What would you like to change about WVW to stimulate your participation?

[sduFire.8420]

for me.. stealth effectiveness has to tune down ALOT in some classes, especially from those classes that have high burst damage, high mobility and can go back into stealth whenever they want! It just makes the fight so unfair that you are forced to fight their fight plans and pray that you will land something blindly and luckily that can knock them down. I have never played a competitive game which allows a class go back into stealth at will like this in gw2. 

Another is boonball. A 10-15 players boonball wiping out everything until a larger boonball show up is just sad. I like anet trying to address this issue e.g. removing the alac from some classes. I am currently playing barrier scourge in zerg and it really hurts me but I am still pleased to see that that they are trying to address this issue.

[ArchonWing.9480]

Oh, maybe I should post seriously.

I think Anet should realize that WvW is one of the few items that makes their game truly unique, aside from their cooperative open world content. This is the reason this subforum still has so many people complaining but they can't leave because there's nothing else, and every wvw killer we've seen hasn't really done much.

As endgame content, WvW has outlived almost every other new shiny endgame hyped content there is.  5 person instanced content is some of the best the game has to offer, but they never did that much to improve on them. Dungeons are now archaic and fractals are just kinda there. They spend much time and effort catering for the raid crowd but most of gw2's players just don't care. sPvP, of which WvW was suppposed to be a bridge to, just wasn't a very interesting thing to watch and the esports dream never became anything else.

And despite the cries of the GoB, it's not really been a real deterrent to legendaries as people still get them anyways. Could you imagine if the GoB required spvp? Even me typing this sentence would send most of the game's populace out with the pitchforks.

Heck, some people will even do the wvw legendary armor, even if pve is their preferred game mode.  Maybe some of them just aren't very good at the game, but WvW inherently is closer to the OW that most prefer, because your performance typically isn't monitored under a magnifying glass nor can you be evicted by power hungry squad leaders.

Gw2 has a reputation of a game that respects your time. You don't have slave away to for 3 hours in your chair, being unable to go to the bathroom. You can come in and out as you place, and for the most part other players cannot grief you. You can also put the game away for years and come back and most of the stuff is still here unless they want to sell another expansion.

And what about WvW? WvW being a sandbox means that it supports a variety of playstyles. You don't have to even be good in the combat system if you find some other way to be helpful to your team. This means you are less bound to meta things, and as a result all kinds of weird stats and builds see use in wvw. Even escorting yaks is a valid role, after all.

The greatest threats to this game mode if you ask me are its poor new player experience, population imbalance (related to the former), and railroading the game to only be supportive of certain preferred playstyles.  This causes many situations where new players will find themselves griefing their team due to unintuitive mechanics such as instantly being useless in a big fight because your weapons are projectile based. It's kinda difficult for a new player to come in and witness the nonsense that happens in all scales and say "wow, this is very interesting!"

Unfortunately, the only way they seem to know how to make players want to play with each other is the boonball. The game has basically been designed around full boons for the longest time. Ultimately, I think it's their duty to reduce this ridiculous disparity where you are simply a fool for not running certain boon spamming traits.

Finally, they really need to work on stuff like the guild systems and social features. Some people have quipped that gw2 sometimes feels like a lot of solo players playing together, and they really haven't worked on these social aspects much.  Remember when cities were server hubs? Now that the server model is essentially at its end of life and WvW should become guild/alliance based, it should really be a priority that they should indeed put the guild in Guild Wars 2. (Yes, don't come at me with the lore thing)

Edited February 20 by ArchonWing.9480

[Chaba.5410]

40 minutes ago, ArchonWing.9480 said:

Now that the server model is essentially at its end of life and WvW should become guild/alliance based, it should really be a priority that they should indeed put the guild in Guild Wars 2. (Yes, don't come at me with the lore thing)

Thanks for your TED Talk. It's really difficult to have any sort of discussion about more "guild centric" supports without players immediately assuming GvG. Guilds come in all flavors and sizes, but somehow only GvG is ever on the mind, that you want WvW to be GvG...

Edited February 20 by Chaba.5410

[ArchonWing.9480]

25 minutes ago, Chaba.5410 said:

Thanks for your TED Talk. It's really difficult to have any sort of discussion about more "guild centric" supports without players immediately assuming GvG. Guilds come in all flavors and sizes, but somehow only GvG is ever on the mind, that you want WvW to be GvG...

GvG was probably the last thing on my mind, lol.

But that's a symptom of the greater problem-- guilds don't mean much to the avg player.

Edited February 20 by ArchonWing.9480

[ZTeamG.4603]

Greatly reduce boon duration so they're a temporary boost rather than an effectively permanent buff. Double, triple, or even quadruple all offensive target caps (heck, go ahead and remove them!) so that boonballs can't just stack in one place and outheal everything a smaller group throws at them. 

WvW has always been at its best when there are two relatively disorganized groups of 20 or less going at it over an objective--when individual player contribution matters, and individual players can swing a battle with skillful plays. WvW is consistently at its worst when you can just stack a comped group of 50 in one spot and be invincible to anything less than another comped group of 50. It's a shame that the latter is the only type of gameplay Anet encourages.

[Chaba.5410]

3 hours ago, ArchonWing.9480 said:

GvG was probably the last thing on my mind, lol.

But that's a symptom of the greater problem-- guilds don't mean much to the avg player.

Agreed that it's a symptom. I once brought up a similar idea about more supports got guilds and the GvG response is what I got.

Did you have anything specific in mind on how to put the guild into GW2?

[ArchonWing.9480]

35 minutes ago, Chaba.5410 said:

Agreed that it's a symptom. I once brought up a similar idea about more supports got guilds and the GvG response is what I got.

Did you have anything specific in mind on how to put the guild into GW2?

Nope, just complaining about it. 😆

But atm, a new player starts the game and probably has no idea what guilds even do, or why they should join them. It's pretty tucked away and many would treat it as some chat room. Guild halls could really use some updates; guess that arena thing wasn't a bad idea but that's niche.  The Guild UI is so primitive you can't even see who uses consumables, and of course that disaster of tactivator permissions or pushing siege or whatnot. A lot of it just really sad especially in an established game like this.

Players also don't know you can also form small guilds of friends it would seem. Stuff like scribing is pricey and annoying to deal with.

It'd also be nice if we had hubs agaain; imagine a certain alliance's version of Lion's Arch or whatever for callouts (currently paywalled by ABastion) I duinno, just some of the stuff we lost.

The GvG scene was pretty cool back in the day because it encouraged people to improve and seek content. I suppose some WvWers don't think highly of those that only gvg and wouldn't mind doing so in the absence in a WvW, but that's not everyone.  If only we had a working pvp community.... lol.

 

Edited February 20 by ArchonWing.9480

[BumboJumbo.1308]

Let me be able to play with who I want (ALLIANCES, or whatever it's called)

[Mabi black.1824]

12 hours ago, ArchonWing.9480 said:

Finally, they really need to work on stuff like the guild systems and social features.

That's the part I'm interested in. Especially because the main social tool of this mode (team / server) as you wrote has its days numbered. And it is also essentially the purpose of this post, to understand where the player's interest is hidden and what involves him in his participation.

However, in reference to what I'm reading here, if we assume that the players who participated in this discussion really represent the WVW community, the player's interest in this game mode doesn't differ much when WVW is no longer a team game. It doesn't make sense to update our points system, to evaluate a competition in a ''seasonal'' format, no one has said a word about it, except myself and Dawdler.

If we catalog what you have written in the most concise way possible, basically the player, in order to cultivate his interest and be stimulated in the participation of WVW would like to see changes for:

game setting ( which collects all requests related to maps )

class balance ( which collects all boomball requests for group play and all invisibility requests,  super speed etc etc for roaming game or similar ) 

Balance of Teams (which collects all requests for lack of content and route link mechanics)

[ArchonWing.9480]

8 hours ago, Mabi black.1824 said:

That's the part I'm interested in. Especially because the main social tool of this mode (team / server) as you wrote has its days numbered. And it is also essentially the purpose of this post, to understand where the player's interest is hidden and what involves him in his participation.

However, in reference to what I'm reading here, if we assume that the players who participated in this discussion really represent the WVW community, the player's interest in this game mode doesn't differ much when WVW is no longer a team game. It doesn't make sense to update our points system, to evaluate a competition in a ''seasonal'' format, no one has said a word about it, except myself and Dawdler.

Well that's the thing right? The forums do not represent the community as a whole, because the forums consists of players that are typically more in the know (ok, sometimes not). The average player probably doesn't know wtf is going on being on some vague things about having to join guilds. If they play in an active time zone, they probably don't care about population issues in other time zones. Heck, I don't myself.

At the end of the day, players don't exist in a vacuum.  Your average player is also prone to need to follow tags, or at least familiar guilds and groups. But as the game is, public tagging is a lot of work and the game has reach the point where most groups can't take everyone.  Part of these reasons are social, but part of this is also heavily gameplay related.

And we've seen some links in the beta where it's all entirely invisible small groups that do their own thing.

So even if they do not care about what server or guild they are in, it still impacts the gameplay.

Of course a more experienced WvW player would be able to play the game without any of that, but I think that's in the minority, even when considering WvW players in general.

Edited February 20 by ArchonWing.9480

[Mistwraithe.3106]

A new third BL map

Bug and exploit fixes related to the WvW maps (fix some of the ways people can get into towers/keeps without breaking down the walls)

Bigger / more visible commander tags (so easier to track in zerg battles)

More WvW skins, maybe siege skins etc

Probably not the new guild linking team makeup (replacing world linking) because personally I think it's going to reduce my enjoyment of WvW significantly (I regularly play with people in multiple guilds on my world).

Edited February 20 by Mistwraithe.3106

[Braythorn.4328]

I would like to see other (not all) mounts available during play.  (unintended exploits inc!)

• Example: Roller Beetle/Raptor/? -  use on a cool down timer perhaps.
• Use for ? min once per hour. 
• Maybe a reward track to lower the cooldown. 
• OR - Warclaw/Mount upgrade track to give it some of the movement qualities of the other available mounts on a cooldown timer
  But, I know - coding can be very brittle and the changes above could/can/will  break/cause more problems than the game mode being a bit stale and in need of a bit or spice.
  Over and Out!

[XenesisII.1540]

I really don't want to see a blob of roller beetles running around wvw maps.

I'd be more interested in seeing the jackal skins useable on the warclaw...

[MarkBecks.6453]

Time for an unbiased, AI Bot to get fed the data to make accurate decisions based on all the metrics. 
Delete all extensions, DE FR EN SP, there is no longer a need for that, people play across servers and always find a guild home. Case in point, Gandara and GH have no extension (but they were both DE)???????? RoF has EN, yet we have the most diverse mix of different Nationalities, and it works very well.
So many logical ways to fix this, yet it seems there is a direct focus on PVE and new builds, weapons while the rest of the game burs to the ground. Seriously they need to STOP and re-evaluate their current issues and address those before losing more and more players.

[Chaba.5410]

Which metrics? How many yaks slapped?

[TheGrimm.5624]

On 2/16/2024 at 8:35 AM, Mabi black.1824 said:

The question is: what would you like to change/update to stimulate your interest and participation in this game mode? 

Winning matters. This doesn't mean numbers matter but playing smarter does. It means using the right numbers at the right times matter. Every placement should have value. Every tier should have value. Doing things with the right numbers or less should have value. Weekly goals to encourage winning, spreading out to win versus just zerging it. Fighting outnumbered should have value add to those trying to hold what they have. 

Pay the server on the win, pay the player for their value add on the week end. Group and player goals encouraging wins and changing tier placements

[XenesisII.1540]

1 hour ago, TheGrimm.5624 said:

pay the player for their value add on the week end

What would you base this on?

[Kyon.4810]

First of all you need back competition system in COMPETITIVE MODE.

Winner server gets all, other gets nothing or gets debuffs for PVE.

For example, winner server gets x100 loot droprate, x100 gold from monsters, +500% Magic Find, and losers get x0.01 drop rate, x0.01 gold rate, x0 Magic find in PVE ONLY including raids and fractals. (wvw mode and spvp mode doesnt get affected from it), so players who wants some profit from PVE have to play wvw to make their PVE a bit better.

Thats only 1st step of making competitive mode playable. Right now wvw mode managed is just for bots farming legendary sets/gift of battle, that makes wvw mode even more boring than intended by arena net.

[Mabi black.1824]

3 hours ago, TheGrimm.5624 said:

Winning matters. This doesn't mean numbers matter but playing smarter does. It means using the right numbers at the right times matter. Every placement should have value. Every tier should have value. Doing things with the right numbers or less should have value. Weekly goals to encourage winning, spreading out to win versus just zerging it. Fighting outnumbered should have value add to those trying to hold what they have. 

My friend, I would like to buy you a drink in the pub downstairs if only I could. That's exactly what I think too. However, if we read a bit of discussion on this section of the forum, we realize that players are essentially interested in the 3 chapters I mentioned above. Maps - Class Balance - Server Balance. This is what stimulates participation. Yet I am also convinced that if winning is all that you have indicated, it gets a meaning, The player's participation would be a huge leap forward. Especially after I read Xen how he described all the other RvR games on the market, which don't even keep track of a point system, this would only make GW2 even more unique. even more special than all the others.

And since recently here on the forum, I found out that Rubi before being an Anet technician was first and foremost an active WVW player, he would be the perfect interlocutor to ask what he thinks. Ruby, if you have 10 minutes left over after work, please let me know what your thoughts are on this thread. So I can offer you a beer at the local pub too.😉

Edited February 21 by Mabi black.1824

[Mabi black.1824]

15 hours ago, ArchonWing.9480 said:

And we've seen some links in the beta where it's all entirely invisible small groups that do their own thing.

So even if they do not care about what server or guild they are in, it still impacts the gameplay.

I completely agree with this, it's what I also saw during the beta week.

[XenesisII.1540]

5 hours ago, Mabi black.1824 said:

And since recently here on the forum, I found out that Rubi before being an Anet technician was first and foremost an active WVW player, he would be the perfect interlocutor to ask what he thinks. Ruby, if you have 10 minutes left over after work, please let me know what your thoughts are on this thread. So I can offer you a beer at the local pub too.😉

You're barking up the wrong tree, she barely posts in these forums while she's basically the community manager, that should tell you something. I find it hard to believe she's interested in wvw.

[Rubi Bayer.8493]

6 hours ago, Mabi black.1824 said:

My friend, I would like to buy you a drink in the pub downstairs if only I could. That's exactly what I think too. However, if we read a bit of discussion on this section of the forum, we realize that players are essentially interested in the 3 chapters I mentioned above. Maps - Class Balance - Server Balance. This is what stimulates participation. Yet I am also convinced that if winning is all that you have indicated, it gets a meaning, The player's participation would be a huge leap forward. Especially after I read Xen how he described all the other RvR games on the market, which don't even keep track of a point system, this would only make GW2 even more unique. even more special than all the others.

And since recently here on the forum, I found out that Rubi before being an Anet technician was first and foremost an active WVW player, he would be the perfect interlocutor to ask what he thinks. Ruby, if you have 10 minutes left over after work, please let me know what your thoughts are on this thread. So I can offer you a beer at the local pub too.😉

I've been reviewing this thread and writing up a summary for the studio and just got to this post. 😄 

I think that I super appreciate the constructive posts throughout this thread--as with all threads that I summarize and pass along, it helps me share useful feedback and trends with the rest of the studio. 

[CafPow.1542]

18 hours ago, XenesisII.1540 said:

I'd be more interested in seeing the jackal skins useable on the warclaw...

My jackal skin is always a super cute fox and since there is nothing against a auper cute fox i can only support that.

 

2 minutes ago, Rubi Bayer.8493 said:

I've been reviewing this thread and writing up a summary for the studio and just got to this post. 😄 

Well i too would like a new map tho it’s a lot of work but it’s cool if devs read our silly ideas 🙂

[Glissando.6093]

And we've seen some links in the beta where it's all entirely invisible small groups that do their own thing.

The above cannot be emphasised enough, my Guild was in a map with 30+ queues and the queue bug, so I did not get to play with them when i was on. It was just terrible, either hidden tags or open tags but the moment you turned up it was just guild people and they would literally finish their objective, zone out and hide their tag! it was encouraging anti social behaviour i think, and I am someone who has nothing against small Guild raids or havoc groups as a rule.

Another thing i feel is encouraging unsociable habits is the boon ball meta, is HAS TO GO. No if's no buts, not only is it shockingly boring, it seems to feed into and encourage some behaviour from commanders that is somewhat elitist and Discord obsessed. It's a third party app, I have run with plenty of open group commanders that don't run with it and do well. My SIL was in a squad last week ( open) said they were doing well, the majority were not on discord, they lost one battle and the commander started complaining that it was the squads fault for not being on discord, and then tried to offload all the non discord squad onto someone else mid prime time. I think boon ball is partly why voice squad has become 'required'

All this talk of maps, you have a map EOTM, do something with it.

So, due to all of the above and that the changes coming seem to encourage this, plus the radio silence on boon ball means neither I or my SIL want to do wvw at all at the moment. Abandon or change the restructuring so that this anti social Guild only mentality does not set in because it will kill off wvw forever, stop boon ball, use EOTM.

 

 

 

[XenesisII.1540]

Now let's see how long it takes to get around acting on the feedback to boon ball, willbender, celestial, and relic of the ice trends.... 😏