Tao.5096 Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 Hey,Thief skills are way too much spammable and they are way too OP for them to be used so frequently.In order to balance it out, initiative should be increased for following skills:Heartseeker - Increase from 3 to 5Black Powder - Increase from 6 to 8Shadow Shot - Increase from 5 to 7Head Shot - Increase from 4 to 5Dancing Dagger - Increase from 3 to 5Flanking Strike - Increase from 5 to 7Infiltrator's Strike (or Infiltrator's Return) - Increase from 4 to 6 (or 2 to 3)This way Thief will be more oriented on proper initiative and skill management and not spam to winAlso, in order to increase healthier plasytyle in PvP, Daredevil's trait Physical Supremancy should have reduced Endurance Threshold Increase from 50 to 25.Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonidrex.5649 Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 @Tao.5096 said:Hey,Thief skills are way too much spammable and they are way too OP for them to be used so frequently.In order to balance it out, initiative should be increased for following skills:Heartseeker - Increase from 3 to 5Black Powder - Increase from 6 to 8Shadow Shot - Increase from 5 to 7Head Shot - Increase from 4 to 5Dancing Dagger - Increase from 3 to 5Flanking Strike - Increase from 5 to 7Infiltrator's Strike (or Infiltrator's Return) - Increase from 4 to 6 (or 2 to 3)This way Thief will be more oriented on proper initiative and skill management and not spam to winAlso, in order to increase healthier plasytyle in PvP, Daredevil's trait Physical Supremancy should have reduced Endurance Threshold Increase from 50 to 25.Thanksif you buff all thief dmg by 20% then it could be something devs could think about.Headshot is fine at 4 now that PI is crap.Black powder at 8 is waaay too much, i think its fine at 6Hearthseeker could go to 4 with slight damage boost in turn, same with shadowshot.I dont like dancing dagger as a skill but thats just me, wont leave my opinion since I dont like it.Flanking at 7 is a joke, stop.Infiltrators strike/return is toxic, but I dont know how it can be change to be still usable and not super annoying.all in all you should play thief before you comment with this ridiculous stuff lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psybehr.2518 Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 Imagine being so bad, that you’re still crying about thief. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tayga.3192 Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 Remove every thief skill, reduce total initiative to 1 and give thief only 1 skill for 1 initiative that deals 90% HP damage unblockable unevadable and recharges every 180 seconds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eugchriss.2046 Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 The problem (one of) with thief skills has never been the skill itself. It s the spamm-ability of those which create the issue. cf other thread.But again, good luck with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crypto.8054 Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 And dont forget to give Necros at least 5 more lifebars in shroud so they can't die to "spam to win".... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UNOwen.7132 Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 @Leonidrex.5649 said:@"Tao.5096" said:Hey,Thief skills are way too much spammable and they are way too OP for them to be used so frequently.In order to balance it out, initiative should be increased for following skills:Heartseeker - Increase from 3 to 5Black Powder - Increase from 6 to 8Shadow Shot - Increase from 5 to 7Head Shot - Increase from 4 to 5Dancing Dagger - Increase from 3 to 5Flanking Strike - Increase from 5 to 7Infiltrator's Strike (or Infiltrator's Return) - Increase from 4 to 6 (or 2 to 3)This way Thief will be more oriented on proper initiative and skill management and not spam to winAlso, in order to increase healthier plasytyle in PvP, Daredevil's trait Physical Supremancy should have reduced Endurance Threshold Increase from 50 to 25.Thanksif you buff all thief dmg by 20% then it could be something devs could think about.Pretty sure theyre being sarcastic. Though, 20% would be way too little of a damage buff to make up for this, its barely enough to make up for the Assassins Signet nerf. Do these changes, and thief goes from "Only good at ganking in WvW" to "completely unplayable in WvW".Headshot is fine at 4 now that PI is kitten.Not really "fine" as much as its incredibly underpowered. There is basically no reason to use headshot unless you somehow screwed up and absolutely need to interrupt their heal and dont have steal up.Black powder at 8 is waaay too much, i think its fine at 6It probably is. Most I could see is trying it out at 5, but its not really worth messing with.Hearthseeker could go to 4 with slight damage boost in turn, same with shadowshot.Cant. Remember, they said max damage is gonna be 2.0 with only few exceptions now. Heartseeker is already at 2.0. Shadowshot if anything needs the random initaitive increase reverted.I dont like dancing dagger as a skill but thats just me, wont leave my opinion since I dont like it.Its not a great skill, you basically just use it for the cripple.Flanking at 7 is a joke, stop.All of them are jokes. This one is just the most obvious.Infiltrators strike/return is toxic, but I dont know how it can be change to be still usable and not super annoying.I cant say I ever paid that close attention, but making the return spot visible to the opponent if it isnt would be a start. That way people can more obviously see what they need to do to deal with that skill.all in all you should play thief before you comment with this ridiculous stuff lolAgain, pretty sure its satire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonidrex.5649 Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 @UNOwen.7132 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:@"Tao.5096" said:Hey,Thief skills are way too much spammable and they are way too OP for them to be used so frequently.In order to balance it out, initiative should be increased for following skills:Heartseeker - Increase from 3 to 5Black Powder - Increase from 6 to 8Shadow Shot - Increase from 5 to 7Head Shot - Increase from 4 to 5Dancing Dagger - Increase from 3 to 5Flanking Strike - Increase from 5 to 7Infiltrator's Strike (or Infiltrator's Return) - Increase from 4 to 6 (or 2 to 3)This way Thief will be more oriented on proper initiative and skill management and not spam to winAlso, in order to increase healthier plasytyle in PvP, Daredevil's trait Physical Supremancy should have reduced Endurance Threshold Increase from 50 to 25.Thanksif you buff all thief dmg by 20% then it could be something devs could think about.Pretty sure theyre being sarcastic. Though, 20% would be way too little of a damage buff to make up for this, its barely enough to make up for the Assassins Signet nerf. Do these changes, and thief goes from "Only good at ganking in WvW" to "completely unplayable in WvW".Headshot is fine at 4 now that PI is kitten.Not really "fine" as much as its incredibly underpowered. There is basically no reason to use headshot unless you somehow screwed up and absolutely need to interrupt their heal and dont have steal up.Black powder at 8 is waaay too much, i think its fine at 6It probably is. Most I could see is trying it out at 5, but its not really worth messing with.Hearthseeker could go to 4 with slight damage boost in turn, same with shadowshot.Cant. Remember, they said max damage is gonna be 2.0 with only few exceptions now. Heartseeker is already at 2.0. Shadowshot if anything needs the random initaitive increase reverted.I dont like dancing dagger as a skill but thats just me, wont leave my opinion since I dont like it.Its not a great skill, you basically just use it for the cripple.Flanking at 7 is a joke, stop.All of them are jokes. This one is just the most obvious.Infiltrators strike/return is toxic, but I dont know how it can be change to be still usable and not super annoying.I cant say I ever paid that close attention, but making the return spot visible to the opponent if it isnt would be a start. That way people can more obviously see what they need to do to deal with that skill.all in all you should play thief before you comment with this ridiculous stuff lolAgain, pretty sure its satire.he was whining after necro got nerfed, im fairly sure its not satire but necro main being a necro main. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psybehr.2518 Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 @Leonidrex.5649he was whining after necro got nerfed, im fairly sure its not satire but necro main being a necro main.It’s required that you blame everyone but yourself for deaths when you main necro. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darren.1064 Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 LOLoh wait i need more than just that to post a comment?well...LOL GO LEARN TO PLAY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crossroads.5174 Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 Wait, is this post serious? I can't tell if there is sarcasm or too much salt in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazsi.2734 Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 @"Tao.5096" said:Hey,Thief skills are way too much spammable and they are way too OP for them to be used so frequently.In order to balance it out, initiative should be increased for following skills:Heartseeker - Increase from 3 to 5Black Powder - Increase from 6 to 8Shadow Shot - Increase from 5 to 7Head Shot - Increase from 4 to 5Dancing Dagger - Increase from 3 to 5Flanking Strike - Increase from 5 to 7Infiltrator's Strike (or Infiltrator's Return) - Increase from 4 to 6 (or 2 to 3)This way Thief will be more oriented on proper initiative and skill management and not spam to winAlso, in order to increase healthier plasytyle in PvP, Daredevil's trait Physical Supremancy should have reduced Endurance Threshold Increase from 50 to 25.ThanksWhat the hell kind of balance would this be? Thief has 12 baseline initiative, the most basic combo of Black Powder->Hearthseeker would cost 13 with your proposed changes. So basicly the combat presence of theif would be reduced to use maybe 1 or 2 skills, then autoattack for 10 seconds, thats what you think "proper initiative and skill management" is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthernRedStar.3054 Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 Guys, this is a sarcastic post..... Right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sneakers.8462 Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 Lets look at this from a logical point of view....Core Thief currently has 12 initiative and 15 initiative on Daredevil to play with. Currently the standard combo of Blackpowder + Heartseeker + Backstab uses up 9 of that initiative. It allows the thief to actually use other skills to get out of that fight or stay in it.Your proposed change to Blackpowder and Heartseeker would make the combo 13 initiative. That means your proposed change would literally end coordinated bursts which require initiative management. Also, your proposed reduced endurance nerf to Physical Supremacy is completely ridiculous. The whole point of Daredevil is to be fast on your feet, meaning more evades. Eliminating this would again kill the class.Honestly, it seems that you do not play Thief, have no idea about the skills or traits of Thief but have probably been at the receiving end of a good Thief. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xXxNikiGoesWildxXx.3678 Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 I think necros need life force costs on spells(and auto attacks) instead so it can't spamm 11111 with quickness all the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crab Fear.1624 Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 If every class spammed their weapons skills for 1 minute (not including autos), thief would still use less weapon skills than any class per minute. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raiden The Beast.3016 Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 @Tao.5096 said:Hey,Thief skills are way too much spammable and they are way too OP for them to be used so frequently.In order to balance it out, initiative should be increased for following skills:Heartseeker - Increase from 3 to 5Black Powder - Increase from 6 to 8Shadow Shot - Increase from 5 to 7Head Shot - Increase from 4 to 5Dancing Dagger - Increase from 3 to 5Flanking Strike - Increase from 5 to 7Infiltrator's Strike (or Infiltrator's Return) - Increase from 4 to 6 (or 2 to 3)This way Thief will be more oriented on proper initiative and skill management and not spam to winAlso, in order to increase healthier plasytyle in PvP, Daredevil's trait Physical Supremancy should have reduced Endurance Threshold Increase from 50 to 25.ThanksTroll thx bb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shao.7236 Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 What they should really do is make 15 initiative baseline and remove the trait that increase it so Thief can finally have build diversity instead.Look at Revenant not having Empty Vessel now, picking other traitlines don't feel like wasted potential anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eugchriss.2046 Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 @"Shao.7236" said:What they should really do is make 15 initiative baseline and remove the trait that increase it so Thief can finally have build diversity instead.Look at Revenant not having Empty Vessel now, picking other traitlines don't feel like wasted potential anymore.Or keep 12 initiative baseline and remove the trait that increase it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psycoprophet.8107 Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 @Eugchriss.2046 said:@"Shao.7236" said:What they should really do is make 15 initiative baseline and remove the trait that increase it so Thief can finally have build diversity instead.Look at Revenant not having Empty Vessel now, picking other traitlines don't feel like wasted potential anymore.Or keep 12 initiative baseline and remove the trait that increase it U sound like the bias hater that is just sore cuz he dislikes thief and is so self centered could care less others enjoy playing this class. Its unfortunate that people as selfish and self righteous as u exist and at the numbers they do. Why I always say people as a whole a pieces of ......That said I wish u further enjoyment on the classes u play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kulvar.1239 Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 Increasing thief initiative cost is in no way the solution.Adding a very short cooldown (like 2s or 3s) to their strongest skills would cut on the spammability without destroying the class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eugchriss.2046 Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 @Psycoprophet.8107 said:@Eugchriss.2046 said:@"Shao.7236" said:What they should really do is make 15 initiative baseline and remove the trait that increase it so Thief can finally have build diversity instead.Look at Revenant not having Empty Vessel now, picking other traitlines don't feel like wasted potential anymore.Or keep 12 initiative baseline and remove the trait that increase it U sound like the bias hater that is just sore cuz he dislikes thief and is so self centered could care less others enjoy playing this class. Its unfortunate that people as selfish and self righteous as u exist and at the numbers they do. Why I always say people as a whole a pieces of ......That said I wish u further enjoyment on the classes u play.There were supposed to be a gif attached with my post but it didn t get displayed. Here it is: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UNOwen.7132 Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 @Kulvar.1239 said:Increasing thief initiative cost is in no way the solution.Adding a very short cooldown (like 2s or 3s) to their strongest skills would cut on the spammability without destroying the class.Actually it would rather destroy the class if you do it to the strongest skills. It also defeats the point of initiative in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paradoxoglanis.1904 Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 Looks good to me. I also think more thief skills should have positional requirements. Too many of their skills can be used regardless of what direction their target is facing, its OP considering the theme of the class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psycoprophet.8107 Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 @Eugchriss.2046 said:@Psycoprophet.8107 said:@Eugchriss.2046 said:@"Shao.7236" said:What they should really do is make 15 initiative baseline and remove the trait that increase it so Thief can finally have build diversity instead.Look at Revenant not having Empty Vessel now, picking other traitlines don't feel like wasted potential anymore.Or keep 12 initiative baseline and remove the trait that increase it U sound like the bias hater that is just sore cuz he dislikes thief and is so self centered could care less others enjoy playing this class. Its unfortunate that people as selfish and self righteous as u exist and at the numbers they do. Why I always say people as a whole a pieces of ......That said I wish u further enjoyment on the classes u play.There were supposed to be a gif attached with my post but it didn t get displayed. Here it is:In that case I apologize and still think what I said rings true even if doesn't include u lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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