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We need an official position from ANET about ARCDPS and TACO

SurfinBird.1978

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SidewayS.3789

SidewayS.3789

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@Pifil.5193 said:

@"Kheldorn.5123" said:

@"Greener.6204" said:Blaming Anet for the tizzy that people are creating for themselves makes no sense.

1583 accounts got suspended. More than 1583 people use taco. It can be inferred that simply using taco won't get you banned. It's that easy.

Unless in some cases TACO triggered false positive result for anet.

Maybe on some cases their mouse drivers caused false positive too, they probably shouldn't use a mouse. ;)Maybe Anet should sell approved 3rd party GW2 mice. They have no buttons, no scrollwheel and no optics just to be 100% macro safe.

"They look a lot like bricks with a GW2 logo on them, are they bricks? I'll take two!" :)

@"Kheldorn.5123" said:

@"Greener.6204" said:Blaming Anet for the tizzy that people are creating for themselves makes no sense.

1583 accounts got suspended. More than 1583 people use taco. It can be inferred that simply using taco won't get you banned. It's that easy.

Unless in some cases TACO triggered false positive result for anet.

Maybe on some cases their mouse drivers caused false positive too, they probably shouldn't use a mouse. ;)

Well i have installed TacO and the driver for my gaming mouse for SAB tribulation, and guess what.I have been banned. I never installed ARCdps or any software.I guess i should go and search for an old mouse with 2 buttons.

Did you use any macro functions to bind multiple actions to a single button press, like for dodge jumping?

Yes, and this gave me, the hammer ban. But still...6 months for a little double jump in SAB...

So it wasn't the mouse software it was the fact that you used it to bind two actions to a single mouse button.

Assuming that was the only reason it seems a little harsh (to me) to hand out a six month ban for that when others have received the same ban for teleport hacks in WvW but it is against the ToS.

Yes, they "cut" everyone in the same manner.Doesn't matter if you did a macro to bind 2 keys in 1 for double-jumping like me, or teleport hacks in WvW.

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AliamRationem.5172

AliamRationem.5172

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@SurfinBird.1978 said:Hi,

Since last night and the operation of ban accounts, most of the community debate on the legality of ARCDPS and TACO.A simple official position from you, ANET, would close this debate and especially give to your players the opportunity to be truly responsible knowingly a ban due to one of these two overlays.As i reminder, you approved their use some time ago. Since they have been update, we need to know if the latest versions are always in agreement with your policy. Ban people for using overlay that you had approved without informing them that you had change your policy, would be absolutely contrary to any form of respect of your players ... At the opposite, I'm sure that if the players using them know that you do not approve them anymore, they will not use them anymore.

So tank you for your official position for:

ARCDPS:1.dps meter2.build template3.reshade

TACO:

  1. general
  2. markers overlay

All the community will tanks you to take the time to give us an official reply, we really need it !

I would love to be told that arc is safe. However, it puts ANet in a bad spot. In fact, all this uproar over 1600 account bans is mostly a result of uncertainty caused by a policy that says one thing while ANet employees have, in the past, suggested another - or at least created a gray area. A better alternative, in my mind, would be to develop a built-in DPS meter and give players the option whether or not they want to share their combat data with others.

That would give those of us who use it for personal performance improvement a useful tool that is 100% safe to use. For those who are against the idea of damage meters, they can simply toggle it off.

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artemis.6781

artemis.6781

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@Tails.9372 said:

@"Endless Soul.5178" said:Here's my official position: Don't use
any
third party software with this game, ever.You do realise that if you're looking up something GW2 related in your browser you're already using a 3d party software, one could even argue that using this software gives you an unfair advantage over those who don't so do you think that it's reasonable to expect everyone to not use ther browser anymore?

You do know Anet controls that "3rd party software" and Anet doesn't control Arc or Taco?

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Jojo.6140

Jojo.6140

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@SurfinBird.1978 said:This post is not made for personnal players position, only for an official reply by ANET. So please, dont spam this disucsion with your personnal point of view or complaint, just keep this clear for a reply by ANET :-)

If Anet desires to make a statement about certain 3rd-party-tools, im sure they would create their own thread for that.

Apart from that i agree with Endless Soul here. Just dont use 3rd-party-software. The game is very well playable without any.

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Ardenwolfe.8590

Ardenwolfe.8590

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@"FogLeg.9354" said:

If he does not work for Anet, the answer is just a opinion of some random guy. He can not give any quarantee about using his program.

But if he says he got banned too, it indirectly tells us more than your opinion suggests. That said, still no response . . . which also tells me something.

Asking and getting answers is always better than blanket assumptions from some 'random guy' on the forum who doesn't update the program, but gives his opinion on it like he does.

And if he says, "Yes, I asked after these suspensions, and ANet not only didn't ban me, they said it's fine. Here's the message."

Well . . . I think that carries more weight than some 'random guy' or words to that effect.

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Ardenwolfe.8590

Ardenwolfe.8590

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@SidewayS.3789 said:

Well i have installed TacO and the driver for my gaming mouse for SAB tribulation, and guess what.I have been banned. I never installed ARCdps or any software.I guess i should go and search for an old mouse with 2 buttons.

I'm really starting to wonder if macros that give players the jump/dodge ability with one button are to blame . . . especially in Tribulation mode in SAB.

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SidewayS.3789

SidewayS.3789

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Well i can confirm, other 2 friends of mine who used their Logitech software to create a macro of Space+V (double jumping) on 1 mouse button have been banned. So yeah, we broke the rules of ToS and we deserve to be banned, but 6 months? I mean what we did, is much more worse then those guys who were paid with real money to lose the games in pvp tournament and even those were banned for 3 months only.

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apharma.3741

apharma.3741

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@artemis.6781 said:Well technically one button performing 2 actions are not allowed? So it could very well be the jump/Dodge.

I wonder if any cakes are walking out of this ban wave alive?

I think most people banned would be using a macro or some kind of hack tool, I think that the ones using macros are probably the majority and that may be related to farming or executing several instant cast abilities in a competitive game mode.

Of course the people banned aren’t likely to be a trustable source no matter unless you’ve known them in real life for years.

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CptAurellian.9537

CptAurellian.9537

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@Mini Crinny.6190 said:From what i know, Arcdps is fine as people who just use arcdps haven't been banned, TacO idk

It is, obviously. Otherwise, most of my guild (and countless others) would have been banned. As long as the statements of Christ Cleary et al. aren't publicly revoked, there's little reason to expect a ban for using Arc or stuff like Taco. Swinging that kind of banhammer would be PR suicide.

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Drakth.1875

Drakth.1875

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I doubt they will make a whitelist of "addons", because each time a new version gets released they would have to review it, and that means people and time, and that translates to money. So, even if some dev posted on some forums post that was ok, the official policy as far as i know is "Use it at your own risk".

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Illconceived Was Na.9781

Illconceived Was Na.9781

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Official Statements: TACO

11 months ago,
:I haven't seen anything that TACO is doing that would violate the rules set forward with the fair usage of the mumble API.

:Being a former MMO dev myself I specifically set strict rules for the development of TacO in order to keep it as legit as possible. I fully intend to keep it that way.

(If you read further, one of QT's infamous members asks some follow-up questions, with some helpful responses by TACO's developer, some of which remain relevant today.)

and

, Redditor MairnSA wroteI have made a timer for the Dhuum fight for GW2TacO. It includes timers for all three wisps and the Soul Split mechanic, as well as POI for all Reapers, which matches the callouts done by the timer.Chris Cleary replied:I've reviewed this, this is fine.This isn't anywhere close to DBM or Bigwigs. This is what's called a "dumb" timer. It runs independent of any information from the client while using existing tech from Taco. Review the code if you want, I did. It's nothing more than markers and a stopwatch (not putting down the author, just trying to explain).

If someone wanted to put in the time to actually build real bossmods, that might be something that we could approve if they wanted to work with me.

Official Position ArcDPS: DPS Measuring

@"Chris Cleary.8017" wrote in October 2017

The current implementation of DPS meters is nothing more than a re-presentation of information already being transmitted by the game server to all clients in the reporting radius. Combat data does not have player ownership as it is being generated by the game server and then transmitted in order to update the status of the world state.

Essentially since the server is running a calculation/simulation based on actions by all the clients in the area, it owns the subsequent reporting of all calculations.

This is different for situations like chat, where there is no impact or simulation necessary and essentially is a forwarding service that the server is simply handling the reporting of the client action.

and

In Feb 2017, @"Chris Cleary.8017" wrote on Reddit:We have no problems with players using a 3rd party tool whose scope is only to collect and visualize combat data gathered directly from the game client. Anything beyond that scope is still considered a violation of the User Agreement.

So, does that mean memory reading DPS readers are OK as long as they are only parsing combat data?You are correct. Combat data is defined as any information that is created due to the usage of skills or impact on players due to skill usage (by the player/s or an outside source).

Edit/Update: These statements are particularly targeted at a "DPS Meter" or functionality built around the capture of combat data. Features outside of that most likely fall under "Quality of Life" changes and should be removed from DPS meters if they want to be considered compliant with our rules.

and again

In April 2017, Chris Cleary wrote on Reddit:ArenaNet authorizes the use and development of 3rd Party tools under the banner of a "DPS Meter". "DPS Meters" is defined as the collection and processing of combat related data in order to develop a statistical and visual representation of that data. This combat data maybe collected from anyone inside of your immediate social group. Social groups are defined as including the player character, and current party and/or squad.

Combat data does not include current entity status, including current Buffs/Debuffs/Health/Stats/Location or any other data that is not generated due to the usage of skills or impact on player characters due to skill usage (by the PC/s or an outside source).

The collection and processing of data in the client must be limited to the scope of the "DPS meter" and should not exceed it. Visualization of this data must also limited to the scope of the "DPS Meter" which includes visualizations, logging, and processing/visualization of logging.

ArcDPS Official Statements: Build Template/Loadout Features

, ArcDPS developer
DeltaConnected
wrote:I now have the all clear for build templates. arcdps serves as the framework for the time being
About 2-3 months ago I asked /u/deltaconnected to take down his previously created Build Templates addon to ArcDPS. At the time it was in violation of our rules to distribute it and it had key issues with it when it came to functionality and interaction with the game client.

This release is the result of a multi-month coordination to get his Build Templates addon into a place where I can green-light it for release. Unlike DPS meters, Build Templates is a much more passive user interface addon and thus it could be individually allowed to release outside of the DPS meter Terms of Service rules restriction. If future developers are interested in working with me to create addons, please reach out to me and we can chat.

I'm green-lighting this due to the developer's trustworthiness after months of interaction and willingness to add key restrictions and functionality changes to accommodate my push to keep addons away from becoming a "must have to win" situation (WvW restrictions were not outlined in his post, but they are there along with others).

In their current state, /u/DeltaConnected's Build templates are green-lit and safe to use by users (in terms of violating the Terms of Service). I've asked him to run any functionality changes by me before releasing, so hopefully we don't need to worry about things changing in the future in terms of "safe to use".

This is officially unsupported, and ArenaNet will not be able to offer any support for this addon or issues that occur due to use of this addon.

Further reading:

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Azoqu.8917

Azoqu.8917

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@"Nidome.1365" said:Anything with a DPS meter that allows you to see the DPS of other players should not be allowed. It is a recipe for toxicity. If you want to monitor your own DPS that is fine.

Before Arc was allowed, it was "Ele or gtfo." You could not prove yourself at all. Once it was allowed, everyone saw that most Eles pulled abysmal DPS compared to other classes in raids and the entire community accepted other classes and also improved as a whole because everyone could see if they needed to practice or not. The current meta has been shifting back to "Ele or gtfo" but that is not the DPS meter's fault. It is the terrible balance that is causing that and that people have become better to be better on Ele in general.

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