Feedback from first day of patch

[Ario.8964]

I did a good deal of playing today and these are just some of my preliminary thoughts that I gathered throughout the day (this is from a holo/rev perspective if that helps give a reference view)

• CC is too present now. The reduction of stunbreaks and stab was great, and cc definitely feels more meaningful when it's actually landed on a target but there's just too much of it right now. It is way too easy to get rag dolled around for an entire fight just because you simply don't have the capability to deal with that level of cc. Please look into either reducing the duration of ccs that had extended durations or remove the control effects of many cc skills.
• Firebrand needs to be toned down more (specifically symbolbrand). Obviously since I don't play firebrand I can't say with absolute certainty but my first thought is the need to reduce/remove burn and bleed access for their kit as it allows them to stack too much damage while still being able to support their team (a more extreme solution would be to remove sage but I'd prefer not to remove amulets when that can be avoided). Their Daze on axe 2 doesn't need to be there either, it is not necessary for the function of the skill and just adds more unnecessary cc into the game.
• Projectile hate needs to be toned down. For projectile based builds in any sort of teamfight is is ridiculously hard to do consistent damage since there's almost always some sort of projectile hate up (bubble or hammer 2 from scrapper, Axe 5 on ranger, Shield 5 on guard, focus 4 air on ele, dagger storm, etc)
• Ranger greatsword is still overloaded as a set, maul still hits for absurd amounts on a 6 sec cd (I got hit for 11k today) AND gets instant reset from cc. Combine that with block on 4, evade on 3 (+ heavy mobility) and the set has way too much of defensive and offensive power on the same set. Maul either needs another cd increase, another damage nerf, or no more skill reset on cc. After that the weapon is fine imo.
• Pathing is still a huge issue for dash skills, I have skills like bull's charge going around pillars to hit me which defeats the whole purpose of LoS. Not a new issue, but still one that needs to be looked into.
• Engineer's bombs need a shorter fuse time. Short fuse got the cd reduction rolled into the skills but they needed the functionality change too. They are still too slow and will not hit anything reliably that doesn't just stand next to you. Also was pretty sure big boomer was supposed to heal 202 hp per second but even with healing power I'm getting like 178 a second instead.
• Rev battle scars is very underwhelming, you don't get enough healing for that investment and it doesn't matter because of something even bigger: REV ENERGY COSTS ARE TOO DAMN HIGH. Either remove energy costs from all weapon skills, or reduce the energy costs of the stunbreaks because the removal of EV combined with the shiro nerf was WAY too much (EV removal alone would've been enough to keep rev balanced but functional at least) Now you break stun 1 time and you have 0 cds you can use because energy costs...

Overall, patch feels nicer. The game has slowed down to a reasonable pace but there are some outliers that were missed and still ought to be adjusted in the alleged follow up patches.

Edits:Removed discussion about evade on auto because I'm somehow that much of an uninformed monkey. Apologies for the mistake, thanks for the correction.

[mrauls.6519]

Please revert deflecting shot change

[Ario.8964]

@"mrauls.6519" said:Please revert deflecting shot change

Forgot about this, this is a big one. DH is unplayable with that change alone. If it was targeted the cast time would be justified but rn it's too slow and you have to predict where the enemy will be a second after you use the skill.

[zealex.9410]

If they remove the cd reset on ranger greatsword the playstyle will be so much worse. Its one of the few examplesof actively having a rotation of sorts and i think we nees more of that in gw2. Maybe up the cd by 2 or 3 sec.

Cant commend on the rest.

[mrauls.6519]

Test of Faith's initial strike and Deflecting Shot need to do more damage than .01 or whatever it is

[JTGuevara.9018]

First off, let me say that this update is magnificent! I couldn't ask for anything more! An end to powercreep, 2v2 ranked, a new armor set.

Still, yes there are flaws. I will give feedback from the queuing perspective. Don't pug. I'm serious. Get a friend. Toxic people will remain, but the stakes for losing are higher in 2v2 than in conquest. Going from personal experience, one disgruntled afker or troll can cost you the game.

In a sense, it's a repeat of the first pvp seasons but with 2v2 instead of 5v5. Normally, I'm in support of separate queues in the case of 5v5, but with 2v2, I don't think it's that big of a struggle to get another person to play with. Honestly, it's better off not to pug.

[JTGuevara.9018]

@"Highlie.7641" said:I'm enjoying this patch. I've yet to play guild wars but the forums are entertaining. It's showing exactly what we've been telling people for years, "carried by design"

you know this CC topic came up year's ago right, the same people whining about CC's now are the same people telling people "L2P" back then.. and all it took was for them to remove there easy to access stability for it to become a "Dire" issue. a perfect example of being carried by power creep.

You got that right! It is "carried by design". Minus the damage, the CCs haven't even changed at all! If anything, they're right back to where they were before! People will chatter as always, I pay no attention to it.

[Yosmo.5306]

this patch is total trash. u killed to many skills what u just had to do was kill a few skills that 1 shot people thats all power condi and everything was just fine. but im done with the game. ty for letting me save money and now off to find a new game

[otto.5684]

Nothing out of the unexpected. FB dominates, among condi/bunker builds. Everything is fucking slow. This is the worst it has at least since PoF release. It is most definitely the worst meta in years.

Again, we exactly knew this would happen.

[Moradorin.6217]

Its another death nail in GW2 coffin

[FtoPScrub.5476]

Pretty much spot on imo from a guardian perspective. Symbolbrand - both sages and menders is still completely busted, especially in 2v2.Most DH changes including the nerfs were good but the .75s cast time on the knockback is just unacceptable.

[Abelisk.5148]

DH's just need to learn the new playstyle, no more running forward and DS'ing backwards. DS => LB2

[Sansar.1302]

@Ario.8964 said:I did a good deal of playing today and these are just some of my preliminary thoughts that I gathered throughout the day (this is from a holo/rev perspective if that helps give a reference view)

• CC is too present now. The reduction of stunbreaks and stab was great, and cc definitely feels more meaningful when it's actually landed on a target but there's just too much of it right now. It is way too easy to get rag dolled around for an entire fight just because you simply don't have the capability to deal with that level of cc. Please look into either reducing the duration of ccs that had extended durations or remove the control effects of many cc skills.
• Firebrand needs to be toned down more (specifically symbolbrand). Obviously since I don't play firebrand I can't say with absolute certainty but my first thought is the need to reduce/remove burn and bleed access for their kit as it allows them to stack too much damage while still being able to support their team (a more extreme solution would be to remove sage but I'd prefer not to remove amulets when that can be avoided). Their Daze on axe 2 doesn't need to be there either, it is not necessary for the function of the skill and just adds more unnecessary cc into the game.
• Projectile hate needs to be toned down. For projectile based builds in any sort of teamfight is is ridiculously hard to do consistent damage since there's almost always some sort of projectile hate up (bubble or hammer 2 from scrapper, Axe 5 on ranger, Shield 5 on guard, focus 4 air on ele, dagger storm, etc)
• Ranger greatsword is still overloaded as a set, maul still hits for absurd amounts on a 6 sec cd (I got hit for 11k today) AND gets instant reset from cc. Combine that with block on 4, evade on 3 (+ heavy mobility) and evade on auto and you just have a weapon that does too much. Autos don't need an evade (that is the ONLY weapon in the game with that kind of ability, closest follower in overloaded auto effects is staff thief getting reflect on an auto. No auto in this game should have really strong effects like that tied to them.) so that can be removed, maul either needs another cd increase, another damage nerf, or no more skill reset on cc. After that the weapon is fine imo.
• Pathing is still a huge issue for dash skills, I have skills like bull's charge going around pillars to hit me which defeats the whole purpose of LoS. Not a new issue, but still one that needs to be looked into.
• Engineer's bombs need a shorter fuse time. Short fuse got the cd reduction rolled into the skills but they needed the functionality change too. They are still too slow and will not hit anything reliably that doesn't just stand next to you. Also was pretty sure big boomer was supposed to heal 202 hp per second but even with healing power I'm getting like 178 a second instead.
• Rev battle scars is very underwhelming, you don't get enough healing for that investment and it doesn't matter because of something even bigger: REV ENERGY COSTS ARE TOO kitten HIGH. Either remove energy costs from all weapon skills, or reduce the energy costs of the stunbreaks because the removal of EV combined with the shiro nerf was WAY too much (EV removal alone would've been enough to keep rev balanced but functional at least) Now you break stun 1 time and you have 0 cds you can use because energy costs...

Overall, patch feels nicer. The game has slowed down to a reasonable pace but there are some outliers that were missed and still ought to be adjusted in the alleged follow up patches.

You know Ranger lost the evade on greatsword autochain long time ago? It is one of the weakest auto attack chains in game now due to the slow speed of the chain

[Downstate.4697]

Personally I'm having a blast in core d/d ele. Very viable but because signet of restoration is healing for more than it should I'm worried fixing it might make it unviable. Also, poison sigil on bunkers. Works wonders my friends. Fb feels much squishier with the right pressure

[Fueki.4753]

Remove CC from weapon skills and put the damage back onto them asap!Also, remove daze from PvP, it's garbage.

[alain.1659]

Feels there is too much cc on the board as many stunbreaks and stab sources are gone. But the lack of one shot builds (some of them at least) feels good. There are still some overtuned professions, especially the bunker types and tempest+firebrand combo is really annoying. Boon problem is still there. Shorter, but still there. It would not been an issue if glamour mesmer had been restored (yes I am a glamour mes fanatic).

It can be a good meta in 1-2 fixes and patches.

[Tayga.3192]

@Fueki.4753 said:Also, remove daze from PvP, it's garbage.

Will mesmer f3 stun instead?

[Leonidrex.5649]

@Tayga.3192 said:

@Fueki.4753 said:Also, remove daze from PvP, it's garbage.

Will mesmer f3 stun instead?

it already stuns. if you know what I mean.

[Tayga.3192]

@Leonidrex.5649 said:it already stuns. if you know what I mean.

Shhh.

[verskore.4312]

Maul still too strong? are you kidding me? i rarely hit 11k with maul unless I run full zerker scholar + zerk runes + I pop elite and am mightstacked. You completely wanna destroy soulbeast? The fact that we can't petswap makes us a walking target.

[Leonidrex.5649]

@verskore.4312 said:Maul still too strong? are you kidding me? i rarely hit 11k with maul unless I run full zerker scholar + zerk runes + I pop elite and am mightstacked. You completely wanna destroy soulbeast? The fact that we can't petswap makes us a walking target.

oh nooo, i rarely hit 11k oh noo. its weak.my full glass cannon mesmer deals 5k dmg with TRAITED gs2 in MELEE on LONGER CD on enemy with 10+ stacks of vulnerability and with 13 stacks of might. all while being glass with scholars.

[Sanity Obscure.6054]

Ranger really is fine where it is. I don't agree with the engi bombs needing a smaller fuse either.

I was more concerned with

1. How easy it is to push people into pillars on Hall of the Mists.
2. Duo Symbolbrand. That shit is hilariously over powered lol. Like legitimately hilarious, it will leave you laughing at nearly every fight.

[NorthernRedStar.3054]

Ranger greatsword is still overloaded as a set, maul still hits for absurd amounts on a 6 sec cd (I got hit for 11k today) AND gets instant reset from cc. Combine that with block on 4, evade on 3 (+ heavy mobility) and evade on auto and you just have a weapon that does too much. Autos don't need an evade (that is the ONLY weapon in the game with that kind of ability, closest follower in overloaded auto effects is staff thief getting reflect on an auto. No auto in this game should have really strong effects like that tied to them.) so that can be removed, maul either needs another cd increase, another damage nerf, or no more skill reset on cc. After that the weapon is fine imo.

Let's get some facts straight.

• Maul is the most telegraphed skill in the game, it's extremely hard to hit w/o quickness. This is the main damage tool of the kit. It needs to hit hard when it does. Hilt Bash isn't exactly fast either, and it only dazes if not hit from the flank.

• Swoop only evades at the end of the animation, when you've reached your target. So in melee combat, yes, the evade is nearly instant - but it's not warrior GS 3.

• Ranger GS auto chain lost its evade on Power Stab some months ago. It only grants some endurance back - if it hits. The weapon is 100% fine - jack of all trades, master of none; something ranger has desperately needed for a while now.

[Luthan.5236]

I never really considered using bombs in PvP. Thought the fuse was a problem at first. But then again: In PvE mobs aren't moving like players. And in PvP I didn't find a good build yet.

On Metabattle most elite spec builds use Alchemy and Tools or Inventions for the 2 other slots. (Not explosives which you might want together with the bombs.) I still like and play core a lot atm but I do it similar ... with the 3rd slot firearms instead of elite. And I think most people with explosives as trait line used the grenades.

The feel of more CC might also be because of the lower damage. Players can stay alive longer - makes it more worth to pick up more CC skills since you easier get to use them before getting killed. :D

[Rylai.3158]

Power on Power fights feel quite comfortable, unless Ranger is involved, because if anyone thinks that ranger pets and overloaded GS needs to be that good, they are delusional. The new ranger block on GS is absurd.

That being said Symbolbrand was already the meta of meta meta meta meta builds last patch and now its literally shining, when the type of damage that used to have a chance against it was toned down, its just overloaded as hell.

I dislike fighting Mirage as much as the next person but the one dodge is just absurdly bad for them. Coupled with the Chrono rework which literally destroyed Chrono.

Conditions are out of control. Condi rev is absurd to say the least. We see core terrormancer creeping higher and higher and then there's scourge that has now returned.

I think every prof/spec should be viable, because otherwise there's no balance but the current state is not that favorable for power specs. I mean, I've even seen the old bow mace/shield berserker condi spec returning. You remember that spec? The one because of which arenanet decked Berserker in pvp so hard that it has not been viable since? Some of the reworks and changes have been terrible, looking at you chrono. And Warrior GS f1.

Battlescars on revenant is literally not worth looking at due to its values.
TLDR: Power damage apart ranger in a good place, conditions and symbolbrand are not.