Celestial Gear needs to go, these builds are unfun and boring to fight against as well as to play.

[Hotride.2187]

On 5/13/2023 at 11:17 AM, Zyreva.1078 said:

Yea, lets just nerf all classes into the ground because of one overperforming stat combination.

Lol I think I just fought your build at south camp (was on defense dagger/gs spb).

So it didn't occur to me to record this until it had been going on for a while, but here is a cele duel (both are competent players):

It started from south camp as a 2v1, the sb killed the 2nd  and kited the harb to duel spot. I was watching them fight for some time until it occurred to me, its a good showcase of an endless duel. I only recorded 4 mins of it, I think the total was close to 8 min (I went to tag the south camp after it got flipped and they were fighting the 2v1 already, I didn't see the start of the fight). And honestly I'm surprised the harb died. It wasn't exciting to watch either tbh, as usual with cele fights.

Edited May 20, 2023 by Hotride.2187

[Arianth Moonlight.6453]

craft your own celestial gear? I mean, if it is so powerful, just get yourself one.

[Hotride.2187]

58 minutes ago, Arianth Moonlight.6453 said:

craft your own celestial gear? I mean, if it is so powerful, just get yourself one.

Topic says "builds are unfun and boring to fight against as well as to play". So how exactly will playing cele help?

[SleepyBat.9034]

1 hour ago, Hotride.2187 said:

Lol I think I just fought your build at south camp (was on defense dagger/gs spb).

So it didn't occur to me to record this until it had been going on for a while, but here is a cele duel (both are competent players):

It started from south camp as a 2v1, the sb killed the 2nd  and kited the harb to duel spot. I was watching them fight for some time until it occurred to me, its a good showcase of an endless duel. I only caught 4 mins of it, I think the total was close to 10 min (I went to tag the south camp after it got flipped and they were fighting the 2v1 already). And honestly I'm surprised the harb died. It wasn't exciting to watch either tbh, as usual with cele fights.

I'm not surprised this fight took forever, both are good players and both classes have great defensive skills/traits. I think the outcome would be the same regardless of the stats. Both specs have access to perma protection, strong sustain, high cleanse, and lots of stat mods. Good players will find a way to drag fights out forever regardless of stats because they spend so much time kiting whenever they get low. Remember protection = about 1k toughness.

Edited May 20, 2023 by SleepyBat.9034

[Hotride.2187]

24 minutes ago, SleepyBat.9034 said:

I think the outcome would be the same regardless of the stats.

Harb will get deleted in 1-2 min at best without cele (and I'm being very generous with the 2 min bound). The sb will be power lb/gs or at least axe/warnhorn/gs without cele. No idea why you think protection does much here, they are both condi focused builds.

There are matchups that can take up to 5 min on power builds, sure, but not this one. And definitely not approaching 10 min.

Edited May 20, 2023 by Hotride.2187

[TheGrimm.5624]

Cele harb gets deleted by Power SB and even by Power core Necro at range. Cele harb does well, against other Cele and Tanky builds but fails to DPS range. Sorry its not a I win combo.

[Zyreva.1078]

15 hours ago, SleepyBat.9034 said:

I'm not surprised this fight took forever, both are good players and both classes have great defensive skills/traits. I think the outcome would be the same regardless of the stats. Both specs have access to perma protection, strong sustain, high cleanse, and lots of stat mods. Good players will find a way to drag fights out forever regardless of stats because they spend so much time kiting whenever they get low. Remember protection = about 1k toughness.

Ofc players can stalemate each other without cele (heck, there's plenty of bunker stats that will never kill each other and certain classes have too much sustain even without bunker stats), but that's not why cele is op. Whoever drops cele loses. That's the problem.

5 hours ago, TheGrimm.5624 said:

Cele harb gets deleted by Power SB and even by Power core Necro at range. Cele harb does well, against other Cele and Tanky builds but fails to DPS range. Sorry its not a I win combo.

Power slb does nothing against a good cele harb (or any good cele build). It doesn't have an answer to perma prot + high toughness + weakness spam and projectile denial. It might be able to stalemate if played very defensively, but that's about it.

And power core nec ... you are joking right? That one gets rolled by pretty much anything.

Edited May 21, 2023 by Zyreva.1078

[TheGrimm.5624]

8 hours ago, Zyreva.1078 said:

Power slb does nothing

How many threads do we get with power Ranger nerf call outs? 

[Xenesis.6389]

20 minutes ago, TheGrimm.5624 said:

How many threads do we get with power Ranger nerf call outs? 

Nerf Rapid Fire One Wolf Pack combo! 🤭🍿

Btw, anyone wanna explain why One Wolf Pack has 6sec duration in pve and pvp, yet somehow is still 8sec in wvw? Why the strike intervals was increased to 1sec in pve, but left to 1/4sec in wvw and pvp?

Weird split balancing, par for the course I guess.

[Zyreva.1078]

27 minutes ago, TheGrimm.5624 said:

How many threads do we get with power Ranger nerf call outs? 

1. That's not what i said. Don't put stuff out of context.

2. Haven't see one in a while.

3. Completely unrelated to this topic.

[Zyreva.1078]

14 minutes ago, Xenesis.6389 said:

Nerf Rapid Fire One Wolf Pack combo! 🤭🍿

Btw, anyone wanna explain why One Wolf Pack has 6sec duration in pve and pvp, yet somehow is still 8sec in wvw? Why the strike intervals was increased to 1sec in pve, but left to 1/4sec in wvw and pvp?

Weird split balancing, par for the course I guess.

The nerfed the strike interval in PvE because the burst was too op in grp content in combination with stance share after buffing it to scale with the ranger's stats (they then had to compensate by massively buffing all ranger weapons to keep the class relevant in PvE). The PvP/WvW split is weird - as so any other skill splits.

Edited May 21, 2023 by Zyreva.1078

[TheGrimm.5624]

12 hours ago, Zyreva.1078 said:

1. That's not what i said. Don't put stuff out of context.

2. Haven't see one in a while.

3. Completely unrelated to this topic.

You did. Nerf ranger threads are a regular feature here people need to defend to say not so much. Related since power rangers melt a lot of builds hence all the callouts that rangers need nerfs, yet they are unwelcome in zergs even with that skill set. Rangers remain the best anti-necro class which is fine. Do you disagree that kiting and keeping range on Harb is not a good tactic?

[calimoura calypso.3604]

I couldn't disagree more. Some classes excel in cele, others don't. It's been like that since they released it.

[TheIceman.1039]

On 5/20/2023 at 10:17 PM, Arianth Moonlight.6453 said:

craft your own celestial gear? I mean, if it is so powerful, just get yourself one.

They cant win = boring. Even hear here same about one server. Cannot win them, its boring.. 😄

[Zyreva.1078]

10 hours ago, TheGrimm.5624 said:

You did.

I said "power slb does nothing against a good cele harb" - the bold being the relevant part. Which you choose to leave out, to put words into my mouth that i never said or implied. I have experienced that matchup from both sides, so i'm not basing that statement on guesswork.

10 hours ago, TheGrimm.5624 said:

Nerf ranger threads are a regular feature here people need to defend to say not so much.

So what? This isn't a ranger nerf thread (and not all ranger nerf requests are unreasonable, i'm saying this as ranger main, mind you).

10 hours ago, TheGrimm.5624 said:

Do you disagree that kiting and keeping range on Harb is not a good tactic?

Depends on the situation and matchup.

1 hour ago, calimoura calypso.3604 said:

I couldn't disagree more. Some classes excel in cele, others don't. It's been like that since they released it.

So you are saying cele has been fine since release, yet somehow those massive buffs it got for free (while all other gear remained unchanged) had no impact on it's relative balance? Something doesn't hold up here.

[Gendalfs.7521]

Bad thing about cele is that not every class benefits from those stats.

Other than that, I say cele fights are better, then, 123 dead.

p.s. Im complete noob, its just my perception of WvW

 

Edited May 22, 2023 by Gendalfs.7521

[nativity.3057]

cele is good bc with cele i can 1v5 and win and that is really fun

[Junkpile.7439]

Did meet celestial ele today. Critted me like 1.3k dragons tooth and use all kind of damage combos that really didn't do anything. Then he probably did get mad and  finded his inner celestial abuser and started to just spam fire 1 and I did die.

[Burnfall.9573]

Celestial solo 100cm Silent Surf fractal 

 

Edited July 20, 2023 by Burnfall.9573

[Justine.6351]

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/relics-bring-new-equipment-to-guild-wars-2-secrets-of-the-obscure/

Check out the trinket selection rofl.

[Deniara Devious.3948]

I agree that boon generation (in general, not just celestial) should be toned down. Celestial without any might stacks doesn't hit that hard, but the problem is that many builds can easily gain 15+ stacks of might. Celestial with 15-25 might stacks is a problem. Also zerg fights have way too much boon balls, enemies having almost every boon in the game.

But talking about unfun builds to fight against is not a celestial issue. The most unfun builds to fight against are:
excessive stealth (certain thief builds like D/P and smokescale pet + LB on ranger... this also gives annoying ability to reset any fight, thus never lose)
excessive amount of evades (turns into random shoot if one can finally land something through the evades)
excessive amount of condition spam (even with multiple condition removal skills, the conditions just come again in few seconds)
multiple shadowsteps/teleports (once again resetting the fight)

 

[Exzen.2976]

Nerf cele please anet. It's no longer funny, it's clearly op. Thanks. 

[RazieL.5684]

On 5/20/2023 at 9:56 PM, Hotride.2187 said:

Lol I think I just fought your build at south camp (was on defense dagger/gs spb).

So it didn't occur to me to record this until it had been going on for a while, but here is a cele duel (both are competent players):

It started from south camp as a 2v1, the sb killed the 2nd  and kited the harb to duel spot. I was watching them fight for some time until it occurred to me, its a good showcase of an endless duel. I only recorded 4 mins of it, I think the total was close to 8 min (I went to tag the south camp after it got flipped and they were fighting the 2v1 already, I didn't see the start of the fight). And honestly I'm surprised the harb died. It wasn't exciting to watch either tbh, as usual with cele fights.

oof 2 condi bunker builds that have tons of cleanses took a while to kill each other... i'm so shocked i almost fell out of my chair...

one thing that power has in favor in these fights is that you can't just cleanse power damage, in condi fights after you get through all the dodges, blocks, stealths and invulns and you finally land a hit, even if it puts 10000 stacks of poison on the target... 1 cleanse and it's gone... the best are abilities that you passively just put up and they pulse cleanse on you every second so you are pretty much immune to condi damage for that duration, the worst are necros, rangers and mesmers that put 6+ condis on you with 1 button, then you need more cleanses but most other condi classes are manageable... as i always say in these topics - if you have so many issues with "cele bros" just get some condi cleanse and they will do 0 damage to you...

[Dawdler.8521]

5 minutes ago, RazieL.5684 said:

one thing that power has in favor in these fights is that you can't just cleanse power damage.

There are builds that also regenerate 1000+ hp a second, but yes I suppose so.

[senftube.6081]

Still no change to fotm cele. Thsi Devs are surely not playing their own game.