overhaul.

[Phyb.6704]

4 hours ago, draxynnic.3719 said:

They left a pretty big dangling plot thread with the whole 'it wasn't Soo-Won causing problems with the underwater civilisations, it was something that showed up after she moved to Cantha' thing.

Underwater combat is, like many things in GW2, something that's almost good but which ArenaNet abandoned instead of fixing the issues it had. Overhauling it to address the problems would certainly be worthwhile.

Aquatic fractal's problems aren't that it's underwater IMO, it's that it has a lot of mechanics that would still be annoying without the water environment. Builds being shut down entirely due to being underwater certainly doesn't help, to be sure, but that could be part of the aforementioned overhaul.

The only way it would work is if they gave us the underwater weapons as land weapons and made everything on land usable underwater. Because it would be so much fun having the builds you enjoy playing be turned off. This is the main reason I hate the underwater combat. It removes the play style I enjoy and foces me to use something else. If it was all underwater.... and they did not fully open up weapons and legends and whatever else so its the same as land...... and I was restricted to heavily for content I may not even enjoy. I would go play a different game.

[Raarsi.6798]

25 minutes ago, ohericoseo.4316 said:

The only way it would work is if they gave us the underwater weapons as land weapons and made everything on land usable underwater.

Not necessarily.  In fact, it would make more sense if they didn't because it would be easier to balance things when they're confined to one part of the game.  If aquatic weapons were made useable on land, that means that they would have to retool them not just for usability on land, but also so that they aren't performing similar roles as other weapons that professions may have.  This might sound arbitrary to anyone thinking solely as a player, but it's something that devs have been taking into consideration more and more over the years with the introduction of more and more weapons for each profession, and it'd be a pretty massive mountain to climb in terms of balance and performance.

If they were to enable something aquatic going more amphibious, I'd wager it'd be more likely from mastery point stuff attributed to skimmers.

[Phyb.6704]

13 hours ago, Raarsi.6798 said:

Not necessarily.  In fact, it would make more sense if they didn't because it would be easier to balance things when they're confined to one part of the game.  If aquatic weapons were made useable on land, that means that they would have to retool them not just for usability on land, but also so that they aren't performing similar roles as other weapons that professions may have.  This might sound arbitrary to anyone thinking solely as a player, but it's something that devs have been taking into consideration more and more over the years with the introduction of more and more weapons for each profession, and it'd be a pretty massive mountain to climb in terms of balance and performance.

If they were to enable something aquatic going more amphibious, I'd wager it'd be more likely from mastery point stuff attributed to skimmers.

Limiting entire legends on rev, entire skills on every class and all but 3 weapons is supposed to be fun** Nah. It is not.
The underwater combat system has been garbage 100% since launch.

Regardless of the dev perspective...... this is a game. An entertainment product. Its not something like going on a diet or going to the gym. Such are not fun but are very productive for our lives. A game is for entertainment and fun. There is zero money to be made by providing a game that is not fun. Underwater combat regardles of how much work it would take either needs to be totally scrapped and re done or just treated like dungeons and ignored well money is spent in development in other areas. 
 

The most impactful thing they could do is scrap the whole system and re do it. The most pointless thing they could do is put a bandage on a bullet wound. 

[Angesombre.4630]

On 1/10/2024 at 7:52 PM, Raarsi.6798 said:

Or is it...

If they were to do something like an underwater expansion (or even some other low-grav or zero-grav expansion for some bizarre reason), there could very well be an overhaul on underwater combat.  Easy way to add new weapons, redefine purposes for current underwater weapons on professions, and even adjust some elite specializations like Renegade or Mechanist so that their kits will actually work underwater. 

It might even be a way of expanding on skimmer mounts if it's for an underwater expansion, or even create a new mount if it's something designed for low-grav or zero-grav environments.  There's indeed a possibility that Anet has seen the general approval of the expansion of skyscale capabilities and might want to see how giving a similar treatment to a different mount type may fair.

If he could fix the vindicator's water dodge, that would be a surprise after 2 years already.

[draxynnic.3719]

23 hours ago, ohericoseo.4316 said:

The only way it would work is if they gave us the underwater weapons as land weapons and made everything on land usable underwater. Because it would be so much fun having the builds you enjoy playing be turned off. This is the main reason I hate the underwater combat. It removes the play style I enjoy and foces me to use something else. If it was all underwater.... and they did not fully open up weapons and legends and whatever else so its the same as land...... and I was restricted to heavily for content I may not even enjoy. I would go play a different game.

I don't think what you suggest regarding the weapons is practical. Land weapons aren't designed for a battlefield where your feet aren't planted on the ground, and the underwater weapons aren't designed for when you are.

What they would need to do, though, is make it so that the build still works if you're underwater, even if your weapon skills are different. Which means all legends need to work underwater, the mechanist's mech needs to work underwater, and builds that are based around providing a certain form of support are still able to provide that support underwater (so, to give a mesmer example, if alacmirage is going to be a thing there should be a way to alacmirage underwater despite not having staff, and if healmes is to be a thing it needs to be possible to healmes underwater despite not having rifle). Giving each profession an additional underwater weapon to choose from could go a long way to solve "you need a specific weapon to perform this role" issues and allow for more choice in underwater builds.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

Copium: Warrior gets 900 range MH pistol with blast finishers.

Doomium: Anet makes it melee range instead.

[Fueki.4753]

29 minutes ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

Doomium

That's a weird way to write realistic and probable expectation.

[SeTect.5918]

1 hour ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

Copium: Warrior gets 900 range MH pistol with blast finishers.

Doomium: Anet makes it melee range instead.

Auto attack: Hit your target with your pistol on the body (1). Hit your target twice on the body (2). Hit your target on the head with the pistol to inflict confusion (3).

2: shoot 5 Bullets next to your target on 300 range because you cant aim. Confuses your enemy (literally). -> follow up attack: you realize you are out of ammo, throw your pistol at your target.

3: smash your pistol on the ground to blind enemies within a radius of 180.

Burst: shoot a chain at your target to pull yourself towards it.

Trait: you realize you are normally supposed to use a pistol at range. Confuse yourself with each attack.

 

^ what warrior gets when you wish for mainhand pistol. Its good you mentioned 900 range tho. With luck you woukd get 300-400 range then instead of 900.

[Nash.2681]

On 1/10/2024 at 9:01 PM, Fueki.4753 said:

They could make the utilities from Elite specializations available for the entire profession.

Very likely. Would be in line with what they did with weapon mastery and the upcoming additonal weapons. And it would suit Arena.Net's philosophy to increase the existing balancing hell even more instead of learning from former mistakes.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

15 minutes ago, SeTect.5918 said:

Auto attack: Hit your target with your pistol on the body (1). Hit your target twice on the body (2). Hit your target on the head with the pistol to inflict confusion (3).

2: shoot 5 Bullets next to your target on 300 range because you cant aim. Confuses your enemy (literally). -> follow up attack: you realize you are out of ammo, throw your pistol at your target.

2) Toe Shot: Shoot your target's feet crippling them. 240 range.

15 minutes ago, SeTect.5918 said:

3: smash your pistol on the ground to blind enemies within a radius of 180.

3) Flash Shot: Fire your round into the air. Blinds foes within 240 range. Unblockable. Deals no damage.

15 minutes ago, SeTect.5918 said:

Burst: shoot a chain at your target to pull yourself towards it.

Burst: Pistol Whip. Bash your target stunning them and causing 5 stacks of confusion.

Primal Burst: Will weirdly have 1500 range, and a 3.5 coefficient. 

 

[Fueki.4753]

42 minutes ago, Nash.2681 said:

Very likely. Would be in line with what they did with weapon mastery and the upcoming additonal weapons. And it would suit Arena.Net's philosophy to increase the existing balancing hell even more instead of learning from former mistakes.

It's also in line with their efforts of homogenization, which caused the loss of most unique effects.

[Mell.4873]

On 1/11/2024 at 10:43 AM, ohericoseo.4316 said:

They wont do an underwater xpac. They had the chance with the literal deep sea dragon. Everyone knows the underwater combat is horrible. Many classes can not even use their builds underwater. REvenant has multiple legends they can not even use. Most avoid the aquatic fractal like the plauge. Its horrible. Get on skimmer with dive mastery and just skip as much as you can. Would have rathered no water combat like in lotro then what gw2 has. 

Its more likely we get the underwater weapons on the surface with similar skills.