Guilds and WVW

[Hari.7259]

Well, you've ruined WVW for the non guild players .... Unless you are in a guild and have access to all the boosts that guilds do, you don't stand a chance anymore .... Tonight, TEN of us could not kill ONE enemy player because of all the boosts he had .... You've made the playing field totally guild sided ..... And, before your go "Join a guild" , not every one has the time or inclination to join a guild ... So I guess my playing days are going to very limited in WVW .... I used to enjoy it .... No more ..... Well done, ANET ..............

[Kirevey.5079]

What boosts are you talking about ? Presence of the Keep ? Anyone nearby a structure gets those if they are active, being on a guild or not. As for things like strength booster, even if they have them on, don't work on WvW.

[Chaba.5410]

What makes you come to the conclusion that it's these "boosts" for why 10 of you couldn't kill 1 player?  How do you know it's not the player's build and use of it?

[len.7809]

All the "boons" the guild grant are guild enhancements which gives more wxp, karma, magic find, etc.
If you can't kill a single player with 10 is neither you are too bad or he is playing an "unkillable" troll build.

[kash.9213]

Structure boosts are dumb in a non open world game mode but you can drag people and groups out of their territory lines. If they won't leave their territory, then you're not going to get a good fight out of them regardless. 

I kind of feel like this One sized up a group of players and knew what gimmicks they could get away with for a minute. Some of those boosts might also be stuff from pve or the repair npc. 

 

[Hari.7259]

1 hour ago, len.7809 said:

All the "boons" the guild grant are guild enhancements which gives more wxp, karma, magic find, etc.
If you can't kill a single player with 10 is neither you are too bad or he is playing an "unkillable" troll build.

I have no idea what an "unkillable" troll build is

[Ronin.4501]

15 minutes ago, Hari.7259 said:

I have no idea what an "unkillable" troll build is

Google it. "GW2 unkillable troll build" and you'll get dozens of links to follow up on. Just make sure you pay attention to the dates, as items posted more than a year ago may no longer be valid depending on how WvW "balance" updates have changed them.

[Xenesis.6389]

Combat pretty boring and unfun these days tho... 🤷‍♂️🍿

[Dawdler.8521]

Those kitten one man guilds always ruining WvW.

I hear some of the T1 worlds even have some two man guilds, which are twice as strong!

Edited April 6, 2023 by Dawdler.8521

[TheGrimm.5624]

6 hours ago, Hari.7259 said:

Well, you've ruined WVW for the non guild players .... Unless you are in a guild and have access to all the boosts that guilds do, you don't stand a chance anymore .... Tonight, TEN of us could not kill ONE enemy player because of all the boosts he had .... You've made the playing field totally guild sided ..... And, before your go "Join a guild" , not every one has the time or inclination to join a guild ... So I guess my playing days are going to very limited in WVW .... I used to enjoy it .... No more ..... Well done, ANET ..............

There really aren't any boons from the guild hall as others have said. For reference here are the boosts you can get. And mind you only one at a time.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Nathan_the_Bartender

[Custodio.6134]

The only combat-relevant Stat increase are the aura from claiming, and these only really make a difference in large numbers. That is for example a ~200 increase of damage on a Zerg Scourge's axe 2, about 1k more HP, or 100 armor. On a single player, this difference is negligible, it doesn't even remotely impact combat as much as you claim it to do. 

 

The difference in stats only shows in large player numbers, because on 50 players, it's roughly 5 players worth in stats

[TheGrimm.5624]

4 hours ago, Custodio.6134 said:

The only combat-relevant Stat increase are the aura from claiming, and these only really make a difference in large numbers. That is for example a ~200 increase of damage on a Zerg Scourge's axe 2, about 1k more HP, or 100 armor. On a single player, this difference is negligible, it doesn't even remotely impact combat as much as you claim it to do. 

 

The difference in stats only shows in large player numbers, because on 50 players, it's roughly 5 players worth in stats

And the players receiving the boost didn't need to be in the guild to get the boost, just on the same side.

[TheGrimm.5624]

16 hours ago, Hari.7259 said:

Well, you've ruined WVW for the non guild players .... Unless you are in a guild and have access to all the boosts that guilds do, you don't stand a chance anymore .... Tonight, TEN of us could not kill ONE enemy player because of all the boosts he had .... You've made the playing field totally guild sided ..... And, before your go "Join a guild" , not every one has the time or inclination to join a guild ... So I guess my playing days are going to very limited in WVW .... I used to enjoy it .... No more ..... Well done, ANET ..............

Do you know what class they were playing? This does sound like a player playing a tank build and gear. Did they kill any of the 10 or just escape the fight?

[Heibi.4251]

22 hours ago, Hari.7259 said:

I have no idea what an "unkillable" troll build is

We've had a hard time killing certain builds. Sometimes 25+ can't kill one player. The build is like - block block block, evade evade evade, immune immune immune, block block block, massive leap forward multiple times, heal heal heal, heal more, heal more. Perhaps that's what you've seen?

Edited April 6, 2023 by Heibi.4251

[Solvar.7953]

I've seen some builds like that.  I'm not sure if I would use the term troll build - I quickly realized what the other player was doing, and just broke off trying to kill them, but they probably did in what they were trying to do, in which have 5+ people pursuing them, trying to kill them.

On that basis, if those 5+ pursuers don't recognize the fact, I would argue that is a pretty good tactic - anytime 1 player can occupy 2+ players, one would argue that is a win.

Flip side is that one player isn't actually doing anything than drawing others in - if a camp even has a 1 other player, they aren't going to flip it, though perhaps if they see that, they quickly switch to a high DPS build which would work then.

 

[Dawdler.8521]

7 hours ago, Heibi.4251 said:

We've had a hard time killing certain builds. Sometimes 25+ can't kill one player. The build is like - block block block, evade evade evade, immune immune immune, block block block, massive leap forward multiple times, heal heal heal, heal more, heal more. Perhaps that's what you've seen?

Builds by themselves can be very strong and take on two or three, maybe even four or five if they get a really good initial engagement that disables/kill a few almost instantly and hardcounters the rest but if a group of 25+ have a problem killing one that's not a problem with the build...

Edited April 7, 2023 by Dawdler.8521

[enkidu.5937]

On 4/6/2023 at 12:00 AM, Hari.7259 said:

Well, you've ruined WVW for the non guild players .... Unless you are in a guild and have access to all the boosts that guilds do, you don't stand a chance anymore .... Tonight, TEN of us could not kill ONE enemy player because of all the boosts he had .... You've made the playing field totally guild sided ..... And, before your go "Join a guild" , not every one has the time or inclination to join a guild ... So I guess my playing days are going to very limited in WVW .... I used to enjoy it .... No more ..... Well done, ANET ..............

Alliance blobs coming sooon

enjoy 🤡

[subversiontwo.7501]

12 hours ago, Heibi.4251 said:

We've had a hard time killing certain builds. Sometimes 25+ can't kill one player. The build is like - block block block, evade evade evade, immune immune immune, block block block, massive leap forward multiple times, heal heal heal, heal more, heal more. Perhaps that's what you've seen?

Was that player only playing around a tower and ran inside after 5 odd seconds perhaps?

What you describe could easily be a Warrior with Stance-heal, Defy pain, Endure pain, Shield, GS, possibly a Sword, Bull's Charge, possibly Savage instinct etc. However, the vast majority of those abilities have existed in this game for 11 years and it says more about you than the game or the mode if you can't identify it and understand it.

The only one thing we're seeing a sharp increase of is players who play like absolute cowards; around objectives or to gank. While those things are annoying they say far less about the class balance of the game and far more about the population balance and its effect on the social-infrastructural collapse of the mode (ie., more small premade groups purposely building to gank solos than using their advantages to take on bigger challenges or using the force-multipliers of objectives to gank rather than bust too).

[MarzAttakz.9608]

2 hours ago, subversiontwo.7501 said:

Was that player only playing around a tower and ran inside after 5 odd seconds perhaps?

What you describe could easily be a Warrior with Stance-heal, Defy pain, Endure pain, Shield, GS, possibly a Sword, Bull's Charge, possibly Savage instinct etc. However, the vast majority of those abilities have existed in this game for 11 years and it says more about you than the game or the mode if you can't identify it and understand it.

The only one thing we're seeing a sharp increase of is players who play like absolute cowards; around objectives or to gank. While those things are annoying they say far less about the class balance of the game and far more about the population balance and its effect on the social-infrastructural collapse of the mode (ie., more small premade groups purposely building to gank solos than using their advantages to take on bigger challenges or using the force-multipliers of objectives to gank rather than bust too).

There's also a pure troll Vindicator build - does kitten all damage but trolls like a boss.

I'm not even going to get started on the recent Gank Squad compositions - kinda missing the days when it used to be three thieves only though.

[Heibi.4251]

7 hours ago, Dawdler.8521 said:

Builds by themselves can be very strong and take on two or three, maybe even four or five if they get a really good initial engagement that disables/kill a few almost instantly and hardcounters the rest but if a group of 25+ have a problem killing one that's not a problem with the build...

It truly is the build. Sorry - no build should be able to be immune to damage, CC's, block constantly and have cooldowns that are so short that the same skills come right back up almost instantly. They outrun most players and can't be stripped due to the ranges. Once we finally get them it has taken 20+ seconds and everyone to finish him off.  Willbender is one of the most guilty these days. Mobility upon mobility.

[Riba.3271]

That is mostly just server quality difference. It was kind of caused by linking system as good players tend to travel around, and all bigger servers in the past are either very expensive or full to go to. Actually they can't even fit guilds in them anymore whereas pugs and guilds could coexist in same server before.

 

Take average casual player: They will save their gold for some miniature or useless 15th same legendary weapon skin, over transferring in WvW, so they will all stay in their original server.

 

Player quality difference is just caused by bad server system. It reminds me of those 3-faction MMORPGS where everyone just goes to winning faction since you can't do anything otherwise.

[Zyreva.1078]

32 minutes ago, Riba.3271 said:

That is mostly just server quality difference.

Nonsense. Every world has some good and many bad players and the described situations can happen between any of the servers.

[Chaba.5410]

4 hours ago, subversiontwo.7501 said:

The only one thing we're seeing a sharp increase of is players who play like absolute cowards; around objectives or to gank.

Now I want to see you fight 10 v 1 and not run back into an objective or otherwise exit the fight.  Just stand out there and wait for them to kill you.  Die an e-honorable death.

Edited April 7, 2023 by Chaba.5410

[subversiontwo.7501]

10 hours ago, Chaba.5410 said:

Now I want to see you fight 10 v 1 and not run back into an objective or otherwise exit the fight.  Just stand out there and wait for them to kill you.  Die an e-honorable death.

There is a context here: People complaining about not being able to kill things. My point was quite simply that you see people whine about eg., Willbenders (or in the post you misqouted: some Warrior build). The builds they claim to be "unkillable even with 25" is likely just someone spending 5s just outside a tower and cycling their invuls - a highly unremarkable feat or build. We are seeing more players play that way, than we are seeing some mythic magical unkillable-with-25 builds out there.

There is quite a difference between escaping while outnumbered and having a build purpose-built to only gank around a tower. I'm sure you know that, even if you pretend not to and cherry-pick a line just to try to score some childish point. Also, if people want to specialise in hugging objectives like that (or chasing down solos with a premade 5-man roaming comp, instead of fighting up) that is their prerogative, but let's not pretend it isn't cowardly.

Edited April 8, 2023 by subversiontwo.7501

[Chaba.5410]

57 minutes ago, subversiontwo.7501 said:

There is a context here: People complaining about not being able to kill things. My point was quite simply that you see people whine about eg., Willbenders (or in the post you misqouted: some Warrior build). The builds they claim to be "unkillable even with 25" is likely just someone spending 5s just outside a tower and cycling their invuls - a highly unremarkable feat or build. We are seeing more players play that way, than we are seeing some mythic magical unkillable-with-25 builds out there.

There is quite a difference between escaping while outnumbered and having a build purpose-built to only gank around a tower. I'm sure you know that, even if you pretend not to and cherry-pick a line just to try to score some childish point. Also, if people want to specialise in hugging objectives like that (or chasing down solos with a premade 5-man roaming comp, instead of fighting up) that is their prerogative, but let's not pretend it isn't cowardly.

You can't make such a point without accusing players of being cowardly?

Players don't generally play games where they make decisions that would put themselves into a losing situation on purpose like trying to 10v1 without some sort of mitigation including hugging objectives.  It's like expecting a fight guild to 50v25 without any sort of organization and synergistic builds.  Why should I pretend that such standard game decision making is anything more than that?

Edited April 8, 2023 by Chaba.5410