ANET Do not EVER do anything like LWS2 Chapter 7 again!!!!

[Dante.1763]

4 hours ago, nosleepdemon.1368 said:

 

Oh boohoo, poor player has to take a moment to experiment outside of their immediate, faceroll comfort zone for fifteen minutes. The horror, the anguish! How will they cope? Heaven forbid some small section of gameplay diverges from the usual "go to green star and smash things" approach. Funnily enough though, if you want to smash things with Caithe and utterly ignore the stealth sections you actually can. When I read the tooltips for her skills it was pretty clear she was more than capable of slaughtering most of the Asura on her own.

Not every player is a good player, really uncalled for. Not that it matters, even the better players werent happy with that section. I picked ele, i want to play ele. Not a thief, with ele armor, traits and HP pool, cause anet didnt bother making it a full custom class.

 

[nosleepdemon.1368]

1 hour ago, Dante.1763 said:

Not every player is a good player, really uncalled for. Not that it matters, even the better players werent happy with that section. I picked ele, i want to play ele. Not a thief, with ele armor, traits and HP pool, cause anet didnt bother making it a full custom class.

 

 

You don't have to be good, you just need a little perspective. It's one mission that just needs a little thought on how it is approached. I feel there are two kinds of players here; Players who expect everything to be done for them, and players who don't mind falling over a few times to understand a new mechanic that was thrown at them. The former tend to make a big loud noise at developers accusing them of all sorts of utterly overblown infractions the moment some mechanic *dares* to prove insurmountable on the first attempt. The latter enjoy a challenge once in a while, and don't often make a fuss on forums because they are busy playing the game. Unfortunately developers listen to the loudest bunch and whittle down their good, unique ideas until the only thing that's left is mindless skill spam trains collecting their 10g an hour. So consider this a protest against that noisey lot who, irrespective of skill, refuse to eat their dinner unless it is spoon fed to them.

Edited September 4, 2021 by nosleepdemon.1368

[Hirukaru.4539]

Caith skills are amazing. And for the storyvit was required as you are in the vision. So you play as Caith. Would be stranger if you have your own skills. 

Seeing caith with ranger skills or engineer just doesnt make sense. 

[Fueki.4753]

1 hour ago, Hirukaru.4539 said:

Caith skills are amazing. And for the storyvit was required as you are in the vision. So you play as Caith. Would be stranger if you have your own skills. 

Seeing caith with ranger skills or engineer just doesnt make sense. 

When we have to play as Braham or Ryland, we have our own skills, even if it doesn't make sense.

Those instances were visions as well.

Arenanet could change the Caithe missions and have it do the same.

Edited September 4, 2021 by Fueki.4753

[Algreg.3629]

needs more content like this. The exclamation marky rage is exquisite.

[BlueJin.4127]

10 hours ago, Hirukaru.4539 said:

Seeing caith with ranger skills or engineer just doesnt make sense. 

It makes as much sense as playing as yammering salads and talking cabbages. 😆

[Hirukaru.4539]

16 hours ago, Fueki.4753 said:

When we have to play as Braham or Ryland, we have our own skills, even if it doesn't make sense.

Those instances were visions as well.

Arenanet could change the Caithe missions and have it do the same.

Or give us braham and ryland skills. Would be more inline. As the caith mission comes before braham and ryland. 

Also makes more sense to give their skills. 

But you can think what your want never going to change. And they probably never make awesome new skills for missions only, cause that takes too much time. 

[Fueki.4753]

2 minutes ago, Hirukaru.4539 said:

Or give us braham and ryland skills. Would be more inline. As the caith mission comes before braham and ryland.

They already have skills.

You can choose whether you want to use them or not.

Arenanet ought to apply the same to Caithe.

 

That way, both the people who want to enjoy their chosen profession in all missions and those who want to role-play can have their fun in those missions.

It's a win-win situation with no downside.

There is no logical reason to be against that.

[Ashantara.8731]

On 8/27/2021 at 6:52 PM, BlueJin.4127 said:

The problem is not the difficulty. Anybody can read the skills, try them out, and (should be able to) go through the missions without issues. But considering different players like different builds, taking those builds away from the players and hoping everybody will enjoy playing a static build forced on to them is not going to go well.

 

It's just a handful of missions, and as you said, once you get used to the skills, it's easy to play through those without problems.

 

I thought it was fun, to be honest. It used to be more challenging when LWS2 was released back in the day, but nowadays it's not an issue... in my opinion at least.

[NotTooFoolish.7412]

It was a fun concept to see once. I think they just didn't expect it not to work very well.
We've gone through it, let's move on. It cannot hurt us anymore 😂

Edited September 5, 2021 by NotTooFoolish.7412

[Faridah.8431]

On 8/26/2021 at 3:14 AM, Narathkor.8541 said:

If I wanted to play a crappy profession like whatever the heck caithe is with crappy skills and crappy weapons i would play it, don't take my character choices and skills and familiarity from me and make me fight a boss, all for a memory, make a cinematic for memories!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yeah I am having an extremely difficult time completing the last achievements for No Refuge...the ones where you fight Togonn Windmane.

[Brandon Uzumaki.1524]

Found it fine for the normal missions, didin't have any problems, even completed both "infiltration" achievements first try.

Now the Wicked Rodeo achievement, holy crab, one of the most frustrating experiences i've had with this game, mostly because half the wind walls just spawn under the ground, so you are fighintg him normally, them bam, get one-shot out of nowhere without any way to react.

[SoftFootpaws.9134]

I believe that Caithe should be retroactively be given the toggle to use player skills. But at the same time, I wish we could use Braham's skills in IBS, not just the Wolf transformation itself.

[SexyMofo.8923]

Agree. Worst experience in a video game ever. 

[Shena Fu.5792]

it was great experience. devs should be more daring to create controversial content and mechanics.

[Fny.4502]

 

On 9/5/2021 at 2:22 PM, NotTooFoolish.7412 said:

We've gone through it, let's move on. It cannot hurt us anymore 😂

If only that was the case. But unfortunately it keeps hurting everyone who struggles with those missions now. Be they veteran players going back for achievements or new players doing it for the first time.

 

On 9/4/2021 at 1:56 AM, nosleepdemon.1368 said:

 

 I feel there are two kinds of players here; Players who expect everything to be done for them, and players who don't mind falling over a few times to understand a new mechanic that was thrown at them. The former tend to make a big loud noise at developers accusing them of all sorts of utterly overblown infractions the moment some mechanic *dares* to prove insurmountable on the first attempt. 

 

So everyone who struggles with these missions, who try and try and try and try and fail again and again, who are frustrated to the point of pure agony, are just lazy bastards who want everything done for them? I don't think you realize how difficult this can be for people. We're not talking about people raging after failing the first attempt. We're talking people who keep trying and keep working and still find it a complete pain. When speaking up and explaining how difficult they find it, they deserve better than the sort of response you gave. That you find something simple and easy to adapt to does not mean it comes as easily to everyone else, and your complete lack of understanding and sympathy is really quite off-putting. 

 

Personally, I got through the missions. Story-wise I found them to be some of the most interesting and hard-hitting of the entire game. Combat however was unpleasant and generally frustrating, which soured the experience and made me never want to play those missions again. 

[RyuDragnier.9476]

I personally loved it, and find it kinda funny how people complain about it, especially when Caithe is pretty kitten OP in that instance. FFXIV does this from time to time too with other NPCs, and every time it's pretty awesome, because you get to see just how cool they can be without the main character there.

Edited October 18, 2021 by RyuDragnier.9476

[Fueki.4753]

1 hour ago, RyuDragnier.9476 said:

I personally loved it, and find it kinda funny how people complain about it, especially when Caithe is pretty kitten OP in that instance. FFXIV does this from time to time too with other NPCs, and every time it's pretty awesome, because you get to see just how cool they can be without the main character there.

I actually think it's pretty bad and annoying if I'm forced to play a job I didn't sign up for. For me, that's one of the lowest points in an otherwise mostly great game.

If one has to role play, one ought to be able to switch between personal skills and character skills, like the Ryland instance. That way, both the people who like role play and those who hate it get to maximize their enjoyment.

Edited October 18, 2021 by Fueki.4753

[Faridah.8431]

On 9/7/2021 at 10:47 AM, Faridah.8431 said:

Yeah I am having an extremely difficult time completing the last achievements for No Refuge...the ones where you fight Togonn Windmane.

This is still true. Man I hate this fight.

[Random Wax Orc.7695]

The Final Boss fights for Season 3 Episode 4 and Season 3 Episode 6 are far worse than being Caithe.  Situations where excessive repeated dying are the norm do not belong in a story instance.  Seasons 4 & 5 were generally an improvement in this respect.  The PoF final battle was also vastly better than the HoT final battle.  Anet's content has improved on most of these fronts, but some of the achievements (required for meta completion) still do occasionally go overboard.

Having done Season 2 on a couple dozen characters, the worst part of the Caithe instances is all the unskippable dialog.  The combat is actually a bit mundane after learning her skills.

[Fueki.4753]

11 hours ago, Random Wax Orc.7695 said:

The Final Boss fights for Season 3 Episode 4 and Season 3 Episode 6 are far worse than being Caithe.  Situations where excessive repeated dying are the norm do not belong in a story instance.  Seasons 4 & 5 were generally an improvement in this respect.  The PoF final battle was also vastly better than the HoT final battle.

I think the worst offender of excessive dying is the fight against Balthazar on top of the Spire in Elon Riverlands.

If Arenanet would not reset Mordremoth or the illusions before it and let people continue after wiping, I'd prefer the HoT ending to the PoF ending.

[Gibson.4036]

On 10/18/2021 at 1:13 PM, Random Wax Orc.7695 said:

 

Having done Season 2 on a couple dozen characters, the worst part of the Caithe instances is all the unskippable dialog.  The combat is actually a bit mundane after learning her skills.

I think that's the biggest problem... "after learning her skills". You're not her for very long, and you've got an entire bar to figure out. Once you do, it's not such a problem, but people go in having built up familiarity with the bar they have, so it feels very abrupt. Her major OP thing is the stealth that isn't broken by combat, which is counter to stealth in the rest of the game, making you not immediately realize you can abuse it.

I personall find the stealth mission with Caithe more frustrating than the centaurs. If you trigger the alarm, every single thing in the room aggros you, and the game laughably tells you to defeat the enemies to restore stealth. Restore stealth? Why do I need stealth after I've defeated every enemy in the room except the leader? At that point, it's time to just run over and kill him.

 

[Gorem.8104]

On 10/14/2021 at 3:38 PM, Shena Fu.5792 said:

it was great experience. devs should be more daring to create controversial content and mechanics.

 

No, it honestly wasn't, purely due to the achievements they tacked on. If you didn't need to redo the Centaur camp with un-skippable cutscenes a thousands times just because of a single mistake in the final fight in the last 1% maybe it'd be fine then. 

 

The achievements is what made the experience the worst experience in gw2. 

[draxynnic.3719]

On 9/5/2021 at 3:56 PM, Fueki.4753 said:

They already have skills.

You can choose whether you want to use them or not.

Arenanet ought to apply the same to Caithe.

 

That way, both the people who want to enjoy their chosen profession in all missions and those who want to role-play can have their fun in those missions.

It's a win-win situation with no downside.

There is no logical reason to be against that.

Well, the way Ryland and Braham were done, you're not really using their skills.

 

With Ryland, you can at least say that the flamesaw is his preferred weapon, so you're using his skills there. But you still have the utilities of your own profession, rather than Ryland's (warrior, I think?), and the health and armour of your own profession to go with having access to your own profession's weapon skills and utility skills. 

 

With Braham, it's even worse, since the only "Braham skills" you have are Wolf Form, and that's set up so it can only be used in bursts. The rest of the time, you're using your own skills, and you don't even have the choice to play Braham as Braham unless you're playing a dragonhunter yourself.

 

A suitable compromise, I think, would be that when you enter the mission, you're given the choice between fully immersing yourself in the experience, or asserting your own identity on the vision. If you do the latter, you have your own skills and stats. If you do the former, though, you have the custom build set up for the character, including health and armour, that has the tools you're expected to need to finish the instance. That should satisfy both groups, as long as the balance isn't set up so that you can't finish the instance with regular skills. (Which makes sense, since lorewise, the Commander should probably be able to wipe the floor with anything that pre-champion Ryland or Braham could handle.)