Anyone else can't stand Joon?

[Ashantara.8731]

I don't know about you, but I find her unbearable.

I don't get why we didn't get her arrested in the end after she had tried to kill us twice, once via her security in the main wing of her estate, then - and that is the actual crime - after she had acknowledged our innocence.

The Commander's behavior was pretty much like, "Ohhh, don't worry! People are trying to kill me every day, and I have forgiven every single one of them." - Rrright.

She seems to have the emotional stability of a child, justifying attempted murder with protecting her life's work. And the Commander honors this attitude by completely ignoring that she was trying to kill us.

Does this strike anybody else as extremely inconceivable?

Edited March 13, 2022 by Ashantara.8731

[Luthan.5236]

I never really liked her. But I also don't hate her. I just find her boring ... and I actually had hoped that the story would take a direction where we'd team  up with Ankka and where Joon would turn out to be some evil mastermind. Or at least "corrupted" where she had to be killed (and  healing/cleansing not possible).

The only think where I like that she exists:  For interaction with Taimi. Nice to see the 2 researchers working together. Overall most of the new chars were weak though. Empress didn't even play a big role. Rama boring. Only Navan (how did I not recognize that with the name lol) ... was a bit interesting. She didn not get much time though.

As for the killing/imprisoning: I guess it often happens ... the game is also targeted at younger people. Also trying to include a lot of our real world minorities. The commander is just trying to be peaceful if it is possible. A lot of other people that could have just been killed. I bet he would have saved Ankka as well if it had been possible. And she was even more extreme - would have harmed whole Kaineng ... attacking the reactor.

Edited March 13, 2022 by Luthan.5236

[Westenev.5289]

I didn't hate Joon, and honestly I liked that she had a MASSIVE reason to hate us as the story progressed.

 

She spent days thinking we (the commander) released her life's work and almost destroyed New Keinig for the lols, and when we get around to giving her the time of day to explain what happened, we're asking her to help KILL the pinnacle of her career and that she has no say in the matter? It's no wonder she went off the deep end and tried to kill us in shock, fear and grief.

Edited March 13, 2022 by Westenev.5289

[AliamRationem.5172]

3 hours ago, Ashantara.8731 said:

I don't know about you, but I find her unbearable.

I don't get why we didn't get her arrested in the end after she had tried to kill us twice, once via her security in the main wing of her estate, then - and that is the actual crime - after she had acknowledged our innocence.

The Commander's behavior was pretty much like, "Ohhh, don't worry! People are trying to kill me every day, and I have forgiven every single one of them." - Rrright.

She seems to have the emotional stability of a child, justifying attempted murder with protecting her life's work. And the Commander honors this attitude by completely ignoring that she was trying to kill us.

Does this hit anybody else as extremely illogical?

Well, we did break into her house and start trashing her security system after we were warned to leave.  I guess fair is fair?

[AliamRationem.5172]

2 hours ago, Luthan.5236 said:

I never really liked her. But I also don't hate her. I just find her boring ... and I actually had hoped that the story would take a direction where we'd team  up with Ankka and where Joon would turn out to be some evil mastermind. Or at least "corrupted" where she had to be killed (and  healing/cleansing not possible).

The only think where I like that she exists:  For interaction with Taimi. Nice to see the 2 researchers working together. Overall most of the new chars were weak though. Empress didn't even play a big role. Rama boring. Only Navan (how did I not recognize that with the name lol) ... was a bit interesting. She didn not get much time though.

As for the killing/imprisoning: I guess it often happens ... the game is also targeted at younger people. Also trying to include a lot of our real world minorities. The commander is just trying to be peaceful if it is possible. A lot of other people that could have just been killed. I bet he would have saved Ankka as well if it had been possible. And she was even more extreme - would have harmed whole Kaineng ... attacking the reactor.

Oh, okay.  So Asian people = meh, minorities, weird little gremlins = good.  Got it. LoL  What a weird place to interject that.  What did Ankka do that was so interesting?  She was pretty run-of-the-mill bad guy, no?  Kidnap gorrik, use evil tech in an attempt to destroy the world cuz kitten everybody.  Does it really get any more boring than that?

[hedjeroo.1085]

I think she's a very complex character, and I spent a while thinking she was going to become a full on villain and wondering if I could really trust her. but this is actually part of why I like her as a character - her motivations may become obvious (she wants everyone to know how exceptional she is and not forget it, and she loves her nation and wants the best for it)... but her emotions are not ever straightforward. and I get it - she was terrified of feeling like all her work to be seen might come to naught.

 

she stands her ground on her feelings beyond what some might see as reasonable - and I'm starting to wonder if she's going to become as polarising as Braham, someone else who leveled negative feelings towards the Commander for something fairly complex, and needed time and understanding to work through. (and another character I adore, incidentally)

 

she is also an excellent companion to Taimi, and I want to see more of these two working together! they understand each other really well and it was nice to see Taimi step up as the one who smoothed things out instead of the Commander or Kasmeer. really hammered home just how much Taimi has grown since we first met her...

[Luthan.5236]

17 minutes ago, AliamRationem.5172 said:

Oh, okay.  So Asian people = meh, minorities, weird little gremlins = good.  Got it. LoL  What a weird place to interject that.  What did Ankka do that was so interesting?  She was pretty run-of-the-mill bad guy, no?  Kidnap gorrik, use evil tech in an attempt to destroy the world cuz kitten everybody.  Does it really get any more boring than that?

I meant other minorities. But I do not want to talk about this too detailed. There have been other threads that got "too political" and got closed/deleted. I do not like the way the game is doing things. As long at it does not feel annoying or badly written and too forced. (Most of the time it feels okay. Not worse than the other stuff lol - well MMORPGs are not the best at story-telling and GW2 feels still better than other MMORPG.)

I found it interesting that she wanted to rescue the captured dragon in the reactor (Soo-Won) - while Joon felt just like a "i wanna keep the dragon so I can be famous and liked cause I managed to improve people's lifestyle with the jade/dragon energy". So maybe both are "weak" (regarding how "well-written" they are) ... but Ankka certainly not worse than Joon lol.

There was some explanation - where they wanted to hint that she acually had a reason (coming from a poor background I think?) to act the way she did. But that did not seem too interesting. And she certainly did not want to to so just because she was nice and wanted to help others. Might change a bit now though. Characters always changed. Like Gorrik that was in the inquest first. (On a side note: Starting to like Gorrik - the time we get to spend with him now. Maybe in the future living world seasons we will get stories with the "Friends's Detectives agency" lol.)

Edited March 13, 2022 by Luthan.5236

[AliamRationem.5172]

1 minute ago, Luthan.5236 said:

I meant other minorities. But I do not want to talk about this too detailed. There have been other threads that got "too political" and got closed/deleted. I do not like the way the game is doing things. As long at it does not feel annoying or badly written and too forced. (Most of the time it feels okay. Not worse than the other stuff lol - well MMORPGs are not the best at story-telling and GW2 feels still better than other MMORPG.)

I found it interesting that she wanted to rescue the captured dragon in the reactor (Soo-Won) - while Joon felt just like a "i wanna keep the dragon so I can be famous and liked cause I managed to improve people's lifestyle with the jade/dragon energy". So maybe both are "weak" (regarding how "well-written" they are) ... but Ankka certainly not worse than Joon lol.

There was some explanation - where they wanted to hint that she acually had a reason (coming from a poor background I think?) to act the way she did. But that did not seem too interesting. And she certainly did not want to to so just because she was nice and wanted to help others. Might change a bit now though. Characters always changed. Like Gorrik that was in the inquest first. (On a side note: Starting to like Gorrik - the time we get to spend with him now. Maybe in the future living world seasons we will get stories with the "Friends's Detectives agency" lol.)

Ankka literally died with her reasoning for doing as she did: "kitten the world, I just wanted to have a little fun".  She didn't "rescue" Soo-Won.  Soo-Won was there by choice.

Agreed on Gorrik.  I am looking forward to seeing more of him.

[Eekasqueak.7850]

I didn't mind her. 

[Obliviscaris.6937]

She's one of the better characters. She doesn't fit into a neat little trope like every other character seems to. I actually like her the more I'm exposed to her. 

I'd also probably take a similar stance if someone, as you said, tried to destroy my LIFE'S WORK. I think it's actually childish for someone not to understand her point of view.

I'm also acidic so yeah, I dig her.

Edited March 13, 2022 by Obliviscaris.6937

[Imba.9451]

Joon is just boring. She only very narrowly avoided the "strong women" trope by being written kinda stubbborn, but in the end she of course helps to save the day.

 

My bigger problem is how Mai Trin and Ankka were just wasted characters. Mai Trin could have been an awesome grain of salt to the main cast of characters, with her not just being a goodie.two-shoes, and Ankka would have been an excellent vessel for nihilistic world views and a truly philosophical angle to the story.

Both wasted. Poof. Here, have moar Dragon drama. And more Aurene talking in her constant gasping voice. Have fun.

 

I'd like to say that the B-team wrote this story. But that would imply hope for a shred of quality left somewhere. A hope I do not have left at this point. Unless of course they announce GW3 in a year of so, basically confirming they have been working on that simultaneously alongside EoD.

 

 

Edit: Also Taimis line about "You do know women have children? It's normal" seemed thrown in so incredibly into your face.

Edited March 13, 2022 by Imba.9451

[SweetPotato.7456]

4 hours ago, Ashantara.8731 said:

I don't know about you, but I find her unbearable.

I don't get why we didn't get her arrested in the end after she had tried to kill us twice, once via her security in the main wing of her estate, then - and that is the actual crime - after she had acknowledged our innocence.

The Commander's behavior was pretty much like, "Ohhh, don't worry! People are trying to kill me every day, and I have forgiven every single one of them." - Rrright.

She seems to have the emotional stability of a child, justifying attempted murder with protecting her life's work. And the Commander honors this attitude by completely ignoring that she was trying to kill us.

Does this hit anybody else as extremely illogical?

Not really, I am indifferent, at first I thought she would become the enemy, but who knows what might happens in the next chapter of living story, We still hasn't seen her prodigy, she could need the dragon magic to keep it alive or something, and than she will become worse.

[Obliviscaris.6937]

Oh but whilst I'm here, Ankka has the single best voice acting of any character in the entire franchise, and I desperately want more of her in the future, somehow. In any way possible.

 

[ugrakarma.9416]

i miss the blood/violence of personal history.

We should have killed her.

the history is over-americanized:  nobody is bad, they are all people with psychological problems, the commander could save the world by opening a doctor's office.

 

Edited March 13, 2022 by ugrakarma.9416

[ugrakarma.9416]

50 minutes ago, Obliviscaris.6937 said:

She's one of the better characters. She doesn't fit into a neat little trope like every other character seems to. I actually like her the more I'm exposed to her. 

I'd also probably take a similar stance if someone, as you said, tried to destroy my LIFE'S WORK. I think it's actually childish for someone not to understand her point of view.

I'm also acidic so yeah, I dig her.

its a war to save the world, she shouldn't have to undestund anything, she have to obey or die. if she needs to be understood, let him see a psychologist or a priest.

Edited March 13, 2022 by ugrakarma.9416

[ASP.8093]

"I wish I could arrest her." / "I wish I could kill her."

She's the Empress' sister and probably the richest and most powerful individual citizen in Canthan society. You are not getting either of these outcomes unless the storyline is "let's kill this entire government and see what happens next."

Edited March 13, 2022 by ASP.8093

[AliamRationem.5172]

1 hour ago, Imba.9451 said:

Joon is just boring. She only very narrowly avoided the "strong women" trope by being written kinda stubbborn, but in the end she of course helps to save the day.

 

My bigger problem is how Mai Trin and Ankka were just wasted characters. Mai Trin could have been an awesome grain of salt to the main cast of characters, with her not just being a goodie.two-shoes, and Ankka would have been an excellent vessel for nihilistic world views and a truly philosophical angle to the story.

Both wasted. Poof. Here, have moar Dragon drama. And more Aurene talking in her constant gasping voice. Have fun.

 

I'd like to say that the B-team wrote this story. But that would imply hope for a shred of quality left somewhere. A hope I do not have left at this point. Unless of course they announce GW3 in a year of so, basically confirming they have been working on that simultaneously alongside EoD.

 

 

Edit: Also Taimis line about "You do know women have children? It's normal" seemed thrown in so incredibly into your face.

If the B-team wrote this story, the C-team must have written all the earlier content.  I thought it was better than past story content.

[Obliviscaris.6937]

29 minutes ago, ugrakarma.9416 said:

its a war to save the world, she shouldn't have to undestund anything, she have to obey or die. if she needs to be understood, let him see a psychologist or a priest.

Literally have no idea what I just read.

[ugrakarma.9416]

9 minutes ago, Obliviscaris.6937 said:

Literally have no idea what I just read.

the Joon Mansion instance was unecessary arc, just all about dialogues about her "motivations". 

we're in an action game, supposedly, not training to become a psychologist.

I miss the raw dialogues of personal history.

[Obliviscaris.6937]

I'll let someone else set this guy on the right path, I don't have a taste for low-hanging fruit right now. 💤

[AliamRationem.5172]

6 minutes ago, ugrakarma.9416 said:

the Joon Mansion instance was unecessary arc, just all about dialogues about her "motivations". 

we're in an action game, supposedly, not training to become a psychologist.

I miss the raw dialogues of personal history.

It was about a little bit more than just Joon's motivations.  We had a purpose for being there.  We couldn't resolve the crisis on our own.  We needed Joon and the Canthan government to be partners in that or we would have failed.  Just because it's an "action game" doesn't mean every problem is resolved by turning into Dirty Harry whenever we need to get things done.  

[SoftFootpaws.9134]

I think you need to put a spoiler warning in your title. The expanison's only a few weeks old friend, and even if its in the EoD forum it still shows up on the main page sometimes.

Edited March 13, 2022 by Hannelore.8153

[Gibson.4036]

2 hours ago, ugrakarma.9416 said:

i miss the blood/violence of personal history.

We should have killed her.

the history is over-americanized:  nobody is bad, they are all people with psychological problems, the commander could save the world by opening a doctor's office.

 

Adversaries with motivation is an American thing?

More like a realistic thing. People don’t sit around rubbing their hands together plotting evil and cackling to themselves. They lash out due to fear or anger over feeling wronged, even if those fears or that anger is totally delusional.

 

[Ashantara.8731]

2 hours ago, Hannelore.8153 said:

I think you need to put a spoiler warning in your title. The expanison's only a few weeks old friend, and even if its in the EoD forum it still shows up on the main page sometimes.

The title clearly states that this thread is about discussing Joon, a character from the EoD expansion (hence the EoD section of this forum). What more of a spoiler warning do you need? 😂

7 hours ago, Luthan.5236 said:

the game is also targeted at younger people.

1. "Younger" players, who are being taught that actions have no consequences?
2. I wouldn't call EoD "child-friendly", to be honest. It was the most "grown up" story so far. Just think about Ankka's intense death scene (or Mai Trin's excessive drinking, heh).

2 hours ago, AliamRationem.5172 said:

We needed Joon and the Canthan government to be partners in that or we would have failed.

I agree. But after the deed was done, she should have faced consequenes for her actions. Instead, the Commander acted as if that little intermezzo at her estate never happened.

3 hours ago, ASP.8093 said:

"I wish I could arrest her." / "I wish I could kill her."

She's the Empress' sister and probably the richest and most powerful individual citizen in Canthan society. You are not getting either of these outcomes unless the storyline is "let's kill this entire government and see what happens next."

Please don't put words into my mouth. I didn't say anthing about killing her. I am not 11 years old, crying "Meh, that was evil! Die, die, die!" 😉

I merely pointed out that her actions should have had consequences, but were completely ignored by the Commander, and that this fact strikes me as weird. IMO, she should have assumed responsibility for her actions.

7 hours ago, Luthan.5236 said:

and I actually had hoped that the story would take a direction where we'd team  up with Ankka and where Joon would turn out to be some evil mastermind.

Me, too! I already saw her as the "big bad" after we had learnt about her keeping Soo-Won emprisoned to drain her energy. I was a little disappointed that it didn't go down that path.

Edited March 13, 2022 by Ashantara.8731

[Teratus.2859]

5 hours ago, AliamRationem.5172 said:

Well, we did break into her house and start trashing her security system after we were warned to leave.  I guess fair is fair?

Haha that's also my view on it too.

We went to her house.
She told us to leave, we didn't.
We broke further and further into her house against her will.
Her security systems tried to kill us as a result XD

Suffice to say I fully believe in the right to defend your home against trespassers so Joon did nothing wrong here.