I miss playing ranged elementalist

[Godfather.9058]

Back when I started playing almost 9 years ago I picked the mage (elementalist) because I wanted to fling spells from a distance. Mainly used the staff and sometimes scepter/ focus. Since then all the elite specs released for the elementalist seem to be based around melee combat. Tempest brought the warhorn (which could be completely ignored). But to get the most value you had to get really close to use the storms. Weaver got the sword which made the class almost entirely melee focused with good mobility. Now the catalyst gives me a hammer and asks me to play like a warrior, smashing things up close.

 

I want more options for ranged combat.

[Danikat.8537]

You don't have to use the weapon with the elite spec. I usually don't, including using a staff on my weaver a lot of the time (mainly in WvW zergs). In open-world PvE especially you can pretty much use what you like, you'd have a hard time coming up with something that's so bad it doesn't work there, and if you did it's more likely to be because the stats are wrong than the skills.

Of course you will miss out on some of the new options if you don't, but the same is true if you don't use all the new utility skills and the elite and I doubt anyone uses a build that's 100% of an elite spec with none of their core skills.

[jcH.7109]

Like the person above me said, you don’t have to use the elite spec weapon. For example, one current meta build for raids/strikes/fractals is condi weaver using scepter/focus.

[Godfather.9058]

1 hour ago, Danikat.8537 said:

You don't have to use the weapon with the elite spec. I usually don't, including using a staff on my weaver a lot of the time (mainly in WvW zergs). In open-world PvE especially you can pretty much use what you like, you'd have a hard time coming up with something that's so bad it doesn't work there, and if you did it's more likely to be because the stats are wrong than the skills.

Of course you will miss out on some of the new options if you don't, but the same is true if you don't use all the new utility skills and the elite and I doubt anyone uses a build that's 100% of an elite spec with none of their core skills.

I wanted some other options for ranged combat. I know staff and s/f are there. But they are there since vanilla.

[Randulf.7614]

Ele with short bow is a popular request. Maybe next elite

[devastoscz.9851]

Hammer is 600 range mostly, could be considered midrange weapon. That said, I would like a long range option as well, but we'll have to wait for a new elite/expac for that. So..... another year or so according to this new "expansion structure" they have going on. Give ele a bow Anet!

[Jski.6180]

I think scpter is "the" ranged for ele at this point when it comes to dps builds. Staff is an utility wepon.

To fix ele "ranged" problem anet would need to make an good utility set that fill the ranged needs of the ele class. We need to see glyph or conja weapons to fill that ranged caster roll the ele class seems to be missing. Say glyph pets needs to be more contorl-able from an ranged and simply more durable then they are as well as making the ranged casting glyph have more effects. Even glyph of element power needs have some ranged cast effect even if its just giving other ppl the effect of the GoEP. As for conja wepon we need to see a real ranged dps wepon set. Axe frost bow and FGS realy dose not cut it one of these 3 wepons should be on the lines of scpter 1k range with real dps skills that dont have odd/slow projectile effects

[Liewec.2896]

i totally agree with this, i want the next elite to bring ele back to its roots as a long range spellcaster.

not a hammer wielding bruiser or a sword wielding swashbuckler, A STAFF WIELDING WIZARD!

 

imho the next expansion should be "acolyte" and allow us to focus on an element for more powerful spells of that element at the cost of losing in-combat stance dancing.

for example a Fire Acolyte will focus their talents of dps and stay in fire attunement and would have enhanced effects with fire spells, not just damage boosts, but effecting the spells themselves, like larger lava font, more meteors, a volley of fireballs instead of 1 etc.

now we can finally play a pyromancer, hydromancer, geomancer or aeromancer!

[draxynnic.3719]

8 hours ago, devastoscz.9851 said:

Hammer is 600 range mostly, could be considered midrange weapon. That said, I would like a long range option as well, but we'll have to wait for a new elite/expac for that. So..... another year or so according to this new "expansion structure" they have going on. Give ele a bow Anet!

Hammer having 600 range on less than half of its skills doesn't make it 'midrange' in any sense. Midrange is 900; 600 can only be described as 'short', and is generally associated with ranged skills on otherwise melee-oriented weapons (examples: Zealot's Defence, Vapour Blade). In the case of catalyst hammer, this is exacerbated by exceptionally sluggish projectile speeds: they're so slow-moving that if the enemy is moving away from you they might as well be melee.

It is accurate to say that you can run staff or scepter on the elite specialisations. Even Tempest can be played as a skirmisher, running in for an overload and backing out for ranged attacks after it completes. It is also accurate, however, to observe that elementalist is using the same ranged autoattack-capable weapons it had on release, and every elite specialisation has been optimised for melee.

[Serephen.3420]

13 hours ago, Randulf.7614 said:

Ele with short bow is a popular request. Maybe next elite

If we ever get another elite 😕

i still like the look of longbow more.

[zeyeti.8347]

I understand the point , all e-specs have obvious melee design .

Tempest with overloads .

Weaver with the sword , while you can use scepter as a range weapon .

Catalyst with hammer , with obvious design to be played by hammer for energy management (no other weapon has so many multi-hit skills) and hammer is a peculiar weapon being half melee , half ranged (but way more efficient melee).

There are indeed option for range , but they are too few for a "mage" .

And staff is now more sort of a support weapon .

If they make a new e-spec , i don't care the weapon it will use , but plz at least 900 range .

[Infusion.7149]

Run staff or scepter condi weaver if it is PvE. For PvP scepter catalyst is dominant  for WvW you typically would run staff instead.

Tempest is okay if you can deal with getting in just above melee range for overload, regardless of game mode.

[RazieL.5684]

i would LOVE to see longbow on ele with 1500 range (yeah ranger having monopoly on 1500 range is horrible imho) there are many games like diablo and what not where there is a bow class that enhances arrows with different elements to inflict some kind of effect on the enemy that for me would both feel great as a theme because i love both longbows and ele so combining them would be like a dream come true

[Joncal.9623]

This game with its amazing staff skins but useless staves is killing me. 
I just want to be a staff main for kittens sake!

Edit: yes I know rev/daredevil are a thing but they’re not “casters”. 🥹

Edited March 9, 2023 by Joncal.9623

[Serephen.3420]

7 hours ago, Joncal.9623 said:

This game with its amazing staff skins but useless staves is killing me. 
I just want to be a staff main for kittens sake!

Edit: yes I know rev/daredevil are a thing but they’re not “casters”. 🥹

You can play condi or hybrid staff weaver and it works well enough. Not the very best but still effective.

(But yes I would like the autos fixed up)

[Joncal.9623]

5 hours ago, Serephen.3420 said:

You can play condi or hybrid staff weaver and it works well enough. Not the very best but still effective.

(But yes I would like the autos fixed up)

resorting to staff boon support/healer in fractuals b/c staff but yeah. I'd be nice to be something else for a change.

[the krytan assassin.9235]

6 hours ago, Serephen.3420 said:

You can play condi or hybrid staff weaver and it works well enough. Not the very best but still effective.

(But yes I would like the autos fixed up)

Even power is pumping quite hard atm. (especially when used on bosses with larger hitboxes that favor ranged dps). I pretty much outdps like 98% of the puggies on stuff like deimos or HT nm. 

Im no bench God by any means, but im pretty sure there's potential for power staff to deal 40k+ bench on large Golem atm (there's an outdated power benchmark out there that deals like 36.5k and thats before the dmge boost to stormsoul, weave self, Swift revenge and elements of rage).  This would put staff on top of all power ranged dps builds currently available. I showed the basic staff rotation to a guildie of mine yesterday (he never plays staff) and he managed a 34k dps on his 2nd Golem (medium size) attempt. 

 

I know most people on the forum tend to disagree, but i think staff is in a good spot right now (maybe only lacking abit breakbar dmge). You can't expect a 1200 ranged aoe heavy build to deal the same amount of damage as a close ranged power build or a 900 range condi build. Otherwise there's literally no reason to use anything but staff. You sacrifice abit of dps, but you get alot of consistency in return.

 

95% of the player base simply only looks at specific sites to see whats viable, without actually trying the build for themselves. For example the majority of the ele playerbase could probably benefit from taking flame Legion runes over scholar runes, yet every single player simply refuses to actually do so or is unaware of its potential. 

For some reason we all agree that Pmech, scourge &Pvirtuoso are in a decent spot because they're provide reliable consistent dmge output, yet simultaneously we blame staff ele for doing the exact same kitten. 

Link for the staff benchmark before the mentioned buffs to Weaver.

https://youtu.be/OoDkeTqMWjc

Edited March 10, 2023 by the krytan assassin.9235

[Joncal.9623]

1 hour ago, the krytan assassin.9235 said:

You can't expect a 1200 ranged aoe heavy build to deal the same amount of damage as a close ranged power build or a 900 range condi build. Otherwise there's literally no reason to use anything but staff. You sacrifice abit of dps, but you get alot of consistency in return.

The way boons work there's not a single ranged build in the game (pve, I reckon pvp is a different story). Staff or bow, you're a melee ranged hoe (that kinda rhymes lol, sorry). EDIT: yes I know, not always.

I don't think the endgame builds rule out staff because it lacks in damage (let's be honest, it does) but because 9/10 times it's a utility or healing weapon and some people want that to change.

I personally would LOVE to see a damage focused staff with a matching skillset.

Edited March 10, 2023 by Joncal.9623

[the krytan assassin.9235]

2 hours ago, Joncal.9623 said:

The way boons work there's not a single ranged build in the game (pve, I reckon pvp is a different story). Staff or bow, you're a melee ranged hoe (that kinda rhymes lol, sorry). EDIT: yes I know, not always.

I don't think the endgame builds rule out staff because it lacks in damage (let's be honest, it does) but because 9/10 times it's a utility or healing weapon and some people want that to change.

I personally would LOVE to see a damage focused staff with a matching skillset.

So if all PvE builds are melee anyways, why bother asking for a ranged dps staff build anyways? 

Also i just provided evidence that staff is able to deal alot of damage, why suddenly pretend that its not able to do so? Lol 

Btw why is having some extra utility suddenly a bad thing? Almost any ele weapon has some utility slotted in anyways and you need a decent amount of crowd control for open world staff ele. 

 

Viper, grieving and bers are all able to get 40k+ benchmarks atm, which put them all in the top 20 benchmark dps builds that are currently available. 

 

Sure i agree that there are some skills that could use an update, but its a completely viable weapon right now. Right now it seems like the entire ele community is desperately looking for excuses to shittalk on staff. No we'll never get back to 65k dps Tempest and thats an actual good thing. 

[draxynnic.3719]

4 hours ago, Joncal.9623 said:

The way boons work there's not a single ranged build in the game (pve, I reckon pvp is a different story). Staff or bow, you're a melee ranged hoe (that kinda rhymes lol, sorry). EDIT: yes I know, not always.

I don't think the endgame builds rule out staff because it lacks in damage (let's be honest, it does) but because 9/10 times it's a utility or healing weapon and some people want that to change.

I personally would LOVE to see a damage focused staff with a matching skillset.

The more modern encounter design is forcing at least some ranged play on most builds. Boonball does not require being stuck on the boss 24/7 - sometimes you might be at range while still in a group, and some mechanics force you to split apart (and hopefully gather back up afterwards to renew boons).

Plus, y'know, instanced group PvE isn't the only content in the game.

[Joncal.9623]

5 hours ago, the krytan assassin.9235 said:

So if all PvE builds are melee anyways, why bother asking for a ranged dps staff build anyways? 

Your sir, might enjoy wielding your puny dagger or clumsy hammer, or, what have you not. I would like to flaunt my walking stick. It is as simple as that.

Just because a gun is a ranged weapon irl doesn't mean I can't bash your head in with its butt. Or fire it from close range. *gasp* I know.
 

3 hours ago, draxynnic.3719 said:

Plus, y'know, instanced group PvE isn't the only content in the game.

and I've already stated I do not comment on PvP/competitive. 😘

Edited March 10, 2023 by Joncal.9623

[SinisterSeven.2781]

anet remembers when staff used to be good on elementalist too. and they're sending another nerf just to make sure.

[draxynnic.3719]

14 hours ago, Joncal.9623 said:

and I've already stated I do not comment on PvP/competitive. 😘

I wasn't just referring to competitive modes.

[Joncal.9623]

2 minutes ago, draxynnic.3719 said:

I wasn't just referring to competitive modes.

What else? Open world? 
Everything goes there. I myself use a power cata staff minion build for it. 

Edited March 11, 2023 by Joncal.9623

[draxynnic.3719]

9 minutes ago, Joncal.9623 said:

What else? Open world? 
Everything goes there. I myself use a power cata staff minion build for it. 

Ah, yes, the classic "everything works in open world" copout. Except that if you drift away from the zerg events (where bad builds are carried by the people with good builds) and easy areas, it doesn't. And often, the builds and tactics that work there aren't the same as the builds you'd use in instanced content and meta-events.

 

And that's without considering the observed trend of ArenaNet developing even instanced content where you can't melee the boss all the time.